Clan enclaves & Villa Somalia at odds.

[gooni]

yuunis

Adiguna dhexdhexaad baad noqotay sida qoraalkaaga ka muuqata

 

dhexdhexaadka waa shay diinteenu amartay xaqiiqdiina aan cidna dhib u keenayn.

 

Dad nadaam la'aan ku koray kuwo kali talis lasoo koray toosh kuma shidi karaan aragtidayda.

 

federaal kala dambayn leh iyo dastuur iyo is maqal ma haysaa?

 

Dawlad dhexe oo dimuquraadiya oo kali talisnimo ka caaggan ma haysaa?

 

Intee dawladood oo afrikaana yaa ku dhaqanta nadaamka fedaraalka?

 

waa kuwee? habkee ugu dhaqmaan?

 

Al-cayn iyo shaariqa maka hor imaan karaan go'aanka ubudabay?

 

maxaa keenay inay isku mowqif noqdaan? maxaa qaarkood qatar u taageeri waayeen?

 

Waa maxay sababta aysoomaaliya ugu muhiimsanaatay kuwait iyo cumaan khilaafkan khaliijka?

 

Taageerada galmudug maxay kusoo kordhin kartaa khilaafka carabta?

 

Maxaa keenay in madax goboleedyadu midba mar wakhti u dhaxeeyo jacaylka imaaraadka lasoo tooso?

 

Maxay noo caawin waayeen markay daarta aduunka ugu dheer dhisayeen somaalida caruurtooduna gorgorku cunayay-soo axaadiista iyo quraankuba af carabi kuma qorna?

 

Afeef

Uguma talo galin inaad ka jawaabto su'aalahaas tirada badan balse waxaan is leeyahay akhrintoodu waa jawaab.

 

 

[YoniZ]

Oday Gooni, waa suaalo xikmad ku qotoma intaasoo dhan.

 

Burburka jiilka ku koray waa waaya arag, dareensan xaalada dhabt ah ee dalka iyo dadka maanta kusuganyahay. Jiilkii waxbarasho iyo caafimaad bilaash ah nasiibka u helay, waxay weli ku riyoodaan maalmihii tegay. Soofiyeet bilaa xisaabtan ah warshado iyo cudud ciidan uu dhisay ayaa weli ku haya indha sarcaad. (Intaa waa iga Kaftan)

 

Hadii aanu inagu qurux u yeelin madaxda maanta talada haysa, wadanka haka sugin inuu qurxoonaado. Hadii aanu toosin, nidaamka hadda curdanka ah, xageed kasugaysaa cid toosisa. Dhaliisha hadeysan aheyn mid wax lagu toosinayo, waxa fiican in laga dhowrsado.

 

Maamulka ugu da'dayar federaalka weli ma gu' jirsan. Marka soo maaha cadaalad daro, in layiraahdo wax walba may noqdaan mid qalooc kamaran.

 

Aan wax toosino, hadii midaas aysan dhici karin, afkeena yaanan wax kudumin. (Intaana waa iga Talo)

[galbeedi]

Yoniz,

 

you are right. I posted the two posts at the same time before I read what peaceAction wrote. The second one was was delayed somehow.

 

Now, I must respond arguing against the huge tide in favor of federalism as practised in Somalia. Of course I am pragmatists when it comes of dialogue and compromise between Somalis.. Having said that from now on count me among those who will be fighting to dismantle the federal system at it stands today.

 

Some of you rightly think that we are making the life difficult for the new president by confronting the regional states. I do not believe that Farmaajo or Khayre to have a backbone or even means to confront these states. Both of them are weak and both are implementing the what international community proscribed for both.

 

 

PA said, Farmaajo and Khyre understand this dilemma and are not rebuking the federal member states..

 

The men leading Puntland and South west and other states know that they and the federal government have to fill up same forms to get the badly needed financial help. from the donors So, why would they listen to someone who has just a name title as a president..

 

Some of you have stated that you want a weak federal system, where the power of the national government is balanced and checked by the regional states. THat kind of system will drag the country for another quarter century. A nation coming from a civil war and anarchy, needs to reconcile the tribal interests of the country, but you must have a unified leadership to impliment the tough decisions needed to impliment anything. For example, when the government established the " Ciidanka Nabadaynta Caasimada"{ , certain tribal interests opposed , but the government did stick to it's a gun with great success

 

Yoniz said, I will take someone serious the day they live among their ppl and, make statements based on reality.

 

Well, my friend this is not rocket science. You do not need to reinvent the wheel. Somalia is not the only nation that went civil war and mayhem. Look at Rwanda, four years after the genocide they were sending peacekeepers to South Sudan. Look at Sierra Leone and many more. There is a huge interest among certain segments, especially the business community to drag this issue, because , if peace and accountability comes back, they might lose their cash.

 

You can not do the same thing and expect different result. In Hargeisa,, when I use to ask people why the system is not working?, the diaspora would say, " you do not know the reality on the ground.". Well, change means making tough decisions.

