somali christian is it a fact or a fiction

[Nur]

Sherban Shabeel

 

Your last name sounds like TIGER in Somali, you are not a "Tiger" from the "Woods" I guess, lol .

 

How did you pick this Somali sounding screen name if you are not Somali?

 

I wholeheartedly agree with you that faith is a deep personal choice that comes from within us.

 

I also admire true Christians, I have devout Christian colleagues that have earned my highest respect ( Higher than so called "Muslims"). I also know of few Somali Christians of second generation and some converts, though too few and very recent ( The Mariano family from Somaliland were converted during the British occupation of Northern Somaliland for unknown reasons)

 

Jesus Christ ( May Peace and Blessing Be Upon Him) is celebrated in the pages of the holy Quran like no other ( including Muhammad May Peace be upon him), the story of the immaculate conception and of Mary cause Muslims to break in tears in Surah ( Chapter) dedicated to Jesus, Mary, John ( Yahaya) , Zakaria and the desciples.

 

http://audio.islamweb.net/audio/listenbox.php?audi oid=90322&type=ram

 

 

Here is the Translation of the Holy Quraan Chapter of Mary ( May Peace Be Upon Her)

 

 

1. Kaf­ Ha­Ya­'Ain­Sad. [These letters are one of the miracles of the Qur'an, and none but Allah (Alone) knows their meanings].

 

2. (This is) a mention of the mercy of your Lord to His slave Zakariya (Zachariah).

 

3. When he called out his Lord (Allah) a call in secret,

 

4. Saying: "My Lord! Indeed my bones have grown feeble, and grey hair has spread on my head, And I have never been unblest in my invocation to You, O my Lord!

 

5. "And Verily! I fear my relatives after me, since my wife is barren. So give me from Yourself an heir,

 

6. "Who shall inherit me, and inherit (also) the posterity of Ya'qub (Jacob) (inheritance of the religious knowledge and Prophethood, not the wealth, etc.). And make him, my Lord, one with whom You are Well-pleased!".

 

7. (Allah said) "O Zakariya (Zachariah)! Verily, We give you the glad tidings of a son, His name will be Yahya (John). We have given that name to none before (him)."

 

8. He said: "My Lord! How can I have a son, when my wife is barren, and I have reached the extreme old age."

 

9. He said: "So (it will be). Your Lord says; It is easy for Me. Certainly I have created you before, when you had been nothing!"

 

10. [Zakariya (Zachariah)] said: "My Lord! Appoint for me a sign." He said: "Your sign is that you shall not speak unto mankind for three nights, though having no bodily defect."

 

11. Then he came out to his people from Al-Mihrab (a praying place or a private room, etc.), he told them by signs to glorify Allah's Praises in the morning and in the afternoon.

 

12. (It was said to his son): "O Yahya (John)! Hold fast the Scripture [the Taurat (Torah)]." And We gave him wisdom while yet a child.

 

13. And (made him) sympathetic to men as a mercy (or a grant) from Us, and pure from sins [i.e. Yahya (John)] and he was righteous,

 

14. And dutiful towards his parents, and he was neither an arrogant nor disobedient (to Allah or to his parents).

 

15. And Salamun (peace) be on him the day he was born, the day he dies, and the day he will be raised up to life (again)!

 

16. And mention in the Book (the Qur'an, O Muhammad , the story of) Maryam (Mary), when she withdrew in seclusion from her family to a place facing east.

 

17. She placed a screen (to screen herself) from them; then We sent to her Our Ruh [angel Jibrael (Gabriel)], and he appeared before her in the form of a man in all respects.

 

18. She said: "Verily! I seek refuge with the Most Beneficent (Allah) from you, if you do fear Allah."

 

19. (The angel) said: "I am only a Messenger from your Lord, (to announce) to you the gift of a righteous son."

 

20. She said: "How can I have a son, when no man has touched me, nor am I unchaste?"

 

21. He said: "So (it will be), your Lord said: 'That is easy for Me (Allah): And (We wish) to appoint him as a sign to mankind and a mercy from Us (Allah), and it is a matter (already) decreed, (by Allah).' "

 

22. So she conceived him, and she withdrew with him to a far place (i.e. Bethlehem valley about 4-6 miles from Jerusalem).

