America: Police shoot Another black kid from behind

[DoctorKenney]

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@Che -Guevara

said:</cite>

Doctor, things don't happen in vacuum, this has been brewing for decades and this killing was last straw. As looting, it was by a small group and community its has come out against the looting. They actually helped the victims of looting.

 

By the way, when the cop stopped Micheal Brown, he was not aware if Micheal robbed anything. The outcome would have been the same whether Micheal robbed anything or not

 

Yes, I'm aware of that. But 40 people are murdered every single day in America, and most of those who are killed are young black men. I really wish that instead of putting all of our focus on Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown, we focus on the poverty and high crime rates in the American ghetto.

 

I don't want to dismiss these young men's deaths, it's certainly tragic, but there's bigger things to worry about. There are some serious problems in Black America that need fixing, and to put all of the focus on the deaths of these young men sounds ridiculous.

 

Blacks should be pro-active in solving their problems. They shouldn't be reactionaries. They should have taken the initiative in promoting the hiring of more Black Police Officers, Black Judges, and Black Prosecutors. They should clean up their own neighborhood, build more businesses in their own community, and actively work with the State Government to improve the quality of Black Public Schools.

[Che -Guevara]

Doc. You seem to be under the impression that blacks chose poverty and violence; things are far complex. It is hard to recover from slavery, Jim Crow, the Great Northern Migration, Civil Rights attacks, ghettoisation, war on drugs and other systemic issues lack of access to good education and employment.

 

Why do you know how the white middle class came about?

[DoctorKenney]

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@Che -Guevara

said:</cite>

Doc. You seem to be under the impression that blacks chose poverty and violence; things are far complex. It is hard to recover from slavery, Jim Crow, the Great Northern Migration,Civil Rights attacks, ghettoisation, war on drugs and other systemic issues lack of access to good education and employment.

 

Why do you know how the white middle class came about?

 

Bro, the ethnic persecution which the Chinese people went through in Malaysia in the 20th century was just as bad as--if not worse--then the treatment Black Americans went through under the Jim Crow era. But the Chinese in Malaysia persevered through family values, hard work, acquiring new skills, and investing their savings. And the Chinese people who live in Malaysia are BY FAR much richer than the ethnic Malay people. Imagine that.

 

And that's just one example.

 

The Irish people in America were discriminated against heavily, so were the Italians. So were the Jews. But they all pulled their resources together, worked their butts off, and ended up achieving a lot. Discrimination is no excuse for failure at all.

 

Black Americans number 45 million people. That's a large number of people, that's more than the population of Canada. They have access to some of the best universities in the world. They have access to almost 1 trillion dollars in capital. If they want to, they can separate into their own communities and build their own businesses, supermarkets, factories and elect their own Governors and have their own Police Forces.

 

But they're not proactive enough.

 

Did you know that 90% Black Men who are in jail are in State Prisons, and the vast majority of those in State Prisons are there for violent crime, and property crime? I mean, it sounds to me that you haven't met these people in real life. They have the opportunity to succeed, to clean up their own communities, but they don't. And that's a huge problem.

[DoctorKenney]

I said it before: The Liberals in America are fostering a culture of dependency and victim-hood, and Blacks in America have fallen for it completely. You need to look at the works of Malcolm X, and he's written about this extensively in his autobiography.

 

If the black man can't get hired at this company, then he can set up his own businesses and hire his own people and build his own consumer base. The Jews managed to achieve it, why can't we? What makes people think 45 million Blacks aren't capable of building their own economy and creating their own influence and stop being dependent on other races for their survival?

 

If the black man doesn't like the school his children are attending, then it's his duty to pool his resources together with his neighbors and create all-black private schools and lobby the State Government to provide vouchers for the black families.

 

I could go on and on with examples.

 

But this requires organization and discipline. It requires good leadership from within the Black Community and I'm afraid that it just doesn't exist right now

[Che -Guevara]

Firstly, I don't know where you get the number of 90% of black males are in prison. That's highly unlikely.

 

Secondly, the Irish and Chinese were economic migrants. Nobody put them to boats and sold them like properties in foreign lands. Thirdly, the black families never had stable existence. During slavery, families were torn apart as they were sold from one owner to another. During the civil war, families were also split. There was some stability during Jim Crow, but poverty and indentured servitude to former slave owners made life difficult.

 

During the Great migration, families were further separated. Blacks did find economic opportunities in the North through manufacturing jobs but that ended when the white boys returned from World War II and the white flight to the subarbs.

 

Speaking of dependency, America's white middle class came into being cuz the Government helped in creating. It was not just through hard and organization that made it happen.

[DoctorKenney]

<cite>

@Che -Guevara

said:</cite>

Firstly, I don't know where you get the number of 90% of black males are in prison. That's highly unlikely.

 

Secondly, the Irish and Chinese were economic migrants. Nobody put them to boats and sold them like properties in foreign lands. Thirdly, the black families never had stable existence. During slavery, families were torn apart as they were sold from one owner to another. During the civil war, families were also split. There was some stability during Jim Crow, but poverty and indentured servitude to former slave owners made life difficult.

