Treating Christmas with Respect

[sigma]

Saying merry christmas is not an endorsement of the deity of Jesus.

That line of thought is demented

. And for a people who live in an ocean of christianity and wish to be aknowledged and respected for our holidays and celebrations, we're showing an immense amount of intolerance.

thats the only way...please lets stop trying to make even ...take the higher ground :cool:

[Pacifist]

Originally posted by Castro:

Saying merry christmas is not an endorsement of the deity of Jesus. That line of thought is demented. And for a people who live in an ocean of christianity and wish to be aknowledged and respected for our holidays and celebrations, we're showing an immense amount of intolerance.

Thanks atheer My thoughts exactly.

[sigma]

just have checked:confused:

to be clear ..

thanks castro

[Medley of extemporanea]

with regards to the 'the hoopla and consumerism surrounding Christmas ' here is an interesting article in the news about Christmas celebrations in Asia by non Christians.

 

Asia celebrates Christmas with a twist

 

By Nur Dianah Suhaimi

Sun Dec 18, 9:09 AM ET

 

SINGAPORE (Reuters) - Few Asians are Christian but people across the vast continent are embracing the holiday as a great excuse for shopping, partying and even romance.

 

Come December, Christmas lights brighten shopping streets in cities from Beijing to Colombo, while images of Santa Claus and Rudolph adorn office buildings, shops and restaurants.

 

Shopping malls in Indonesia, the country with the largest number of Muslims, play carols like "Silent Night" and "Jingle Bells" through speakers during the year-end holiday season.

 

"Most workers here are Muslim but we also celebrate Christmas just like we celebrate Eid al-Fitr. We are complementing each other with these costumes and ornaments," said Jakarta restaurant receptionist Lina Novianti, wearing a red Santa Claus hat. The Moslem celebration Eid al-Fitr marks the end of fasting during Ramadan.

 

Every year the Indonesian president and top officials attend national Christmas celebrations with church groups.

Read More here

[N.O.R.F]

What does wishing one a Merry Christmas mean for a Muslim?

 

It would be interesting to read a hadeeth/ayat regarding this matter. This will inform as to the level of respect one should give to other religious celebrations. The rest is irrelevant

[ElPunto]

Originally posted by Shams-ud-Din:

quote: I don't know about you but I've engaged in hoopla and consumerism at times, especially when I have cash in my pocket.

Exactly my point, Thepoint

 

Ones you divorce consumerism from “deitification of Jesus†then there’s no Christmas! Have I helped?

 

Salaams

No. Because you are wrong. Christmas, at least orginally, is about the celebration of the birth of Jesus etc. For many devoted Christians - that is primarily what it is about. However, for the majority - the celebration is infused by consumerism. Still, you can separate the two. That is my point. So, I still don't get your point?

[ElPunto]

Originally posted by sigma:

quote:Saying merry christmas is not an endorsement of the deity of Jesus.

That line of thought is demented

. And for a people who live in an ocean of christianity and wish to be aknowledged and respected for our holidays and celebrations, we're showing an immense amount of intolerance.

thats the only way...please lets stop trying to make even ...take the higher ground :cool:

Saying 'Merry Christmas' is not quite an endorsement of the diety of Jesus - what it definitely is a pat on the back or endorsement of those who do beleive in the diety of Jesus. It is a fine point.

 

For me, anyone who wished me Merry Christmas, I reply Happy Holidays - I avoid that tag simply because it is, at best questionable, in Islam - if it happens accidentally than that is what it is.

 

Castro, that is a very weak argument. By not wishing ppl Merry Christmas we are showing intolerance? Personally, it doesn't matter to me whether my observances are acknowledged/respected by the larger society because that has no bearing on my religion's basic truth but it definitely is nice and shows an educated and open society.

[Medley of extemporanea]

The news article about non Christian Asians celebrating Christmas show's that for many people (maybe the majority of people?) Christmas has little or no religion conotations and is seen simply as a "holiday". To them celebration of Christmas is no different from celebrating thanks giving or mothers day.

 

if Christmas is just another holiday with no religions significance, then how is saying “marry Christmas” different from saying “happy new years” or “happy thanksgiving”?

[Castro]

I don't believe in the divinity of Jesus. Saying merry christmas does not amount to believing that. Saying merry christmas is like saying "Hi", only it happens in December a lot.

 

Here's my favorite christmas song. See if this song advocates and endorses the divinity of Jesus. Enjoy:

 

Jingle bell, jingle bell, jingle bell rock

 

Jingle bells swing and jingle bells ring

 

Snowing and blowing up bushels of fun

 

Now the jingle hop has begun

 

Jingle bell, jingle bell, jingle bell rock

 

Jingle bells chime in jingle bell time

 

Dancing and prancing in Jingle Bell Square

 

In the frosty air.

 

What a bright time, it's the right time

 

To rock the night away

 

Jingle bell time is a swell time

 

To go gliding in a one-horse sleigh

 

Giddy-up jingle horse, pick up your feet

 

Jingle around the clock

 

Mix and a-mingle in the jingling feet

 

That's the jingle bell,

 

That's the jingle bell,

 

That's the jingle bell rock

[xiinfaniin]

^^^Do I see you confuse tolerance with embracing religious holidays?

[Castro]

^ How so, atheer?

[xiinfaniin]

^^^Although acknowledging and the tolerance are encouraged, endorsing their religious holidays, however, is not. Merry Christmas signifies this religious holiday.

 

If we celebrate and endorse other religious holidays for gaining acceptance for our own holidays and winning mutual respect in kind, as your rational of singing Merry Christmas seems to be, it would be hypocritical and phony stance to take.

 

That’s why I think you’re a bit confused about this issue, saaxiib.

[Medley of extemporanea]

Castro, Christmas Carolling is taking it a little too far! Don't you think there is something wrong with signing Christmas Carols like Silent Night, 'From Heaven Above to Earth I Come', and the well known 'Hark! The Herald Angels Sing'?

[Castro]

Originally posted by xiinfaniin:

If we celebrate and endorse other religious holidays for gaining acceptance for our own holidays and winning mutual respect in kind, as your rational of singing Merry Christmas seems to be, it would be hypocritical and phony stance to take.

I reject that argument saaxib. Quid pro quo is the name of the game here. No one is going to switch faiths because they say merry christmas or happy Hanuka. When I am celebrating Eid and my boss sends me an email wishing me a happy Eid, it's a nice gesture of good will. It's not an embrace of Islam. It's an embrace of a muslim who is a co-worker. It's incumbent upon heterogenous societies to be aware of its members celebrations'. Otherwise, we risk isolation and intolerance.

 

As for Jingle Bell Rock, it's a nice song that happens to be a christmas song whose lyrics are benign and tune is melodic.

[Arawella]

I can not understand the point of celebrating Christmas. For one the actual birth of Christ was not on 25 Dec. This festival was originally celebrated by the pagans.

 

In fact in certain boroughs in London, it is termly incorrect to use Christmas light since it may offend other religions.

 

I also beg to differ on your tolerance rule, we as muslims are not given any Eid holidays while in certain Muslim countries christmas holidays exist.