Thoughts

[Khalaf]

I would like to understand how these conclusions was reached by the Culima!

 

Culimadaas ayaa shaaca ka qaaday in wax

shaki aysan ku jirin

in qofkii naftiisa waaya isagoo la dagaalamaya ciidamda Itoobiya ee jooga dalka Soomaaliya uu galayo janada.

 

Waxaa kale oo ay culimada Soomaalida ay sheegeen in qofkii dhinta isaga oo ku jira safka ciidanka Itoobiya aysan wax shaki ku jirin inuu naarta galayo sida diinta islaamka ay noo sheegtay

source

1. Only Allah is the Knower of the AL-GHAIB-the unseen and knows the intentions of people and knows who will enter jannah and who will enter Nar (the unseen). On what authority have ulma in this case say one side will enter jannah, the other will be in nar? Considering these verses from the Quran:

 

Say: "No one in the heavens and the earth knows the unseen but Allah; and they do not know when they shall be raised." [27:65]

 

Which brings me to my next question, because i hear there are two clear cut sides to the conflict, true believers vs. munafiqeen.

 

2. Aiit explain to me how the ICU are haaq ku dirir islamically, and by islamically can only be when its on the method of prophethood-purely for the sake of Allah Most Great Alone which would divide the people into two camps that are clear cut. Lets rewind the show back to the orgins of the ICU, tell me how they followed the method of prophethood scw since their humble beginnings in xamar to kismaayo and beyond?

 

 

*****bringing peace, stability, the dislike of warlords, national pride, injustices, Ethiopia involvement, American conspiracies ect is not what I am interested in i know that alreadly, but was this movement purely islamic for the sake of Allah Most Great Alone, on the footsteps of nabi scw and the companions ra and if yes, explain how so because that would make the ulmi's conclusions valid and hence there are two camps clearly, if not then how grave are those statements by the Culima? And Allah Knows Best. Just thoughts that i have not found any convincing answers too,. ***********

[Nur]

Khalaf Brother.

 

There is a merit to your question, the statments that you have quoted could have been put in a better way, as follows.

 

1. Maxkamadaha Islaamiga ah ee Somalia wexey sheegteen iney wax ku xukumaaan Quraanka iyo Sunnada, inta awooddooda tahay.

 

2. Dawladda (Transplanted Foreign Government) wexey la safatay cadowga ummadda kula dirirsan iney diinta Allah isku xukumaan, oo caddeystay ineyna ralli ka noqoneyn in Somalia ay ka istaagto dowlad diinta Islamka ah wax ku xukunta.

 

3. Labada qolo wexey isku dirireen in qolo walba ay ka taliso waddanka.

 

4. Qolada TFG wexy kaalmeystay cadowga ummadda ee diintooda rabta iney tirtirto, horeyna u gumeysatay dadka Somalida galbeed, ka dharjisay Jaad, una banneysay wax walboo Allah xarrimay si ay diintooda uga fogesyo, una diidday iney diintooda ku dhaqmaan.

 

5. Qolada Maxkamadaha, wexey kaalmeysteen Allah, ooy sheegteen ine diintiisa iyo sharcigiisa inuu saremaro u dirirayaan. Muddada gaaban ay waddanka xukumeen, wargeysyada dunidoo dhan wexey isku raaceen in ay nabad waddanka ka dhaliyeen markey ku xukumeen diinta Allah ooy ummadda ka xoreeyeen qabqablayaasha dagaalka waddanka 16 sano dhiiga daadshay, haatanna, la wada saftay cadwoga Allah, kana soo horjeeda diinta Allah in laga hirgaliyo wadankeenna.

 

6. Qofkii Allah diintiisa iney sare marto u dhinta ooy ka dhab tahay,WAXAAN SHAKI LAHEYN INUU jannada galayo, qofkii u dhinta asagoo la diriray cadawoga Allah iyo waxa u gargaara oo ku dhinta niyaddas Allah wuxuu noo sheegay inuu SHAHIID YAHAY.

 

7. Qofkii lagu dilo asagoo u gargaaraya cadowga diiddaan shareecada Allah dada lagu xukumo, oo la jira ama u kaalmeeya cadowga Allah, Allah wuxuu noo sheegay inuu ka noqday diinta Islaamka oo uu naarta galayo.

 

May be that would have been to the point though bit long. Let me know if the point of the Ulima is clear, that is what they meant, but for previty, they fell short, hence my explanation of meanings between the lines.

 

Nur

[Khalaf]

Salaamu lah Sh. Nur, yeh- yeh I can read af Somali kabax! but inshallah lets stick with English. I hope u can make sense of my “thoughts” and questions, I in no way am in the realm of those men or you in terms of knowledge or experience, but as a sincere Muslim would like to make “sense” of this saga. As ive said before, I am primly interested in was this movement truly Islamic meaning was it in the footsteps of the nabi scw and his companions ra, anything else is deemed bidah. The social, moral, national, ect aspects of it be it good or not I am not interested in, just the islamic aspect which means the way of nabi scw.

