The Somalia-Somaliland talks Thread

[IsseRiyole]

Xaaji Xunjuf;985200 wrote:

The goverment in Mogadishu called the Turks and and wanted to delay the talks for another month because they are not ready to resume the dialogue. This is an official statement from the Somaliland goverment. Somaliland is ready when ever the Koonfurians are ready.

X.X Amazes me, dude sometimes you seem like you say anything that comes to your mind at the moment.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Issa riyoole what are you talking about what did i say that is wrong

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Somaliland: President Silanyo Parley Turkish Delegation E-mail

Monday, 25 November 2013 02:02

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VP Sayli and President Silanyo ® with the Turkish team VP Sayli and President Silanyo ® with the Turkish team

By: M.A.Egge

HARGEISA (Somalilandsun) - The President H.E Ahmed Mohamed Mahmoud (Silanyo) met with Turkish Ambassador H.E. Cemalettin Kani Torun for Somaliland- Somalia and it was agreed that Turkey would open a consulate in Hargeisa soon.

The Turkish envoy delegation comprising of Turkish businessmen at the Presidential Palace discussed several issues including the upcoming Somalia-Somaliland talks which are expected to resume next year in Istanbul, Turkey.

President Silanyo flanked by Vice President Hon Abdurrahman Abdullah Ismael Sayli'i further discussed how Somaliland and Turkey would not only foster political relations but also how to increase trade and investment as means of reinforcing commercial and economic relations.

Hon Mohamed Bihi Yonis, Minister of Foreign Affairs later speaking during a press briefing said, "Both sides have agreed on the significance of doubling the existing political and commercial exchange in the coming years and developing mutual relations in the field investment we now have a moment of opportunity to build stronger ties at all levels between our business worlds.

Turkey will host a fourth round of talks between Somaliland and Somalia in January 2014, led by President Ahmed Mohamed Mahmoud Silanyo and President Hassan Sheikh Mohamud, respectively. The new consulate office in Hargeisa will assist in maintaining momentum for the Dialogue process.

The next round of talks between the governments of Somaliland and Somalia, due to take place in Turkey in January 2014, will cover a range of issues, including the management of air space, cooperation on the fight against terrorism, piracy, serious crime, illegal fishing and the dumping of toxic waste at sea, as well as economic development focusing on the encouragement of international aid, trade and investment.

The FM also said the Turkish government will open a consulate in Hargeisa while Somaliland is also expected to open in Ankara in the near future, he also revealed the Turkish government to will increase the educational Scholarships to Somaliland Students.

Through greater diplomatic and economic engagement, historic relations between Somaliland and Turkey, which have spanned centuries, will only deepen further."

[Dalmar1]

So will it the talks be in January like the new ^^^ says or December?

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Surely yes the Koonfurians are in a political crisis remember the Prime minister and the President are having a their usual cat fights sidi caadadu u ahayd. I think they told the Turks to give them more time no official statement there is still a chance for the talks to happen first week of December.

[malistar2012]

, will cover a range of issues, including the management of air space, cooperation on the fight against terrorism, piracy, serious crime, illegal fishing and the dumping of toxic waste at sea, as well as economic development focusing on the encouragement of international aid, trade and investment.

The FM also said the Turkish government will open a consulate in Hargeisa while Somaliland is also expected to open in Ankara in the near future, he also revealed the Turkish government to will increase the educational Scholarships to Somaliland Students

So the talks are about integrating or you my call it cooperation between SFG and Hargeysa admin on security and economic issue Interesting News indeed .

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

^^ The talks are not to interesting for now either way they will reach a dead end , sooner or later what Somaliland sun mentioned was what was agreed on before, and what the 2 sides agreed on for now. Clearly if you have been following the dialogue very closely in June they reached a dead end, and only agreed on the airspace joint committee, for practical reasons. Other than that both sides have no room to reach an agreement on the most controversial and disputed area of the 2, Somaliland quest for recognition and the re establishment of the old Somali republic. Why do you think the 2 discussed for 72 hours and only agreed on the airspace, i think we have reached the final stage of these talks i believe with out our friends from the European union and they meddling and mediating and joining the negotiations table, the 2 sides will not come to an agreement, on their future relations.

[thefuturenow]

Xaaji Xunjuf;987503 wrote:

Surely yes the Koonfurians are in a political crisis remember the Prime minister and the President are having a their usual cat fights sidi caadadu u ahayd. I think they told the Turks to give them more time no official statement there is still a chance for the talks to happen first week of December.

