The 21 October Revolution

[Safferz]

Classified;982343 wrote:

So far, YoniZ, Wiil Cusub and "Irshad Manji"

(Safferz)

all condemn 21 October.

Don't call me that again. Why do you struggle so much with reading comprehension, Classified? I've noticed this in more than a few threads now, either you don't read people's posts at all before responding to them, or you have difficulty processing nuanced arguments. Who in this thread has said anything about "condemning" 21 October?

[Saalax]

I think the appropriate question should be should 21 October be made a national holiday in south Somalia?

because it seems that is the only place he is glorified south Somalia meaning anything south of

Galkayo.

[Gar_maqaate]

Classified;982261 wrote:

Should it be a National holiday in the new

Federal Republic of Somalia

? As we all know, the last Somali government that had controlled every bit of square mile from the Djibouti border to the Kenyan border and along side the Ethiopian border was Mohamed Siad Barre's government of 21 years. Ever since that government collapsed, there was and there is no central/federal government that controls the entire country, from the Djibouti border to the Kenyan border.

 

Should the Kacaan be recognized as symbol of pride or should it be rejected like Nazism post-world war 2? If 21 October becomes a National holiday, what about the Rebel movements? Would they too be given national platform to recognize them as saviors or will they be rejected like Nazism as well?

What happened on the 21st of october 1969 was never a revolution. It was a text book coup d'etat and like all coup d'etats it quickly degenerated into a bloody and savage oppression. Calling the coup d'etat of october 1969 a revolution is almost as comical as calling Barre's petty dictatorial regime, scietific socialism. There was nothing to share apart from abject poverty, hungary, ignorance and fear.

[Gar_maqaate]

YoniZ;982310 wrote:

In short, Siyad inherited functioning African state with impressive international deplomatic ties dealing with both sides of the cold war blocs. He turned it to *** licker for one bloc and after few years inguinuanly turned against his only left allies.... The rest as they say is history.

 

.

what a load of tripe!.

Siyad Barre inherited a dysfunctional state that was ravaged by inter-clan rivalry and rampant corruption. Somalia was all but a failed state before Siyad Barre came on the scene.

[Gar_maqaate]

Hawdian;982290 wrote:

A famous saying from Sayed Barre goes like this

When I came to Xamar the city had only one asphalt Road when I leave I will only leave this one road

This man was a disaster on every level.

I though he said "Let them eat cake"

[Tallaabo]

That day should be remembered as a dark day in the history of Somalis. A minute silence should be observed at 11. am on this day every year to commemorate the untimely death of our young republic in the hands of the late tyrant.

[Khadafi]

Tallaabo and Safferz: People will always be nostalgic weather for the good or bad. What ever happens, Siyaad Barre ( aun) and his brutal regime are part of the Somali history. Only by discussing its achievements and failures can we understand the present and change the future.

 

The regime of Siyaad Barre included all Somali clans and we should blame each others then pointing the fingers on a single man. One of the greatest failures of Siyaad Barre is that he failed to seize the moment when his regime was crumbling. Rather then leave the city and immediately start negations with the rebels he took another destructive path, Axmxaarki Mengistu ayaa ka fiicnay.

 

Siyaad Barre and his regime was a disaster for the Somali society but his greatest permanent achievement must have been the writing of the Somali alphabet. Weather we like it or not, during his rule we had free education and healthcare. Now days only 20% of Somali children go to school.

[Safferz]

Khadafi;982425 wrote:

Tallaabo and Safferz: People will always be nostalgic weather for the good or bad. What ever happens, Siyaad Barre ( aun) and his brutal regime are part of the Somali history. Only by discussing its

achievements

and

failures

can we understand the present and change the future.

 

The regime of Siyaad Barre included all Somali clans and we should blame each others then pointing the fingers on a single man. One of the greatest failures of Siyaad Barre is that he failed to seize the moment when his regime was crumbling. Rather then leave the city and immediately start negations with the rebels he took another destructive path, Axmxaarki Mengistu ayaa ka fiicnay.

 

Siyaad Barre and his regime was a disaster for the Somali society but his greatest permanent achievement must have been the writing of the Somali alphabet. Weather we like it or not, during his rule we had

free education and healthcare

. Now days only 20% of Somali children go to school.

