xiinfaniin Posted December 20, 2011 Som@li;766472 wrote: it is like a white supremacy kid, who fully supports the racism,lives, and eats and drinks white supremecy ideology, and then says i am not a racist, it was my forfathers who started it and I don't have a choice, as I was born to it. Carafat, You always have a choice. Don't support this racist clannish agenda! Spot on Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GoldCoast Posted December 20, 2011 How about autonomist? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Carafaat Posted December 20, 2011 Che -Guevara;766463 wrote: ^What does your age have to do with supporting secessionist provinces in Somalis? It's the politics that defines you! Time has everything to do with politics. Yesterday's siyadist fighting for the survival of the Somali goverment are today's rebels opposing a Somali goverment, yesterday nationalist are today's clannist, yesterday's proponents of a centralist goverment are today's federalist. So when you call someone today a seseccionist, what exactly are you accusing them that they are withdrawing from? The TFG that was created in 2004? the Somali union? a Somali State, which Union? Which State? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Carafaat Posted December 20, 2011 GoldCoast;766475 wrote: How about autonomist? That is somehow who wants to gain autonomy not really suited for someone who has full authonomy and is fully indepedant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Xaaji Xunjuf Posted December 20, 2011 Carafaat has a point the dissolvement of the union former (Somali republic)happened two decades ago in the year 1991 when the late General Siyad bare fled to Gedo his ancestral home land and even tried to launch a counter attack from there. It has all to do with the time frame Why should he be called a secessionist end 2011 its absolutely illogical. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
burahadeer Posted December 20, 2011 carafaat,how you expect logic when their tactics descend to talking bad about women,thread after thread...& then declaring victory! Futile attempt to be reasonable only encourages them come with a full swing & call victory as the norm. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Carafaat Posted December 20, 2011 Som@li;766472 wrote: it is like a white supremacy kid, who fully supports the racism,lives, and eats and drinks white supremecy ideology, and then says i am not a racist, it was my forfathers who started it and I don't have a choice, as I was born to it. Carafat, You always have a choice. Don't support this racist clannish agenda! Supremacism is the belief that a particular race , species, ethnic group, religion, gender , sexual orientation, belief system or culture is superior to others and entitles those who identify with it to dominate, control or rule those who do not. SEXUAL Many anthropologists consider male supremacism, also known as “male dominance” or “patriarchy”, to exist in all cultures throughout human history . Under it special rights or status is granted to men, i.e. "male privilege." Such supremacy is enforced through a variety of cultural, political and interpersonal strategies. Others note that this often has been balanced by various forms of female authority. Since the 19th century there have been a number of feminist movements opposed to male supremacism and working for equal legal rights and protections for women in all cultural, political and interpersonal relations. Where, race supremacist belief in something and are striving for it, they are the rare exception on the larger human scale. Thats why it makes sense to call them racist if they a rare small exception. Male dominance is on the other hand much wider excapted in the most cultures and feminist are the rare exception believing in ideals and wanting to change the (male dominated) socities completely. My point, Somaliland's independance is widely and naturally accepted within Somaliland and those opposing it are the rare expection striving or believing in something which is not a fact at the moment. Somaliland exists more then 20 years and most people in Somaliland accept its excistense, like most of us accept that a male has to work and female has the right to take care of her children. Except those few extreme feminist that belief that society is to much male dominated and it should completely change. So who accepts nature or de facto excisting practise and who is the exception that denounces it and beliefs something else? Who is the real secession(or exception) today that beliefs and wants to withdraw from a larger part? Who is the exception on the larger scale? Who's vieuw are tangible and who's vieuws are attainable? Who has the overhand? These are fundemental questions that have not resulted in a clear overall answer yet. Mostly these debaates result in who's clan support something and who oppose the, who's clan is bigger, which tuulo or region is controlled by who, etc, etc. My point. We all know the political reality on the ground and vieuws of most Somali's today and yesterday. Name calling or labelling eachother wont help nor contribute to reaching an overall (end)solution or a better future for the Somali people. Knowing someone's political vieuws and not sharing them, and still calling them Secessionist, Clannist, Siyadist, F****sh, Xabashi lover, dhaba******, etc will contribute 0 to the debate nor will it make your own political vieuws stronger, or raise support. It will only further polarize the debate(and the people) and make dialogue more difficult without actually contributing to a final lasting solution and I think that is the single most important issue for our people today. