Top Secret: Cajalad Sir Ah oo laga Hayo Jen:Morgan -- REPOSTED

[Baashi]

This post was locked and I had to dig it to find it. I trust it's locked for a good reason and has nothing to do with what I posted.

 

Abtigiis posted the post below late last night.

 

Well, it is not something I thought I will do ever - to disagree with Baashi. I always seem to agree with what he says, and saw no reason to confront him. But I disagree with him here and now.

 

There is a lot of revealtions in this video. It cannot be downplayed as a mere meeting where a clan is plotting against another clan. It has a much more significiance than that. It shows the mindset that ruled Somalia for 21 years. These men who are speaking in this meeting are not traditional elders. They were commanders of Somalia's national army. They were political leaders in actuality because politics and military were one and the same under Siyaad. While we all have heard of the decadence of the leaders of Somalia's false Kacaan, hearing from the mouths of the men themesleves is quite revealing.

 

Look at the amount of nonesesne Gabiyoow is spweing in this video. Look at the mindset. Shantii or lixdii or laba iyo tobankii block ayaa meesha fadhiya, I feel like God toda because the clan chose me.... Look at Morgan's useless sterotyping: Rer-hebel baa sal-fudud baa la yidhi inagaa ka sal fuduud blah blah... To say this while cheawing Qat with your friends is soemthings, to institute these false sterotypes and insert them in national policy is a different matter altogather. What is even worse is knowing that the two Generals are not speaking for themselves alone. The whole Somalia government had the same mentality and no wonder other clans who saw what is going on revolted.

 

Of course other clans are not better too. Like the same Kaydmedia group who use this clip to fuel a backlash against another clan.

 

War dadka Somalia ku nool,what are they? I am not worried about the masses. War ka daaya hal qof oo yidhaa (ku yidhaa reerkiisa) maxaa loo la'yahay. In this regard, I salute Buuba and the few Somalilanders who faced upto their kins and said no to what they saw as wrong.

Abtigiis,

 

Disagreements are most welcome. We certainly don’t want to preach to the choir

 

I take it you take issue with negative tribalism. And rightly so.

 

I don’t know about you Abtigiis but I am well versed in the goings of Somalis political scene. The very institutions that Somali political framework rested upon have always been that of clan institution -- the traditional clan mold. And yes you heard me right I believe clan is and has always been the basis of our social system. Never has social contract of national scale been drafted without getting the clan consideration right.

 

Clan is not everything to everyone and certainly not to you - I take your word for it - but it is a humongous factor in our xeer. Let me emphasis this. I said xeer! Xeer in itself is informed by clan considerations. Do this quickly: try to take any institution of significance and extrapolate its line items to trabilism and see the upward trajectory the line traverses! You will find there are no sacred cows from qoys to highest echelons of governments that ruled Somalia in its heydays.

 

General Morgan and general Gabyow were the top military brass and ahd held highest positions of the government. True. They were negative tribalism practitioners long before that meeting. Most of us knew that tidbit. In that sense there is no new revelations in the clip.

 

I want you to try to answer if you would Abdi Shube’s geeraar in which he poses questions:

 

War hadaan nahay Geeskan bari,

Kuwii gaarka u lahaa,

Ama uu ku galaday Allah,

Baheey gobolkeenii mee?

 

Dakeygoo garasha xume!

 

Hadaan nahay gobolka ka mida

Gayiga aadmiga ku nool,

Goor hore iyo waayo tagay,

Halkii laga geedi galay,

Asageen saban gudbeen,

Maxaa galabta ina dhigay?

 

Maxan isu gowracnaa,

Innagu isu goominaa,

Guhaada inoo ku wacan?

