Niqaab

[LayZie G.]

^my dear, unlike you, this lecturer is not under the illusion that all women choose to conceal their identity or that they conceal their identity without coercion. She is very careful to limit her views on the few women she came across and she goes on to say that individuals who conceal their identity are in the minority in Australia, which tells a different story altogether.

 

That said, I want to go back to your earlier post and provide commentary to the following quotes:

 

Aaliyah states:

 

you are arguing that women in the middle east have no voice and should be given a voice (which I fully agree islam is a religion of choice no women should be forced. She has to want to follow islam willingly)...

 

What I stated above is not limited to the portion of the quotes you used to take my words out of context. That said, if you wish to know my position on the Burqa as a subject, please just ask, don't assume anything.

 

Moreover, if we need to take this discussion in a positive direction and to come to clear conclusions about this controversy, we must first identify what is it we are discussing here. What is the discussion all about? Is is about the ban of the Burqa in France? the fundamental freedoms and rights of women and/or society? Role of Muslim women in Islamic republics? Is the discussion geared towards the role of the Burqa, and is the question focused more on the contention that the burqa is a religious symbol or a cultural symbol?

 

We need to be able to define our subject and outline the course of action. Furthermore, if you want to know my position on the Burqa, it is as follows:

I argued and continue to argue that BURQA and/or NIQAB is not prescribed by Islam. So, as you can see, my position on this subject is clearly defined, what about you? Do you have a position or are you undecided? Are you just as unsure about the subject as you are about concealing your identity? If yes, please state your reasons.

 

 

Teeda kale,

You stated the following:

This is a clear contradiction walaal. Do you think your arguments make sense???

Please explain yourself as I need to know where you feel I'm being contradictory.

 

Marka kale, in response to my earlier post about engaging issues and not people, you stated the following:

 

lol I simply stated facts. She is like Ayan Hersi. Muslim women who convey western values so they can get some fame.

I don't know what I find more troubling, you not being able to distinguish a fact from an opinion or you painting all Muslims with the same brush when they speak about unpopular issues which are not desired by the Arab lords, especially if these Muslims are women like Mona. I really I'm troubled by your earlier statement. I dont know if you are saying this for the sake of appeasement or if you truly believe that all Muslims should speak with one voice and no Muslim, especially Mona should be able to come on television and condemn the Burqa because the garb is a desirable feature and a religious symbol. Its consistant with the ideals of a good Muslimah and failure to prescribe to such ideology results in you, a muslim being condemned by a fellow Muslim, especially a woman in the case of Aaliyah who equated Mona with Ayan Hirsi, a self-professed non-believer with a believer in Mona.

 

Mona, as far as I know did not come out to condemn Islam nor did she claim to be a non-believer, so for you to draw your own conclusions about her and what she is about, simply because she happens to have a platform and she happens to express views which are different from yours, she must be ought to get the Muslims, she must be out for her 15 minutes of fame, she must be like Ayan Hirsi, without any facts is simply disturbing to me@Aaliyah.

 

As far as I know, what I read about Mona does not give me the impression that she is anything but what she presents herself to be, a Muslim woman.

 

If opponents of the hideous garb were to say to you, Aaliyah, that all women who come out against the banning of the garb are agents of Islamists, what would you say? How would you react?

 

Your folks should be coming out speaking out against the ban, argue the merits of the law, do not form an opinion of people and claim it as a fact. YOu do not know anymore about Mona than she knows about herself. If she said she was working for neo-cons as Tariq Ramadan recently accused her, she would have come out and said so herself, instead, Mr Ramadan proved to be incompetent on BBC by being incoherent because she ruffled his feathers and he didnt have anything to say, except that she was working with neo-cons. He turned a debate over the outlawing of Burqa to a debate about Mona and who she works for. So does that mean, as a woman, you agree with Ramadan, you believe that all Muslim women, who have a public platform are working for neo-cons just because you disagree with them?

 

IF thats the case, does that mean, you share Mr Ramadan's view that all Muslims should speak with one voice?

 

Just think about what you said on your earlier post and think about what I just wrote above, just think for a moment, take a moment to regroup and revaluate your earlier statement and let me know your findings.