 

As you know Nur, the time we are living in today wa Qarnigi (century) Gaalda. With Allah Alone rests Power, but if we look around the world xoog iyo xuukaan is not in the hands of Muslims, nor do they have “awood” to rule with Islam. Even in the land of the Kaba we witnessed the Scholars of Islam in Mecca give fatwa for US troops to “protect” the rulers of the Kingdom. Thus it is fair to say world over, the Muslim societies including somalia are far from xuukuunka deenul Islam and divided into many camps.

 

Which brings me to this point, u said:

Maxkamadaha Islaamiga ah ee Somalia wexey sheegteen iney wax ku xukumaaan Quraanka iyo Sunnada, inta awooddooda tahay.

 

Nur, is it possible to establish this deen without following a particular method, the method that Allah has laid down for His Prophet scw? Is it possible to create a muslim community without following this method, or to be called a “Muslim Group” unless it fully enters in its trueness and complies with this prophetic method, and bases its entire way on Islam in every aspect? If yes tell me how the courts have honored the Islamic Method?

 

Going back to the scholars statement, I would say Allah Knows Best, because to reach such conclusions means there are two clear camps, one based solely on the correct aqeedah and method, the other not, I don’t think that is the case in Somalia but u may tell how that is considering the ICU alliance with Christian Eritrea, and amongst its comrades in battlefront those who burned human corpses among other things. The blood of the Muslims is unlawful except in three cases I am sure u know, and there is Hadith that says when two groups fight that are muslims, the killer and killed are both in hell. And it begs the question when the ICU was fighting warlords that wouldn’t comply with their authority what made their (the warlords and their followers) blood halaal in xamar or in kismaayo? Did the ICU in those cases follow the prophetic method in implementing the islamic way as was done in Mecca, then in setting up a islamic community like in Madinah or as witnessed due to their hasty actions opened the flood gates to a greater fitnah?

[Nur]

Khalaf bro.

 

I know where you'r coming from, first read suurah Al Rum, it begins with the mention of a battle between Pagan Persia and Christian Romans, the verse describes that persecuted believers in Makkah following that war were sympathizing with the Christians as their cousins in the kinship of the Gospel of Jesus (peace be upon him) sent by Allah,( although the Quran maintains it was corrupted ) while their opponents the Qureish tribe, care takers of holy Makkah were siding with the Zoroastrian pagan Persians as they share polytheism.

 

The Quraan maintains that the Romans who were defeated in the first battle, will eventually win in the final war, and that day, persecuted believers in Makkah will rejoice for a Roman victory.

 

The involvement of Ethiopia in Somalia is transgression, an invasion that was against the UN charter, endorsed only by the international outlaw nation of USA ( UN Charter, Geneva Convention etc) , it has also dominated Eritrea for many years, an continues to subjugate western Somalis to this day, and Eritrea with the Help of the Siad Barre regime was liberated from Ethiopian empire, now, both nations, are victims of Ethiopia for Eritrea to help Somalia against Ethiopian occupation, without sending a single soldier, is not equivalent to the Ethiopian / American invasion and the bombardment and merciless cold blood death of thousands of civilians as a result .

 

The issue is that of justice and oppression, regardless of faith, its an Islamic cause, Islam made alliance in the past with any non Muslim entity that helped establish itself. Allah says in Quraan : Allah does not forbid that you treat well those (unbelievers) who have not persecuted you nor have driven you out of your homes, but Allah forbids that you become allies with those unbelievers who have fougaht against you (against your faith) and who have driven you out of your homes "

 

As we Muslims, we always side with those closer to ideal Islam, and treat well any Islamic friendly entity, even if they are non Muslim.

 

Please read the following eNuri aqeedah article:

 

 

Q. What is the Aqeedah concept of Al Walaa and Al Baraa ?

 

A question posed by Nomad Hanif, here was my answer:

 

 

Bismillah wa bihi nastaciin.

 

Hanif bro.

 

Jazaakallahu Khairan for posing a great question at the most needed time ever, a time when issues got mixed up, and fundemental concept in Islam got entangled with whims and desires.

 

Before we define the concept of Al Walaa and Al Baraa in Islam, let me congratulate you for picking one of the most Tawxiid centric screen names, Hanif, is an outstanding name, it actually desctibes the concept for which you are seeking an answer for.

 

Hanif, means a person who always is searching to connect with his maker and away from any other diversion, a person, who seeks Allah SWT, but at the same time diverging away from offering his services to othet than Allah SWT, in that sense, the name Hanif is one coin, depicting walaa on one side and baraa on the other. Abraham, the patriarch of all Monotheits was one such a Hanif, Allah SWT called him Hanifan Musliman, Navigating his way to Allah always and submittinh his will to Allah( True Jews at their time, true Christians at their time and True Muslims all allign themselves with Abraham central concept, because Abraham was the Father of Islam ( submission and allegiance to Allah alone).) ,

 

Abrahams legacy was that of true devotion to Allah SWT and denial of other forms of subjugation to creatures, be they humans, animals ar objetcs. Abrahams famous statement was " Innaa bura-aa- u, minkum wa mimmaa tacbuduuna min duunillaahi, kafarnaaa bikum, wa badaa beinanaa wa baynakum al cadaawata wal baghdaa-a, xataa tuminuu billaahi waxdah " meaning " We are indeed disowning you ( since you are criminals by worshipping other than Allah)and we further disassociate ourselves with all that you worship other than Allah, ( and because of this disownment and disassociation) clear enemity and hatred is apparent between us, up untill ( you repent) and worship Allah alone "

 

For that bold statement, Allah honored Abraham by calling him Hanif ( mid ka soo issha waxaan Allah aheyn), Allah further instructed believers to make Abraham thier example for his brave stand against his very own tribe and father, and for his partying ways with his people on the basis of belief in Allah.