 

Aduunyadu waa giraan,

Waayuhu waa galinba ceyn,

Xilligu wuu is gurahayaa,

Baheey galabta iyo xasuus,

Gadaal ugu noqo xisaab,

Diiwanka galkiisa fura,

Tariikhdan guurinine,

Gadmadihii dhumay ka daya,

Intan goob joogna iyo,

Soo gaareen waxuu ina yirri,

Markad isu geysataan

 

Horta godobteena ya qaba,

Abaal ya ina gashaday,

Watan qarran gaamuroo,

Guyaal jira heysanaye,

Xornimadii yaa ganbiyey,

War yaa calankeenii gubay,

Gobaad yaa ibaha jaray

Intuu gaxdeedii dhamay,

Gabaankii naga dhaqdhaqay,

Gabaad baa lagu jiray e,

Gawaan maray yey na tubay,

Caawana an gaabsanine,

Godkii doonaaya weli,

Inay nagu sii guraan????????????

 

Tip: there is only one answer.

 

Are we square Abtigiis? I went to the trouble of finding this post awoowe. I do enjoy your posts (politics section ones) especially when you beat up my man Xiin It lightens up the board. I am waiting another memorable shellacking of Kampala Accord ( or may be you are rooting for it dunno but I wanna see a takedown of the munomental meeting where a sinster understanding has been reached).

 

Later after work.

[Cambuulo iyo bun]

that cleared a lot, now we know for sure who was against the starvation of the bay & bakool residents,, somali wee ka taala and those who are thinking about this and this mamul goboleed bull shit is no more than dhulballaarsi soon clans will fight about ceelal,deegamo, iwm well done somali people! qaran aa saan lagu noqohaayaa been ya lisku sheegin

[MoonLight1]

Ar kan muxuu cambuula ka dhargay.

[Ace of Spadez]

Baashi,

This video has displayed valuable information. In brief here are my reasons:

 

a)The famine that was caused in Baidoba has been a point of contentions for some time. It appears Morgan seems to point the finger on the SNF when he says they live on the stored food in the barns of the natives of Baidoba. This is valuable information in the search of who was responsible for this tragedy.

 

b)The reason detere of those who held power in the Facist regime of Afweyne can best be epitomized by Xaliimo Soofe’s core beliefs. It is one based on clannish superiority and hierarchy. The call to dehumanize certain clans and view them as wild animals seems to be long held beliefs institutionalized over 21 years.

 

c)The members of this gathering, namely Morgan, Gebyow, Maxamed Cabdi Yuusuf call for Somalinimo as of late is obliterated by this video. If I remember correctly Geybow himself cried during the Impigathi conference.

 

Now, if you shrug this all off and say it is normal since the very nature of Somalis is to be clannish then that means Somalis cannot transcend clans and form a nation. This is an interesting point since Somalinimo essentially means to look at the collective good rather than that of the individual/clan. Perhaps the clans that live in Somaliland did not think it through when they abdicated their new found sovereignty by giving it up to further “Somalinimo”. Unfortunately, in hindsight once the calculus is done their sacrifice was to their misfortune and only furthered the interest of the clans from Somalia Proper. This may very well be the reason Somalia Proper is finding it difficult to come together as a nation today because of the lack of will to look beyond the clan. It may also explain why Somaliland has despite the bumps along the road has managed to unify the different clans in its country. For Somaliland, it appears the common Somali can go beyond his better nature to reach for something greater.

[Somalia]

KeydMedia's agenda is nothing short of ironic given official purpose of the release.

 

- The views held by the men in the video have been known for years but it's different seeing it for yourself. Though the views are considered atricious by some, this was a civil war and these views were held by both sides.

 

- When you look at the other videos uploaded by KeydMedia, for example the one where Aideed says "Do not harm civilians", I am paraphrasing but that was the message portrayed to the audience and compare it to this, the agenda is clear.

 

- Also look at the comment section. Bear in mind these are comments APPROVED by KeydMedia, we as of now have comments like these;

 

Viva mujahidiinta usc

warcriminal morgan must die

Look at all of the other APPROVED comments where they insult the opposing clans. I posted a comment saying KeydMedia was not fair and balanced in its selection of videos and my comment was not displayed. I then posted a comment saying that I believed KeydMedia had an agenda regarding the video and they blocked me.

 

So please, lets not take this as a legitimate news organization. This is the equivalent to 'Breitbart.com'.

