Kismayo Update

[NGONGE]

^^ War it wasn't Norf that asked for the update dee. You drove us crazy and got us addicted to this Kismaayo issue for the past few months and then suddenly stopped. I have withdrawl symptoms now and want an update ninyaho.

 

Haye, maxa soo khorday? Baastada ma la cunay mise wali way karaysaa?

[xiinfaniin]

^^NGONGE,

 

To say Kismayo issues lacked any updates is unexplainable given the amount of posts dedicated the events in Jubbaland. NORF's craze on Kismayo could not be explained by a lack of updates

 

The Baaso guy has been made example of what awaits for VOA presidents if they ever act on mere interviews

[Abtigiis]

NGONGE;960938 wrote:

^^ I have withdrawl symptoms now and want an update ninyaho.

 

Haye, maxa soo khorday? Baastada ma la cunay mise wali way karaysaa?

kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk :D :D kkkkkkkkkkkk

 

Baastada ma la cunay??

 

hadaan qosol u dhinto maanta Ngongaa I dilay dadoow.

[N.O.R.F]

Xiin updates are copy and paste jobs. I have lost hope that you would actually formulate an opinion on what should happen next for the benefit of Somalia. Its these kids following me around every thread that give you the impression I wanted an update. Have they been hired as the Jubbaland Cyber Police? Apo needed a job

[Baashi]

Xiin please ignore the likes of NORF . He's not making sense anymore.

 

NGONGE is raggeedii. I second that he is laacib iyo nus. Abitigiis dropped the ball and NGONGE was quick to see that breif opening.

 

Abtigiis awoowe with all its shortcomings and loopholes, the draft Constritution is the only thing we have. That sorry document is the product of the long and hard roadmap process. This SFG draws its legitimacy from this constitution and the roadmap that made possible to bring all the stakeholders to the dirrin. You can't exhort Madoobe to work with SFG and the same time throw the contract that Hassan swear to uphold. That just does not make sense.

 

At some point in the future government will hopefully come to its senses and take a coorective action in addressing constitutional questions head on.

 

Kismayo was a litmus test and what a litmus test it was

[N.O.R.F]

Ah, Bashi welcome back. Apologies, I tend to call a spade a spade. Waa la iska qirtaa saxib

 

Are you talking about the same constitution you didn't think needed discussinglast year?

[Carafaat]

N.O.R.F;960980 wrote:

Ah, Bashi welcome back. Apologies, I tend to call a spade a spade. Waa la iska qirtaa saxib

 

Are you talking about the same constitution you didn't think needed discussinglast year?

The same constitution that was stolen in the dark and replaced by another version, according to Faroole.

[Baashi]

NORF awoowe I never said or thought the constitution was irrelevant. I read it and understood it pretty well. It just so happen that we interpreted differently and we are not alone in reading it differently.

 

Make no mistake I for one thought one has to go back to the primary document and settle things that way. All my posts reflect that deep held understanding.

[Baashi]

I think I posted on a different thread. I intended to post the below comment in a different thread. Someone please move it to the other thread.

[Abtigiis]

war ileen tan oo kale. War Baashe maxaa ku dhacay? Waxaan moodi jiray inuu Xinn iyo Ngonge fahan dhaamo!

 

Listen ya jamacaa. Re-read what I wrote. I am not saying constitution looma baahna. Ama yaan la aqbalin. I am talking about what constitution means in a more generic terms. I am trying to say it is "consent" that makes a document a constitution. It is not the mere articles written in the document. Whatever you say, if Somalia's Constitution today says "Hargeisa is the second capital of the Somali Republic", and the Hargeisawi's DO NOT CONSENT TO IT, it remains a constitution to those who want to use it, but for Hargeisaawi's it is just a paper! Nothing else! That does not mean it cannot be enforced! It can be enforced. But through brute force only. Now, that said, what I trying to say is that if the parliament meets tomorrow and because of the clan balance decides that the President has the right to nominate Governors, there will be no ambiguity. But if the D-block members reject the decision and withdraw from the Parliament because of pressure from their constituencies, the same Hargeisa scenario will follow. The Government can consider the decision a majority decision and start to enforce it, but if there is no CONSENT from the clan (and this applies for all clans by the way), then they will not see the constitution as a document which they have agreed to. That makes it a paper for them.