 

Abraham's word of Walaa and Baraa, became the center principle of islam, Allah SWT says : Wa jacalahaa kalimatan baaqiyatan fii caqibihi lacallahum yarjicuun " meaning, " Allah made (that word of Abraaham) a legacy word after (Abraham) so that (Poeple) can refer back to (that word whenever they get lost from the true path of Allah ).

 

That word, of Walaa and Baraa, took the present form under the Messneger of Allah Muhammad SAWS when he declared " Laa Elaaha illaa Allah' no allegiance to any other Sovereign other than Allah as the only rightful Sovereign.

 

 

Allah SWT mentioned this concept in numerous verses in Quraan : " Ucbuduu Allah wajtanibuu Al Taaaghuut" Serve Allah, and stay away from the Service of transgressors" Taghuut in Arabic comes from the root Daghaa, which is when a measured quantity crosses thershold or its limits. So , any human who claims to have devine rights becomes Dhaguut in that sense, which exactly what Pharaoh of Egypt has claimed when he was subjugating the helpless slaves of the Children of Israel. Pharoah calimed " Maa calimtu lakum min ilaahin gheirii " meaning, I know of no other Sovereign except me to rule over you"

 

Walaa in Arabic has the root of Yalii, meaning: following, Walaa comes from the noun Waliyy ( friend, closest to you, caretaker, overseer, defender, stake owner ). So, in that regard, Walaa means the concept that assigns Allah alone to be ( friend, closest to you, caretaker, overseer, defender, stake owner ) for a believer by virtue of his creation of the same.

 

Walaa, therefore is the result of love of Allah, because once you assign all the above qualities to Allah alone like Abraham defined who should be his Waliyy : " The one who created me, so he(only) can guide me, and the One who feeds and quenches me, and when I get sick, Allah is the one who cures, And the one who will (finally) cause me to die and the will resurruct me, and in the day of judgement the one with whom i place my hopes to forgive my sin, Once you believe in these favors, you can not allig yourself with other than Allah SWT, you cant help but love Allah with all your soul and body and mind, a sign that you Allah also is reciprocating that love for you.

 

Walaa of Allah SWT, therefore is born out of love of Allah. Allah SWT says in holy Quraan : Innamaa waliyyukumullahu wa rasuuluhu walladiina aamanuu" " Your Waliyy, is indeed Allah SWT, his Messneger and the believers. This verse clearly draws the meaning of Walaa to be the ultimate alligiance which is much higher than any other temporal or worldly allegiances that are born out of passing interests of the lowly life of this world, while Allah SWT is calling believrs for a better life in the hereafter if the form allegiance with Allah who will deliver his promises unlike humans who always let you down and betray you when you count on them in difficult times.

 

Baraa, on the other hand is the exact opposit of the Walaa concept, total disowing, disassociation, cutting of sympathy, due to the crime of disbelief in Allah SWT and befriending their enemy Satan..

 

The word Baraa has roots in (Ba ri ah) among its derivatives, is healing from an ailment, clearing your stand that you are not of a crime that is committed by a group or a person.

 

In ancinet times, one wars brake out between tribes, neutral tribes had to show their Baraa-ah ( they are not part of the warring parties) so that they are not drawn to an unjust war or to pay the price of being a supprort of a party.

 

Allah SWT instructs believers in Suurah al Kaafiroon ( The unbelievers) : " Say o ye unbelievers, I do not worship that you worship, and you do not worship that which I worship..... to you is your way of life(which is based on your beliefs) and to me is my way of life ( based on my beliefs).

 

When Abraham practiced Baraa ah of his people, Allah SWT blessed him with the following:

 

1. Children at old age ( he had Ishmael and Issac)

 

2. His Children and decendents were honored to become leaders for mankind, Allah said to Abraham" I will make you a leader to mankind, Abraham then asked " And my decendents?" Allah responded, transgressors of your progeny are not to benefit from this offer.

 

3. The house Abraham built for Allah in Mecca was accepted.

 

4.. He was given the title khalil ul Allah ( Allah's friend).

 

This topic is much deeper than I could respond to this thread, inshAllah when I get around to it again, I shall add more of my thoughts, till then, hold the rope of Allah tight, do not differ on the eventual purpose of being true servants of Allah SWT alone.

 

 

To be contiuned

 

 

2005 i-Nuuri Caqiidah First, Somaliaonline Summer Program.

 

If You Dont take a Stand For Allah Alone, Y'd Fall For Anything Else

 

Nur

 

...................................................................................................