Cadhow shisheeye amuu kuu xalaaleenkala deegan aadhan

laheen

That's KeydMedia's agenda.

[Baashi]

Ace Of Spadez,

 

First off let me say I strive to address folks who don’t already agree with me. Exchanges like these give us a chance to put other side “on the stand”.

 

Now, I am not saying negative tribalism and all its ills is “normal” or desirable for that matter. Nor am I condoning what’s being said in the vid clip. What’s been shown on the clip may very well be “valuable” information to some. One thing it is not, however, is a secret or new revelation. You seem to be taking issue with that position. You shouldn’t.

 

Obviously what occurred in Baidoba and how that epic famine came about, as epic tragedy as that was, is a public knowledge. Crop failure, looting, civil strive, and what not are all known events -- hardly a secret.

 

Let me pound this point till it sinks in. The famine had received wall to wall coverage here in the states. I was here and I have seen it on first hand. Media coverage (CNN, in particular) generated millions of words, not quite that many but a lot of words, and thousands of images. So much so US felt compelled to act partly because of cable news incessant coverage of skeletons walking and people dropping dead.

 

As much as you would want to pin responsibility on particular group or personalities the fact of the matter is Somali’s breadbasket region (farming communities and their farming fields) become a frontline in the wake of Inna Barre’s ouster -- the epicenter of the civil war. Looting was the order of the day in every major city in the south including Kismayo’s Inji, Mareeray Sugar Plant, Rice fields of Mugabo. You name it and it was not spared. Needless to say, looting is wrong, inappropriate, uncivilized, xaraam, theft, and what not.

 

As to your second point on Somalinimo, awoowe one thing you are not taking into account is culture. Good governance is not something that comes easy. Our nomadic culture is not compatible with hierarchy, order, and regulatory agencies. Nomads dominate Somali political discourse and the leaders that are now a household names were born and bred in an environment where niman shantaadu ka dhicin, sharci kaama dhacsho is not a hal qabsi but a reality practiced by inna rag.

 

Somalis including these dominant nomads fought for a state and prevailed. But modern state required functioning institutions -- police, national defense, trade, and representation. Trust deficit among competing clans who were forced to share resources and manage institutions of the newly found state got us where we are today.

 

The irony is that Somalinimo and Muslinimo slogans were crafted in order to elevate nomadic mindset of Tol’ayeey to much nobler and better ideal where collective good trumps clan interests. It didn’t work. Next generation have to work harder and learn from this epic tragedy.

 

I find it saddening that you my man Ace of Spadez belief in Somalis that hail from clans like duriyada will succeed where others fail because of being from duriyada alone or perhaps being colonized by Anglo Saxon alone. That underlying theme in your write-up is a sad commentary on Somali tragedy. Not only sad statement but also untrue one. Clans in that neck of the wood have fought among themselves to a devastating effect for the same reason that Southern cousins have been at each others throat. It’s just that Southerners are more diverse in their clan composition, and have more resources to be had in that contest not to mention neighboring states in the region have "existential" interest in post conflict Somalia and want to shape it to their liking and hence are involved in fuelling the conflict.

 

Oodweyne, awoowe ha igu dhegga adkaan dee. Recite boowe recite

 

Dabka cadawgu keenaan lahaa, daadiyo quba e,

Dalaalka iyo malaalkaan lahaa, duubta gogolaha e,

Diraacdaa ku raagtaan lahaa, roobku haw da'e,

Dawlad weyn ha noqotan lahaa waaye dabdoode

Damashaadka faraxaan lahaa daawsho u jooge.

Arrin ka dahsoon baa jirtee taa ma dayi weyday!,

[Ace of Spadez]

Baashi,

 

Let me first agree with you that for some what is said in the video is not a secret nor a new revelation; however, I believe for a large number of people it is one thing to have heard about rumors or innuendos about members of the former regime and another to watch on video how they operated.

