Consensus for All-inclusive Somali Conference inside Somalia

[Somalina]

General Duke;712250 wrote:

Xiin, You made valid points, if Puntland sent a team led by Abdulkadir Ali Hashi or

Dr Jimcaale

to Mogadishu and sat with the cabinet, things could easily be worked out.

You can't be serious. Jimcaale? no thank you, I will take Faroole over him.

Carry on.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Xiin labada axmed Amiirka big stake holder ah wax idin tari kara, Mujahid Siilanyo waxba idinku ma so kordhin karo tallo wu idin siin kara kaalin ,, Laakin Qaran dhan bu ka masuul yahay hada Ta jaarkisa inu mawqifkisa ka dhibto mooyane wax u ku so kordhin kara oo buurani ma jirto But Madaxweynaha Jamhuuriyada Somaliland waan gaadhsin doona casumada , Walaalkeen Ismacil Cumar geele na ma casumaysin Ileen Waa Soomali eh?

[xiinfaniin]

Libaax,

There is no good defense for keeping AMISOM in Mogadishu. AMISOM boys tried but failed to defeat alshabaab, it is time for them to go home. Any resultant government from all inclusive conference shall be based on somewhere else until a good, realistic strategy is devised to deal with alshabaab either militarily or politically. Whatever strategy is chosen to apply to alshabaab must be done by Somalis alone. The world gives pennies to Somalis yet dictates us in a way that retarded our ingenuity to resolve our problems. There is no precedent for what we are going through.

 

I await your further input.

[Mintid Farayar]

How can Somalis not be cynical? Both Abdullahi Yusuf and Sharif Ahmed willingly ran and carried water for this 'despised international community' when it was the means to their attaining the presidential chair but as soon as they're told to vacate the position they gain a life-changing revelation that maybe, just maybe, foreigners might not always have Somalis' best interest at heart.

 

Sharif Ahmed greatest political enemy currently within the TFI's is Sharif Hassan (speaker of the TFP). Now any follower of Somali politics knows that Sharif Hassan currently represents Ethiopian interests (which Abdullahi Yusuf alluded to in his VOA interview, although refusing to name the exact country). However, just yesterday the TFG President, Sharif Ahmed, was in Addis (hat in hand) to plead to Meles for support in keeping his chair. Isn't it a bit counter-productive to seek help from those who put you in this constitutional argument in the first place (the Ethiopians)?

 

People: Stop putting your salvation in the hands of those who cannot even save themselves!

 

P.S. Abdullahi Yusuf's timing in undermining both Faroole and Sharif Hassan as 'danaystiyaal' seeking personal gain at the cost of everything else is indeed interesting.

[Gabbal]

Xiin, you seemed to have great faith in the Nairobi conference prior to the latter developments starting with the TFG executive branch's vocal opposition. It was just weeks prior when you put forward the Nairobi conference force disintegration of the TFG in Mogadishu, giving the south to Al Shabaab, and restarting in Garowe? What is at the crux of your change of heart?

 

Forgive me for assuming but it seems many of the Puntlanders just want to be at the center of any Somali conference, and therefore of any future Somali construct, and such a situation is impossible considering we are in civil war and majority of the Somali entities and clans each view each others' influence with suspicion. This has been showcased by Puntland's unbridled ambition to be relevant in the future Somali construct starting with the Yusuf appointment, the attempt to take advantage of Shermaake's position as PM, and the current shameless attempt to compete with central Somali government in international fora following the internal assumption Puntland has lost influence in the TFG center. It also explains both the vigorous push back received as well as the form of "redemption" Abdullahi Yusuf is seeking by castigating Faroole as following a wrong path; that tried and failed path followed by Yusuf prior.

