SOL: Where priggish goat-skinners parade as political pundits

[xiinfaniin]

Chimera;953590 wrote:

I don't think you're telling me the whole story here Xiin. What happened to the status of the Kismayo Port? The charcoal trade and the remaining stash? There were major disagreements on these issues long before the Jubba conference, and Madoobe and his team didn't show political decorum towards the Federal government, in fact the ban was ignored. Would you recognize the efforts by the Ras Kamboni leaders if they disrespected you on a issue like the charcoal trade let alone more important ones on a federal level like how to create a regional state?

Kismayo port, charcoal trade, and remaining stash would not be a problem if the fundamental issue of federalism is resolved. The notion that the federal government would dismiss a years old effort to establish a federal state in Jubbaland regions yet convince the same community whose political objectives the government is impeding to handover local administrations is not practical to me. It may be ideal to see a strong federal government take hold in Somalia today but it could only be so after Somali communities feel they have ownership in it and such central government is not organized to deny their rights and role.

 

Ports proceeds , charcoal revenue and enforcement policy to prevent charcoal trade is minor issues compared the federalism question. You resolve the federalism question , you resolve many issues. You ignore it and try to workaround it, and you will continue spinning your wheels, perhaps backwards. You must understand Somalia's conflict is political in nature, and mistrust is deep.

 

Chimera;953590 wrote:

I might sound biased, (but i'm honest) because I see nothing wrong with the PM's proposals, or anything that is over the top. The areas claimed by Jubbaland are still under the yoke of Al-Shabaab, declaring a state in Kismayo today or tomorrow would not matter, for better or worse, as long as these territories remain under their yoke. I also don't see why getting all these delegates back together 6 months later would be a problem, considering it would be sponsored by the government. How will sacrificing Federal recognition aid the sustainability of the regional state? Is declaring one today instead of 6 months later that much more important than recognition? Unless your privy to info that states the Federal government would appoint a whole new administration after the interim one, because I have read no such thing.

It is true that the majority of areas claimed by Jubbaland state is under alshabaab. But it was also true that most of the city of Mogadishu was under alshabaab when a legitimate Somali government was organized and inaugurated in peaceful pockets within the city , guarded of course by none other than AMISOM troops. In fact , it is AMISOM that is insisting thier campaign against alshabaab would be more effective if there is a political entity , legitimately elected and representative of these regions, functional and in place to administer liberated towns and villages. That logic makes sense to me personally , as it would result a scenario where liberated areas would not be under foreign military officers and instead would be under Somali regional leaders. Of course the same objective could be achieved by appointments from Mogadishu. But many including me prefer local governance over central authority in today's context.

 

And of course it matters a lot whether to postpone the conference and disband vs whether to build on the progress already achieved on reconciliation and understanding amongst these communities. If you are honest you would admit the objective of this government in wishing to postpone the conference is to regain a political leverage to affect the outcome in these regions. I do not see a reason to destroy such a beuitiful process in organizing a federal state unless you are totally opposed to the notion of federalism in Somalia as I suspect the president and his team are. It is also obvious it would be better to complete the process now for logistical reasons, why wait 6 months when you have all of them talking and ready right now? But of course the objective of the government does not seem to be establishing a state in those regions.

 

And finally what is wrong with PMs proposals is the fact that it does not reflect on the reality on the ground. To say disband the delegates shows utter disregard to the wishes of the locals, it goes against the spirit of reconciliation and trust building , and above all it represents a political desire that is sadly small ---it is not inline with our national priority of defeating alshabaab, reconciliation, and trust building.

 

Chimera;953590 wrote:

As for Kenya and IGAD, anyone that has followed the Somali conflict for even a single day can see their agendas from a distance. IGAD is the extended filthy hand of Ethiopia, and their entire mission is to undermine the Federal government, luckily after decades of throwing Somali leaders around like rag-dolls they have found their match in the Federal government.The issue of the maritime borders is not a conspiracy theory, it is a well-proven subject. Kenya never claimed what it's claiming today back when there was a strong Somali navy patrolling those waters, yet they have awarded specific maritime sections legally under Somalia's jurisdiction to multi-nationals in direct violation of the UNCLOS Law of the Sea agreement, and even attempted day-light robbery through a shady memorandum.

 

I still think the said annexation is exaggerated; Somalia's territorial integrity (maritime or otherwise) remain unchanged. Every piece of UN resolution that was issued since our center fell affirms it.