 

To this day, Somalis tend to sweep many events under the rug either by denying in ever occurred or down playing its ferocity. Many people heard Hargeisa was bombed, but to actually witness the grainy footages on Youtube of one of the former regime’s commanders ordering “Lama xabo oo deg deg ah rid” nonchalantly puts some context to what has been transmitted through word of mouth. You see, human beings will only believe what their eyes ears can witness.

 

To dismiss such evidence as passé, old news, nothing worth being gob smacked about is in line with how Somalis have dealt with the situation in Somalia; to stick one’s head in the sand hoping it will get better.

 

You’re quite right the famine in Baidoa was all over the news. So much so that some Somalis in the west decided not to mention they were from Somalia. Nevertheless, all that was in the airwaves was that the natives in Baidoa were starving. What up until now was a mystery is who looted the barns that caused the famine when the drought hit? On these very pages we’ve had nomads accuse one another for who was responsible. Now maybe to you it is not worthy to pinpoint who was responsible since this occurred during the unfortunate civil war between Somalis, where a lot of wrong was being committed but I beg to disagree. This famine was unique and has not occured anywhere else in the former Somali Republic! It was manmade and I’d think the confession of remnants of the former regime goes along way of appropriating blame and giving us another example of what they were capable of doing.

 

Now if I was to consume your definition of Somali culture as being synonymous with competition and confrontation, then how does one ever form a nation? From the empirical evidence of the last 42 years, it appears Somalia cannot and will not move beyond clan nor learn to share anything without vying for the lions share. If your thread about 2012 and what is to come for Somalia was any indication, this visceral competition of winners and losers is still alive and well. This does not bode well for Somalia and is precisely why the countless conferences have been a total failure because of the inability for Somalia to put some meat on the hollow bones of “Somalinimo” and “Muslinimo”. I don’t see how any other generation can overcome this obstacle without rejecting that it is inherent in them to embrace a culture of winner takes all, of one that fosters us vs. them instead of one that looks out for the greater good.

 

In stark contrast to Somalia and your definition of the very nature of Somalis to be unruly and not co-operative, we’re confronted with the success of Somaliland to bring together the numerous clans that live there. To hammer this point home, let’s compare the trajectory of Somalia and Somaliland from 1991 onwards. While in the video in question the remnants of the former regime were continuing to divide & conquer by whipping up clannish sentiment in Somalia, Somaliland was reconciling neighboring clans and building consensus. Somalia drifted into the abyss and Somaliland has been clawing back from dark hole it entered in 1960. Did clans in Somaliland slip into chaos? Yes. However, as I stated in my previous post, regardless of the bumps along the way, Somaliland managed to traverse the minefields and won the day because of true Somalinimo and Muslinimo. Somalinimo and Muslinimo are alive and well in Somaliland, because it is practiced and not just preached. Unfortunately it is dead in Somalia. The proof is in the pudding. In 1960, Somaliland gave up its sovereignty for Somalinimo and in 2012, Ceerigaabo with 4 different clans has been at peace for nearly 20 years despite minor clashes due to Somalinimo practiced by Somaliland. Borama is flourishing because of the Somalinimo practiced by Somaliland. Lascanood no longer has clan revenge killings because of the Somalinimo practiced by Somaliland. It is because of the Somalinimo that is practiced in Hargeisa that the refugees from Somalia live in peace without fear or favor. It is because of Somalinimo that the residents of Buroa have reached into their pockets to help those in Somalia during the recent drought. Excuse me if I and the citizens of Somaliland are tired with the blanket statements and value deeds more than empty words. Just by listening to you, it seems Somalinimo is an ideal, and something never really attained. I think this is the thinking that has handicaped Somalia from unleashing its shackles to serve the interest of the nation as opposed that of the clan.

 

In short, the video has shown that the emperor had no clothes and has exposed the modus operandi of the former regime. If it was no secret Xaliimo Soofe would not have lamented that she is being recorded and would have preferred it not to be recorded so she may have a chance to deny it ever happened.

