Afghan on trial for Christianity

[RendezVous]

Originally posted by ibtisam:

...

 

The Afghan Human Rights Commission has called for a better balance in the judiciary, with fewer judges advocating Sharia law and more judges with a wider legal background.

 

Several journalists have been prosecuted under blasphemy laws in post-Taleban Afghanistan.

 

The editor of a women's rights magazine was convicted of insulting Islam and sentenced to death last year - but was later released after an apology and heavy international pressure.

 

Mr Karzai's office says the president will not intervene in the case.

 

Observers say executing a converted Christian would be a significant precedent as a conservative interpretation of Sharia law in Afghanistan.

 

But it would also outrage Western nations which put Mr Karzai in power and are pouring billions of dollars into supporting the country.

 

what right do muslim have demanding Tolerance?

Your point?...............................

 

To show that AFGHANISTAN, a country where many muslims reside is persecuting someone and that Shariah is not applicable...

 

By the way, did u read about The crusades the christians carried out in the 12th century where muslims were brutally murdered and women raped in hundreds..to re-convert and conquer them in spain and In southern Europe?

 

Did u know How our Religion, ISLAM passed hardship during it's infancy stage...

 

Do u know our

prophet Mohamed

was stoned until blood covered even his toes and he still prayed for the attackers..

 

Do u know Amaar bin yaser (A companion) of the prophet was killed and His pregnant mother was also sliced up through the stomach?

Reason....Converting To islam...

Good girl...Of all topics..you saw this is the best one...

 

Just to show ISLAM is defective...

 

Try another

[Baluug]

Originally posted by Socod_badne:

quote:Originally posted by Viking:

First of all, how am I rejecting Shari'a Law?

 

By choosing to live in the West over Sharia Law run countries.

Um......actually, I might be going out on a limb here, but wasn't Somalia plunged into CIVIL WAR and most of it's displaced citizens didn't really have a choice in which country they would take asylum? And aren't some of us (including myself) born in non-Muslim countries and can't just pack up and move to Muslim countries whenever we want? Your argument that I have rejected Sharia Law based upon where I live is baseless and actually quite st^upid.

[codetalker]

Originally posted by Socod_badne:

I assert the Sharia Law is not divinely ordained. To "prove" that I just have to cite just ONE Sharia punishment that is

contradicted

by what Allah ordained in Quran...the most notable is the punishment of adultery. Sharia law proscribes

stoning to death.

While Allah delineated in the Quran only 100 lashes. Since in Islam the Quran trumps everything else, we can conclude that the Sharia is not Allah's laws.

I acknowledge the fact that there has been a long-standing debate about the punishment for adultery/fornication (zina') in Islam.

 

However, do not miss the gravity with which the Noble Qur'an deals with evil act of zina' itself. In the translation of the ayah, Allah SWT says:

 

“(And the servants of the Beneficent) are those who do not invoke another god with Allah, and who do not…commit

fornication/adultery

, for whoever does that shall receive the penalty; for him shall

the torment be doubled on the day of resurrection,

and therein he shall abide forever, disgraced, save him who repents and believes and does good works; those, Allah shall change their misdeeds into good works. And Allah is Forgiving, Compassionate.†(Al-Furqan: 68-70)

Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, a senior lecturer and Islamic scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, states:

 

“Adultery in Islam is one of the most heinous and deadliest of sins. Its enormity can be gauged from the fact that it has often been conjoined in the Qur’an with the gravest of all sins:

shirk

or associating partners with Allah."

While you're here concerning yourself with the "death by stoning" punishment on Earth, you seem to miss the eternal punishment for zina' in the Hereafter (when it REALLY matters). In the above translation of the ayah, Allah SWT promises that the torment for those who commit shirk - the gravest of all sins - and those who commit zina' will be doubled on the Day of Ressurection.

 

I ask you: What earthly punishment could surmount to an eternal double punishment in the Hereafter? None! None! None!

[RendezVous]

There is someone who is HAPPY @muslims who are against their own religion...

 

Makalajabti,

 

I am happy to see that not all of you are pro-sharia, I was losing hope

bilan,

 

You talked some truth walahi,That was good.

 

how can any sane muslim be against the shari'a,shari'a is derived from hadiths and quran,scholars disagreed with each other,but these people actually did spend years and years learning hadiths and fiqhs,and i mean years not two minutes googling. also when they disagreed with each other they had their proof based again on hadiths and quran,they were/are not following their desires. i think shari'a is complex field,and unless you have the knowledge you can not argue against it.

Anyone who doesn't accept what Allah has revealed whether it was meant for 6th Century or the 21st century , is Not a muslim.It is either you are a muslim or a non-muslim.Fullstop

 

No one is forcing you anyways

 

No wonder you see Islamic control on the advise of The Shariah that came from the Quraan and translated with Hadith,

 

on alcohol, prostitution, adultery, AIDS, Gay and lesbianism, swinging and many diseases to some extent STD's and many others.

 

We know the ones who are harsh on the Shariah want to have their way of life in the

21st Century

...

 

You are not the first...proceed to swingers club and the worst

You have just started

[Valenteenah.]