 

Mona is not critical of Islam, she is critical of individuals and practices, not the religion. On the other hand, Ayan Hirsi is critical of Islam. So you can see why I was troubled by your so called "fact" when in fact you wanted to say, my view is that the two appear to be converging on some issues, while they may differ on their approaches, something to that like@aaliyah.

 

I'm sorry that I find your words troubling, thats because I had high hopes for you. I thought that you knew when and how to distinguish fact from an opinion. Now I'm very doubtful you know the difference between a fact and an opinion. I thought you knew facts were indisputable and opinions were statements not usually based on fact or knowledge and I thought you were capable of demonstrating the difference between the two but you proved me wrong.

 

Mida kale, you stated the following:

 

And, I was not getting personal but rather u were with Heba (I wont call her by her name lol..or oh the masked one.. )..

I did not get personal with her, I did not offend her, I just called her what she was, a masked woman. If you dont believe that, ask yourself, what was she wearing? Was her identity not concealed from the viewers? Was her face not masked? What do you have me call her? I cant call her by her full name because she forfeited the right for people to call her by her full name when she parted ways with her identity and self-respect by opting to conceal her identity from the rest of the world. So, I called her what I thought was fitting for people like her, the one whose name I will never mention, your beloved masked one because you afforded her false praises and for that, she will forever be known to me as the masked one. I did not disrespect her, belittle her, I just called her for what she truly represented, a woman without an identity.

 

Yours truly, and forever

 

LayZie G.

[The Zack]

Ayan Hirsi is a SOLer, it has been verified, ladies and gentlemen!

[Somalina]

Layzie rocks!

[Aaliyyah]

Layzie I have already pointed out how you contradicted yourself. I wont repeat myself!. if you dnt see ur contradiction. So be it.

 

Also, as far as I am concerned I did not mention anywhere that all muslim women chose to wear the niqaab. So, I have no idea where you got that from.

 

lastly, I did not take anything you wrote out of context..this is exactly what you wrote,

 

poted by layzie : we live in civilized world not the Jahiliyyah era and niqab or Burqa or what have you has no place in this civilized world.

Just remember this mentality of yours will not take you too far! and as far as Islam goes niqaab is recommended and those who choose to wear it should wear it regardless of where they are arab world or western countries such as France..

 

salaam

[Axmed-InaJaad]

i agree with ayaan hirsi, the burqa is too much. i want to see a woman's nice body. just hijaab and tight jeans should be standard for the ladies.

[LayZie G.]

Aaliyah states:

Layzie I have already pointed out how you contradicted yourself. I wont repeat myself!. if you dnt see ur contradiction. So be it.

Aaliyah, wallaalo, its not that you won't repeat yourself, its that you can't explain yourself.

 

Wallaalo, I have to be honest with you, I'm seeing a pattern here. First you pulled what is now famously called "a John Kyle moment", were you stated an opinion as factual but instead of retracting like John Kyle, the senior Senator from Arizona claiming something similar to "how his statements are not intended to be factual", you stubbornly remained silent, not to mention that you have called my statements contradictory without an explanation, what giveS?

 

The other interesting thing you said while you were putting your fences up was the Niqab was a recommended garb, does that mean it deserves equal protection in the eyes of the law?

 

You are not saying that Islam prescribes the niqab but you are saying its recommended, so why should the law recognize an item thats only optional?

 

Why should the law exempt the niqab but not all over masks that conceal the face in public places? If your position is that its recommended, why do people who support the right of woman to wear her niqab invoke the religious clause when arguing in favour of the niqab?

 

Last year, there was a case were a Muslimah was compelled to testify on behalf of the prosecution and she invoked a religious clause, insisting that she must wear her niqab in an Ontario court, under oath, and I ask you, who is protecting the rights of the defendant? Doesn't he/she not have a right to face his/her accuser? Why invoke special privileges, especially religious privileges when you and others insist that it isn't a religious obligation and merely a recommended product.

 

It is recommended that you wear Sun screen lotion to protect against skin related cancers and sun burn but does that mean sun-screen producers should invoke special privileges to compel you to buy their products?No, its just a recommended product.