 

Oodweyne, I believe you’re quite right about this:

 

In other words, when you stripped all of the fancy double-talk about "Somalinimo" and "Brotherhood" to their naked core, and you get down to the brass-tack of the nitty-gritty things, such as to how to build nation out of the disparate "self-contained-clan-community" of Somalia, what you will left with, it seems to me, is immovable object in the form of unwilling to compromise "clannish calculation" coming up, hard, against empty rhetoric of "Somali Brotherhood".

 

Our friend Baashi has side stepped how Somalia will overcome this, other than one line about learning from mistakes.

[Abtigiis]

Baashi;772641 wrote:

 

Abtigiis,

 

Disagreements are most welcome. We certainly don’t want to preach to the choir

 

I take it you take issue with negative tribalism. And rightly so.

 

I don’t know about you Abtigiis but I am well versed in the goings of Somalis political scene. The very institutions that Somali political framework rested upon have always been that of clan institution -- the traditional clan mold. And yes you heard me right I believe clan is and has always been the basis of our social system. Never has social contract of national scale been drafted without getting the clan consideration right.

 

Clan is not everything to everyone and certainly not to you - I take your word for it - but it is a humongous factor in our

xeer

. Let me emphasis this. I said

xeer

!

Xeer

in itself is informed by clan considerations. Do this quickly: try to take any institution of significance and extrapolate its line items to trabilism and see the upward trajectory the line traverses! You will find there are no sacred cows from

qoys

to highest echelons of governments that ruled Somalia in its heydays.

 

General Morgan and general Gabyow were the top military brass and ahd held highest positions of the government. True. They were negative tribalism practitioners long before that meeting. Most of us knew that tidbit. In that sense there is no new revelations in the clip.

Dear Baashi,

 

I agree with what you said here and maybe you knew what these Generals and other leaders were upto well before the collapse of the State. While I was not privy to this, my assumption was they would practice this type of clannism but would be sophesticated enough to sugar-coat it and at least not to so unashamedly utter what they practice. I know when Ina Omer Jess meets the O-people (I have never met him by the way) he would talk about danta-reerka. These kinds of things all somali politicians used to do (whether they believed in it (most did so) or whether they wanted to carry the support of the clan for their selfish ends or for both reasons).

 

But to openly address thousands and talk of we have to do this or that to so and so clan is truly shocking. The biggest political quack Somalia has ever known Aideed was also doing this. But it never makes it right just because all sides were saying so, and certainly there is no context to talk about in these kinds of things.

 

I have never lived or visisted Somalia when Siyaad was in charge, and therefore assumed the leadership wouldn't explicitly say such things. Anyway, even today, Yeey, Sheikh Sharif, Silaanyo very much are in the mould of old leadership with clannish mentality. But you don't hear them say such things very openly. Even when Yey said th infamous 'badaan ku daraynaa' he skipped the clan name (micnaha qabiilkiii u macnaystay in iyaga loo jeedo).

 

I am not a fan of neither the Kampala Accord nor the clueless Sharif. Xinn is. But right now, I am not sure if there is any deal better than that out there. Except Hiil-Qaran, of course. But then Xiin is saying he is not sufficiently oriented by a Tolka elder about what Hiil-Qaran is about. Once Abdirisaq Xaaji Xussen finalizes the induction about HQ to Xinn, maybe we will see things the same way.

[Baashi]

Ac of Spades,

 

I withhold judgment and assume by barns you meant fertile farming fields in that area which encompasses Bay and Bakool. Let’s suppose, for the sake of argument, that marauding armed militia or members of former military units determined to restore Inna Barre’s presidency looted the large warehouse in Baidoba! In your judgment, would that act alone be sufficient to cause the great famine the world had witnessed in 1992?

 

You may not be familiar with the number of warehouses a city of Baidoba’s size may have or how big the footprint of typical warehouse of the farming cities like Jammaame, Jilib, Qoryooleey, Biadoba may be. Typically it is only one and the footprint is 80 x 40 meters. Say there was two warehouses and each twice the size of the typical warehouse (an order of magnitude increase); still that wouldn’t prevent the calamity that visited Biadobo.

