Puntland Government Position on Natural Resources in Somalia

[Haatu]

Somalia, well that's a shame because in a court of law that holds no weight

[Somalia]

War ilaahi yaa yaqaan, how dare you invoke the word 'law' in Somalia, come on man

[Tillamook]

Haatu;955585 wrote:

To the Faroole apologists, what Faroole wants is a Somali

confederacy

not a federation, going by his actions and demands in the past 2 years. I believe that a confederacy will be the final nail in the coffin for what once was Somalia. As for their stance with regards to the resources, it is illegal first and firmost under international law as those oil blocks in question have already been signed off to other foreign companies. What Faroole should be arguing for is a renegotiation of the terms, not short-changing the Somali people accepting peanuts in return for a few million so he can continue the Faroole Inc. hegemony. Secondly, if all regions follow in his footstep, how are we to move on? How is reconstruction to be restarted? Politics aside, how is the central government to get revenues?

 

As for wadani, his sheeko is clan-supremacy and an imagined superiority.

Once again, waxaad lasoo shir tagtey, hearsay and gossip. From what we know, unless you can submit to the gallery here otherwise, Faroole has never called for a Somali Confederacy. In fact, contrary to that, he took part as one of the stakeholders who helped establish the Somali Federal Government. Secondly, you once again make unsubstantiated wild statements, such as "it is illegal first and foremost under international law as those oil blocks in question have already been signed off to other foreign companies", yet you do not provide when, to whom and who "signed off" those hydrocarbon blocks?

 

See here, Haatu, your problem is that you refuse to acknowledge the reality that the only form of government that Somalis can come together under is through a federal system, because you keep making statements like,"how is the central government to get revenues" inferring that unless Xamar gets full control of all the resources of Somalia, then we cannot develop our country. You, sir, are flawed in this thinking.

 

What you fail to understand is that the resources of Somalia belong to the people, and not a central entity in Xamar. Get that through your head! The people, through their respective federated states, will decide the fate of their blood and treasure. The fed's only job is to help facilitate this. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Che -Guevara]

Wadani;955549 wrote:

In my years of perusing Somali news wbsites, forums and talking to nomads in real life it's clear that MJ's and SNMers are the two most hated clans. Is it a coincidence that they also happen to be the two most successful clans in almost every indiciator of development? Somalis have a serious issue with envy and xaasidnimo which we need to address before we can move forward.

Right, the everyday person in the South struggling with life has time nad the energy indulge your sense of superiority hahaha

[Haatu]

Tillamook;955648 wrote:

Once again,

waxaad lasoo shir tagtey

, hearsay and gossip. From what we know, unless you can submit to the gallery here otherwise, Faroole has never called for a Somali Confederacy. In fact, contrary to that, he took part as one of the stakeholders who helped establish the Somali Federal Government. Secondly, you once again make unsubstantiated wild statements, such as "it is illegal first and foremost under international law as those oil blocks in question have already been signed off to other foreign companies", yet you do not provide when, to whom and who "signed off" those hydrocarbon blocks?

 

See here, Haatu, your problem is that you refuse to acknowledge the reality that the only form of governent that Somalis can come together under is through a federal system, because you keep making statements like,"how is the central government to get revenues" inferring that unless the Feds have full control of all the resources of Somalia, then we cannot develop our country. You, sir, are flawed in this thinking.

 

What you fail to understand is that the resources of Somalia belong to the people, and not a central entity in Xamar. Get that through your head! The people, through their respective federated states, will decide the fate of their blood and treasure. The fed's only job is to help facilitate this. Nothing more, nothing less.

I give it to you he has never uttered the words "confederacy", but the form of federalism he wants is much looser than the type of federalism that Somalia is aiming for.

 

As for the oil blocks, re you seriously telling me you are unaware that the Kacaan government signed oil deals before the state collapse? Connoco, Shell? Ring any bells?

 

As for my opinion on federalism, it's not my preferred choice as I would rather a decentralised unitary state but that's not likely any time soon. As for the country developing properly I stick with my statement that it can't be done without a national government because without it Somalia remains a failed state.

 

As for the resources, it's my belief that every inch of resources on Somali lands belong to the Somali people collectively and the only fair way to distribute them is through a central government.

[warsamaale]

che, you statement is totally off point.

[Che -Guevara]

warsamaale;955660 wrote:

che, you statement is totally off point.

How so?

[warsamaale]

, tell me of a decentralized unitary state currently, anywhere in the world ? Even Kenya is devolving into counties because they realized its a more efficient system of governance.

[Wadani]

Che -Guevara;955656 wrote:

Right, everyday person in the South struggling with life in the South has time indulge your sense of superiority hahaha

So r u claiming I haven't experienced what I have experienced? All Somali clans have the propensity for envy. MJ's and SNMers included. Heck look how these two hate on each other day in and day out on this very forum. But my point was, when u read the comments sections on news sites and on youtube, these two bare the brunt of the vitriolic tirades by Somalis. Some of it is justified...people unhappy about Somalilands seccession, and people unhappy about Puntlands reliance on neighbouring countries to further their own interests (ethiopian invasion plus current Jubbaland/Kenya debacle). But, I get a sense that a lot of it also stems from envy (more so in Somalilands case)...which like I said we are all guilty of.