 

If Mogadishu holds 500 MPs and the TFG, is the capital of the country, and is considered the appropriate venue where all stake holders will feel on an equal setting in as far as the agreed upon consensus of base of Somali national political leadership is concerned then I believe Faroole and those trying to compete, often at a folly, for national influence are the ones who need to compromise. You can't have attacked clans and personalities, attempted to arm wrestle your way even at the expense of the TFG institutions which you are a part of, trying to threaten and blackmail the TFG into capitulating to your desires and then expect to be taken as offering goodwill and honored with a privilege of being at the center of the future Somali construct, particularly when you have Abdullahi Yusuf being at the forefront of those criticizing such a naked, and might I say, alienating ambition.

 

Puntland has a better chance than most of being given such an honor, but in my estimation, being bestowed that accolade has the odds stacked against it as long as Faroole is at the helm of leadership in that area.

 

I would also ask you to try to stay on the realistic side of the Somali politikking and cease attempting to bring Somaliland into the picture in order to legitimize your (what seems like) anti-Mogadishu basis of rationalization. Somaliland is for Somalia to sit down with. There is no chance it will risk its self-announced independent position by being seen as another Somali faction part of the Somali southern conundrum. I am sure you already know that though.

[Bashiir]

Shir xalaal ah( bottom up approach) oo ay Somali ku dhantahay( macal jabhadaheeda sida caanoole, SSC, Galgala front, iyo budh cad badeedka) wuxuu Idam Alle ka dhici doonaa caasimada maamul gobaleedka Azania bacda Alshabaab la qab jabiyo ama ayba guulaystaan. Intaas ka hor inta af faranjiga ku muranta ,,, ee jikooyinka UNta isku qabsata ha sii wataan hawshooda ....

[Gabbal]

xiinfaniin;712253 wrote:

Somalis will have fond memory for the years to come of whoever breaks first the political culture of empowering foreign entities to facilitate Somali talks. I would be happy for whoever takes the initiative first, Faroole or Sharif/Farmaajo team.

Correct me if I am wrong, but judging by the current Somali majority consensus, the Farmaajo government has already shot the first shots in changing the discourse. I do not understand your judgment with respect to "whoever breaks" the mold, at least without taking into consideration the limitations of normative Somali bias (socio-political tribal based).

 

It is well understand that if this moment is really the beginning of Somali internal attempt to solve Somali problems, then those who had participated in the Nairobi conference including Faroole, Sharif Xassan, etc will be recorded as those having supported the "anti-Somali agenda"; the "others" (foreign lackeys) vs. the "us" (Somali nationalists).

[Peace Action]

It is the most appropriate time to consider all Somali peace conference, unfortunately, Sharif is not up to the task anf frankly I have no idea what he stands for. Since he become President there was great hope that he will be able to bring Somalis together. His record speaks for itself; he was unable to bring AS on board and they become even stronger. He was unable to work with Puntland for the larger cause of peace and progress instead quarelling with it minor issues such as oil exploation, the fight against piracy etc and he even alienated his natural allies Alsunna wal Jama. Don't be fooled by the false outcry against the Nairobi conference, Sharif has become an obstacle to peace and progress in Somali, the sooner he goes, the better. Let us forget about the upcoming elections and who becomes President and instead concentrate on grass roots peace and reconcilation conference inside Somalia.

[The Zack]

Let's just accept the fact that Somalis are not yet ready for rebuilding their nation. It is obvious that we are still clan/state minded. Somali can't trust eachother. I am not sure what another mere meeting is going to do specially when the real stake holders, shabaab, won't show up.

[Som@li]

The Zack;712299 wrote:

Let's just accept the fact that Somalis are not yet ready for rebuilding their nation. It is obvious that we are still clan/state minded. Somali can't trust eachother. I am not sure what another mere meeting is going to do specially when the real stake holders, shabaab, won't show up.

I agree, Believe me this conference, like the dozens before will be a waste of time, Somalis are not ready yet to take the first step, and can't get rid of thier biggest obstacle, clan-ism.

 

Markaa, Ha is xiijinina, Somalis,with all the suffering and hardship over 25 years, still can't see beyond clan, and will stay in this situation for some time.