Originally posted by Socod_badne:

The only Sharia Law is the one practiced by Afghanistan, S. Arabia among others

. Conversely, the

REAL

Sharia Law the one you and others exalt so much... the perfect one, benchmark for judging how Sharia should be practiced is pure

fantasy

.

That sounds absolute. Are you absolutely sure?

 

In today's information era, it is relatively easy for someone to study Islamic Law at foundation level or in its complex entirety. You may not even need to learn Arabic as most of the important legal texts have been translated into English and other languages.

 

You cannot make comparisons if you don't have the necessary information.

 

 

To "prove" that I just have to cite just ONE Sharia punishment that is contradicted by what Allah ordained in Quran. There are several but the most notable is the punishment of

adultery

. Sharia law proscribes stoning to death.

While Allah delineated in the Quran only 100 lashes.

LoL. The punishment for proven adultery (a married person sleeping with someone other than their wife/husband) is death. The 100 lashes is punishment for proven fornication (an unmarried person engaging in pre-marital sex), NOT adultery. *Duh*

[Viking]

Socod_badne,

So all 1.2 billion around the globe should find a way to move to the four countries that [claim to] practise Sharia Law or else they are against Sharia Law itself? Is such your reasonning? :eek:

 

Why are you refusing to answer my question? Do you think the laws in the Qur'an are only to be applied in homes and not in governments? Is the law of usury, taxes etc NOT to be applied on state policies?

 

 

FYI, laws are NEVER based on our whims. Even for nonbelievers. Rather they're imposed on us by our environment and mitigating circumstances.

Allah has forbidden the consuption and sale and of alcohol and IF the society (environment) pressures the govt to allow the establishment of a brewery and permission to sell it in shops then the people will be following their own whims/desires while ignoring Islamic Law. Don't you agree?

 

PS: How do you explain away the following verse?

 

To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: SO JUDGE BETWEEN THEM BY WHAT ALLAH HATH REVEALED, AND FOLLOW NOT THEIR VAIN DESIRES, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee. TO EACH AMONG YOU WE HAVE PRESCRIBED A LAW AND AN OPEN WAY. If Allah had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) TO TEST YOU IN WHAT HE HATH GIVEN YOU: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to Allah. it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute; (Qur'an 5:48)

[makalajabti]

Gosh ! And none of you have ever lived in an islamic country or have ever been subjected to Sharia law!!And you are all craving for it?

[Johnny B]

So , an innocent human life is about to persih becouse a man for some personal reason finds Jesus more trustworthy than Mohamed.

Now, if the Islamic faith is based on free and convenient doctorine that you freely come into of your own conveniency and stay out of it of your own inconveniency as there is no compulsion in the religion , then the notion "Islam is a peaceful ,self-explanatory, roubust and true religious faith " would inquestionably prevail , but since you enforce the Faith by the grimmest punishment possible instead of it´s clarity, intellectual persuasiveness , practical cogency and self-explanatory devineness , it is irreconcilable with the above notion..

you can´t frankly know what is really in the minds of the people, period. Human conscience is not available for penal judgement.

With such a grim punishment as an enforcement of a religious faith ,

you´ll have to think that life is not a precious and a valueable thing but a fucntion of a vague idea.

 

I understand the psycological effect that punishment can have on the beleivers , and unless one is batting an embarrassing zero, properly understood, some Sharia laws beeing applied here are the most cogent force for devoting oneself to un-islamic life as ever conceived.

[Khayr]

MashaAllah,

Despite all the efforts that the world's leading stooges have put into 'liberalizing' Afghanistanistaan, this still occurs-ALHAMDULILLAH. The majority of afghanis still have respect for the Shariah and unlike some on here, wouldn't DARE to question its authority.

 

Ahura,

 

Shariah gets its source from Quran and Sunnah which are both Diven Sources. Hence, making Shariah = DIVINE LAW. Why else did the Rasul (salallahu caliyhe) spend 23yrs delineating the Shariah to us and then the Ulama have elucidated on the Rasul (salallahu caliyhe) and his sahaba's application of the Shariah.

 

Johnny,

 

No Complusion in Religion is for those that are Ahl-al-kitab (People of the book) that pay Jaziyah (tax for living in shariah land, while you are an 'Ahl al Kitabi'. You have to be 'born' as an 'Ahl-al Kitabi' and not a 'convert' from Islam to Christainty. The Ulama are Unanimous on this. (If you read the Quranic explanations/TAFASIR books, you would know this.) If you leave ISLAM and become a Christian or anything else, you become an Apostate and there is no ambiguity about it.

 

Ibitisam,

 

A MUSLIM does not EQUAL a NON-MUSLIM.

I think that as time goes, we start to think of ourselves as being EQUAL all under the banner of 'HUMANISM-We are all part of Humanity after all'.

 

Gotta go...