 

23. And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a date-palm. She said: "Would that I had died before this, and had been forgotten and out of sight!"

 

24. Then [the babe 'Iesa (Jesus) or Jibrael (Gabriel)] cried unto her from below her, saying: "Grieve not! Your Lord has provided a water stream under you;

 

25. "And shake the trunk of date-palm towards you, it will let fall fresh ripe-dates upon you."

 

26. "So eat and drink and be glad, and if you see any human being, say: 'Verily! I have vowed a fast unto the Most Beneficent (Allah) so I shall not speak to any human being this day.'"

 

27. Then she brought him (the baby) to her people, carrying him. They said: "O Mary! Indeed you have brought a thing Fariya (an unheard mighty thing).

 

28. "O sister (i.e. the like) of Harun (Aaron) [not the brother of Musa (Moses), but he was another pious man at the time of Maryam (Mary)]! Your father was not a man who used to commit adultery, nor your mother was an unchaste woman."

 

29. Then she pointed to him. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?"

 

30. "He ['Iesa (Jesus)] said: Verily! I am a slave of Allah, He has given me the Scripture and made me a Prophet;"

 

31. "And He has made me blessed wheresoever I be, and has enjoined on me Salat (prayer), and Zakat, as long as I live."

 

32. "And dutiful to my mother, and made me not arrogant, unblest.

 

33. "And Salam (peace) be upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!"

 

34. Such is 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary). (it is) a statement of truth, about which they doubt (or dispute).

 

35. It befits not (the Majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son [this refers to the slander of Christians against Allah, by saying that 'Iesa (Jesus) is the son of Allah]. Glorified (and Exalted be He above all that they associate with Him). When He decrees a thing, He only says to it, "Be!" and it is.

 

36. ['Iesa (Jesus) said]: "And verily Allah is my Lord and your Lord. So worship Him (Alone). That is the Straight Path. (Allah's Religion of Islamic Monotheism which He did ordain for all of His Prophets)." [Tafsir At-Tabari]

 

37. Then the sects differed [i.e. the Christians about 'Iesa (Jesus)], so woe unto the disbelievers [those who gave false witness by saying that 'Iesa (Jesus) is the son of Allah] from the meeting of a great Day (i.e. the Day of Resurrection, when they will be thrown in the blazing Fire).

 

38. How clearly will they (polytheists and disbelievers in the of Allah's Sovereignty) see and hear, the Day when they will appear before Us! But the Zalimun (polytheists and wrong-doers) today are in plain error.

 

The story about Jesus in the holy Quraan concludes with these stunning verses:

 

 

89 .Indeed you have brought forth (said) a terrible evil thing.

 

90. Whereby the heavens are almost torn, and the earth is split asunder, and the mountains fall in ruins,

 

91. That they ascribe a son (or offspring or children) to the Most Beneficent (Allah).

 

92. But it is not suitable for (the Majesty of) the Most Beneficent (Allah) that He should beget a son (or offspring or children).

 

93. There is none in the heavens and the earth but comes unto the Most Beneficent (Allah) as a slave.

 

94. Verily, He knows each one of them, and has counted them a full counting.

 

95. And everyone of them will come to Him alone on the Day of Resurrection (without any helper, or protector or defender).

 

 

Nur

[Sherban Shabeel]

I picked shabeel because the leopard is my favorite animal lol

 

Some of my friends ask me if I thought about converting. I tell them that, although I love Islam, I don't believe in converting. I was born Christian and I'll die that way. But we'll wind up in the same place anyway incha'allah

[Ashkiro]

Salams everyone,

 

I do agree with both of you that faith really is a personal matter, and the Quran tells us, Allah Alone is the Final Judge. Nur waan ku salamay walaal. You mentioned you know a few converts whom left Islam. Do you personally know them, and what were the reasons behind their change of faith? As we know those whom enter Islam by the Grace of Allah, the overwhelming majority if not all do so after studying the deen in great detail and masha-Allah are very series about their Islam, even surpassing those whom were Muslims all their lives. Many of these reverts to Islam have been even very knowledgable people before hand, and some were scholars of their old faith. The same can not be said of those whom leave Islam. On the contary, they were never series about Islam or were religious to begin with, and find Islam restrictive (ie moral code of Islam no drinking, sex ect), therefore take the easier way out. Have you ever heard of a Muslim scholar or a learned Muslim that converted from Islam? I certainly haven't. Anyhow, religion is personal to each their own. I thank Allah for making me a Muslim.