 

Aqeedah Concepts and Terminology Series

[Khalaf]

SH. Nur is there a reason u didnt cover the main points of my post mainly what is the islamic way of establishing shariah in society? Two my brother there is no big difference between Eritrea and Ethiopia other then politics, Eritrea also has a tyrant in place which commits gross human violations, including the oppression of Muslims. If it comes to the fact that Eritrea has no soldiers in Somalia and neither is an aggressor, well that is due to the world order its on the side of TFG backed Ethiopia, and it could as well be said that TFG backed Ethiopia in somalia is not fighting Islam or Muslims but after a political group hence why all areas of Somalia are “peaceful” and the Muslims, their masjids, their salat is not under threat nor are they under oppression can freely practice their deen. Do u think if the appointed TFG government, no matter how corrupt it is ect had been allowed to rule from the beginning, would what transpired in Somalia (bombings, killings of civilians, fitnah) taken place? Since the ICU have/had no awood to rule with shariah in Somalia considering today’s reality not only world but inside somalia, do u think as the saying goes they awakened the fitnah and have a fault in what went down in Somalia? We are strictly discussing the Islamic way...... not nationalistic interests, or social interests, ect but what is the islamic way of establishing shariah in society?

 

 

1. What is the Islamic methodology? Do you agree this is the only way that shariah can succeed is by following this methodology hence why the Quran instructed the the nabi scw and his companions ra only towards this road? It is possible to establish this religion without following its particular method and entering it fully and faithfully? And do u think the ICU follow it according to you? Over to you bro. JZK.

[Nur]

Khalaf bro.

 

Let us go back to your initial questions:

 

"1. Only Allah is the Knower of the AL-GHAIB-the unseen and knows the intentions of people and knows who will enter jannah and who will enter Nar (the unseen). On what authority have ulma in this case say one side will enter jannah, the other will be in nar? Considering these verses from the Quran:

 

Say: "No one in the heavens and the earth knows the unseen but Allah; and they do not know when they shall be raised." [27:65]

 

Which brings me to my next question, because i hear there are two clear cut sides to the conflict, true believers vs. munafiqeen.

 

2. Aiit explain to me how the ICU are haaq ku dirir islamically, and by islamically can only be when its on the method of prophethood-purely for the sake of Allah Most Great Alone which would divide the people into two camps that are clear cut. Lets rewind the show back to the orgins of the ICU, tell me how they followed the method of prophethood scw since their humble

beginnings in xamar to kismaayo and beyond?"

 

 

My Response:

 

 

Bismillah, wa bihi nastaciin.

 

Akhii

 

A Good question is half the answer, and your two questions are humming with deep aqeedah and political assumptions, so to unearth the hidden assumptions in your questions, allow me to put it in my own words to understand you well, once you acknowledge the assunptions, or deny, my detailed point for a point answer will follow inshAllah.

 

 

Your Assumptions As I Understand:

 

a. In Islam, anyone who says laa ilaah illaa Allah is Muslim, actions or words contrary to islam do not make a person Kafir as long as his Niyah is good, which Allah only can see, thus the two groups are the same. further, Both sides ( TFG and ICU ) remain Muslims no matter of the actions they commit, allegiances to non Muslim entities, because we go to jannah on our intentions alone and not our actions, and Allah alone knows our actions, once a Muslim, allways a Muslim, no one can declare any Somali to be kaafir as long as he says la ilaaha illaa Allah even if all of his actions are not different than the kuffar in everyway.

 

 

b. Living and accepting a human made law in our lives does not contradict with our faith, as long as we pray and read Quraan.

 

c. Establishment of Sharia law is not mandatory, and if established or even attempted, protecting it by joining a resistance movement is not an Islamic duty if it can make Fitnah and divide the "Muslims".

 

d. The Quraan mentioned the qualities of a Munafiq, but pointing a finger at a warlord as a Munafiq if he fits the description of Munafiq can make Fitnah ( Because every clan has its own Doofaar ), thus accepting the TFG could have been better and more peaceful, most important thing is peace, even if being ruled by kuffaar ( Through TFG) who declared that they can not tolerate to see Sharia law to spread into other sleeping Somali areas they presently colonize ( Where Americans are planning to dig oil ).

 

e. TFG and ICU Both sides are dedicated to estblish Islam as the law of the land. Because the Islamic Democracy system presented by the TFG is no different than the Islamic Sharia presented by ICU since its not 100% according to the Sunnah of the Prophet SAWS, thus the two systems are the same.

 

 

f. Both sides are allies to Ethiopia and Eritrea respectively, Ethiopia and Eritea are equally guilty in their historic enemity to Somalia, their subjugation of our peoples, If ICU were sincere, they would not have sought help from Eritrea who is against our Somali interest as Ethiopia, thus the TFG and the ICU are the same.

 

g. The ICU is wrong because, look, all other regions are peaceful, and if they have accepted Ethiopian and American subjugation, they would've also lived peaceful just like Somaliland and Puntland. Beause as long as we go to the mosques to pray, as long as we are peaceful in our regions, we are following the Sunnah of our Prophet SAWS because fighting to stop foreign domination can make fitna in which many people die, so its wiser not to make the Ethiopi and and the Americans unhappy by declaring Sharia and seeking freedom from subjugation.