I agree with you completely.

[burahadeer]

^^^Biggest lie !! Free education & health care as meagre as it was existed before him(infact many schools in the north were closed during his reign...your world centred around Mogadishu) and you guys seem to emphasize only Mogadishu but scortched earth policy was going on in the north till late 70s.Again it shows how you didn't acknowledge that disaster in the north back then and still wilfully disregarding.Only when Mogadishu(south) suffers is somalinimo relevant.

[Hawdian]

Khadafi;982425 wrote:

Tallaabo and Safferz: People will always be nostalgic weather for the good or bad. What ever happens, Siyaad Barre ( aun) and his brutal regime are part of the Somali history. Only by discussing its

achievements

and

failures

can we understand the present and change the future.

 

The regime of Siyaad Barre included all Somali clans and we should blame each others then pointing the fingers on a single man. One of the greatest failures of Siyaad Barre is that he failed to seize the moment when his regime was crumbling. Rather then leave the city and immediately start negations with the rebels he took another destructive path, Axmxaarki Mengistu ayaa ka fiicnay.

 

Siyaad Barre and his regime was a disaster for the Somali society but his greatest permanent achievement must have been the writing of the Somali alphabet. Weather we like it or not, during his rule we had

free education and healthcare

. Now days only 20% of Somali children go to school.

I Disagree . The Idea of Creating A Somali Alphabet Was the Goal of Previous Gov. And Many Somali Academics even before Siyad came to Villa Somalia. He just happen to be at the right time for that goal to be fulfilled.

[YoniZ]

Safferz;982341 wrote:

Well said. I enjoy your posts, YoniZ.

 

He systematically manipulated clan for political power, which had the effect of politicizing clan difference and creating clan based opposition to the state. One of the most lasting legacies of his rule was the destruction of the philosophical belief and trust Somalis had in being subjects and citizens, and with the collapse of the state, the primacy of clan as the only political unit that could be trusted for group welfare and collective security. This is something that even well functioning governments like Somaliland are unable to overcome and instead find themselves negotiating political power with the clans.

Thanks Safferz, I wish we could have levelheaded Nomads like you when it comes to discuss Somali politics, not the blinded clannish characters that fill the space.

[Safferz]

Thanks YoniZ

[Khadafi]

burahadeer;982438 wrote:

^^^Biggest lie !! Free education & health care as meagre as it was existed before him(infact many schools in the north were closed during his reign...your world centred around Mogadishu) and you guys seem to emphasize only Mogadishu but scortched earth policy was going on in the north till late 70s.Again it shows how you didn't acknowledge that disaster in the north back then and still wilfully disregarding.Only when Mogadishu(south) suffers is somalinimo relevant.

Burahdeers : you need re-read my post. I simply stated that his regime was brutal and is ultimately the reason that the vicious civil war erupted. The regimes massacres happened all over in Somali and not only in the north as some people want it to be. The wells of central Somalia was poisoned and massacres were committed on every group that wanted to overthrew the regime.

 

But you need to understand that if we compare the Somalia of Siyaad Barre and now, we are comparing between heaven and hell. Somali education was one of the best in Africa. Education in Somalia or Somaliland or Puntland (what ever land or region) is today defined by the one who has capital (Doolar). Only 20 % of Somali children actually go schools, higher education is non-existent and even those who exist are all private and are not recognized in the world.

 

 

Hawdian: Your quite true that politicians before the coup had dreams of written Af-Soomali , but Siyaad Barre implemented it and made an everlasting cultural contribution to the Somali society. By writing in Af-soomali what was before only orally he somewhat made his presence e permanent. Even Somalis in Jabuuti and Itoobiya today use the accepted writing of Af-soomali.

[Classified]

Not a single one comprehend what I asked. A simple YES or NO was all that was needed.

 

Here is Radio Muqdisho on October 21, 2013.

 

http://saadaalnews.com/2013/10/21/dhagayso-axmed-saleebaan-dafle-saamaali-waxey-ka-tashataabaa-lagu-xukumi-karaa/

[Tallaabo]

^ I think we answered your question.