[Indhoos]

Ashkiro Castro haku maqlo bakoorad buu kaa soo daba qaadan doonaa for talking about those who left b/c they found the faith restrictive.....

 

Don't you want to know what was the motivation for them?

 

Sherban, instead of saying I am going to worship what my family worshipped, read and learn about both faiths, compare them, then make a decision for yourself. Much respect to ya for stayiing open-minded.

 

PS. Castro please warn me before throwing the bakoor after me, atheer, I had that happen once and ended up with a broken wrist.

[Ashkiro]

^Salams dear

 

LOL@ bakoorad, I believe your refering to the similar topic on the general section for those of us whom are not following the debate. To answer your question, I am not really interested in their motivations, I share the view of the other member whom said "its their loss". I am more interested with the theory I have and I am certain many others do as well. And since I do not know of any "Ex Muslims" personally and Nur mentioned he knew a few, I wanted to see if their stories fit into this theory of mine, which in short states, the so called "ex-Muslims" are those whom scummed to their base desires (finding Islam restrictive-thus take the easier road), hence why it's unheard of to see the likes of Hamza Yusuf, Bilal Phillips, and many others of former non-Muslims whom were guided to the true faith. Don't you find it funny, all the famous "ex-Muslims" such as our very own Ayan Hirsi, put so much emphasis on "why they left Islam" as opposed to what truth they found? As is the case with those whom converted to Islam? In any case I would like to say, someone's choices in their life (even that of Ayan Hirsi) is totally upto them, but I do find it strange and it's very suspious of these so called "former Muslims."

[Sherban Shabeel]

Indhoos,

 

I've read and learned about both religions, believe me, but still I stand by my faith. It's a cultural thing. Islam just isn't compatible with my culture.

 

We are brought up drinking, and drinking is in every aspect of our lives from parties to negotiating, to just sitting out in the street in the afternoon. Distilling strong alcohol is an art passed down from generation to generation and if I let that disappear from my life, it would change who I am, it would change my identity. I know a lot of Muslims who drink, but if I were to become one I wouldn't allow myself to drink. What's the point in converting to Islam if you don't want to be a very pious man?

 

Also, sexual norms are pretty lax in my country (I'm sure you've heard rumors of Romanian women) and I could never become a respectful gentleman who only has eyes for his wife.

 

That being said, I still pray every night and I believe in God, and hope to see one day those who aren't here anymore. I know some of you think God will treat me differently because I'm not a Muslim, and that's OK because there's some Christians who believe the same about you. But it doesn't mean much to me. I believe all good men will wind up in the same place.

 

Even heathens, I think, they believe in God even if they don't know it. They feel love (for their children, for their mothers, for those around them), and God is love.

 

Me, I would be honored to die amongst Somalis, amongst Palestinians, amongst people fighting for their survival against all odds. But even fighting for Muslims, I'll die a Christian.

 

And maybe the world will remember me as a moderately extremist Christian Islamist

[Goodir]

^That would make you a human bonobo. No pun intended.

 

You have not seen much about life if what motivates you is just punch of nude women and alcoholic beverage. But glad you know your outlook in life.

[Sherban Shabeel]

Never said that's what motivates me, it's just part of me.

[Nur]

Ashkiro sis

 

you write:

 

" ....You mentioned you know a few converts whom left Islam. Do you personally know them, and what were the reasons behind their change of faith?"