 

h. The ICU is not better than the TFG, they are not closer to Islam than the TFG, and in Islam if two "Muslims" dispute, we do not have to go back to the Quraan and the Sunnah to find a solution, as the Prophet SAWS instructed, by going back to the Ulima, we go back to the media, BBC, etc. because the Ulima from Puntland to Kismaio who say that the TFG are Murtadd for their actions against Islam are terribly wrong, they can never be right.

 

 

Please let me know if you agree with any of the above assumptions before I can post a formal answer to your above questions:

 

 

Peace Be Upon Those Who Follow Allah's Guidance

 

 

Nur

[Khalaf]

Yaa akhi its not good to make assumptions, I stopped at assumption numero uno, if my points aren’t clear only ask and I will be more then willing to clarify. A recap:

 

1. I have the most respect for the scholars, but on the issue of “shaki laan’ who is going to hellfire I found somewhat problematic. When we look at the Muslim World there are no countries or rulers practicing the concept of al walaa-al baraa, we even witnessed the scholars of Islam in Mecca making fatwa’s to allow US troops into the holy lands of Islam, and more the many evils that those who claimed to be Muslim have committed, I think a poor Somali youngster who enlisted with this TFG to make a little change aint dat bad. There are actions which make one kufar no doubt, deeds and faith go hand and hand in the Quran, however in the Quran Allah says that He forgives Whom He Wills and Punishes Whom He Wills, except for shirk, and as human beings we don’t know the Will of Allah, Hadiths narrates people being punished for small sins, others forgiven for large sins ect. To say “shaki laan” one will enter hellfire, what if that person built an orphanage house, or has children, family that makes du’a for them is their du’a stopped according to you? or Hadith that says anyone with an atoms weight of faith will not enter naar? ect And Allah Knows Best.

 

2. Somalia is a wounded nation, divided along clan lines, 17 years of war, oppression of the poor, accumulation of wealth and power by a few, In 2004 it was agreed and the TFG was appointed to be a transitional government. After all that has occurred since then, this TFG is actively supported by some inside Somalia (and backing of major power players including the arabs-da world order), actively opposed by some, but the majority of Somalis are only idle observers as their country is played by world powers and interest groups , and most inside Somalia one of the poorest countries in the world, in which many don’t have the means to even feed themselves, I believe what they want most is peace and not prolong warfare which is in their interest and the country as a whole.

 

3. Which brings me to this point: Shariah in Somalia. Shariah is the law of Allah and is obligatory on the Muslims to set up the laws of Allah. And like Jihad, Shariah has conditions and guidelines that must be followed strictly, It is not possible to establish this religion without following its particular method, anything contary to this method will only result in abuses and oppression and not be the blessings and haaq of the Islamic System, the same way anything contary to the rules and methods of jihad will not be considered a jihad.

 

salaamu alaykum

[Nur]

Khalaf bro.

 

We only judge the ( Dhaahir) actions and words that can be heard or seen. The Niyah and the ghaib is with Allah alone, and its not the sphere of our influence nor judgement, we judge the apparent only, Anyone who says or does an action that is deemed to be Kufr or Shirk is said to be a Mushrik or kaafir, Allah tells us that Mushrik or Kaafir goes to hell, so believing that fact is in itself a condition of Shahaada, what Allah will do evenually with these people is not our business, however we can not be wishy washy on pivotal aqeedah issues in which Ahlul sunnah agree upon, the best we can do for our loved ones is to advice them not to oppose Allahs deen by siding with the TFG who've openly declared that they are allies with the Ethiopians and even brothers in speeches by the Prime Minister and President. ( We all know that the TFG are also stooges for them and have no will nor power of their own, they are slaves for the devil, they will be overrun in a day if left alone without the misguided American Airforce and Ethiopian artillery)

 

You say "I think a poor Somali youngster who enlisted with this TFG to make a little change aint dat bad."

 

Brother these men are mercenaries ( Soldiers of Fortune) at work, ( a person who would kills others for money), I hope that your words are a misprint, because its shocking, wallahi, I am shocked, because justifying cold blooded murder by a mercenary who leads enemy to his own homeland to kill his own people is a major crime, never did I think a devout Muslim to be sympathetic to such a crime, my advice is to make tawbah from that stateement.

 

Allah SWT says, " Wa man yatawallahum minkum fa innahum minhum" He who sided with them ( enemies of Allah), is counted one of them, both in judgement and in hellfire in te day of judgement.

 

With no breath in between, you contradict yourself again, by saying:

 

"There are actions which make one kufar no doubt, deeds and faith go hand and hand in the Quran, however in the Quran Allah says that He forgives Whom He Wills and Punishes Whom He Wills, except for shirk"

 

Allah can also forgive Pharoah, Jenkhis Khan, Attila the Hun, Hitler, and Bush. Thes men have one thing in common, they slaughtered millions of innocent people as superpowers. They are all dead facing their crime, Bush is waiting his day in Allah's court, I pray for his poor Zionist possessed soul, may Allah guide him to Islam, while he still has a chance.

 

What is more disturbing is that your writing shows that you are well versed on Tawheed, walaa and baraa, how can you then justify actions of the TFG by equating them with the the actions of other Arab states? Do we follow the Sunnah or the example of Arab states?

