Isnt ironic...........

[Blessed]

^^^ Well said!

 

I agree with most of your comments except for the one about a girl in jeans and islam mixing!

 

You ppl really need to losen up on the jeans issue lol sisters don't set out to make religiouse or political statements by waering jeans... it just an item of clothing!

 

Yes, idealy a sister should wear the hijab but wearing jeans doesn't make her a non-muslim!

 

 

Brown_Suga

 

Though I agree with you in saying that your friend is being hypocritical and idealistic. Truthfully, his statements are the requirements of the deen. When your married your status is different, you know culturally a girl is 'inan timo daban' prior to marrige and 'shaashley' after marriege... most brothers still beleive in this concept.... which isn't all bad if U think about it...

 

 

sorry if my comments are muddled up .... laters.

 

 

nice topic tho.

[Business_Man]

LOL to shyhem. Good comment. Well let me see. Men are not intimidated by women really. Its just a mental game that u women are good at!.

 

I wont want to be seen walking with my wife wearing tight clothes by my mother and father on the streets!. Imagine the looks she will get from other men as well!. I would not force my wife to change her dress style but she has to be respectable in public. At home she can wear anything or even nothing!.

 

But when we step out of the door, i would like her to wear at least something sweet, sexy but not too revealing. I would not force her to wear a hijab though!.

 

As for the man, he shouldn't try to control her but advice her. Advising her will do more good than by forcing her to do something she doesn't want to do. This will only make the situation worse!.LOL

[Captivating_SouL]

Che-Guevara you're rite, perhaps i need to elobrate tad bit when i said " i have a western world"... it was a referrence a friend of mind made; to which in his words said " i want a girl who is cultural,relgious and still have a modern western mentility as well as still have a firm grib on our roots. So from ther, i used myself for an example, emphasis on how withhold those traits being in a modern world...you followin along? So that's the only reason i brought it to context--and just to clearfy neva did i say "i only have a western mentility" if you read back to the start of this post.

One more other thing; Che- i brought the relgion up because i know some farah would try and reverse things around...you can say just as per caution.

 

*1

xxx

[Captivating_SouL]

Ameenah macaan how many times have i said this...I AM AWARE OF THE RELGION GUIDLINES BUT THE QUESTION I'M ASKING HAS LIL OR NOTHING TO DO WITH THE RELGION. QUESTION: DO YOU THINK AN INDIVIDUAL SHOULD GO INTO A RELGION WITH THE INTENSION TO CHNGE THE OTHER"...THAT IS MY PRIMARY QUESTION AND YES IT THE WHOLE JEANS THING IS CONNECTION WITH THE RELGION AND WHAT NOT BUT ASIDE FROM, LETS NOT FOCUS TOO MUCH ON THAT. BUT THANX FOR THE INTAKE...

 

MR.MILLENIUM, UMM INTESTING, SO YOU THINK WE'RE THE QUEENS OF DAME IN YA WORDS "PLAY GAMES"..ITS NOT REALLY MORE OR LESS OF THAT; EVERYONE HAS THEIR VIEWS. ONE COMMMENT WHICH YOU SAID IN REFERRENCE TO THE JEANS WAS RIDICIOUS, YOU STARTED OFF WITH I DONT WANT MY FAMILY, FRIENDS ETC TO SEE HER LIKE THAT? AND THEN YOU WENT ON A DIFF. TRAIL AND SAID I DONT MIND IF SHE DOESNT WEAR HIJAB?...SO ARE YOU REALLY CONCERN WHAT PEOPLE THINK OR WHAT YOU THINK. CUZ TAKING FROM THAT STATMENT, I TAKE IT AS YOU'RE NOT THAT RELGION (CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG) BUT YET YOU WANT YOUR "WIFE" TO NOT WEAR JEANS. SOMEONE HAS ALREADY CONCLUDED THAT MALES AND FEMALES ARE DIFF IN THEIR WAYS, SO PLEASE LETS NOT FOCUS ON WHAT "WE" AS SISTAH'S NEED TO CHANGE BUT IN FACT WHAT "WE" ALL NEED TO CHANGE TO BENEFIT OURSELVES AND OUR MOST OF ALL DEEEN.

 

*1

XXX

[Captivating_SouL]

sorry i was in a rush and had made some errors to the question at hand.

