The Worldwide Spread Of Islamic Revolutionism...

[CidanSultan]

Case In point:

 

Operation shock and awe.

 

 

Fast forward 2014:

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5tB0HcPG7c

 

 

 

[Tallaabo]

[DoctorKenney]

I completely agree with the analysis of Erdogan...and this is why I'm such a strong supporter of Tayyip Erdogan and Mohamed Morsi. These men know that we're living in a decadent time-period. They know that the establishment of an Islamic System would be near-impossible today, especially with the deep corruption which still exists within some of the people in Egypt and Turkey.

 

Morsi unfortunately failed in his objectives, but we need to try again. And try harder. And it was due to his poorly-calculated political mistakes.

 

Which is why their strategy to slowly push their countries in a more Islamic direction is a good strategy. Turkey is far more Islamic today than it was in 2000. The difference is like night and day. People are far more religious today and the country is developing a more Islamic character. In a generation or two, there may be more widespread public support for an Islamic-Style Government in Turkey. And the same can happen in Egypt, in Tunisia, in Yemen, in Sudan and in many other countries including Somalia. After educating the people, obtaining grassroots support, we can then work towards the establishment of some "unity" between the various Muslim States, such as a military alliance like NATO or a political/economic alliance such as the European Union. This can then set the framework for a new Caliphate in the future.

 

This is the methodology of Erdogan. This is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. And I believe this strategy can ultimately succeed, by the Will of Allah.

[Tallaabo]

Here is the Saudi dictatorship crushing the revolution

http://rt.com/news/saudi-police-fire-protestors-qatif-wounded-212/

[CidanSultan]

Talabo your a very strange man. You have no understanding of what you are talking about because if you understood the Shia creed you would never support it. This struggle between Islam and the west is an ideological struggle between the forces of conservatism, tawhid, societal advancement and the western secularist godless system of endless materialism and degeneration. The battle between the Shia and Islam is one of the most important struggles. If you support the Shia you support Karbala as the new Mecca, you support Hussein and Ali as God not the supreme Creator. If you support Shia you support the death of all Sunnis this is their objective. Talabo clearly supports this.

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8BMf39TlZE

 

 

 

[Khadafi]

<cite>

@DoctorKenney

said:</cite>

Khadafi, I hate Al Shabab more than you can imagine. I've said it before on this forum numerous times. And I agree that the term "Islamist" is outright silly and redundant. It doesn't really mean anything, and is a made-up term by the media and Western policymakers. But there has always been a difference of opinion in Islam. Even during the days of the Caliphate, you had differences of opinion between the earliest generations of Muslims. Scholars have engaged in dialogue with each other, as well as with Christians and Jews for centuries, and this is nothing new in our history. We've been doing this for centuries. Men such as Ahmed Godane and Mullah Omar go against the very spirit of our religion, and are autocratic Rulers who use the name of the religion for their own personal ambitions. But what we all can agree on, is that we should strive towards the establishment of an Islamic government, and to spread Islamic ideals throughout the world. Today you have groups such as the Muslim Brotherhood, and within their ranks you have differences of opinion as well as differences in methodology. The least we can do is to leave our differences of opinion in our private lives. But when we engage the public, then we should strive to use Islamic principles as well as the principles of dialogue and compromise to govern the country. We even have a term for that in Islam and it's called

Shura

. The earliest generations of Muslims used it, as well as the subsequent Caliphs. And for hundreds of years, when we Muslims stuck to our principles, the Muslim World was at the forefront of the globe. Muslims in Somalia today should work on building their communities from the ground-up, infusing the communities with Islamic values and principles. Actions such as being a pious individual, standing against corruption, setting up charities and educating the people can go a long way. Muslims in Sudan and Nigeria and Pakistan can do the same thing, and then we can all slowly begin to create Islamic-style governments, which rule according to Islamic principles. When that happens, then we can start talking about establishing a common union between the many different Muslim nations, and by the Grace of Allah, it will eventually start coalescing into a Caliphate. This is a process which can take centuries, but we need to get the building blocks moving TODAY so that our great-grandchildren can reap the benefits of our actions today.

 

Ditoore. I am happy to see that your far away from that murderous cult in Somalia but you still somehow need to smell the coffee of realism. In one of your thread you praise Erdogan yet you do not ask the foundation and the conditions that made him appear. Mustafa Kemal, like it or not, for those who love to romanticize and flirt with ottomans. Istanbul was captured by the british and the sultan and so called "caliph" of islam were technically puppets under the british/french/greeks. When the anatolian turks rebelled, the british forced the offical shaykhul Islam, meaning the mufti to utter a fatwa forbidding rebellion and the caliph himself said to his subjects not to take arms against the british/greeks/armenians.

 

Mustafa Kemal and his assembly refused and with blood they became the only non-colonized Muslim nation. (Saudi-Arabia was allready a british puppet state). Without that war, those adaanka in Istanbul could today have been church bells. Mustafa Kemal was an extremist and I condemn his non-islamic actions but who can blame him for introducing the latin alphabet?. When he was a young corporal he saw the deceit of the arabs and that probably gave him cuqdad.

80 years of modernist thought and thinking made Turkey today what it is. A nation-state that functions.

 

Shaheed.Sheekh Ramadan Saciid Bouti, a well known Islamic scholar, who was ironically blown up by fellow "muslims" while he was giving quranic tafsir in the famous ummayad mosque in damascus famously said that the muslim brotherhood was one of the dangerous "modernists" we had in our midst. Orthdox Islam is about worshipping God and preparing for the afterlife and making islam a unifying factor in society not a dividing one. The muslim-brotherhood with all it's fancy words are a bunch of people with radical different agenda but who all use religion as to gain power.