 

During the Great migration, families were further separated. Blacks did find economic opportunities in the North through manufacturing jobs but that ended when the white boys returned from World War II and the white flight to the subarbs.

 

I never said that. I said 90% of Black Men who are in jail, are in State Prisons. 10% of them are in Federal Prisons. And of those who are in State Prisons, most of them are there for violent crimes and property crimes.

 

And you're talking about the disintegration of the Black Family? But in 1965, the vast majority of black children grew up in a 2 parent household. This was AFTER slavery, this was after Jim Crow. A black child born in 1965 most likely had both parents in his life. But if you look at black children born today, most of them are born to single mothers. And this has some serious long-term problems because children who grow up without a fatherly presence in their life, are far more likely to get into serious trouble when they get older.

 

You're acting as if White Flight to the suburbs is a bad thing. If the Whites want to "run away" from Blacks, and live in their own all-white communities, then so be it. How is that a bad thing? If Blacks have their own neighborhoods, and Whites have their own neighborhoods, if that's what the people want then who are we to stop them?

 

Blacks need to set up their own independent economy. I don't understand how is it that Somali refugees in Minnesota set up their own thriving businesses, with VERY limited resources and a small population, but the Blacks in America don't? Why are most supermarkets and convenient stores in the black neighborhoods owned by Indians and Koreans?

 

The Blacks need a self-help philosophy, not a "Blame-Whitey" philosophy. Only we have the ability to change our own fate, with the help of God. There is nothing that the White Man can do that we can't. And we need to stop relying on him for our sustenance. Rely on yourself. If the White Man can set up Ford Motors and Chrysler, then we can do the same for our own companies.

[DoctorKenney]

Speaking of dependency, America’s white middle class came into being cuz the Government helped in creating. It was not just through hard and organization that made it happen.

 

The American middle class came into being because of the expansion of capital and investment in the 1880-1930 period. That was the period when America transformed from a 3rd world country, to literally the richest country in the world.

 

It was through capital investment and maximized production. That takes hard work, that takes savings, and that's how America became an economic superpower in a span of about 50 years.

 

There is NO reason why Blacks in America can't do for themselves what the Jews have done, what the Irish have done and what the Italians have done.

[xabad]

<cite>

@DoctorKenney

said:</cite>

Bro, the ethnic persecution which the Chinese people went through in Malaysia in the 20th century was just as bad as--if not worse--then the treatment Black Americans went through under the Jim Crow era. But the Chinese in Malaysia persevered through family values, hard work, acquiring new skills, and investing their savings. And the Chinese people who live in Malaysia are BY FAR much richer than the ethnic Malay people. Imagine that.

 

And that's just one example.

 

The Irish people in America were discriminated against heavily, so were the Italians. So were the Jews. But they all pulled their resources together, worked their butts off, and ended up achieving a lot. Discrimination is no excuse for failure at all.

 

Black Americans number 45 million people. That's a large number of people, that's more than the population of Canada. They have access to some of the best universities in the world. They have access to almost 1 trillion dollars in capital. If they want to, they can separate into their own communities and build their own businesses, supermarkets, factories and elect their own Governors and have their own Police Forces.

 

But they're not proactive enough.

 

Did you know that 90% Black Men who are in jail are in State Prisons, and the vast majority of those in State Prisons are there for violent crime, and property crime? I mean, it sounds to me that you haven't met these people in real life. They have the opportunity to succeed, to clean up their own communities, but they don't. And that's a huge problem.

 

None of these so called persecuted peoples you mentioned like the chinese , italians or irish have faced even 10% of the persecution, racism, stigma nor humiliation american blacks have gone through.

They have been deliberately been bred for stupidity in plantations by their slave masters, denied education and opportunity at every turn.

African americans are suffering from structural racism, as result of deliberate policy and one that has been in place ever since they come to america.

 

maoris, aborigines and gypsies are also faring terribly under white subjugation.

 

 

[DoctorKenney]

Xabad....you're going to make the claim that the Chinese in Malaysia, or the Armenians in Turkey (another very successful group) or the Jews in Europe and America, and the Germans in Russia and all these other racial minorities went through negligible discrimination, but that's far from true.

 

Your past is not an excuse for what you do in the future. Black Americans being enslaved in the 1800's or being discriminated against in the 1960's is not an excuse for a 20 year old Black American in 2014 not trying his hardest to pull himself together and work hard to build his own community. And you know very well that's true.

 

Only people with a victim mentality are going to reference past injustices for their inadequacy today. I'm not going to blame the British or Italian colonialists for my failures as a Somali. I will blame myself, and only I have the ability to change myself and change my community.

 

We can debate all we want about what happened 200 years ago or 50 years ago, but the Black Man in America has his own fate in his own hands. This is what Malcolm X said 50 years ago and it rings true even today.

 

Only he has the ability to stop these high crime rates in his own neighborhood, the high unemployment, the lack of good schools, and the lack of 2 parent families.

[DoctorKenney]

The day the Black Man in America takes responsibility over his own fate, instead of blaming the White Man for his problems all the time, is the day he finally becomes a real man and not a slave.

