Article Al Jazeera: Will the London conference change Somalia's future?

[SayidSomal]

I guess you are the "half empty" type of guy, very hard to convince that it could also be 'half full'.

 

 

Walaal adigu wax fahan and for once admit without deductions of any kind.

[NGONGE]

^^ Not at all. My glass is always half full, saaxib. But, with Somalis, I keep it well hidden.

 

Sayid, everyone has dreams and everyone wants such dreams fulfilled, saaxib. But in order to achieve your dreams you have to take some practical steps first. The biggest leap (in your case) involves the fact that Somalis without clans are not Somalis. This fact should be central to any dreams or solutions you have. In fact, never mind the professor's 100 Somalis, I'd say go for TEN THOUSAND (as long as every last tiny clan is represented and appeased).

 

When you're surrounded by dogs it's exteremly foolish to expect your wuduu to remain intact, saaxib. Wax fahan.

[SayidSomal]

^ :D

 

Saxiib with all due respect this clan claptrap of yours is not beginning and the end of all things.

 

First of all let not us not make the first mistake of assuming that what seems good idea to us is not good to other Somalis. At end of the day we are Somalis and we are talking about Somalis here. Have you ever heard the English proverb "what is good for the goose is good for the gander"?

 

Secondly, you analogy is false to begin with - I am not surrounded by dogs - hence me and only me can break my weeso.

[Carafaat]

NGONGE;787609 wrote:

EXACTLY. You know it, I know it and the professor knows it. It's a great idea and the one that is morally acceptable but it's not SOMALI and never likely to be implemented in our life times. Marka, again, what hole did Mr Hiil Qaran prick?

Ngonge, it one you are right that Somali's and clannism are inseperatebal. Just like humans have a tendency to sexual pervert thoughts and actions. Still, you should not accept nor institutionalize pervert behavior. One need to protect the man from himself. Adigu laakinse waxa leedahay dharka tuura kolay waa la dheeliyaa. And that my friend is an immoral thing to do.

[NGONGE]

^^ (ma tedhi?).

 

Protecting the man from himself? These are Shababi tendencies you're displaying there, adeer. Is qabo ban ku edhi.

 

As for the rest of what you wrote there; there is nothing immoral about what I am saying. I'm telling you that clan is the problem and in order to sort Somalia you need to consider it, take it into account and embrace it. That you think clan is an ugly concept is neither here nor there, adeer. Somalis (by their actions and prononcements) don't and you are outnumbered here. Get on with it.

 

 

Sayid,

As ever, you are missing the entire point, saaxib.

 

What is a good idea to you is also a good idea to me, ninyaho. But while you stop at the idea itself, I look at the practicalities of it and KNOW that Somalis will fall out along tribal lines when push comes to shove. I know it, not because i'm some sort of fortune-teller or magician. I know it from EXPERIENCE (one that you too should have). Marka naga daa oo weesada ku so cel celi ban ku idhi.

[SayidSomal]

No, i am not missing any point (unless it is hidden like your optimism)

 

The practicality of implementing the idea is within the idea itself saxiib. Talk about who is missing the point.

If you like the idea and you are given how it should be implemented and you also like that and more importantly you are Somali yourself (of course; born of noble clan) - what is the fuss then?

 

Weesadaydiina weli waan qaba!

[NGONGE]

Sayid*Somal;787644 wrote:

No, i am not missing any point (unless it is hidden like your optimism)

 

The practicality of implementing the idea is within the idea itself saxiib. Talk about who is missing the point.

If you like the idea and you are given how it should be implemented and you also like that and more importantly you are Somali yourself (of course; born of noble clan) - what is the fuss then?

 

Weesadaydiina weli waan qaba!

Using sand can replace weeyso now and again but you seem to be mistaking it with sticking your head in the sand, adeer.

 

Ya saaxibi, the idea is BRILLIANT and I trust you to implement it but I don't trust Carafat and Somalia, sadly, is full of Carafat's. Marka naga daa dee.

