A third way for Somaliland and Somalia

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Union should be beneficial for both sides geopolitical economically security this seems to be not the case union with Somalia was given a chance 30 years it failed miserably why repeat the same mistake all over again makes no sense. Why Unite with a poor country when you can unite with a strong state as that of Ukraine with a gdp of $344.727 billion dollars, if we talking about unity. I don't think when we talk about unity religion plays a major role Turkey wants to be part of the EU Morocco wants to cooperate with the EU in one of their trade unions. Somalilanders in the 50s were maybe dumb and naive thinking Unity with Somalia would benefit them the old generation feels ashamed because its their fault that Somaliland is fighting to secure dejure recognition in 2013. While they had the chance 52 to years ago real easy. But some how think it was a lesson for the people of Somaliland never trust some one blindly. They put Pan Somalism before their own interest Djibouti didn't and i swear by god if the people of O'gaden region were given the chance to be free of Ethiopia they would never join with Somalia. But that doesnt mean Somalilanders are disliking people of Somalia, it just means ino kala sooca geela:D

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Rahima watch this kids just imitate their parents both SL and Somalia a nice play lol

 

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[Rahima]

XX,

 

It's good to be honest with each other. The situation of Somalia has nothing to do with the bid for independence. It is about history, open to interpretation yes, but unchangeable. Even if Somalia had a GDP that trumps that of Ukraine i'm sure you'd come up with some other argument.

 

Please don't make it sound like Somalia is some God forsaken land with no hope, 30 years did you say? Are you trying to convince us that unification is beneficial for Somalia but not SL?

 

Look, no point arguing about this, i support SL, it just would be good if folks like you said it like it was and stop the marmarsiyo. Your argument is full of contradictions, on the one hand you say it is about interest, on the other you say "it was a lesson for the people of Somaliland never trust some one blindly". So which one is it? The latter I'm sure, hence my point.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Its both its about what is good for you're country interests economy security and its also about trust grievances i have seen the old Somalia the new Somaliland. I think some how Somalia needs Somaliland more than Somaliland needs Somalia. Its Somalia that's more attached to the Union sometimes obsessed not you Rahima there are many like you who believe in live and let live. But sometimes i think its not that they are not rational. But a Somali republic with out Somaliland they cant think of that it doesn't come into their mind. Its more psychological attachment they have with Somaliland ever since Somalias independence first of July was the day of the union they cant think of a day Somaliland was not there. So its hard for them to let go but i think with time this process will be loosened up a bit since Somalilands re-independence in 1991 the people of Somalia lived with out Somaliland. So there will be less political cultural attachment to Somaliland. Give it a few more years and no one will ever remember the union.Keep in mind 70% of SL population are below the age of 35 i think this is the same with Somalia. The 2 people have adopted unintentionally different identities the past 2 decades so i think its destiny.

[QansaxMeygaag]

Oodweyne;909562 wrote:

This is what is known in certain quarters a trail balloon send up to see whether the public could be conditions to accept a diminished outcome from the said talks with somalia.

 

In other words, you do this sort of stuff in advance of a likely concession you know you will have to make in the negotiation table.

 

All in all, it is non-starter for Somaliland, despite whatever the some elites connected to the current government may whisper to the ears of a passing journalist. But we shall see.

I agree with your analysis; looks like a canary in a mine...

[Carafaat]

Oodweyne;909703 wrote:

Haatu,

 

How about we make a deal in here and say the minute you folks in NFD stopped being the Kukuye favourite butlers and all handy shoe-shiners and to boot decide to join somalia, then at that day we in somaliland may passingly see whether some sort of association with somalia is to our benefit.

 

But till that day see to it to notice that charitable advise of the kind you have offered to somaliland may come useful to your kind of ilk.

Loool@Kikuyu favourite butler.

 

In all seriousnesd why does Haatu and co belief so much in Kenya? Rather fight for the indelpedence of NFD or Somaliweyn?

[QansaxMeygaag]

Xaaji Xunjuf;909891 wrote:

Union should be beneficial for both sides geopolitical economically security this seems to be not the case union with Somalia was given a chance 30 years it failed miserably why repeat the same mistake all over again makes no sense. Why Unite with a poor country when you can unite with a strong state as that of Ukraine with a gdp of $344.727 billion dollars, if we talking about unity. I don't think when we talk about unity religion plays a major role Turkey wants to be part of the EU Morocco wants to cooperate with the EU in one of their trade unions. Somalilanders in the 50s were maybe dumb and naive thinking Unity with Somalia would benefit them the old generation feels ashamed because its their fault that Somaliland is fighting to secure dejure recognition in 2013. While they had the chance 52 to years ago real easy. But some how think it was a lesson for the people of Somaliland never trust some one blindly. They put Pan Somalism before their own interest Djibouti didn't and i swear by god if the people of O'gaden region were given the chance to be free of Ethiopia they would never join with Somalia. But that doesnt mean Somalilanders are disliking people of Somalia, it just means ino kala sooca geela:D

So why did West Germany unite with East Germany if your logic is to be followed? One could argue there was nothing in it for the West Germans, if anything they has to subsidize the East for a very long time, and I believe they still do...

[STOIC]

Raheema, that is sad and I agree with you we should not dance around the issue or undisturbed by reality, but for some reason I still have hope . Without distorting the problems at hand I still think Somalis need each other and an expression of solidarity can only come from the people in the street and not the politicians. A secure and economical viable Somalia/Somaliland can only be built with strong solidarity! If such a solidaity takes place in the heart of the Somalis a much greater prowess can be anticipated for all Soomalis.

