Somalis and Oromos

[Mukulaalow]

Nonsense. Some of us are descendants of the great Abdirahman Ismail Jeberti.

Oday C/laahi visited the oldman in his grave few years ago, they should get some DNA from the bones, that will answer alot of questions.

[Mukulaalow]

[Somalia]

Of course, he had to show some respect.

 

That man must have been special, the minds who descended from him are just wow. Take me for example.

 

[Garnaqsi]

Somalia, I'm convinced you don't believe yourself half the stuff you say around here.

 

Mukulaalow;801024 wrote:

Waryee Garnaqi is ilaali, Xaajiga Xunjuf iyo xertiisa yeysan ku maqal, They believe they are directly from the household of Prophet Muhammad (PPUH), that is why they are called Duriyada, the other guys in Puntland, well they are just happy with an Arab shaikh, they are not pushing hard like the XX guys.

I'm not going there, sir. No, no.

[OdaySomali]

Having done some further research I can confidently say that the reason why there is some overlap of the Oromo and Somali clans is becuase (in terms of naming, language etc) is that the Oromos have been attempting and indeed have been 'Oromo-izing' Somalis who bordered them. Most likely this is said to be during the great Oromo expansion; this was in the aftermath of the long Adal-abyssinia wars when the Somalis and Xabashis had worn each other out and the Oromos used that to their advantage. They came from southern Ethiopia/Northern Kenya and migrated north and east conquering the lands and the people - this is when they also overtook Harar etc.

 

Somalis are indeed and ancient, for the most part unique, homogenous people as I will post soon.

 

I do apologise for even foolishly suggesting that we came from the Oromo.

[OdaySomali]

http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v13/n7/full/5201390a.html

 

Discussion

 

The present study demonstrates that male Somalis has the highest frequency of the haplogroup E3b1 (77.6%) observed in any population studied until now. The great majority of the Somali E3b1 Y chromosomes studied (96.8%) carried the otherwise rare allele 11 of the DYS19 STR locus and, thus, belonged to the cluster defined by Cruciani et al.10 The E3b1 cluster was previously reported in five of seven (71.4%) male Boranas (Oromos) from North Kenya, in 52.2% of Somali males, and in 32.0% Ethiopian males.10 The majority of the E3b1 Y chromosomes (91.0%) were further characterized by the DYS19-11, DYS392-12, DYS437-14, DYS438-11, and DYS393-13 alleles. The Eurasian clade FR had a frequency of 15.4% and the typical sub-Saharan haplogroups A, B, E3a*(xE3a4), E2 and E3b* were found in only 5% of Somali males.

 

The network of the E3b1 lineages in the present Somali population sample (Figure 3a) displayed star-like features and we observed a low Y STR haplotype diversity and a very limited spread in the sizes of the STR alleles (Table 3), suggesting a coherent, common, recent ancestry. The network of the E3b1 lineages of previously published data of East African populations and our data (Figure 3b) demonstrate that the E3b1 cluster lineages of the present Somali population sample are part of the East African E3b1 lineages. E3b1 cluster lineages were observed in low frequencies in Bantus from Kenya, North Egypt, Morocco and Niger10 (Figure 4). In the present study, haplogroup E3b1 was found in 6.3% of Iraqis and none of them belonged to cluster . Only 11 subjects with a DYS19-11/DYS392-12 pattern were reported outside the Horn of Africa in 26 654 subjects analysed in a worldwide set of 236 populations by November 2004 (http://www.yhrd.org/index.html). Taken together, the data suggest that the E3b1 cluster DYS392-12 lineage was expanded in the Somali population.

 

Cruciani et al10 suggested that the E3b1 cluster lineages originated in East Africa and estimated that the TMRCA (time to the most recent common ancestor) was approximately 9600 years. We estimated that the E3b1 cluster DYS392-12 lineages of the present Somali population sample originated 4000–5000 years ago, and that the expansion of the E3b1 cluster DYS392-12 lineages in these Somalis involved a relatively small number of Y chromosomes (around 1000 males).

 

The time of the eastbound Bantu expansion was estimated to be 34001100 years ago.24 Bantu populations have high frequencies of E3a haplogroups.4 We have observed only a few individuals with the E3a haplogroup in our Somali population, thus, supporting the view that the Bantu migration did not reach Somalia.42 It has been suggested that a barrier against gene flow exist in the region.43 The barrier seems to be the Cushitic languages and cultures to which Somalis belongs. The Cushitic languages belong to the Afro-Asiatic languages that are spoken in Northern and Eastern Africa. The Cushitic languages and cultures are mainly found in the Somalis and the Oromos, one of the two main groups inhabiting Ethiopia.44, 45, 46. The Somali and Oromo languages have a high degree of similarity and the two populations share many cultural characteristics. The Somali and Oromo people live in clans with special patterns of marriage and the Somali and Oromo people have complex, interwoven pedigrees.44, 45

 

The very high frequency of the E3b1 cluster in our Somali population sample could be due to ascertainment bias or special clan or family relationships in the present sample of Somali immigrants to Denmark. No reliable information on geographic origin or clan relationship in the present Somali population sample was available. However, the genotypes of the autosomal STR systems were in Hardy–Weinberg equilibrium, indicating random mating in at least the last generation, and the distribution of Y-STR haplotypes in our Somali population was similar to that in a sample of Somali immigrants to Norway,37 indicating that these two population samples came from a larger, homogenous population of Somalis.