[Carafaat]

Ngonge, we should not deny the existence of clan nor the tendancy to 'clannism'. In fact we should embrace it and make sure institutions don't show tendancies to clannism or have mechanismms in place to prevent ot deal with clannism.

 

However institutionalizing clan with formula's like 4.5 in goverment is immoral. Just like showing up at work naked. There should be times and places for nuddist behavior, I agree that with you. Maybe in a harmless clan based 'cultural' Guurti, with fadhi ku dirir and dhaanto sessions.

 

 

Using sand can replace weeyso now and again but you seem to be mistaking it with sticking your head in the sand, adeer.

 

Ya saaxibi, the idea is BRILLIANT and I trust you to implement it but

I don't trust Carafat and Somalia, sadly, is full of Carafat's

. Marka naga daa dee.

explain?

[NGONGE]

^^ Dee I don't know you. I know Sayid personally and can vouch for him and trust him. Adigu you're all over the place. Likewise, Somalis know their clansmen and would vouch for them, they don't know the 'others' and, don't trust them.

 

As for what you're talking about. I beg to differ and would actually champion the 4.5 system. It did not come out of thin air, saaxib. It is there because Somalis (or rather their leaders) demanded it and will continue to demand it. You can your fellow dreamers can oppose it all you like, it will still carry on being used (in one form or another) until Somali finally gets fixed (and it wont get fixed without it).

 

p.s.

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not claiming to be a Qardaawi here.

[Carafaat]

NGONGE;787672 wrote:

^^ Dee I don't know you. I know Sayid personally and can vouch for him and trust him. Adigu you're all over the place. Likewise, Somalis know their clansmen and would vouch for them, they don't know the 'others' and, don't trust them.

 

As for what you're talking about. I beg to differ and would actually champion the 4.5 system. It did not come out of thin air, saaxib. It is there because Somalis (or rather their leaders) demanded it and will continue to demand it. You can your fellow dreamers can oppose it all you like, it will still carry on being used (in one form or another) until Somali finally gets fixed (and it wont get fixed without it).

 

p.s.

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not claiming to be a Qardaawi here.

Ok, I understand on the trust part.

 

On the formula. Afcourse, we need somekind of a diversification policy or system to insure inclusiviness. but is a set formula the answer, no! why, see TFG and AL Shabaab. One uses the formula, no succes or support on the ground. The other uses an inclusive diversity policy en voila, they get support from all over the country.

[NGONGE]

^^ Al Shabab claim to belong to the biggest clan of all, adeer. Wax fahan.

[Carafaat]

Yes, they do. And we should atleast try to get near that position on local, regional and national level. No formula that can't reflect that ambitio except the formula of the local stakeholder. Anyone who lives x nr of years in Banadir is a Bandiri, anyone who lives x nr of years in Baidoa is a Baidoawi and same goes for SL. And I think even the SL Laws have been changed and say one needs to live atleast so many years to run for office, disqualifying all those foreingners abusing the formula against the cost of the real stakeholders in the country.

[SayidSomal]

@Not being a Qardhaawi - Hal fuusto saliid ah will change that - or in your case hal tuubo oo afka laguu geliyo, given that you are nin culus (and i am not referring to weight here)

 

Ngonge - saxiib we have been on this merry go around before. Let us just agree to disagree, although for all intents and purposes - there is actually nothing we disagree upon - this is more of "ood qaad ama jiid - waa isla guri geyn".

[NGONGE]

^^ The dreaming professor naga daa and check out Cabdi (I bet he's right up your street).

 

http://allafrica.com/stories/201202101070.html

 

(Should I have had it as a thread on its own?).

[SayidSomal]

At least the good professor had logical argument from beginning, middle to the end - where as this joker is all over the place, against, neutral, and then suggesting how the meeting should be held and what outcomes should be had at the end.