 

I am -- unknowingly perhaps – sweeping it under the rug. That’s not my intention. I just don’t see looting a shed causing an epic tragedy of the scale we witnessed in 1992. It is safe to say, and evidence attest to this, that the great famine of Baidobo was a culmination of many factors biggest factor being the sustained clan fighting in the area and the cascading effect it had to the farming communities.

 

You posed a million dollar question when you stated that in light of my definition of Somalinimo how does one get to the promise land and constitute an state that does not deny away with that which cannot be denied (centrality of clan in Somalia’s political process) and form institutions that all Somalis can have faith in its integrity. I don’t know. It is a puzzle worth pondering. Islamic governance, if adopted methodically (first teach the masses), implement gradually over time may check negative tribalism quite effectively in my opinion.

 

As to the former ruling class and their crimes, well that there is two ways to go about it. One would be one faction to have complete and total victory over all other contestants. The victors can do what victors do and take what’s left of that class into account. Another way, and more desirable one, would be to end the conflict first, convene all the stakeholders, weak and strong alike, and reach conclusive, just, and final settlement. Truth and reconciliation commission is one model we can make use of.

 

Now where I disagree with you is when you held up Somaliland experience as unique or better than experience of other regions during the recovery period. There are many Somalis across Somali peninsula that are both peace-loving and forward looking. They are minority in every region however.

 

I have yet to find one instance where Somaliland experience in maintaining stability its domain and rebuilding its shattered infrastructure is different from that of Puntland. Apart of bragging bravado, you would be hard pressed to seriously examine and find differences in the larges scheme of things. All the examples you’ve listed about Somalinimo and Muslinimo and attributed to Somaliland can be found in all other regions including Puntland.

 

That being said, the outcome of Taleex will test how deep is Somaliland’s Somalinimo.

 

Abtigiis,

 

Agreed. On Kampala, I can certainly understand why one of Xiin’s caliper would lean supporting it as all available resources and political capital available are thrown at it. I beg to differ though. Kampala Accord may be a victory for principal signatories but it is unjust in its core. There are major stakeholders that are not on board. Not to mention Islamists. Say what you must about them but make no mistake they do have a huge following. They made monumental mistakes in every step of the way but there is plurality of Somalis that wants to have Islamic governance. Today they are weak and if goings gets tough will melt away but they will form sleeping cells and strike back.

 

It’s containment policy. That’s what it amounts to. West will have maritime order under control at babl Mandab straight and neighboring countries will stick to their national security interests irrespective how their policies impact on Somalia’s future.

 

Dirrin or Gogol would have worked had foreign interest groups and other king makers funding warlords, arming factions hold their horses and let the traditional pastoral mediation take its course.

[Carafaat]

Baashi,

 

What happened in Baidoa and Kismayo during the 90's was not only some normal clans fighting among eachother for land and power in their ancestaral land or just due to failure of the State or Somalinimo State. It's much much worser then you describe here. Clans have collectively abused Somalinimo and the power and means of the State to loot, claim and colonize other people's land and proberty. Bringing a culture of looting, clannism and abuse based on clan dominance that was not known in those region nor local culture. Those regions had a peacefull culture of coexistense and opennes to outsiders and guests. Thats the whole reason many diffrent somali's from other regions were welcomed and settled there during the centuriesm.

[Gabbal]

Somalis can be so tedious sometimes with the safe-facing importance of feigned indignation.

 

What exactly is so revealing about this video? It is situated in the heat of the civil war when the USC and its supporters ethnically cleansed a section of Somalis on the basis of tribe from the capital and we have here those tribes plotting revenge from their safe zones. This is merely guubaabo which was needed by that community in that time frame. I see nothing new or revealing but rather something that only serves as a reflection and reminder of the nature of those days in the heat of the civil war.

 

Though many of us have moved beyond it, it is actually quite endearing to re-witness the strength of the campaign designed against the USC in that period. Nothing is more yawn-inspiring than reading the politically correct self-righteous attempts to give a verdict on that period from men carefully typing away on a computer screen 20 years later.