 

But even if I accept your argument Kenya and Ethiopia are out to get our land, Jubbaland conflict and the government approach does not help in achieving what Somalia needs the most; unity. Unless you believe those leading Jubbaland initiative and those supporting it (Puntland etc) are less patriotic and less concern with Somalia's territorial integrity , and ONLY those in Mogadishu has the best national interest at heart for Somalia, I cannot see how antagonizing them would help defend our maritime lines.

 

Think of it this way: Somalia will come back and revive but not in the same form it was when it fell. So much changed, that it is extremely naive to mimic the old Barre and espouse same notions of nationalism - Nationalism today goes through respecting the political framework that produced Hassan, respecting the new social contract as Baashi likes to put, and adhering to the tenants of federalism for the next three years.

[Alpha Blondy]

^ you do realise you're talking to a script Xinoooow. i'm surprised your crystal ball failed to see this.

[Chimera]

Xiin, I said what I wanted to say on this issue, I can only hope (and dream) for the best, both for that region and the country as a whole. We lose the next five years to petty squabbles, and the country is truly gone for good.

[Alpha Blondy]

Adamsooow,

 

you are RUDE and DISRESPECTFUL. in this thread you've shown your true colours, ma istidhi? WHY are you beating these old foolish men into submission, inaar?

 

the likes of AT, NG and Xinny Meany (with or without his crystal ball) are the laf- dhabarka...... and form the spiritual essence of this site. show your elders some respect, inaar..... otherwise, i will fight on their behalf. ma garatey? :mad:

 

this cut and paste little mashruuc of yours is PATHETIC....sheekadaaduna waxay noqotay sidee maahmaahdi ahayd ''Allow....kan yar iga celiyoo kan weyn igu sii daa''....miyaa? :mad:

 

p.s - to the goldie oldies......dearest uncles, i await your signal and i'll unleash a torrent of destruction on Adams ee sida uula soco......

 

Al.

[xiinfaniin]

dp

[xiinfaniin]

ok Chimera, I can understand ---your sore fingers gave up on you after typing lengthy responses to NGONGE, Baashi, and Professor Abtigiis

 

ps. I did not like the style of copying and responding posters pieces either

[Alpha Blondy]

^ oh yeah?

 

you're a former shadow of yourself Xinnoow.....just give-up, uncle. it'll restore some much needed sharaf. waa taalo.

[Chimera]

xiinfaniin;953607 wrote:

ok Chimera, I can understand ---your sore fingers gave up on you after typing lengthy responses to NGONGE, Baashi, and Professor Abtigiis

 

ps. I did not like the style of copying and responding posters pieces either

Xiin, big bro that's a significant edit you made in your last reply, I logged off at "mistrust is deep" and was content to end the discussion there, but there are few new interesting points you made I must honor with a reply.

 

Insha-allah when I have more time.

 

Alpha, does that make you a pseudo elder? "Baqal fardo la daaqday faras bay is moodaa"

[Taleexi]

Compromise is attainable phenomena within the sphere of ethnic conflicts. Clearly, we Somalis abuse the term compromise to the extreme and for some odd and mysterious reasons - we always proof wrong some natural centrifugal characteristics we possess which were supposed to make societies more cohesive and strong. We remain to be some sort of unique species on the planet. In sum, we are so close yet so afar. Our president can not exercise freely a selective justice when it suits him and at the same time regional admins can not operate in a vacuum as if the country has no government. Their efforts should be streamlined while the stipulations of the current professional constitution honored.

[NGONGE]

Chimera;953569 wrote:

Where is the contradiction? Security and national healing without a proper international presence is just as unsustainable. The case of a grass-roots movement like the ICU is a good example. They controlled more land than either Madoobe or Hassan Sheikh, and restored stability in the South, yet they're history today.

 

Security and national healing comes through economic and diplomatic progress. The former is the fruit of the latter.

 

 

 

Xiin and Abtigiis provide me with insights to the situation, NGONGE provides a useless psycho-analysis.

 

 

 

You confirm its a red-herring then, that's all I wanted to get out of you sxb.

 

No worries.

Err..that's not what A&T said and unless the word "absolutely" has taken on an altogether new meaning, it's not what you said either.

 

No red herrings here, saaxib. No psycho-analysis either. I tell you exactly what I see. LISTS and daydreams are your forte. Real and proper debates are not. This is what I'm lampooning.

[N.O.R.F]

Alpha Blondy;953612 wrote:

^ oh yeah?

 

you're a former shadow of yourself Xinnoow.....just give-up, uncle. it'll restore some much needed sharaf. waa taalo.

Maybe it isn't Xiin