 

 

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink

[Che -Guevara]

Unless it's Evian water:D

[Liqaye]

Gabbal;712283 wrote:

Xiin, you seemed to have great faith in the Nairobi conference prior to the latter developments starting with the TFG executive branch's vocal opposition. It was just weeks prior when you put forward the Nairobi conference

force

disintegration of the TFG in Mogadishu, giving the south to Al Shabaab, and restarting in Garowe? What is at the crux of your change of heart?

 

Forgive me for assuming but it seems many of the Puntlanders just want to be at the center of any Somali conference, and therefore of any future Somali construct, and such a situation is impossible considering we

are

in civil war and majority of the Somali entities and clans each view each others' influence with suspicion. This has been showcased by Puntland's unbridled ambition to be relevant in the future Somali construct starting with the Yusuf appointment, the attempt to take advantage of Shermaake's position as PM, and the current shameless attempt to compete with central Somali government in international fora following the internal assumption Puntland has lost influence in the TFG center. It also explains both the vigorous push back received as well as the form of "redemption" Abdullahi Yusuf is seeking by castigating Faroole as following a wrong path; that tried and failed path followed by Yusuf prior.

 

If Mogadishu holds 500 MPs and the TFG, is the capital of the country, and is considered the appropriate venue where all stake holders will feel on an equal setting in as far as the agreed upon consensus of base of Somali national political leadership is concerned then I believe Faroole and those trying to compete, often at a folly, for national influence are the ones who need to compromise. You can't have attacked clans and personalities, attempted to arm wrestle your way even at the expense of the TFG institutions which you are a part of, trying to threaten and blackmail the TFG into capitulating to your desires and then expect to be taken as offering goodwill and honored with a privilege of being at the center of the future Somali construct, particularly when you have Abdullahi Yusuf being at the forefront of those criticizing such a naked, and might I say, alienating ambition.

 

Puntland has a better chance than most of being given such an honor, but in my estimation, being bestowed that accolade has the odds stacked against it as long as Faroole is at the helm of leadership in that area.

 

I would also ask you to try to stay on the realistic side of the Somali politikking and cease attempting to bring Somaliland into the picture in order to legitimize your (what seems like) anti-Mogadishu basis of rationalization. Somaliland is for Somalia to sit down with. There is no chance it will risk its self-announced independent position by being seen as another Somali faction part of the Somali southern conundrum. I am sure you already know that though.

Excellent Gabbal excellent observations, you have quoted the obvious to this peanut gallery of voices.

 

Reading alot of what xiin has written in the past few weeks I wonder maxaa ninkan waadha especially since, it is obvious that the broad spectrum of what people consider reality is not what is being referred to by the punt land brigades.

 

Horta as you have observed the consistent running thread between all of the puntlanders contribution is the fallacy that the center of gravity in this particular conflict revolves around them, Duke says change the capital to Garowe Xiin says the same thing, with alot of psuedo analysis and coloured prespective, it is an obvious gambit and might have been granted something less than a derisive snort if it was not for the fact that it would change nothing on the ground.

 

But ladies and gents let us start from the beginning....

 

The Nairobi confrence was a failure marked only by tension and open spates of violence between ASWJ delagates, gal-mudug and puntland have already reached agreements on the ground that the nairobi confrence has done nothing to improve of disparage.

The resolutions reached are non-binding as shown by the fact that according to approximatly 180 M.p's Sharif sakin had no right to negotiate their extension down to 2 years and they will ignore that input.

Faroole's submission to the Nairobi conference was pointless and pathetic, apart from railing at the large number of m.p's and the 4.5 clan system [which it is already patently obvious is considered ******, unworkable and divisive by all Somalis regardless of location or affiliation] his submission shed no light on any workable solution or way froward, in this poorly attended and poorly planned and pointless summit.

 

The very same summit that is now being trumpeted by some as having had any effect apart from the per diems collected by the delegates.