 

How can anyone respect this pounds with Small meagre resources, yet setting up huge unsustainable bureaucracy that is undermining progress. With fifty or sixty ministers, what is left for education and health. A friend of mine who just came back from Puntland told me that without the money given to Puntland to fight Al-shabaab, they will be broke. So, who knows the Galgala affair could be a cash cow for C/weli and company.

 

Muxuu tidhi Xaafka Galmudug, " Lacag baan u doonanay Dubai".

 

He knows that if he does not get the money , soon he could be impeached by hungary haynes in Cadaado.

 

The same could be said about C/weli. Where is the $15 million he took from Dubai.

 

If people follow your logic, Somalia will stay in the quagmire for another decade.

 

Nothing is sacred when it comes to Somali politicians and their supporters.. THey are cheap and greedy. A strong leader could dismantle these region, because they are fragile and corrupt within their system.

 

I rather be a small fish and the big Somali sea than a big fish inside a dirty pound.

 

Who knows , many of you could probably change their mind if the Ethiopian federal model copied by for Somalia dissolves in an ethnic based states. I do follow Ethiopian media from time to time and there is a trend going on. The Tigray media is promoting a new union for the Tigray people in Eritrea and Ethiopia if Ethiopia dissolves.

 

 

The ethnicity federation is not sustainable because every ethnicity thinking for himself and considered himself instead their country.

 

The same could be said about the tribal federalism led by warlords and greedy politicians from the diaspora who never built anything in their life, As the time goes they are getting worse in terms of governance and cohesiveness of their people.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Che -Guevara]

I think whether federalism stays or not, one thing all Somalis need to ask themselves is have our fortunes changed for the better since the formation mini-states? It is more than clear the federal states can't deliver anything, not even the basic services, can't defend the country and is easily manipulated.

 

We need devolution with strong central government. Whatever we do, issues of defense, foreign affairs, economic and monetary management and internal security should be in the hands of the federal government.

 

The federal states need to be democratized too and the demography of each region should be reflected in each government and by that I mean, for instance, there is huge population of R-weyne family in Puntland, they represent large chunk of the residents in Bosaso, Galkayo and many towns, that population should be represented in Pland parliament and municipalities.

 

Same thing should be replicated everywhere.

 

 

 

 

[llat]

@Che -Guevara

said:

The federal states need to be democratized too and the demography of each region should be reflected in each government and by that I mean, for instance, there is huge population of R-weyne family in Puntland, they represent large chunk of the residents in Bosaso, Galkayo and many towns, that population should be represented in Pland parliament and municipalities..

 

That is the most asinine suggestion I ever heard and a recipe for sowing the next clan conflict. Rahanwein should return to their lands and farms in the south, they have a Federal state now, they are not disenfranchised people anymore, they are very wealthy by Somali standards.

[galbeedi]

You probably a young man who resides in the diaspora. yet you seem to ignore the basic rights of the Somali citizens. We ,the diaspora have left our homes (Somalia) as refugees and settled many countries around the world. We became citizens, and some of us even elected as parliamentarians to serve the new communities.

 

Now. this guy--Ilat, where you kids get these names any way--thinks Somalis who left their homes during the war and drought ,do not have the right to vote or settle any place they like. They do not need to go back , they are within their rights to settle Hiiraan, Gaalkacayo or Boosaaso. After many years of repeating lies, you probably believe that every land of the country belong to certain clans.

 

In the sixties during the democratic years, Puntland politicians were elected in Hiiraan, Kismaayo and Mogadishu. Reer Baidoa, will be elected from Mogadishu, Boosaaso and Borama. That is the future of democracy and legitimate presentation.

[llat]

@galbeedi

said:You probably a young man who resides in the diaspora. yet you seem to ignore the basic rights of the Somali citizens. We ,the diaspora have left our homes (Somalia) as refugees and settled many countries around the world. We became citizens, and some of us even elected as parliamentarians to serve the new communities.

 

You are comparing Western Societies to a primitive nomadic herder society based on on clans and an honor system. Can't be serious

 

 

 

 

 

Now. this guy--Ilat, where you kids get these names any way--thinks Somalis who left their homes during the war and drought ,do not have the right to vote or settle any place they like. They do not need to go back , they are within their rights to settle Hiiraan, Gaalkacayo or Boosaaso. After many years of repeating lies, you probably believe that every land of the country belong to certain clans.

 

I'm not diaspora nor young, enough with the condescending tone..

 

i didn't choose the llat username, I actually chose Garas, don't know what happened.

 

What do you mean by "After many years of repeating lies, you probably believe that every land of the country belong to certain clans ?

 

In the sixties during the democratic years, Puntland politicians were elected in Hiiraan, Kismaayo and Mogadishu. Reer Baidoa, will be elected from Mogadishu, Boosaaso and Borama. That is the future of democracy and legitimate presentation

 

That was wrong, it was not a postive thing. It's what created the animosity and resentment till today.