 

Forgive but never forget. A video like this only inflames the indignant passions of a serial tribalist or a man with a hollow subconscious.It is part of history and so are those moments. I am just as able to understand the USC perspective as I expect them not to feign ignorance about this perspective. That is real reconciliation not lackluster self-righteous attempts at misplaced judgement..

[Carafaat]

Gabbal,

 

One would hope and expect that folks would morally distanciete oneself from those tragic events and vieuws. If they are indeed a thing of the past. But the silence of many on the particular period and the recent debates and trends on the recapturing of Kismayo, does not indicate a closure of that history as you are suggesting here.

[Abu-Salman]

Baashi;773301 wrote:

Ac of Spades,

 

I withhold judgment and assume by barns you meant fertile farming fields in that area which encompasses Bay and Bakool. Let’s suppose, for the sake of argument, that marauding armed militia or members of former military units determined to restore Inna Barre’s presidency looted the large warehouse in Baidoba! In your judgment, would that act alone be sufficient to cause the great famine the world had witnessed in 1992?

 

You may not be familiar with the number of warehouses a city of Baidoba’s size may have or how big the footprint of typical warehouse of the farming cities like Jammaame, Jilib, Qoryooleey, Biadoba may be. Typically it is only one and the footprint is 80 x 40 meters. Say there was two warehouses and each twice the size of the typical warehouse (an order of magnitude increase); still that wouldn’t prevent the calamity that visited Biadobo.

 

I am -- unknowingly perhaps – sweeping it under the rug. That’s not my intention. I just don’t see looting a shed causing an epic tragedy of the scale we witnessed in 1992. It is safe to say, and evidence attest to this, that the great famine of Baidobo was a culmination of many factors biggest factor being the sustained clan fighting in the area and the cascading effect it had to the farming communities.

 

 

Well, I am more amused than shocked by the tape, not least by Gabyow oratory skills and humor;

Morgan, though, epitomises the power hungry psychopath manipulating clan alliances as he sees it fit to his ambitions (of course, regular nomads seem not so keen to be used as mere tools, dragging feets and putting away weapons, and rightly so one may add) .

 

However, and much more crucially, the "side issue" of Baidoa region famine is actually the worst tragedy overall in the Somali saga and those folks are by far those who suffered the most, almost on a genocidal scale.

 

Of course, this does not necessarily means the hundreds of thousands of victims was deliberately planned but I find very appealing that those who suffered on a much higher, such massive scale are seldom the loudest, while those events are overlooked by other clan "intellectuals".

 

My comments are not specifically directed to Baashi, but those of us familiar with how famines erupt are aware that it is almost never related to "natural" causes or so-called droughts (that are a permanent recurrence) but rather due to human factors, chiefly insecurity or deliberate policies (as Ethiopians starved en masse in the 80s even with food available on the markets).

 

In Somalia, Historians such as as Ioan M. Lewis mention that the great famine in the nineties was caused principally by the fighting between Aydeed USC and Barre militias as farmers were harassed and their grain stores looted (insecurity and looting means no harvest no matter how fertile the area is).

 

 

 

Entitlement approach to Famines Causation

[Gabbal]

Abu-Salman that is a historical misunderstanding on your part. The loss of crops was surely as a result of the fighting between SNF and USCand its allies (which included RRA), but that is not why famine occured. Aydeed's use of food reserves and international aid as a political tool is what percipitated the assive famine and the mandate thar brought in peacekeerpers as protectors of food shipments.

[Abu-Salman]

Indeed, the fighting between the SNF/Syad Barre loyalists and the USC militias was the cause of the insecurity and looting, though historical accounts and Morgan assertion on this tape may incriminate more Syad loyalists for the barns looting as their militias lived off the land, having no direct access to Mogadishu or wider resources unlike the USC.

 

Of course, when aid finally came, the blame shifted more on Aydeed side for hindering deliveries;

it was already way too late anyway and the situation was improving after having reached its apex.

 

As for the locals, It is widely accepted that they suffered for having little military inclination or weaponries, establishing the RRA later as a self-defence force in reaction to such events.