 

Honest question: When the North eventually takes its rightful place as a regional state within the federal system, will you protest in the streets? Will you call for the independence of an entity named "Somaliland" from Somalia? if so, can you please provide your arguments here?

 

Thank you.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Somaliland has been fighting for 23 years for their right place on the world stage as an independent state if you really believe Somalilanders will accept a mere provincial status with in Somalia than you awaits a rude awakening ina futurow. Babuurta iska ilaali yanay ku jidhin eh. Aslong as no one rules Somaliland but its sons and Somaliland flag flies high in every city in Somaliland, i sleep peacefully every night knowing the country is in good hands.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Wada-hadaladii Somaliland Iyo Soomaaliya oo Mar kale dib u dhacay illaa January 2014-ka

November 29th, 2013

Wasiirka arrimaha dibaddaHargeysa (Somaliland.Org)-Wasiirka Arrimaha dibada iyo iskaashiga caalamiga ah ayaa *****lka ka qaaday in dawladda Soomaaliya ay ka dalbatay Somaliland iyo Turkiga in mar saddexaad dib loogu dhigo wada hadaladii u socday Somaliland iyo Soomaaliya oo loo balansanaa bisha December ee fooda innagu soo haysa.

 

Wasiirku waxa uu sheegay in Soomaaliya ay soo codsatay in wada hadaladii dib loogu dhigo illaa bisha January ee kal-dambe, sababo la xidhiidha dhibaatooyinka ka taagan dalkaas dartood.

 

Md. Maxamed Biixi Yoonis oo ka hadlayay arrintaasna waxa uu yidhi “Turkigu aad iyo aad ayay ugu jirraan oo ay wax noola wadaan Somaliland iyo Soomaaliya, aadna waanu ugu faraxsan nahay wada hadalada ay fududeynayaan iyo kaalinta ay kaga jiraanba, hase yeeshee wadahadaladii dib ayay u dhaceen Bisha December ee inagu soo fool leh ayay markii hore yidhaahdeen waayo dhibaatooyin badan baa ka taagan Xamar. Imikana waxay na weydiisteen inaanu December-na dib uga dhigno oo wada hadaladii la qabto bisha January ee sanadka 2014-ka.”

 

“Sidaas ayay na soo weydiisteen Soomaaliya annaga (Somaliland ) iyo dawladda Turkigaba, wakhtina wali lama cayimin ee labada toddobaad ee ugu horeeya bisha January ayaannu isla soo qaadnay, waxaanan ka wada shaqaynaynaa sidii haddii ALLE yidhaahdo aanu wakhtigaas isku arki lahayn,”ayuu yidhi Wasiir Maxamed Biixi Yoonis oo caawa u warramayay laanta Afsoomaaliga ee BBC-da.

 

Wasiirka oo la weydiiyay sida uu yahay xidhiidhka wada shaqayneed ee ka dhaxeeya Somaliland iyo Soomaaliya waxa uu yidhi “Xidhiidhka Somaliland iyo Soomaaliya waa laba wadan oo jaar ah oo cilaaqaad ka dhaxeeyo ayaanu nahay. Waxaanu doonaynaa inaanu wada hadaladda iyo walaaltinimadda wadno oo caalamku noo arko dad degan. Waxaanu ka shaqaynaynaa annagu (Somaliland) inaanu walaaladayada Xamar iskaashi la samayno, wada hadaladayaduna noo socdaan oo aanu farsamadeeda keeno sidii aanu u kala tagi lahayn.”

 

Md. Maxamed Biixi Yoonis waxa kale oo uu ammaanay dawladda Turkiga oo uu tilmaamay inay ka go’an tahay inay Somaliland wax la qabsato, waxaanu sheegay in weftigii dhawaan yimid Somaliland ay si rasmi ah u shaaciyeen inay Hargeysa ka furan doonaan qunsuliyad isku xidha wax wada qabsiga labada dal.

 

Wasiirku waxa kale oo uu intaas ku ladhay in Ganacsato Turki ahi ay daraasad ku sameeyeen Somaliland isla markaana ay balan qaadeen inay mashaariic waaweyn oo maalgashi ku sameeyaan Somaliland.

 

Wada hadalada u socda Somaliland iyo Soomaaliya ayaa muddo laba jeer oo hore dib u dhacay sababo la xidhiidha mashaakilka siyaasadeed iyo wacdiga adage e Soomaaliya ku sugan tahay darteed, waxaanay noqonaysaa markii saddexaad ee wada hadalladani baaqdaan.