[llat]

@galbeedi

said:

 

You probably a young man who resides in the diaspora. yet you seem to ignore the basic rights of the Somali citizens. We ,the diaspora have left our homes (Somalia) as refugees and settled many countries around the world. We became citizens, and some of us even elected as parliamentarians to serve the new communities

Why has my initial post not shown up..

 

I m not diaspora or young.

 

Comparing Western societies to Somali nomadic herder clan based and honor system shows your not a serious person..

 

 

 

Now. this guy--Ilat, where you kids get these names any way--thinks Somalis who left their homes during the war and drought ,do not have the right to vote or settle any place they like. They do not need to go back , they are within their rights to settle Hiiraan, Gaalkacayo or Boosaaso.

 

I chose the username Garas, don't who chose this name for me.

A

 

fter many years of repeating lies, you probably believe that every land of the country belong to certain clans.

 

What the heck does that mean, explain ?

 

In the sixties during the democratic years, Puntland politicians were elected in Hiiraan, Kismaayo and Mogadishu. Reer Baidoa, will be elected from Mogadishu, Boosaaso and Borama. That is the future of democracy and legitimate presentation.

 

And that was not positive thing and I don't support that arrangement, the reason there is so much resentment and animosity till now.

 

Ciao

 

 

 

[Che -Guevara]

If we are to accept your rationale, every Somali will not go out of his house. Every sub-sub-sub clan might as well have their own "country". After all, Somali conflict goes beyond major clans. It is a case, "I, against my brothers. I and my brothers against my cousins. I and my brothers and my cousins against the world".

[galbeedi]

Garas is a good name. From now on will call you garas. Bear with me I hate to write on the I phone. No one is Dishouring anyone we are tribal nomads who went through war famine and anarchy. Some times the biggest threat to our own safety is our clan. You might not know but your uncle or father might have died defending hargrisa or bay Believe me if peace comes we might even intermingle more. A friend came from Borama two weeks ago and he told me that more than 10% of the population is from southern Somalia he said the city doubled in size and could be the third largest city in Somalia. Business is booming due this influx and I am delighted. I wish Borama could be the next melting pot. Finally. I do not mean to put you down but more popolation growth in puntland should be good. And if the bay guys elect one or two members of parliament it is even better.

[llat]

@Che -Guevara

said:

If we are to accept your rationale, every Somali will not go out of his house. Every sub-sub-sub clan might as well have their own "country". After all, Somali conflict goes beyond major clans. It is a case, "I, against my brothers. I and my brothers against my cousins. I and my brothers and my cousins against the world".

 

As long we aren't able to transcend our clan identities and truly become a nation then yes every one should stick to his tuulo.

 

P

 

[Che -Guevara]

You don't transcend anything by doing nothing.

[llat]

@Che -Guevara

said:

You don't transcend anything by doing nothing.

 

Rahanwein and Oromos should return to their lands.

 

X

[llat]

@galbeedi

said:

Garas is a good name. From now on will call you garas. Bear with me I hate to write on the I phone. No one is Dishouring anyone we are tribal nomads who went through war famine and anarchy. Some times the biggest threat to our own safety is our clan. You might not know but your uncle or father might have died defending hargrisa or bay Believe me if peace comes we might even intermingle more. A friend came from Borama two weeks ago and he told me that more than 10% of the population is from southern Somalia he said the city doubled in size and could be the third largest city in Somalia. Business is booming due this influx and I am delighted. I wish Borama could be the next melting pot. Finally. I do not mean to put you down but more popolation growth in puntland should be good. And if the bay guys elect one or two members of parliament it is even better.

 

I guess its my pessimistic outlook on life, but I see trouble down the line. If one were to to go back to 60's and 70's to Xamar and other parts of the south you would've seen different clans existing side by side peacefully, intermarrying, their kids playing soccer together, going to school together, any fair minded Somali would have concluded that as positive development and that we are headed to post clan future. But that was the surface, if you could cared to scratch a little deep you'd find clan identity salient as ever. If you honestly ask the Boramites, they many not be so welcoming of the influx of the southerners.

 

PL doesn't need population growth, it needs a cull lol, as does the rest of Somalia. The population explosion is scary.

[YoniZ]

Every Somali should enjoy the right to vote and, stand for political position in every state, regardless of which clan he/she belongs to. In equal measure he/she shuld take the responsibility of safeguarding the safety and, contribute to the development of the state he resides.

 

Clan representation in state government bodies have to stop. We can make that happen, if we concentrate our efforts in making positive changes and, direct the youth to tangible progress.

 

Gelbeedi, I will advise you to use your talent to encourage good governance, not going back to anarchism or, totalitarian regime. The system you have now, with its imperfections, is a base to build on. As you may well know, demolishing is much more easier than building.