This same conference that was so pointless and despised by the majority of somalis that even the grand poobah of all things puntlandish Abdullahi yusuf dismissed it as a conference setup for daneysteeyal et.al

 

What we are being forced to swallow either in terms of pure un adulterated clannishness peddelled by dukey boy or alice in wonderland logic by xiinfaniin is that puntland is an un intreasted entity that in terms of somalinimo wants to reach a peacefull conclusion to the current impasse, when the truth is that there power hungry moves have been so patently obvious, so bungling, and so squeamishly reckless no one in the somali political calculus gives them an iota of importance beyond that of another intreasted party, be they somaliland, galmudug, xx, the TFG, the shabaab e.t.c

 

And for this, and no amount of long winded articles on somali forums and nacam nacam from cousins and other agnates will change what the single largest mistep was...namely the desicion to withdraw at the lowest ebb and fortune of the beseiged TFG, the recognition of the puntland goverment to the TFG, weliba in such a way as to blur the lines of what exactly puntland is a secessionist government [by banning government officials to travel to puntland under the threat of arrest]or a regional goverment that is in dis agreement with the center, which would have never acted with such contempt and brazenness.

 

This was done in the hand rubbing glee that the TFG could not possibly survive a minute after ku daayo puntlands departure...

 

But lo and behold Allah [s.W.T] has also got his plans the TFG did not crumble and indeed after dismissing and throwing the considerable bulk of cabdibuur overboard , the TFG has made considerable gains both on the ground, in terms of governance and in the hearts and minds of the majority of the Somali people in SC Somalia, whilst maintaining a good relationship with the regional admins on the ground that actually deal with the TFG in the spirit of state to central government transaction!

 

All with out hubshee Faroole's input or an iota of financial or moral support from puntland!

 

Now just days after the conference that failed horribly with out a whimper, the clear cut position of President. Sheikh Sharif and the administration of Prime minister Farmajoo for a reconciliation confrence to be held by the TFG in the capital of the Republic of Somalia Mogadishu, towards the goal of a clear election process for a new administration as well as a coming together in the intreasts of all somalis of those that currently are outside the tent and those that are contributing be it ASWJ, the dollow group, Azania et.al in reaching a national consensus! is set forth clearly and brightly and is there for puntland to accept or reject.

 

Lakiin the impasse has been broken already, and broken by the TFG and no one else, those that where hoping to hoists themselves into power on the back of another foreign intervention courtesy of the bitter moaning of Faroole, will have to do it in Somalia's capital Mogadishu under the aegis of the TFI mechnaism's they so despise .

In that election they will contend with The Present president, The current prime minister [men who have got any sort of track record] the ASWJ candidates, Shariif Sakiin [with his bloc of M.P's] Prof. Ghaandi who I assure will run, assorted xildibhans and the myriad candidates both within and outside Somalia with the money to further murky the waters!!!

 

So alhamdullilah, the TFG goes on, the confrence is slated for July and I.A the elections for August.

 

The rest is cantrabaqash and calacal and alice in wonderland politics.

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

The Zack;712299 wrote:

Let's just accept the fact that Somalis are not yet ready for rebuilding their nation. It is obvious that we are still clan/state minded. Somali can't trust eachother. I am not sure what another mere meeting is going to do specially when the real stake holders, shabaab, won't show up.

ishaaad ka tuurtay

[Liqaye]

Wa ruunta lakiin it is a dream to expect al-shabaab to turn up, they have repeated severally that they will never negotiate even if the immediate pull out of AMISOM is on the table.

 

Unless of course Mukhtar Roobow makes a run for it to the summit table and heeds the increasingly desperate cries of the elders from Bay!!

[Xaaji Xunjuf]

Alshabaab made it clear and said if Amisom Leaves we are willing to talk to the rest of the Somali people.There should be a change of policy from the organisers of the reconciliation conference and they should do everthing to get them to the reconciliation table . I mean think about it Alshabaab is about 5000 Men strong Puntland also has an army And Galmudug and the TFG Somali Soldiers add it all together and you have a new National Army.