 

 

You talk about islamic style governments yet the question remains un-answered. What do you mean by that? It's fancy word but you never answer despite that I have asked you several times in different threads. Do you mean Khomenis style of islamic government? Clergymen assigned by Allah or do you mean Mullah Omars pashtun-infused style of islamic government that forces people to grow beard? or do you mean Pakistan? The offical name of pakistan is actually "Islamic republic" or do you mean North Sudan, or why not Saudi-Arabia?

 

Are all of these options to extreme for you? Do you want Erdogans way of system? You praised him, but Turkey is today the only muslim country where licker/alcohol stores are open in Ramadan! Hey even Khomenis Iran are better then him on this. You might up drinking methanol from an illegal black street-vendor and getting blind but no alcohol store is allowed to be open. Sayyadina Muhammad scw was sent to us a mercy and to teach us how to prepare us for the after-life not to abuse Islam all in the name of power.

 

 

I 'am pretty sure that all above mentioned options will not suite you but clarify more instead of using a brushing word as islamic government? The basic fiq-manuals of the shafi'ite madhab does not even mention the word "islamic state". It does not exist and was created by modernists. If you want to be a good muslim be so by good virtue, establish strong spiritual ties with Allah, help the poor, make the haj and fast. Thats all it is to it.

 

[DoctorKenney]

Khadafi, when I say "Islamic State", my ideal version of one was the society of Umar bin Khattab, and the Caliphate which he governed. And the subsequent governments weren't perfect (the Ummayyads, Abbasids, Ottomans) but the Muslim world went through tremendous development, while the society was strongly Islamic. You can't pretend this is a myth. This is history saaxib. I really suggest you read Will Durant's book about the Story of Civilization and he even describes how superb the Islamic State was during the Middle Ages.

 

Erdogan knows he's dealing with an extremely secular State, and he knows that half of the country is very secular. So he's limited in his actions. He's smart because he knows if he pushes too far, it might backfire on him. But he's slowly pushing his country in a more Islamic direction, and this has been going on for over a decade. We have to be realistic here, but the establishment of an Islamic State is something that's on the minds of many Muslims. And that's not something you should run away from, but you should embrace this.

[Khadafi]

<cite>

@DoctorKenney

said:</cite>

Khadafi, when I say "Islamic State", my ideal version of one was the society of Umar bin Khattab, and the Caliphate which he governed. And the subsequent governments weren't perfect (the Ummayyads, Abbasids, Ottomans) but the Muslim world went through tremendous development, while the society was strongly Islamic. You can't pretend this is a myth. This is history saaxib. I really suggest you read Will Durant's book about the Story of Civilization and he even describes how superb the Islamic State was during the Middle Ages.

 

Erdogan knows he's dealing with an extremely secular State, and he knows that half of the country is very secular. So he's limited in his actions. He's smart because he knows if he pushes too far, it might backfire on him. But he's slowly pushing his country in a more Islamic direction, and this has been going on for over a decade. We have to be realistic here, but the establishment of an Islamic State is something that's on the minds of many Muslims. And that's not something you should run away from, but you should embrace this.

 

 

Here we go again. The fancy word is back but without definition and clarification. Instead of going forward your looking back at an ideal society. Sayyadina Cumar had karamas and reached a point in God eyes that he actually made a known Karama. But he too was killed and so was god promise fulfilled. But you ducked away from my question as if realism shocks you.

 

Your princly boy Erdogan is currently waging a war on Fethullah Gulen for being an "islamic extremist" and Turkey is in Nato and the only muslim countrey where licker/alcohol stores are open freely even in Ramadan. So who is it going to be ditoore, Khamenei/Erdogan with the licker stores or why not Mullah Omar? Notice that no african is mentioned despite that Sayyadina Cisman iyo Ruqqiya Bintu Rasoolilah was actually amongst blacks in the first hijra.

 

 

 

If all above options does not fit you well that no-body who proclaimed himself khalifa (unknown arabs choosing an arab) Abu-Bakr baghdadi might be starter for you. He claims to have an islamic state.

 

 

Try s

 

 

Mirqaanka ka soo kac,

[DoctorKenney]

Liquor Stores were open in Turkey even in the 1980's and 1990's. It wasn't as if Erdogan opened them up, so what criticism does he get here? Do you really think it's even politically possible to outlaw alcohol in TURKEY out of all countries? Are you seriously kidding me here? There were protests in Turkey last year simply because Erdogan wanted to limit the sale of alcohol until 10pm. So he wanted to prevent people from buying alcohol after 10pm and people still wouldn't accept that. People were protesting the streets by the tens of thousands. We're living in the real world here, your fantasy idealism won't get us anywhere.

 

I can try the same argument on you: You say you want a secular State. Well what kind of secular state would you like? China? Russia? United States? Brazil? Turkey? It's a cop-out statement.

 

The ideal governments were that of the Rashidun Caliphs (Abu Bakr, Umar, Ali, Uthman), as well as a large number of Umayyad, Abbasid, and Ottoman Caliphs. The Caliphate of Cordoba, Spain was superb as well. And so were some of the Islamic governments which existed in Nigeria and Mali.

 

And you want to dismiss Umar Bin Khattab's government because "he was killed"....authubilah. I'm actually shocked with you here. So what if he was killed? Presidents and Kings are assassinated all the time, that's why most of them have bodyguards, so what big deal is it that Umar bin Khattab was killed by a Persian slave? That's like someone dismissing the United States because 4 American Presidents (Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, Kennedy) were all assassinated. It's a weak argument.

 

And no, I'm not mirqaan, caathi iska dhig. You're not doing yourself a favor here

 

Open your mind