 

Khalaf bro. I am not worried for the little mercennary boy hired to kill for foreign intersts in Somalia, I am really woried for you now, let us get the aqeedhah issues straight first before we talk about stark facts on the ground.

 

 

Sharia law, in its most perfect way, will not be served on a silver platter, its through toil and struggle, errors and mistakes, that this deen will be established, the chinese say:

 

" Man keep mouth open for long time, before fried duck fly in his mouth"

 

Nur

[Fabregas]

Quote:Ethiopia, and it could as well be said that TFG backed Ethiopia in somalia is not fighting Islam or Muslims but after a political group hence why all areas of Somalia are “peaceful” and the Muslims, their masjids, their salat is not under threat nor are they under oppression can freely practice their deen. Do u think if the appointed TFG government, no matter how corrupt it is ect had been allowed to rule from the beginning, would what transpired in Somalia (bombings, killings of civilians, fitnah) taken place? Since the ICU have/had no awood to rule with shariah in Somalia considering today’s reality not only world but inside somalia, do u think as the saying goes they awakened the fitnah and have a fault in what went down in Somalia?

 

Do you actually believe these things yourself or are you hypothetically speaking. In other words do you believe that Ethiopia was only after a political organisation and nothing to do with Islam. Also that the I.C.U were wrong in opposing them thus they created or contributed to a fitna.

[Kashafa]

Since the ICU have/had no awood to rule with shariah in Somalia considering today’s reality not only world but inside somalia, do u think as the saying goes they awakened the fitnah and have a fault in what went down in Somalia

Umm, who told you that ? Your 'shaykh' ? Same guy whose views you used as 'daleel' to brand the Islamic Courts as 'Not-perfect-enough-therefore-I'll-remain-neutral' ? No disrespect, but it kinda all makes sense now. The above quote is wrong on so many levels, I'mma let Nur take it apart.

 

Just for the record, The ICU had the awood and the authority to apply Sharia law and apply it they did....and guess what akh ? The people, the average everyday Faarax and Xalimo, living in Somalia......they loved it. So that 'fitnah' label ur so generously giving the ICU is really more deserving of the 'inclusive, elected by all Somalis' TFG and their guests.

 

Sorry to break in, this is a great discussion so far. One word of advice: You know ur in trouble when Dr. Nur gets shocked

[Khalaf]

Yaa Kashafa I hear Barre Hiralle was going to rule Kismaayo with shariah law. Saay What? Hold up he’s a warlord no? Like I said brothers, there is a method that must be followed and conditions that must be met, if not met then the whole point of Shariah is lost and it is no longer the blessed system of haaq.

 

 

Originally posted by Geel_Jire12:

Do you actually believe these things yourself or are you hypothetically speaking. In other words do you believe that Ethiopia was only after a political organisation and nothing to do with Islam. Also that the I.C.U were wrong in opposing them thus they created or contributed to a fitna. [/QB]

Geel, the US opposes any entity which its not under its sphere of influence be they islamic or atheist that is nothing new been going down for long time. It supported the Afghan resistances to serve its interests, and turned against it when it threatened its interests. They certainly don’t want to see an independent Islamic State, or a pan-Somalia nationalists State, independent is key here that much is clear. However my point is, since we are discussing the Islamic methodology and nothing else, regardless of the situation, Islam always places strict guidelines to be followed. For example the ICU kicked out the warlords in Xamar after hundreds of deaths, okey we say those warlords deserved to be fought they were working for the CIA and committing fitnah. However after the fact, the ICU shouldve stayed in xamar, make the people whom were 17 yrs were living in mushrik society enter the fold of islam completely, make it a Madinah. But of course that was not the case because of the divisions in their ranks and their gun-ho policy, the move to Kismaayo a peaceful city. I hear a warlord is there, the fear of IGAD ect. But like I said xamar=the entire country. You tell me or the others here: what made the blood of Barre Hirralle and his milita men (as u know probably like our muslim brothers like Horn or Allamagan) what made their blood halaal if they had decided to fight the ICU? Because they and like many others in Somalia wouldn’t recognize the authority of Aweys and Co? Is this the Islamic Way? You tell me akhi.

[Khalaf]

Originally posted by Nur:

the best we can do for our loved ones is to advice them not to oppose Allahs deen by siding with the TFG........

okey, laakin do you think the Muslims in Somaliland, Puntland, everywhere in Somalia whom are indifferent, not even a protest against this TFG are opposing Allah’s Deen? What do you make of their indifference yaa Nur? And why do you think this is the case, the good fight is limited to section of Xamar, the same section that were the key power holders in the old South?

 

Brother these men are mercenaries ( Soldiers of Fortune) at work, ( a person who would kills others for money), I hope that your words are a misprint, because its shocking, wallahi, I am shocked, because justifying cold blooded murder by a mercenary who leads enemy to his own homeland to kill his own people is a major crime, never did I think a devout Muslim to be sympathetic to such a crime, my advice is to make tawbah from that stateement.

 

Allah SWT says, " Wa man yatawallahum minkum fa innahum minhum" He who sided with them ( enemies of Allah), is counted one of them, both in judgement and in hellfire in te day of judgement.