 

The haplogroup K2 was found in 10.4% of Somali males. Haplogroup K2 was suggested to have arisen in Eurasia.4, 9 K2 has a patchy distribution in Cameroon (18.0%), Egypt (8.2%), Ethiopia (4.8%), Tanzania (3.8%) and Morocco (3.6%), probably due to back migration.3, 7, 8, 9 Luis et al9 estimated an expansion time of 13.7–17.5 ky for the K2 lineages in Egypt. The BATWING expansion time estimated for K2 in our Somali population (3.3 ky) is consistent with an African southward dissemination of the K2 haplogroup. The observation of two Somali males with the M17 mutation (haplogroup R1a1*(xR1a1b)) may indicate a recent gene flow by migration from Eurasia.47, 48 A possible explanation is offered by the fact that from the 7th century onward, immigrant Muslim Arabs and Persians established trading posts along the Somali coast51, although also British, French and Italian people were present in Somalia in the region in the 19th and 20th century.

 

The distribution of the haplogroups J2*(xJ2f2) (0.5%) and J*(xJ2) (2.5%) in Somalis support the recent gene flow hypothesis. Haplogroup J*(xJ2) was probably spread by the Arab people.40 The ratio between the haplogroups J2/J*(xJ2) may be an indicator of the genetic components from populations like (1) Balkans, Turks, Georgians and Muslim Kurds and (2) Bedouin and Palestinian Arabs, respectively.40, 52 The ratio was 0.26 in the Oman population.9 The J2/J*(xJ2) ratio of 0.2 in the present Somali sample suggest a predominant gene flow of Arab Y chromosomes.

 

In conclusion, the data suggest that the male Somali population is a branch of the East African population – closely related to the Oromos in Ethiopia and North Kenya (Boranas) – with predominant E3b1 cluster DYS392-12 lineages that probably were introduced into the Somali population 4000–5000 years ago, approximately 15% Y chromosomes from Eurasia and approximately 5% from sub-Saharan Africa. Work is in progress in order to study closely related populations with new informative markers to obtain a better understanding of the E3b1 lineages settlement process in East Africa.

[OdaySomali]

^ Samaale wuu jiray. Odayaashii carabtuna way jidhay. E3b1 is characteristic of Somalis, with only 15% Y chromosomes from Eurasia and 5% from sub-Saharan Africa.

[OdaySomali]

See these pictures:

 

http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v13/n7/fig_tab/5201390f1.html#figure-title

 

http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v13/n7/fig_tab/5201390t2.html#figure-title

[Carafaat]

Oromo's are by far our closest and dearest brothers. Afar is another brother. The similarities we share is as if we are 2 brothers and all other humans are distent cousins of us.

[GoldCoast]

Carafaat;801210 wrote:

Oromo's are by far our closest and dearest brothers. Afar is another brother. The similarities we share is as if we are 2 brothers and all other humans are distent cousins of us.

This is true. Afar culture seems very close to Somali as do their features.

[OdaySomali]

Occupational groups... identity?

 

Maal

 

Soo-maal (he who milks...lives off milk/meat)

 

Biyo-maal (he who lives off water... fisher and/or farmer)

 

Tum-maal (welder/blacksmith/mason lives of his 'hammer')

 

Baaji-maal (potter & clayworker)

 

Disscuss.

[Carafaat]

We tend to forget that eventhough one can be descendant from one ancestor or Sheick in terms of family name(abtirsi), but in terms of blood, culture, culture, etc there are many more ancestors relevent for the result. For example: Imagine a grandson of the arab Sheick. This grandson has 1 Arab grandfather and 3 non-Arabic granparents(the grandmother from fatherside and 2 grandparens from mothers side).

 

So in fact he is one 25% arab and 75% non-arabic. Eventhough he is only a small fraction arabic, he still carries the abtirsi and the name of the Arabic grandfather, while in terms of DNA, blood, culture, language his non-Arabic heritage is far more significant. If you continue this with the son of the grandchild has only 1/8 arabic grand-grandparents and 7/8 non-arabic grandparents.

 

So, while the Arabic Abtirsi remains important name wise, the non-arabic part is way more significant for his culture, upbringing, language, heritage.

[oba hiloowlow]

oromo is bahalo caqli badan laheyn, Afar waa rageedi

[Leezu]

The answer is: Oromo is not an ethnicity like Somali and Afar even though they are our closest relatives together with Afar they are more like the Arabs. Oromos began expanding south, east and north and west from somewhere in central Oromiya and their strategy was to kill the men and rape the women and teach the children of the rape victims Oromo and their culture to expand faster. They have done this to Somalis, Amharas, Bantus and other people that is why they are divided into Borana and Barentoo. There are alot of Somalis who have been Oromized on the border, mostly in Babille, around Harar etc. They are still Somalis but with lost identity, like the Americans who can't figure out where they really are from. Only way to reverse this is by educating these people and Somalis themselves about this.

They are our brothers and muslim brothers aswell, and inshallah they will gain their freedom aswell as the Afar.

[OdaySomali]

Carafaat;801210 wrote:

Oromo's are by far our closest and dearest brothers. Afar is another brother. The similarities we share is as if we are 2 brothers and all other humans are distent cousins of us.

The more I read into this subject the more this seems to actually be the case.