[Wiil Cusub]

Somaliland: Bihi in Surprise Visit to Ethiopia E-mail

Friday, 29 November 2013 18:03

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Bihi in EthiopiaBihi in Ethiopia

By: Yusuf M Hasan

ADDIS ABABA (Somalilandsun) – The Somaliland foreign Minister is in Addis Ababa, the Ethiopian Capital.

The impromptu trip by Foreign Minister Mohamed Bihi saw him depart Egal international Airport in company of the British Envoy to the neigbouring country Ambassador Greg Dorey who was on official duties in Hargeisa.

While it is not yet clear what the Bihi visit entails sources indicate that further dialogue as pertains to the dying Somaliland-Somali talks shall ensue with both Ethiopian government officials and Western diplomats.

The postponement of the fourth phase of the internationally sanctioned talks between the two neigbouring countries which were supposed to have been held in the Turkish capital Istanbul on the 8th of this month have continued to elicit much interest from the international community that is desirous to see the two reconciled either for reunion or honourable separation.

Somaliland withdrew from its 1960 voluntary union with Somalia in 1991 after a brutal civil war that came about after the regime of Dictator Siad Barre massacred over 60,000 landers.

The current visit by foreign minister Bihi to Ethiopia comes a few days after he, Bihi, stopped a visit to Djibouti by a number of ministerial colleagues, a move that is in apparent fulfillment of his ban on authorized tours by members of the cabinet.

Meanwhile FM Bihi Yonis is reportedly expected to link up with a ruling Kulmiye party team led by Chairman Muse Bihi that is in Addis Ababa on official invitation of Ethiopia's ruling party.

This is not the first visit for Behi Yonis a former UN staffer to visit Ethiopia Since assuming the Foreign Affairs mantle a few months back purportedly to strengthen the always apt relations with that country which is the only one to maintain full diplomatic relations with the internationally unrecognized Somaliland.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Somaliland ministerial level delegation leaves for the UK

 

 

LONDON-Somaliland Foreign Minister Mr. Mohamed Biihi Yoonis accompanied by the Minister of Commerce and International Investment Mr. Mohamed Abdilahi Omar have embarked on working visit to UK on Saturday. The Somaliland ministerial level delegation departed from Egal International airport on Saturday leaving for the UK although the aim of the trip has not been disclosed to the press.

 

The media at large did not aware of the visit by the ministers but according to Hadhwanaagnews reported said that the UK government requested the two ministers to come to Britain in order to discuss on issues ranging from the talks between Somaliland and Somalia and the UK government is meeting with the ministers to talk with them about issues relating to the bilateral ties between the two countries.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Somaliland: The Inevitable Conclusion to the Talks with Somalia

Monday, 16 December 2013 12:36

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Signing never to be implemeted agreements in Turkey/fileSigning never to be implemeted agreements in Turkey/file

By: Sayid Madar

Somalilandsun - Twenty two years after self-declared Independence and twelve years after the ratification of Somaliland's constitution by popular vote, the democratically elected Government of Somaliland (GoSL) headed by its fourth president Ahmed Siilanyo had finally been given the opportunity to open dialogue with the internationally accepted President of the Somali Federal Government (SFG), Hassan Sheikh. Talks were inevitable and have been highly anticipated by the Somaliland Govt and the citizens of Somaliland who finally have the opportunity to finalize the reality after waiting decades for a credible Government to be formed and acknowledged by the International community. Somaliland is considered a self-governing autonomous region of Somalia even though it was one half of the former Somali Republic which was formed by voluntary union of British-Somaliland and Italian-Somalia; this formation disbanded after the Somali Civil War which the Socialist Military dictator Siyad Barre was held responsible for the massacre of an estimated 75,000 Somalilanders.

During my several visits to Somaliland, to this present day there are still vivid reminders of that period whether it's the memorial in Hargeisa of the MIG which desecrated Somaliland's capital Hargeisa to naturally occurring reminders such as bones appearing on the riverbank every time the rivers flow in both Gabiley & Hargeisa. These talks have the ability to provide a platform for acknowledgement of the atrocities as well as compelling the SFG to realise the reality on the ground.

Turkey initiated the first round of talks between the two sides to 'open dialogue' in Ankara on April 13th. The talks concluded with a memorandum of understanding known as the 'Ankara Communiqué. The Ankara Communiqué consisted of seven points which both side agreed which can be viewed on the Turkey's Foreign Affairs website.

Unfortunately the talks didn't yield results in terms of breakthroughs from both SFG and GoSL, this deadlock became evident when SFG authorised an airplane to land within Somaliland's territory breaking point seven of the Ankara Communiqué. This led to the GoSL grounding all UN flights in and out of the country. This issue was resolved July 7th – 9th 2013 in Istanbul which both parties held further talks to rectify the situation. An agreement was reached which was to create a joint-control body which manages both airspace based in Hargeisa however this was reneged by the SFG which discreetly signed another agreement with the International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO).