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thankful Posted December 21, 2011 Carafaat;766460 wrote: No, I am not so dont call me one. "Secessionism" like you call it took place 21 years ago, I was a child back then living in foreign land. If it took place today and I supported it, then you could call me one. It's interesting that you say that because if you remember the huge protests in Borama a few weeks ago, the vast majority of the crowds were undoubtedly children when the so-called "Conference of Northern Clans" took place. So the young adults in Borama- who have their whole lives ahead of them - made it clear that they do not want to be part of enclave run by one tribe. They were even waving their state flag! Is it fair to the youth in Borama that they have to abide by the decisions that were made by a bunch of elders 20 years ago? Also, you said that you support the self-determination of peoples - then logically you support the protesters in Borama right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Carafaat Posted December 21, 2011 Thankfull read my post above. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abdul Posted December 21, 2011 Since so called sl is part of Somalia,you are a secessionist for supporting those in the region who want to secede from the country. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Peace Action Posted December 21, 2011 Deep down Carafaat is not a true believer of secession. He is just waiting for new and better Somali state to come back. It is the konfurian's fault that have prolong this faithful day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Zack Posted December 21, 2011 How is the project of seceding a thing of the past when Somaliland is not an internationally recognized state? Good Carafat thinks that Somaliland has been a country for 20 some years when no single country in this entire world recognizes it even today. Love it or hate it, you, Mr.Carafat, are a secessionist To be fair to him, Carafat still has a Somaliweyn belief in him. This is according to his many posts. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Liibaan Posted December 21, 2011 People of Awdal, SSC, and Maakhir support United Somalia/Somaliweyn. Awdal, SSC and Maakhir Regions of Somalia are predominantly Unionists/ Somali nationalist strongholds. The supporters of SNM/Somalidiid-land are NOT only Secessionists, but they are Clan-Secessionists SNM/Somaliland is one-clan secessionist rebel faction, and it wants to create an Independent One-Clan State based on fake and unfair ancient colonial map. For the last 20 years snm/Somaliland clan-secessionists were seeking to secede from Nation of Somalia, Alhamdulilaah they failed, all the 200+ countries of the world and all international organization/bodies rejected to recognize One Clan-State in 21 Century. </font Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Qandalawi Posted December 21, 2011 Secessionism or Isgooniyeel is a sect like clan political cult and a belief that exists and thrives to this day; and not only a historic event that happened 20 years ago. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Liibaan Posted December 21, 2011 Awdal State of Somalia: 5 Principles of the Awdal State Revolution & Movement - By Aman H.D. awdalstate.com/ December 12, 2011 Dear Comrades, The Awdal State is emerging therefore we need to have guidelines to the Revolution at hand. As the Revolution approaches, and the freedom and liberty of the Awdal people become a reality, we need to know who our allies are and who our opponents are. The Revolution has no gray area, it is black and white. You are either with us, or you are against us. If you are an Awdalite and are against the Awdal State (and for the SNM State, aka Somaliland), let it be known that the People’s Army will hold you accountable. There are 5 principles of the Revolution, and every comrade of the Awdal State must believe in these 5 principles: (1). Belief in ONE Somali nation-state (i.e. belief in the Somali Republic); (2). Belief in the Awdal State as a semi-autonomous federal state (within the Somali Republic); (3). Belief in the criminality of the SNM. You must believe that they are war criminals and should be tried in a court of law for the many injustices they have inflicted on the Awdalites; (4). Belief in the Ugaas (may Allah preserve him); and (5). Belief that in the Somali Republic the overall Somali interest comes first and foremost (i.e. it supersedes any clannish interests), and belief that in the Awdal State the overall Awdal interest comes first and foremost (i.e. it supersedes any clannish interests). Let it be known that if you do not adhere to these 5 principles of the Revolution you are not a true revolutionary. Our Revolution is not only about defending the honor and integrity of the Awdalites from the SNM and the neo-SNM (i.e. the Somaliland National Army), but also to resurrect our Sacred Somali Republic. Somali nationalism is the foundation of the Awdal State and is the foundation to our Revolution. Victory is for the People’s Army! In Solidarity, Wadani Aman H.D. Obsiye Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
