Arms Embargo should only be Lifted When Government Creates Viable National Army, Recruited from All

[Malika]

^You must have missed Ngonge's motto - 'Clan is Everything' ....

 

Waxaa laa yiri - there is no difference between an illiterate geeljire to the phd holder of the Somali kind, kuli seem to have the same thinking process when it comes to Somali affairs...lol

[Rahima]

^ Anaaba is la yaabo sometimes- I'm convinced that faraha ayaan ka falanahay. I read some of the comments here and whilst i generally ignore those i can't take seriously i find myself feeling the need to re-educate and re-direct the PhD holders,lol. I'm failing obviously, they seem to be in cahoots, I've insulted the overarching doctrine.

[NGONGE]

^^ I legitimise Xiin’s main point (not the noise that surrounds it) because he and those that share his point of view form an important part of Somalia. You see, Somalia would have not reached the point where real hope is finally detectable without talks and reconciliation (all the Garowe meetings and the London and Istanbul conferences, etc). In all these times and throughout that process it is inconceivable to suggest or think that major points of differences between the sides and clans have not been encountered and that there weren’t any hurdles or stumbling blocks. In fact, some would argue that the whole federal experiment was the result of clans wanting to see more equality and fairness in the Somali process.

 

The embargo issue or that of looted houses falls into the same category. In other words, they are problems caused by the same mistrust and suspicion. So, although I would normally agree with your ideal world scenario, Somalia’s case is one of reality on the ground. The reality is that of 4.5 and federal states. It is one of collective agreements and compromise. Therefore, in order for the process to continue to bear fruit, one has to consider, accept and solve all problems and complaints that may arise, no matter how silly. Right now, some in the Somali arena are vociferously raising their doubts about the lifting of the arms embargo. Behind all the noise and confrontational language lays a genuine and present fear; the fear that the “others” are planning to arm themselves and go back to settling old scores. To simply say “don’t be silly” to someone who is afraid that you’re out to get him only makes him more suspicious and more boisterous. Wax fahan.

 

p.s.

Never mind you and your good reputation on SOL, have you ever seen Nin Yaban post in the political section? That’s the thing about politics though; a reputation that took several years to build can be destroyed in seconds. Keep your helmet on, Rahima. This is a dirty place.

[Mario B]

I support the partial lifting of the arms embargo. I believe the FG should be allowed to equip itself with light armoured vehicles, body armoured and helmets, communication equipment, night vision technology etc...the time for lifting of embargo on tanks, helicopters and fighter jets is premature given the nature of mistrust.

 

 

 

 

Also the IC should help us in the building of military barracks and military hospitals across the country.

[Mario B]

Malika;919385 wrote:

^You must have missed Ngonge's motto - 'Clan is Everything' ....

 

Waxaa laa yiri - there is no difference between an illiterate geeljire to the phd holder of the Somali kind, kuli seem to have the same thinking process when it comes to Somali affairs...lol

Exactly right my friend. Couldn't have said it better myself!

[malistar2012]

The Government was democratically Elected by Somali Parliament consist of all Somali clan .

 

 

I support the lifting of the arms embargo , region militias are to join Somali Army in order to create a viable, competent and inclusive national army recruited from all corners of the country.

 

All regions in Somalia are fairly represented in all level of Government admin .

 

The Army leadership and structure is based on 4.5 formula.

who is the defence minister, who is the armed forces chief of staff, who is the chairman of the parliamentary defence committee??

 

our sovereignty lays in the hand of Strong Somali National Army

[Mario B]

Malistar, I don't agree with those who want the ban to stay, but a partial ban will allow time for most sections of Somalis to iron out their political differences and create an inclusive admin (also sort out what form federalism will work for the average Faarax).

 

The perception now is that we have a government of a president and his inner circles and clan states that are pushing back the Federal government. Also this idea of expanded ministries isn't helping with the distribution of power. [ There should be an independent Ministry of Health and Ministry of Education etc, etc...]

[NGONGE]

Malika;919385 wrote:

^You must have missed Ngonge's motto - 'Clan is Everything' ....