 

Marka, Baashe must see the two-fold debate here. One is what constitution is about, the other is whether in the current discussion, people should insist on a particular interpretation of articles of the constitution. I hope Ngonge got me.

[N.O.R.F]

^Interesting. But wasn’t the document consented to through last year’s process? Can one say he consents to it one year and then say he doesn’t consent to it the following year (the same document)?

 

Baashi, after last week the government will feel vindicated in that reconciliation is required. As for the constitution, I fail to see how it can be interpreted any other way other than the process not being followed. Saying that, the government failed to kick start the process (so maybe there was no process to be followed in the first place). From their end the SFG could argue they weren’t given ample time to get organised and pass the required laws through parliament. It’s a quagmire.

[NGONGE]

A&T,

 

I get you saaxib. I just think you’re poring too closely to the issue to see it for what it is.

The Federal government, PL and all other Somali stakeholders (minus Somaliland) have signed up to this constitution and to the roadmap. They all agreed to adhere to it and were even warned off about “spoiling”. They were all pushed, cajoled and almost forced to toe the line and work towards bringing Somalia back.

 

Still, the process was never straight forward; the constitution, parliament and federal framework were never clarified or set in stone for a reason. The reason was to allow all sides room for manoeuvre and to make the disputes political rather than clannish (even though the clan issue towers above everything else).

 

Hassan Sheikh is being obstinate and refusing to compromise on his interpretation of the constitution or the setting up of federal states. But even that is not a problem had he had something else up his sleeve with which he could pummel his opposition (politically speaking). Alas, as far as we can see, he doesn’t have much other than Barre & Baasto (which is nothing short of a declaration of war and, should it continue in the same vein, would actually break all the rules).

 

The Imam is really not much different to Hassan (well, except in that the Imam shouts his opposition openly whilst Hassan loves to slither about). The Imam’s politics has always been that of confrontation and open defiance (see his “they tampered with the constitution” argument). His politics, outwardly at least, is all about winners and losers. He does not leave any room for compromise nor does he (seem to) care for compromise. As things stand today, he would be the worst alley for Madoobe to have (unless he and his MPs are needed for parliamentary votes).

 

The main player and the key to all this dispute is Madoobe. Mr Islaan wants to keep the seat of power for himself. But, in order for him to keep the seat in a Somali federal government, he needs to outmanoeuvre and outplay everyone else (up to and including the Kenyans themselves). Yet, in order to do that, he also needs to be in full control of Kismaayo! How could he do such a thing when he’s being attacked from all sides by all kinds of opponents (even food items)?

 

Madoobe can’t afford to “take his ball home”, he has to reach out to his opponents within Kismaayo and win them to his side. If he does not, he will lose. Not because Hassan Sheikh is a greater politician than he is, not because the Imam gave him bad advice but because, like Hassan, he was too stubborn to play the politics game.

 

 

The Hargeisa analogy would make sense if Somaliland has signed up to this constitution.

[N.O.R.F]

Apophis;961216 wrote:

^ You sure do fight tooth and nail for a constitution which, as a secessionist, you utterly reject. Odd folks, the Anti-Jubbaland Cyber Lobbyists (A.J.C.L).

It is the 'elephant in the room' you and the others have avoided to discuss (tooth and nail). It is the reason for the disagreements but was the basis for agreement last year when creating the government.

[N.O.R.F]

^Erm, where did I say I reject it? I have repeatedly stated that, subject to interpretation, it could be used to dismantle the Jubbaland process. Give us your interpretation, go on, extend yourself

[The Zack]

N.O.R.F;961269 wrote:

^Erm, where did I say I reject it? I have repeatedly stated that, subject to interpretation, it could be used to dismantle the Jubbaland process. Give us your interpretation, go on, extend yourself

You reject it because you support Somaliland's secession dream. Do you not?

That is what Apo is saying. It is like atheist preaching about Shia vs Sunni lol .