The final talks was expected to take place in November however due to Political turmoil within the SFG which subsequently led to the ousting of its PM Saciid Shirdon, the talks were delayed on several occasions. Somaliland's FM Mohammed Bihi Younis who was the former Deputy Joint Special Representative for UNAMID in Darfur emphasized during an interview with a Somali news outlet that "... Somaliland is ready and has been ready for a while" reiterating that the conclusion of the talks will be "Somaliland and Somalia living side by side as neighbours and brothers as two countries as it has been over the last two decades." On the other hand, the SFG's President Hassan Sheikh proclaimed "We will do our best and unite with our brothers from Somaliland by early next year."

In my view, this proclamation by President Hassan isn't just reckless, but almost borderline delusional as it is completely devoid of the reality on the ground in Somaliland. President Hassan has set the bar very high for himself which he'll soon realise. Somaliland unlike Somalia has stability which many argue is down to democracy. I agree to an extent that democracy is a factor which ensures a sense of national unity, participation and representation. The idea that Somalilanders will reunite again with Somalia to form another Somali Republic is a dream held closely by Somali Nationalists that are predominantly located within former Italia-Somalia who aspire to reunite all Somali speaking regions whether it's within Ethiopia, Kenya, Somaliland or Djibouti. Their arguments tend to be incompatible with the concept of democracy as they strongly feel there shouldn't be a choice. They believe there should be one Somali speaking country irrespective of freedom and choices.

FM Behi Younis with Ban Ki MoonFM Behi Younis with Ban Ki Moon

To understand the difficulty of a reunion with Somalia, I will address some hypothetical situations. Let's say for argument sake the GoSL agrees to reunite with Somalia to re-establish the Somali Republic again, this agreement would have to clear a few hurdles and acknowledge that:

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

• Firstly, the GoSL will have to call a referendum as it would mean a change in the constitution of Somaliland. Please note the constitution was ratified by 97% of electorates in 2001 which was considered free and fair by international observers. The Government in power which attempts to implement this change will have automatically committed political suicide and would most likely be followed by an overwhelming defeat in the next elections and replacement for the foreseeable future after its motion is rejected in parliament. I'm sure every political party in Somaliland is fully aware of the reason why they have been voted for and their expectations to abide by the constitution.

• Secondly, the Government in Mogadishu would be expected to acknowledge the atrocities committed under the regime of Siyad Barre and hand over all those evading justice in Somalia and the West. However a recent report eluded that the SFG has requested immunity for former Defence Minister Mohamed Samantar who's currently in Prison in the U.S. for War Crimes committed in Hargeisa, Somaliland during the late 80's. Information on the case can be found online as 'Samantar v Yousef.' It is very unlikely President Hassan Sheikh would comply with such requests as it would cause him difficulty within his reconciliation efforts with the dozens of warlords in and around Somalia.

• Finally, the SFG will have to acknowledge that Somaliland is not a region of Somalila but a country. The fact Somalilanders celebrate 26th June as their independence is testament to the history and reality of the region. Somalia's Independence Day is celebrated 1st July. Regions such as Puntland and Jubba Administration which had always been a part of the former Ita-Somalia would likely reject the notion that the reunification will be implemented as two countries reuniting again and not a 'Federal Region' as they are/want to be recognised as.

The mammoth challenges which lie ahead are difficult indeed, I believe the talks will ultimately reach a deadlock which the international community will eventually be compelled to mediate. I believe this is actually the most beneficial solution for the GoSL as its clear the SFG have no logical reason to reunite other than the false hope that all Somali regions will eventually be reunited, this is known as 'Somaliweyn' in Somali. This logic is incompatible to the realities on the ground in Somaliland and the aspirations of self-determination of the citizens of Somaliland. Somaliland's case for recognition is similar to every other annulled union around Africa and around the world e.g. Egypt/Syria and Senegal/Gambia.

In conclusion, the inevitable outcome of the talks will ultimately come down the ability of the SFG to recognise the realities on the ground and act on the olive branch being presented. The SFG recently lost an MP within its compound Villa Somalia; this displays the challenges it faces by threats not just within the country, but within its capital Mogadishu from Al'Shabaab. The opportunity for creating an environment of mutual trust and cooperation is required now more than ever in Somalia and I believe the inexperience of the unelected Government in Mogadishu are either inadvertently or purposely harming Somalia's position in the region. The current status quo of delaying talks will not benefit the SFG but prove Somaliland has done everything and the situation calls for International intervention. Just last week I read reports of Somaliland's first car was assembled along with the reports that a French investor is ready for invest a substantial amount into the infrastructure of Berbera port; these projects which have been implemented with the GoSL is testament to the reality on the ground. Moreover, the recent return of Genel Energy will raise eyebrows across the globe, especially if a vast reserve is discovered. It's important to note than these Oil exploration licences were authorised by the GoSL and will be used to benefit its citizens only.