My brother you took my statement out of context, I mentioned the world over, there is no Dar al-Islam. You have so called Muslim countries that bend over backwards “yes sir” to uncle sam, hand over the al-guraba to be tortured in jails, provide them air spaces to shock and awe other muslim states, you even have the scholars in the Glorious Masjid giving fatwa’s to US troops to protect the Saudi state in baitul Islam, you have Zionists riba based companies doing bidness right behind the Glorious Masjid, the list goes on. On the flip side you have war torn country of Somalia, names called Muhammad and Ahmed committed the worst crimes imaginable against other muslimeen, hundreds of thousands of refuges resulted and were welcomed and sheltered by the kufar, and we live here freely and ummm pay taxes which in turn fund their wars against muslim states does that mean we have sided with the enemies of Allah? Marka looking at the world, this TFG and umm these mercenaries whom probably are jahiliya and cause of their environment (poverty) wanted to feed themselves “aint as bad” bad though and is a result because there is no Dar-al-Islam. And Allah Knows Best to each they will take their deeds to Allah Most Great. And mos def Allah Most Great forgive me for any wrong I say in ignorance.

 

With no breath in between, you contradict yourself again, by saying:

 

"There are actions which make one kufar no doubt, deeds and faith go hand and hand in the Quran, however in the Quran Allah says that He forgives Whom He Wills and Punishes Whom He Wills, except for shirk"

 

Allah can also forgive Pharoah, Jenkhis Khan, Attila the Hun, Hitler, and Bush. Thes men have one thing in common, they slaughtered millions of innocent people as superpowers. They are all dead facing their crime, Bush is waiting his day in Allah's court, I pray for his poor Zionist possessed soul, may Allah guide him to Islam, while he still has a chance.

Pharoah, Khan, Hitler, Bush are all Kufars they associate partners with Allah. The Quran says that is the only Sin that Allah doesn’t forgive is Shirk to set up partners in worship, any other sins Allah pardons Whom He Wills and Punishes whom He Wills. Therefore I don’t see how I contradicted myself brother.

 

What is more disturbing is that your writing shows that you are well versed on Tawheed, walaa and baraa, how can you then justify actions of the TFG by equating them with the the actions of other Arab states? Do we follow the Sunnah or the example of Arab states?

Yes Muslims should follow the Sunnah scw that is waajiib. And I am not justifying anything, I am only highlighting what is going in the Muslim world, and TFG is only part of that picture. They are all entities forced upon the Muslims because there is no Dar al-Islam.

 

Khalaf bro. I am not worried for the little mercennary boy hired to kill for foreign intersts in Somalia, I am really woried for you now, let us get the aqeedhah issues straight first before we talk about stark facts on the ground.

My brother we all can improve, no one is prefect or safe and one of my favorite du’as I used to have as a signature is O Allah make me those who return to You often in repentance, the prophet scw was guaranteed Jannah but always sought forgiveness, and I too follow his scw example. Lakiin my brother don’t judge my aqeedah simply because I am raising hypothetically questions in politics, or bringing a different perspective on a topic. Just think of it like as investigator or historian asking tough questions, really has nothing to do with iman or islamic values. Its only a discussion yaa akhi.

 

Sharia law, in its most perfect way, will not be served on a silver platter, its through toil and struggle, errors and mistakes, that this deen will be established, the chinese say:

The Quran says: this day I have completed my favor upon you, and have chosen Islam as your deen. Islam has been completed, all that is needed is a jamacat. Allah instructed the prophet scw and his companion’s ra on a particular method, the Islamic method to establish deenul Islam in the Lands. Therefore to enforce shariah the law of Islam, it can only be done by following this method faithfully and fully, which is the Sunnah of scw.

 

 

I wrote that in a giiiiiify, inshallah it makes sense. Salaamun.

[Nur]

Akhil Habeeb, Khalaf

 

You write: "okey, laakin do you think the Muslims in Somaliland, Puntland, everywhere in Somalia whom are indifferent, not even a protest against this TFG are opposing Allah’s Deen? What do you make of their indifference yaa Nur? And why do you think this is the case, the good fight is limited to section of Xamar, the same section that were the key power holders in the old South?"

 

 

This argument fallacy is called " Fa maa baalul quruunil uulaa" its a distraction tactic from the core issue of aqeedah. Ali Radiyallahu canhu said : "Know men by virtue of Xaqq ( What is right), do not seek to know Xaqq ( What is right) by virtue of men", moral of saying, humans are not a reliable source of what is right, seek wisdom instead.

 

Imagine, a young Somali girl being raped by an Ethiopian soldier, her feet are tied up by a fellow Somali who is making just a dollar, and the rest of us are indifferent because they have relative peace in their regions( Balaayo kaa maqan, dad kaley ku maqan tahay", can we blame the girl who is struggling against the rape for being unreasonable?

 

Accodring to the Hadeeth, in the day of Judgement, Allah will order a pious scholar to be thrown in hell, the angels argue that he was pious, Allah will order angels to begin tormenting him first, reason : Never did his face frown for Allah's cause" " Lam yatamacar wajhuhu lillah"

 

If the indifference shows anything, its the low level we as a nation have descended as to be indifferent of the plight of our brothers and sisters, the Prophet SAWS was reported saying. " A Muslim is a brother to a Muslim, he never commits injustice against him, gives him away to an enemy, not does he betray him.