 

Fi Amanillah

[Khalaf]

Salaamu Lah,

 

^^^^^Islam is not just a religion is complete system, a body so when u proclaim the shadah you proclaim allegiance to this body, thus if u turn back on that allegiance u have become one who opposes that system and is an enemy, a traitor to that system who will actively work to undermine that system, thus the person must be delt with in proper manner. But for real, they want us to believe that someone who understood the meaning of lah illah illah wa ana Muhammad rasulullah, and who knows who Jesus (as) is in Qu’ran, and who read the story of Mary (as) in the Qu’ran, and had fruit of iman in his heart, chose Christianity, religion that teaches your lord and savior is mere a human being who with his blood u will have eternal life and peace without work and deeds. Bull! Where is the rest of the story, money or chance to live in America to this poor afghan. Give me a break.

 

As for shariah, this is an important issue. Let’s not be argue for the sake of argument, but instead discuss and learn something. This is to SB, MJ and those who hold similar views (I am not calling u out just want to know where u are coming from): What is shariah first of all? Please do clearly present your case, your views so we can have discussion. Salaam

[Jacpher]

How would it feel to debate and try to convince a solid rock to find a shelter for the upcoming winter storms? It really feels that way when you engage a debate about Sharia with someone who doubts the infallibility of the prophets and argues his knowledge about Islam is beyond imagination that he does not need the hadiths or the work of the Taabiciyin & Culumaa of Islam. You don’t expect a carpenter to design world-class airplane and likewise, you don’t discuss graduate level mathematics with second grader. That would be pointless. I am in no way suggesting to stop educating people about Islam. That would be wrong as prophet Nuux cs spent 950 years calling his people to the deen.

 

SB is indeed Muslim but he rejects the Sunnah and picks and chooses parts of the Quran. For instance, he repeatedly cites the verses in regards with compulsion in religion but refuses to the ones that direct Muslims to strictly follow and adhere to the prophet’s sunnah [read al-Hashr 7 ]. A good analogy of this would be accepting prophets Mohamed, Yusuf & Ibrahim while rejecting Issa, Adam or Zakariya. Separating the Quran from the sunnah is similar with separation of the shahada of Allah to that of the prophet csw or that of a salaat and its sujuud. Believing in only one prophet does not constitute believing in all the messengers and a prayer with no sujuud is just not a prayer [with exception of Janazah]. All of these things are inseparable.

 

Sharia isn’t as simple as locking up or stoning anyone that commits adultery or steals. It has rules and regulation that need to be followed just like other systems. Actually, it is more difficult if not nearly impossible to prove a case under Islamic sharia. Now that SB mentioned adultery, the court would have to bring four witnesses who saw the act with their naked eyes. Keep in mind seeing two people naked in bed doesn’t mean they did it. The court would have to prove the alleged crime took place. Four witnesses need to testify under oath they saw both parties’ genitals come together like a bowel of cereal and spoon. Yeah that difficult. Not if it’s done in the middle of the highway with all traffic passing by. Perhaps you don’t know this but the court has no business forcing to have you confess or drag you to the court about something you allegedly did behind closed door unless it involves a criminal act on others. Islam encourages against confessing/broadcasting your sins since Allah kept your secret with you.

[Gabbal]

SB is indeed Muslim

I know you mean to appease good Ducaqabe, but that statement makes a mockery of all practicing good Muslims.

 

Islam is a complete way of life and should be accepted entirely. You cannot pick and choose as if you are in an all you can eat buffet.

[Jacpher]

Horn, I can sense some contradiction in my above statement but by professing the Shahada puts him into the fold of Islam. I’m not in a position to decide his Islamness whether it goes beyond name or not but he certainly has a track record of having plenty of time passing harsh judgment on Islamic traditions, laws and customs. I wonder why he gets so defensive whenever a nomad criticizes swing clubs, gay bars and prostitution. Maybe he wishes to run for office one day and concerned that someone might google him up.

[Gabbal]

I wonder why he gets so defensive whenever a nomad criticizes swing clubs, gay bars and prostitution.

Indeed.

[Socod_badne]

Originally posted by MC Xamar:

wasn't Somalia plunged into CIVIL WAR and most of it's displaced citizens didn't really have a choice in which country they would take asylum?

 

Good thing you mentioned that... what was the civil about that initially forced out so many somalis? It certainly wasn't about establishing the Sharia Law! The Sharia law was never a priority for Somalis. Hope it stays that way.

 

 

And aren't some of us (including myself) born in non-Muslim countries and can't just pack up and move to Muslim countries whenever we want?

 

 

Who is stopping you from leaving for Sharia Law country? Tell me what law or force is physically contraining you? You say you can't leave and that is because you don't want to give up what the West gives for what Sharia has for you. The trade off in life style, living standards, health, education, employment, justice, peace, equality etc is not worth it. That is the reality, like it or hate it. But since the reality of your predicament is too painful to swallow you perform absurd mental calisthenics like above among others to delude yourself so as to feel reassured that your hypocracy is palatable. You're welcome to it. Beware though some of us have firmer grip on reality and aren't shy in letting you know about it.

 

 

Your argument that I have rejected Sharia Law based upon where I live is baseless and actually quite st^upid.

I couldn't give a toss of what you think of my arguement. It's what you do that earns you what you're called. You are what you do NOT what you think. If you're convinced of Sharia Law's divinity then stop living under system that consigns it inferior status!