 

QUESTION: DO YOU THINK AN INDIVIDUAL SHOULD GO INTO A RELATIONSHIP (NOT RELGION)WITH THE INTENSION TO CHNGE THE OTHER"..

[Gediid]

Suppose you get married have a couple of kids and your wife's favorite outfit is a pair of hip hugging jeans and a tank top.What sort of influence will that have on your kids?

Seeing their mother dress like an adolescnet sure as hell isn't the role model they desire.Now tell me what if your mom dressed like that what impression would that have had on you?

Life is not stagnant, its a fluid process and eveyone goes through stages which differ.Getting married is the ultimate and final process where one has to stop thinking in terms of being one and has to express emotions and feelings in the plural

sense.One has adapt a way that is compatible with the wishes of the other.I think thats what marriage is all about.

So where am I going with this,well some in here tend to paint a picture that even though I am married I can continue living my life as before and not care about how my mate feels.That I think is a recipe for disaster.You do have to respect your husband's/wife's wishes and make as many sacrifices as possible.That I think is what our parents did and that is why thy have been married forever unlike couples today, married today divorced tommorrow.

[Ariadne]

Maybe the problem is the high expectations people have of each other (no one is going to change because you made them change they will change for themselves when their time comes).

[Thinkerman]

sorry i was in a rush and had made some errors to the question at hand.

 

QUESTION: DO YOU THINK AN INDIVIDUAL SHOULD GO INTO A RELATIONSHIP (NOT RELGION)WITH THE INTENSION TO CHNGE THE OTHER"..

 

Perhaps if u werent in such a rush u wouldnt make such errors, an relationship minus religon? Infact a thought process that is abstract as that is just not logical. Thats why before deciding on any matter in reality ppl usually references some authorities, expirences precendents or so forth. With your question u cannot just ask it as if it where outside religon as it doesnt make sense to pretend so.

 

Good or bad, whether u think it fair or not once someone enters such a relationship a guy would expect, rightly so, that she dress moderatly, dam she sould dress moderatly on her own accord its common sense.

[Valenteenah.]

I agree with some of the above posts and whatever I was going to say has already been said (and very well too I might add) by the likes of Khayr, Che-, Ameenah and Gediid.

 

I would only add that the majority of married ladies do dress modestly (loose clothing...hijaab...etcetra). I think most women understand that a lot of responsibility comes with marriage (including the need to dress accordingly). They don't need their husbands to tell them their duties. I'm slightly offended at that implication. Give the ladies some credit! :rolleyes:

 

Brown sugar,

 

If I try to answer your question "DO YOU THINK AN INDIVIDUAL SHOULD GO INTO A RELATIONSHIP (NOT RELGION)WITH THE INTENSION TO CHNGE THE OTHER"..

I would say that realistically an individual shouldn't go into marriage with the explicit intent of changing their partner's ways, but rather with an understanding that some changes are necessary- no, crucial- from both sides in order to have a [hopefully] long, prosperous and blessed marriage.

[Baashi]

so i guess after all what am asking you is, do you think someone should have the intension of changing the person their with or go with the flow even though it doesnt meet your critia>?....=====--- & if you love someone should something like that break you.

Sure! I may wanna go into relationship knowing that my wife-to-be is not so perfect but reasonable...and can be persuaded into accepting what's right for the well-being of the family and the kids...just as I am willing to do the same for the sake of my family. That, practically, amounts changing the person. It's widely assumed that you can't change your spouse. But don't overlook the less obvious truth: that you still have great influence over him or her. Because we're relational creatures, we're influenced through our relationships. I don't mean manipulation. That never works, because the moment your spouse realizes you're trying to exert control, there'll be rebellion. Nobody wants to be controlled.

 

if you love someone should something like that break you? Not necesserily! Love sometimes makes u blind to see trivial things like that or u are so overtaken that u are willing to overlook it.

 

Hope it helps.

[Blessed]

Originally posted by Brown_Sugah:

I AM AWARE OF THE RELGION GUIDLINES BUT THE QUESTION I'M ASKING HAS LIL OR NOTHING TO DO WITH THE RELGION. QUESTION: DO YOU THINK AN INDIVIDUAL SHOULD GO INTO A RELGION WITH THE INTENSION TO CHNGE THE OTHER"...THAT IS MY PRIMARY QUESTION

I hear what your saying sis .... but in my understanding Somali Men's thought mechanisims are influenced by religion and culture. Like I said, getting married is a major transition which places the necessity to change on the individual. It is as if we have these un-spoken rules about what a married women should or should not wear or how a married man/ woman conducts herself..