 

Somaliland has its own problems and I will be damn if I sit here and say they are better off staying the way they are today.The last twenty years Somaliland have achieved great success since Somalia was on a state of dormancy or inactivity, but they still don't have the ownership of their destiny in their hands.They are alot of disheartening facts that are not only unique to them, but to all Somalis. They still have communities that are not supporting the secession within their borders. They still have sub-clan politics and greedy politician the list goes on and on...

[Haatu]

It appears I hit a nerve, and a raw one at that too.

 

XX, take a deep breath and read what I said again. I agree with you, Somalia =/= Somaliweyn. So, by conceding for Somaliweyn instead of Somalia you save face. Capiche?

 

Oodka, if the butler earns a better wage in Nairobi than in Mogadishu, than can you really blame him for his choice of employment?

 

Wadani, I wouldn't mind joining Somalia today but the reality on the ground dictates otherwise. The Kenyans aren't willing to let go and the populace will only join once Somalia can offer the services they currently receive, no matter how small. As for Somaliland, economically today it is no better than Somalia. The S/land population won't suffer a drop in quality of life if they join Somalia unlike NEP. To put it simply, you guys are further up the road to Somaliweyn than us and will reach the destination sooner. That doesn't mean we're not coming, we're merely behind you. Capiche?

 

The Caravan has been upgraded into a ferry and is waiting. :D

[QansaxMeygaag]

Carafaat;909904 wrote:

Loool@Kikuyu favourite butler.

 

In all seriousnesd why does Haatu and co belief so much in Kenya? Rather fight for the indelpedence of NFD or Somaliweyn?

Isn't it a case of putting the cart before the horse? Why fight for NFD and Kililka5 if the original 2 cannot even be brought together? Isn't it worth start with the original 2 first, which in management terms would be termed "a low hanging fruit"?

[Haatu]

Carafaat;909904 wrote:

Loool@Kikuyu favourite butler.

 

In all seriousnesd why does Haatu and co belief so much in Kenya? Rather fight for the indelpedence of NFD or Somaliweyn?

Carafaat we're not as foolish as our kin across the border (Somali Galbeed). We've been there, done that and have achieved a big fat ZERO. Also, Somalia wasn't that interested in liberating us as they were in Somali Galbeed. So we then decided instead of living in constant fear and violence and achieve nothing, we'd rather live in peace and get whatever paltry sums Nairobi sends our way. Thanks to this sound logic, a lot of lives have been saved.

[QansaxMeygaag]

Haatu;909907 wrote:

It appears I hit a nerve, and a raw one at that too.

 

XX, take a deep breath and read what I said again. I agree with you, Somalia =/= Somaliweyn. So, by conceding for Somaliweyn instead of Somalia you save face. Capiche?

 

Oodka, if the butler earns a better wage in Nairobi than in Mogadishu, than can you really blame him for his choice of employment?

 

Wadani, I wouldn't mind joining Somalia today but the reality on the ground dictates otherwise. The Kenyans aren't willing to let go and the populace will only join once Somalia can offer the services they currently receive, no matter how small. As for Somaliland, economically today it is no better than Somalia. The S/land population won't suffer a drop in quality of life if they join Somalia unlike NEP. To put it simply, you guys are further up the road to Somaliweyn than us and will reach the destination sooner. That doesn't mean we're not coming, we're merely behind you. Capiche?

 

The Caravan has been upgraded into a ferry and is waiting.

:D

I agree. As the Xamaris say, canjeero sidi ay isakorfuusha yaa loo kalaqaada

 

Remember Kenyatta's famous quip when NFD wanted to secede; he said "you can pack your camels and go but am not giving up an inch of Kenyan soil".

[Rahima]

XX,

 

Well of course you would think Somalia needs SL more!

 

A lot of the time i find that fellow Somalis object to SL not because of any specific attachment or obsession (which is beyond insulting btw) but because of all the contested areas. What exactly is SL? Does it include Awdal for example, because we all know that many from that region view SL as a temporary notion. Are they being forced into an independence they do not want?

 

You are right about identities though, when i think of Hargeysa i don't think of it the same way as i do Kismaayo, Baidoa, Mogadishu or Bossaso. No ill feelings, just being honest. Obviously the SL/Somalia thing has affected even those of us from Somalia.

 

STOIC,

 

I see your point but it will be very hard to overcome such feelings. Of course it would be nice if we could (heck i hope for the unification for the entire Ummah) but we just aren't ready for it yet and i doubt we will be any time soon.

[QansaxMeygaag]

Haatu;909911 wrote:

Carafaat we're not as foolish as our kin across the border (Somali Galbeed). We've been there, done that and have achieved a big fat ZERO. Also, Somalia wasn't that interested in liberating us as they were in Somali Galbeed. So we then decided instead of living in constant fear and violence and achieve nothing, we'd rather live in peace and get whatever paltry sums Nairobi sends our way. Thanks to this sound logic, a lot of lives have been saved.

Not really, the shifta movement was defeated after all the supplies and arms dried up from Somalia. Cigaal signed a "no contest" treaty with Kenya and that was the end of the secessionist movement. It was emergency laws and brute force after that...no more garab from older brother.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

QansaxMeygaag;909905 wrote:

So why did West Germany unite with East Germany if your logic is to be followed? One could argue there was nothing in it for the West Germans, if anything they has to subsidize the East for a very long time, and I believe they still do...

Because the Germans had an Empire in 16 century which even included Austria and other parts and in 1870 the Empire was led by William the first and latter William the 3rd it was easy for them revive their old Empire after the cold war they were divided because of a geopolitical cold war between the west and the east. Somaliland and Somalia never shared a country only between 1960 and 1991 its a whole different case different civilization different continent different history different people thus incomparable.