[Che -Guevara]

Doc. You cannot compare Victorian middle class to 1950s middle class. In any case, Victorian middle only represented minority among whites or blacks. Besides, the Great Depression plunged millions into poverty. Only federal intervention saved many people and the World War II ended that recession.

 

Today's middle has its roots in 1944 GI bill where millions of returning veterans were given money for education, mortgages and businesses. Uncle Sam rewarded his white boys and the greatest economic expansion in history was ignited. Unlike their comrades, the GI bill did not benefit black vets. Exclusionary laws and discriminatory bank practices practically denied them everything. In other words, they faced structural/systemic racism. It is one thing for the average person to be racist but when the Government itself enacts discriminatory laws and practices, it is hard to overcome that. Blacks simply had no access to resources that could kick start economic mobility.

 

None of ethnicities you mentioned faced the level of racism and exclusion as the blacks did. The Jews in Europe were excluded from many economic activities but they had niche industries mainly money brokers or the middle men, the Armenians in Ottoman Empire (before the genocide) were not systemically excluded from the empire. They were part of the civil service, had important positions at the highest level, so much so, Ottomans became jealous. They were not banned from trading. Nothing matches what was done to African Americans. It is amazing they survived at all.

[DoctorKenney]

The Government prolonged the Great Depression, the actions of President Roosevelt certainly made the Depression more painful, and much much longer than it should have been. Historians almost all agree on that fact, they just argue on "how bad" the Government screwed up in the 1930's. He tripled taxes, created thousands of new regulations, and did away with free trade. And that made the Depression 10x worse and much much longer. But that's another discussion for another day.

 

Che, I'm not talking about "Victorian people"....that was in Britain, not America. America transformed from a 3rd world country in 1880 to the richest country in the world by the 1920's. Annual incomes for the average American doubled, tripled, and even quadrupled. Prices dropped massively as a result of mechanization. And millions of Europeans migrated to America every single year so they can take advantage of the massive economic boom during that period.

 

It's been said over and over, that this 1880-1930 period was the greatest period of economic growth by any country in world history. No country ever became so prosperous in such a short span of time. It wasn't perfect, there were definitely some problems, but this period is why the American Middle Class arose. Not some G.I. bill. Middle classes aren't created overnight saaxib. A simple government bill isn't going to transform a 3rd world country like the United States into an industrial powerhouse. All of the capital accumulation, the maximized production, and the industrial base is what made the 1950's and 1960's so prosperous. The G.I. bill certainly helped, and definitely made life much easier for the average American, but the G.I. bill would've NEVER been possible if it wasn't for America's massive industrial wealth at the time. If a "G.I. bill" is responsible for prosperity, then why don't we visit Tanzania or Cambodia and tell the people there to start a "G.I. bill" and see if that uplifts the economy and turns Cambodia or Tanzania into a prosperous nation? Prosperity comes from investment, savings, and production saaxib. There is no shortcut to that. And there is no reason why the Black American can't do the same for his people. There are almost as much Black Americans as there are South Koreans in this world. There are as much Black Americans today (45 million people) as there were people in America in 1875 (right before the massive American economic boom).

 

What the Blacks went through during slavery is definitely much much worse than anything anyone ever went through. But what they went through during Jim Crow is very comparable to what other races went through in the past. Blacks in the 1920's set up their own neighborhoods, businesses, their own colleges, their own investment firms, their own Baseball leagues, their own supermarkets and even their own construction firms! If they can do that, in the 1920's, when discrimination was extremely high....then there is nothing stopping them from achieving the same thing in the 21st century. You're talking about the "black family was destroyed as a result of slavery" but I showed you examples of how MOST BLACKS in the 1950's and 1960's grew up in 2 parent households. They grew up with their mother and father in the house. But today, most black kids are born to single mothers, and the father is nowhere in sight. What went wrong? Why is it from 1970 onward, everything started to go downhill for Black Americans and the Black Family? And why is it that Blacks in America don't take the initiative to improve their own societies? Why is that as soon as Black Man in America can afford it, he moves to a White part of town, and doesn't use his wealth to support black businesses?

[DoctorKenney]

If we can agree that what Blacks underwent in America was probably the worst case of human rights abuse that we can think of, then how does this change the fact that we're in the 21st century and the Black Man in America is fully capable of turning his own life around.

 

I'm not talking about discrimination against Blacks in some European or Asian countries, because they're very small in number and don't have the numbers to create real change.

 

But what's stopping the Black American from building his own economy and his own industries and cleaning up his own neighborhoods and lobbying his own local government to hire more black police officers? Why is it that a people, who are 45 million in number, are so dependent on others for their own well-being, and when are Blacks going to change this and finally get rid of this victim mentality and adopt a self-help philosophy?

 

Nothing you do today will erase the crimes of 200 years ago, but you're very capable of making something of yourself today. Che, I'm sure you being a Somali refugee didn't stop you from making something of yourself in America. I'm sure you getting up and leaving Somalia and leaving everyone you know behind didn't stop you from improving yourself and improving your community in America

[Adam]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-28832462

 

National Guard send to end the unrest.

[Che -Guevara]

Dox. Victorian is a period of time, en era. I think you and I simply disagree on the severity of the challenges faced African-Americans.