 

 

Answer:

 

Yes, a room full of Somali youth who invited me over to Christianity. Their American Pastor was keen in my conversion, they had hard time answering some of my questions about the nature and resurrection of Jesus (May Peace Be Upon Him).

 

To say I was shocked would be an understatement, specially when I have known these guys as normal Faraxs that I used to hang around with. Did they know much about Islam? Yes, as much as the Transitional Federal Government knows about Islam. What drove them to switch their faith? Expediency, some even confided in me that they were doing it for money and that they planned to switch back again.

 

But, one myth needs to be cleared here while we are at it. One of the kindest and most respectable human being I have ever met was a Somali Christian Convert, who was probably driven by belief, to this day, I pray for that man, the least I can do for someone whose good character is imprinted in my memory forever.

 

 

Nur

[Nur]

Goodir bro.

 

Be easy on Shabeel, wallahi his words smell honesty and not hypocrisy like many so called " Muslims".

 

He is honest in saying that he needs his booze as a person who grew up in a Christian society, and that getting laid in his culture is like having tea in ours. That was the same culture in MAKKA ( Mecca) when Mohammad SAW began preaching Islam.

 

Remember Hadeeth of Aisha, that there was up to 10 socially acceptable types of sexual relationships in practice prior to Islam? that is what Shabeel is talking about, the fact that he finds it difficult to give up thee habits is normal, and it should not be asked of him before he is comfortable with the concept behind the legislation which is Justice with the Creator, and Justice with fellow Man. What Shabeel said at the end shows that he has a great sense of Justice and tolerance in his heart as a Christian, in the sense that he has sympathy for the oppressed Somalis and Palestinians. We should be proud to have a Christian person like Shabeel in our Forum, and community. We should also show utmost respect and hospitality for his participation in our forum. I have no doubt that his honesty will lead him to the right path at the end.

 

 

Nur

[Indhoos]

^^^Nur walaahi you are right on, because there is the hadith of our prophet PBUH, Ad diinu Nasiixah....

 

Sherban I applaude you once again for your open-mind, and honest answeres...

 

Here is a proposal, since you have read the religion and know about it, w/out converting why don't you try practicing it. Example, give going to the mosque a try, give giving up certain things a try and see how it pans out.(Totally up to you.)

 

Ashkiro, you are absolutely right, it is their loss as well as their personal choice. I believe that they have made conscious, cabable choice as to where they want to go...

[Nur]

Indhoos

 

We appear too quick to force others to experience our faith, which is also normal under the circumstances. But like Shabeel said, faith is a calling, it is dormant within us, it can be triggered from outside when favorable conditions exist, when a person is ready to adopt a faith, all roads will lead to satisfy that faith. But, like a plant, it takes time, or it may never see the light, either way, we need to engage our non Muslim guests in this forum without proselytizing to respect their choice of faith and lifestyle.

 

Nur

[Sherban Shabeel]

I have in my room a Bible in my language and a Qur'An in Arabic and Somali, side by side.

[Chimera]

Sherban Shabeel your a interesting person and welcome to the forum. Castle Dracula is really a fine piece of medieval architecture, and one of the places i would love to visit one day!

 

Nur Christianity in Somalia could be traced between the early centuries of the religion all the way to the establishment of Islam in the 7th century AD, there are many crosses and stone structures(churches? ) of a currently unknown pre-Islamic Somali civilization(there is nothing to compare it with regionally so it's not Axum) littered around Somalia which detail a ancient Christian past that flourished besides the native monotheistic religion of Waqism. Chinese writers of pre-islamic times when referring to the religion of our ancestors said that the only deity we believed in was the 'heavens'. All of this could have been illuminated more clearly if proper investigation was done.

[Nur]

Shabeel

 

Do you need a Quraan in Romanian language? let me know, I may be able to help.

 

 

Adam Zayla

 

Much thanks, very enlightening! in the mdst of so many religions and animism, we need Somali historians who can explain why Islam became so predominant religion for the warring Nomads in the horn, may its the only force tha can tame them, just like Islam tamed Quresih and American hard Core Criminals in US Jails who find in Islam an awsome power that tames them.

 

 

Nur