 

Waxaa laa yiri - there is no difference between an illiterate geeljire to the phd holder of the Somali kind, kuli seem to have the same thinking process when it comes to Somali affairs...lol

Oh I missed this one!

 

Doesn't this thread (and others) prove the C is E rule, Malika? When a mad man breaks his legs, it will be crazy to start dealing with the greater issue of madness rather than the broken leg first. Wax fahan.

 

p.s.

On everyday issues, the geel jire and the phd holder are the same. The only difference is one can articualte his ideas better and the other can't.

[Mario B]

NGONGE;919436 wrote:

On everyday issues, the geel jire and the phd holder are the same. The only difference is one can articualte his ideas better and the other can't.

Isn't this the problem? a geel jire and a Phd holder sharing the same world view. Shouldn't we be expecting the later to be an 'enlightened man/woman' who sees the nuanced part of existence and believes that reality isn't black and white!

[NGONGE]

Mario B;919441 wrote:

Isn't this the problem? a geel jire and a Phd holder sharing the same world view. Shouldn't we be expecting the later to be an 'enlightened man/woman' who sees the nuanced part of existence and believes that reality isn't black and white!

But reality isn't black and white. Reality is that there IS clan conflict in Somalia. Something both the educated and uneducated know. Only those living in dreamland choose to brush it all under the carpet and pretend that no such things exist, saaxib.

[Mario B]

NGONGE;919442 wrote:

But reality isn't black and white. Reality is that there IS clan conflict in Somalia. Something both the educated and uneducated know. Only those living in dreamland choose to brush it all under the carpet and pretend that no such things exist, saaxib.

The conflict is a political one, so long as we remove violence from our political disagreement then all is healthy.

 

P.s They say you can't teach an old dog a new trick, but I will try...instead of 'clan is everything' why don't you try this new adage 'Somalinimo is everything when it comes to our politics, and that our motto[policy] is 'No Somali left behind'.

[Che -Guevara]

What sexist

[Haatu]

Apophis;919462 wrote:

Women, especially Somali ones, should stay out of politics

in the same way men should stay out of fashion. Just being realistic.

Cheap.

[Malika]

Ngonge, my dear friend - I do not deny that tribalism is a Somali political reality but I also know a national unity can be a reality; but at present it is not quite a reality...accepted. What we need is to change this reality of tribalism and adapt it to the unreality of national unity to make it a reality...first we must challenge our own interpretation of events and situations, for example of xiin's post here - how did his post translate to him being tribalist? When he only highlighted the dangers that could be in the lifting of the arm embargo, to a yet unstable and fragmented nation- his concern are legit and any logical person can see that, unless of-course blinded by the green tribal lenses...This new goverment is young and yet to have any full control of the country - until it has earned the trust of the people, it can do its job on the back of AMISOM tanks..These are fragile times, the Army recruitment should be very inclusive , it has to cast widely across the country..hadhii kale, some will feel insecure thus its the duty of the goverment to make people feel secured.

 

Challenging what has become the norm is the way forward my friend..clan isn't everything.

[Gabbal]

I am against the lifting of the arms embargo as well as the bilateral exchange of aid funds without independent oversight because of a simple reason; the national state mechanisms governing the rebuilding of state institutions have not yet been fully drafted through proper legislation and implementation is yet to be pursued. The government should concentrate on codification of law in all levels federal vs. state, civil, municipal, etc. I have heard the top leaders speak on this issue and the President spoke about a future conference where lawyers, law makers, and constitution experts would meticulously outline the process and management of rebuilding the state institutions including the armed forces. As I see it the government with support from AMISOM and various partners has made admirable security gains. Before opening the state to the floodgates of widespread procurement of arms through the relaxation of the arms embargo, the government should solidfy the ways and means of proper running of state institutions not least of all the security sectors.

 

I believe the current government is led by honest and good men. This is not enough. Trust and confidence in government and state should only be derved through accountability steming from law and codes. This is how state institutions will be held accountable by the Somali people and fears, mistrust, and hesitation will be alleviated.

 

Is the Liqaye accused in this topic my old friend who once reminisced to me about Beled-Xaawo?