[warsamaale]

what has person living in the south struggling have to do with this??, wadani is right, some clans are more hated than others justly or unjustly. is that not a fact, che ?

[Che -Guevara]

Warsamaale. Some of the most hateful people I know come from these two communities and their views of other Somalis the south in particular pushes the limits of decency.It is not the politics of other Somalis that they pick on but it's the people themselves. So to portray these people as victims is to absolve of them of the role in this debacle that's of Somalis. They dish out as much as others do. Others pick more on their politics, these people mostly pick on others not for their politics but for tribal backgrounds or aspect of supposed behaviors. Just look comments on the Somali President, more often than not, it's not his actions that are being condemned or discussed, it's his tribal background that's automatically interjected into the discussion, this is followed by insults against his tribe which the admins seem to be tolerate these days, and this Hag and that Hag.

 

And by the way, examine any Somali discussion forum including SOL, who is fanning the hatred, just look here, most of them individuals who preach hate claim to be from Somaliland and Puntland, I don't wanna name names but just look who posts most topics insulting others and promoting hate, and there are like in every forum.

[Tillamook]

Haatu;955659 wrote:

 

As for my opinion on federalism, it's not my preferred choice as I would rather a decentralised unitary state but that's not likely any time soon. As for the country developing properly I stick with my statement that it can't be done without a national government because without it Somalia remains a failed state.

.

War maxaad u kala hadleysaa? You say you would rather have a decentralized state, and in the same breath you turn around and proclaim Somalia will remain a failed a state unless we have a "national governent" meaning..it should remain centralized. Haatu, It is best when debating a point to know exactly what it is you're trying to debate.

 

Now putting aside your bipolarity. Faroole does not want "a looser type of federalism" as you say. What Faroole wants is simply what he signed up the people of Puntland for when he took part in the road map that led to our current federal system. Nothing more, nothing less!(I keep repeating this, because I want you to get it through your head this simple fact, which it seems you find difficult to do so)

 

And finally, your last statement that you believe all Somalis have equal rights to all the resources in Somalia. NONSENSE!

 

Saaxiib, what is mine is mine and what is yours is yours! Now if you want us to share our respective resources equitably and fairly, and help each other develop and thrive under the umbrella of the Somali Federal flag, then welcome. Otherwise, adaa cirka roob ku og!

[Baashi]

Haatu;955659 wrote:

I give it to you he has never uttered the words "confederacy", but the form of federalism he wants is much looser than the type of federalism that Somalia is aiming for.

 

As for the oil blocks, re you seriously telling me you are unaware that the Kacaan government signed oil deals before the state collapse? Connoco, Shell? Ring any bells?

 

As for my opinion on federalism, it's not my preferred choice as I would rather a decentralised unitary state but that's not likely any time soon. As for the country developing properly I stick with my statement that it can't be done without a national government because without it Somalia remains a failed state.

 

As for the resources, it's my belief that every inch of resources on Somali lands belong to the Somali people

collectively

and the only fair way to distribute them is

through

a central government.

Fair enough. Now, on your the last para you made a bold statement and it happen to be a correct one. The trouble with your idealism is TODAY there is no credible, efficient and robust central government. There is one in the confines of Benadir nursed by UN, AMISOM, IGAD and friendly nations of Turkey and Qatar. This SFG the one being nursed and propped by IC is founded on the principles PL is defending against illegal intrusion (unconstitutional power trap or overreach) from the SFG.

[Wadani]

Che -Guevara;955677 wrote:

Warsamaale. Some of the most hateful people I know come from these two communities and their views of other Somalis the south in particular pushes the limits of decency.It is not the politics of other Somalis that they pick on but it's the people themselves. So to portray these people as victims is to absolve of them of the role in this debacle that's of Somalis. They dish out as much as others do. Others pick more on their politics, these mostly pick others on their very being. Just look comments on the Somali Presidents, more often than not, it's not his actions that are being condemned or discussed, it's his tribal background that's automatically interjected into the discussion, this is followed by insults against his tribe which the admins seem to be tolerate these days, and this Hag and that Hag.

 

And by the way, any Somali discussion forum including SOL, who is fanning the hatred, just look here, most of them individuals who preach hate claim to be from Somaliland and Puntland, I don't wanna name names but just look who posts most topics insulting others and promoting hate, and there are like in every forum.

Che I agree with u that we also dish out our fair share of hate, and which like u said isn't always political in nature, but much more pernicious.

[Che -Guevara]

P.s since we are crowning the most hated tribes, I find it insulting you didn't include Aidid's folks. hahaha