 

I think that your friend and other Somali brothers are verbalising these concepts .. they maybe over estimating their positions ... but fact is women / men do and will change after marriege. Thats the whole point in taking that next step in the relationship mahaa? A girl friend is not like a wife ....

[Captivating_SouL]

Gedid

You said that "female" should dress appropiate for the sake of her child so they too dont repeat the same step. On that level i agree; but who said anything as to if it came down to that. Perhaps i should of made things even more clear; when i asked that question, i was making a referrence btw themselves w/ any involvment of any children.----I've seen my shares of brotha's who in the past screwed, played and beaten their girlfriends but after the age of 25 when they realize hey, i need someone not for love but for other reasons.

 

That makes me sick to my stomach, you mean to tell me just because you changed atmosphere that your ish isnt going to follow you to your new environment? I'm just saying you 'GUYS' are tad bit harsh on your sistah's and when i say that i'm making any connections to the jeans issue. I believe we're more logical and understanding when it comes to you guys; for instances; when you "as in guys" have your pants hangin (fashion error); deal w/ drugs, play the game like a pro, have girls pregant, be male hoe, have a past etc. But when i sistah wearin a jeans pops up; that automically discourages you from steppin up..WHY? I'm not sayin we're understandin to everythin you do and espically when you pregant anotha girl or deal w/ drug but least we;re there for you as your friends, sistahs in a support system. So tell me exactly the problem apart from the relgion. Ohh culture okay, well we're 21st century and it about time that it dunned all of you that we cant possible be doing the same things our ancestories use to in the past..WHY ; new relvenlation! new day...but that doesnt mean we forgotten.

[shyhem]

Brown sugah

U seem to be so bitter that i'm coming to believe Malaria tablets are sweeter than u.

 

Anyway forget about the whole independent woman notion u have been preaching for last couple of days,certainly it won't take u anywhere epecially when it comes to Somali men.Stick to the basics and u definately get a farah from the factory.

[Gediid]

Brown Suga

 

Walaalo there seems to be this concept in your mind that men and women are the same.The only similarity between the 2 is that they are both God's creation but everything else is different.I honestly believe that women are a symbol of virtouosness and as such should demonstrate that.How she dresses,walks and talks contributes to that.You can label a man anything that you can come up with and that label won't stick,on the other hand you label a woman a whore and that will haunt her for ever.Call this a cold world but that is how it is.

A woman in other words has a larger responsibilty on her shoulders than a man when it comes to how people percieve her.She has to walk a fine line period.This is in her interest and the interest of those people who care about her.

[Che -Guevara]

Brown-Sugah......That farah must have really pissed off. I have never said you only had western mentality..i was merely wondering wat was your defination of being western oriented.

Anyway going back to your question, I think people can expect these changes even we take religion out of equation. Partners can talk to each other about things that each are not comfortable with. As for the question, why would one marry someone whose they might disagree with on certain. I think realistically, when people meet and begun be fond of each other , they are more interested in being each other's company rather than worrying what farah or halimo is wearing or doing. If they get married, thats new stage in their life and must accept things that come with this new phase which includes taking into consideration how your mate feels about things.Anyone who thinks life after marraige is gonna stay the same before marriage is day-dreaming. N about somali guys listing qualities they look for in somali woman, they are merely expressing expection or desire. It is no different when somali girl make a list of what her mate should be!(tall, mascular, or what have you).

N about jeans issue, everyone has to wear whatever they so desire. But the question is really approipate for one's age and status. I can't personally imagine in being mid 30s and my wife is still wearing jeans n T-shirts looking like Brittney. Every culture including eurowhite cultures expects married folks to be modest and behave in certian way. In the same manner, i don't think no somali woman would see her husband looking like thug with hip-hop clothes.

I can understand young men and women wearing baggy jeans and tight ass jeans respectively when they are in their teens n early twenties.

But being close to 30 or already there and still wearing the same clothing as one did in thier teens or early twenties doesn't make much sense unless if one is from showbiz industry.