 

 

Brother, I did not take your words out of context, the context was Xukum of being an ally with invading kuffar. Many Muhammads and Khadija's will go to hell if their action is contrary to Islam, while many Johns and Mary will go to heaven if their deeds are aligned with Islam, actions speak louder than names and words.

 

The problem that is causing a confusion for you is that you have all the pieces of the picture in your hands, yet they are torn to fragments and are not organized, hence your inconsistency on the main issues, so let me suggest a way out of this problem for you, let me help you put these pieces of the picture in your hand in sequence, that way, you will sigh in relief when all the pieces fall in their respective place, and at last I suggest we take our discussion in private messaging so that we sort out the confusion.

 

 

Nur

[Fabregas]

Khalaf, Akhi I have always said that I.C.U made mistakes and I don't agree with everything they did. Nor do i belief they were perfect angel like people. You say Somailand an Puntland peaceful. I say why is Somali Galbeed not peaceful? Are the Tigrays that occupied Somali any different to the ones that occupied Somali Galbeed? What does the fact that Palestine is peaceful as opposed to Sacudiya, Masar o Kuwait mean to us? Should we take this as a good thing?

 

 

I posted this a while back and no one replied to it. Akhi, listen to it( if you haven't) and tell me this Sheikh isn't struggling in the noble path of Allah swt?

 

http://www.addacwah.com/dhacdooyinka/shbile.ram

[Khalaf]

Geelow, should we take it as good thing? No, but do u think there will be any change, real change not kufar boots off muslim lands, but the establishment of islam unless the ummah changes? Have you heard of the saying it takes years to build trust, and only seconds to destroy it? It took years, decades even centuries to makes the current “state of the ummah”, well planned, and executed, how do you fix it unless they follow the correct path in its rebirth? And Yes to Allah Alone will come help, and ull tell me 1st thing is 1st garthay. If no one replied it doesn’t mean ppl don’t listen yaa akhi, its good lecture, but I don’t agree with more war inside Somalia but reconciliation, removal of ethio soldiers asap and help of Arabs ect ect. And I think what we all can do, is help the maskiin back home, somalia is dirt poor, build schools to educate the ppl that will bring greater success.

 

Originally posted by Nur:

This argument fallacy is called " Fa maa baalul quruunil uulaa" its a distraction tactic from the core issue of aqeedah. Ali Radiyallahu canhu said : "Know men by virtue of Xaqq ( What is right), do not seek to know Xaqq ( What is right) by virtue of men", moral of saying, humans are not a reliable source of what is right, seek wisdom instead.

 

If the indifference shows anything, its the low level we as a nation have descended as to be indifferent of the plight of our brothers and sisters, the Prophet SAWS was reported saying. " A Muslim is a brother to a Muslim, he never commits injustice against him, gives him away to an enemy, not does he betray.

Seek wisdom instead, a good saying. And my brother u answered my question. Another good wisdom is to cure a diseases ( ie somalia) one must apply the correct medication following the correct procedure. It took decades, centuries to separate the muslims, you Iraqi, you Syrian, u are Saudi, you are Lander, u are puntlander, and so on, even w/out Ethiopia, America ect they would be fighting factions and not a brotherhood. And yes Allah Alone Will come Help.

 

Imagine, a young Somali girl being raped by an Ethiopian soldier, her feet are tied up by a fellow Somali who is making just a dollar, and the rest of us are indifferent because they have relative peace in their regions( Balaayo kaa maqan, dad kaley ku maqan tahay", can we blame the girl who is struggling against the rape for being unreasonable?

This metaphor doesn’t fit the scenario, because the victim in this case has no choice. Here’s a better a metaphor, in class you are given a schedule, and to be successful in the class you must devise a plan ( a strategy) to conquer those tasks (battles). The ICU didn’t do that, not a good strategy inside the country (no alliances secured in Somalia) or in foreign affairs we both know yaa akhi. Although what happens is by Allah’s Will this somali saying comes to mind lax kasto meesheey is dhigtey ayaa lagu bireya, the ICU brought the enemy right into its bed-rooms.

 

Brother, I did not take your words out of context, the context was Xukum of being an ally with invading kuffar. Many Muhammads and Khadija's will go to hell if their action is contrary to Islam, while many Johns and Mary will go to heaven if their deeds are aligned with Islam, actions speak louder than names and words.

My brother we agree Muslim is he who believes in Allah Alone and the Last Day, and who obeys the commandments of Allah in the Quran and Fears Allah Much. Hell and Heaven is though, is by Allahs Will and istafgfrullah hadaan qalaad iri. The Johns and Marys, have to have Iman first, Iman and deeds.

 

ps: I am not confused lol, and I know my brother. But I have talked to various ppl since I got interested in Somalia, even men who were part of the early crew of the brith of calaanka in Somalia, I am askin questions and lookin at the picture from different angles-islamic perspective in particular, lakiin we may put that to side and adiga noo muxaaradeey about this saga.

 

salaamun