There a several options available to the SFG, one would ensure an amicably separation based on mutual trust and friendly relations whilst the other option would add tension, mistrust and animosity in an already volatile region eventually compelling International companies to act on the stalemate and lobby for recognition in lieu of their clients operating in Somaliland. The main issue many large international corporations have in Somaliland is insuring their products/services. Due to Somaliland's status, financial services will not provide insurance because Somaliland is yet to be recognised, this is a barrier which I'm sure stakeholders will tackle if the Port of Berbera will be utilized effectively. It would be an embarrassment to President Hassan Sheikh who proclaimed the intention of unity whilst International Governments and NGO's continue to coordinate, liaise and forge bilateral relations with the Government of Somaliland, this itself adds to reinforce that the GoSL is the legitimate representative of Somalis living in that region.

Irrevocable and not for negotiation sovereignty of SomalilandIrrevocable and not for negotiation sovereignty of Somaliland

The inevitable conclusion to the Somalia-Somaliland talks will come down to the issue of freedom and the right to self-determination. Can a country enforce unity on another country? The answer is No. Somaliland earned it's statehood through the darkest of times looking down a barrel of a gun. Think about it, those born in 1991 when Independence was reinstated will be twenty two years old. Twenty two years in living in what they know as Somaliland, how do you reverse that historical, physical and emotional attachment? As long as Somalilanders continues to celebrate its Independence when it gained it from Britain on 26th June 1960, it will always remain a country in the hearts and minds of its citizens irrespective of recognition and that remembrance itself is the biggest obstacle for the SFG.

The author Sayid Madar was born in Gabiley, Somaliland and currently lives in the UK. A business graduate and a Civil Servant employed by the UK Government. Interests include Foreign Policy & International development. Please note, views expressed are views of the author only. You can contact the author on:

Blog: www.SJMadar.wordpress.com

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Somaliland oo Ingiriiska ka dalbatay in uu dib ugu soo laabto wadahadaladii uu u bilaabay Somaliya

 

December 21, 2013 | In Waaheen News

 

 

Waxa kaloo ay dalbatay in ay ku soo noqdaan shantii dal ee ka qayb qaatay kii ugu horeeyey ee Ingiriiska

 

Hargeysa(Waaheen) Wasiirka Wasaaradda Arrimaha Dibeddda Somaliland Maxamed Biixi Yoonis oo safar shaqo ku tagay Dalka Ingiriiska ayaa kulamo la yeeshay Madaxda Dalkaasi, waxaana la sheegay in Xukuumad ahaan ay u bandhigeen codsi ah in ay dib uga qayb qaataan wadahadaladii Somaliya iyo Somaliland dalalkii ka qayb qaatay wajigii ugu horeeyey eek a dhacay Ingiriiska.

 

Ilo wareedyo u dhuun daloola dhaqdhaqaaqa Dublamaasiyadeed ee Wasiir Maxamed Biixi Yoonis iyo Farriintii uu la tagay Ingiriiska ayaa la sheegayaa in ay ka dhalatay tuhun ay Somaliland ka qabto in Turkigu aanu hawlaha wadahadalada sidii la rabay u wadin, isla markaana ay jiraan dhaqdhaqaaqyo ay Somaliya doonayso in ay kaga xuubsiibato sii wadida wadahadaladii ay labada geesood fureen.

 

Balantii dib u dhacday ee Wadahadaladii Somaliya iyo Somaliland ayaa laga yaabaa in ay dib dalka Turkiga uga qabsoonto toddobaadka labaad ee bisha koowaad ee sanadka cusub ee 2014-ka, hase yeeshee waxa muuqata dareen walaac leh oo ay Somaliland ka qabto Dalka Turkigu sida uu hawlaha u wado.

 

Lama oga Dalka Ingiriisku in uu aqbalay Codsiga Somaliland iyo inkale, hase yeeshee waxa la filayaa in wasiirka Arrimaha Dibeda oo ka soo kicitimay Dalkaasi uu faahfaahin dheeraad ah ka bixin doono kulamada uu la yeeshay Madaxda Ingiriiska iyo mawqifka ay ka qaateenba.