 

If one side of the room claims that the motive of the supporters of the ban are simply baseless and not pure, the other side's counter argument similar in tone, which suggests that motives are questioned when people deal with emotionally charged subjects, namely the burqa, no wonder you are putting fences up this early in the discussion. Something tells me that you are ill-equipped to take part of the discussions, so until next time, I bid you goodbye.

 

 

lol@Prometheus, I don't know how I could have missed your first post, you are a joker.

 

LOL@

I think a religious costume like the Niqaab is risible and ridiculous—but I would not, aesthetic considerations notwithstanding, ban it. There are interesting parallels (and distinctions) between this issue and the issue of polygamy.

YOu really do take the mick out of the garb but in all seriousness, I think you raise some valid points, costume or not.

 

For one, ,while the battle to ban has just began, the fight is far from over. Sure, there are challenges, especially where it concerns personal liberties and infringement of rights and freedoms, consciousness and such but each country's constitution, especially our beloved charters and freedoms does say, what you emphasized earlier, which is that freedom is not absolute. In article one, it states that rights and freedoms are subject to reasonable limits as prescribed by law and invoking article one from the charter is a first step but there is and could be other challenges in other areas of guarantees within the charter and freedom that supporters as well as opponents of the ban can invoke and its quite possible that the Supreme Court of Canada can rule in either and/ or, depending on the argument put forth but never say never. I think constitutional scholars would be better equip to put forth an argument but then again, I'm a firm believer that the state can be a force of good when acting in the interest of the public. For example, under Jean Chretien's administration, bill C-20, which passed the parliament of Canada, which became law at the turn of the century was a legislative success. The purpose of this bill, most widely known as the Clarity Act strengthens the federal government's negotiating power in the event of a successful referendum by the province of Quebec, this was a direct response to the previously failed referendum in the 90s, which the supreme court of Canada ruled in an unambiguous terms, basically stating that while Quebec was not in violation of the constitution if majority voted in favour of secession(and while majority was not defined in its ruling), Quebecois could not unilaterally secede from the union without negotiating the terms of secession with the federal government and this bill puts the federal government in a better negotiating position and failure for Quebec to violate the tenets of the clarity Act would result voiding the results of the referendum as it will be in violation of the Act, even if majority of Quebecois were to succeed in favour of secession, as they say, third time is a charm.

 

Ya Prometheus, what my above example shows is that where there is will, there is a way.

 

Yours truly, and forever,

 

LayZie G.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PS: I miss Ibti, atleast she was an effective communicator.

[Blessed]

Johnny B;713201 wrote:

The choice as it were is yours Aliyah, and that the choice is only avaialable here in the filthy west goes without saying.

 

You’re forever full of tosh, my dear. It's a choice everywhere except for Framce (with a few more European countries to follow). Even in the Jeddah (and off course the holy sanctuary) of Saudi you've a choice on niqaab.

 

Prom.

What do you think of the de facto partnership laws in Australia? The aim of these laws is protect the rights of de facto partners, giving same rights as married couples. What’s interesting is that these rights remain even if one is married to another and is also engaged in a de facto relationship. It’s pretty interesting as far as multiple partner and cultural progression arguments go.

[Complete]

I personally do not wear a niqaab but I support and praise the very few sisters who do. Though I do have a family member who decided to wear the niqaab at a very young age and Alhamdulillah continues to rock it till today. Rock on!

 

Oh, and I'd like to share this video:

 

 

[Al-Miskiin]

Layzie waxaas oo qoraal ah, iyo geedo jeex, ma waxaa kaa keenay Gabadh niqaab xidhan?

 

Waxaad soo qortay:

 

I argued and continue to argue that BURQA and/or NIQAB is not prescribed by Islam.

Daliil ma u haysaa hadalkaas? please do share

 

Waxaad soo qortay boqol kun oo qalad baa ku jira, meel laga bilaabo maba laha walee. Waxaad soo qoraysid, waa iska boos buuxsi, iyo dood bilaasha. Video-ga waxaad moodaa inaadanba fahmin. Tusaale yar: waxaad la yaabtay, oo meel gayn kari wayday waxay walaashu u tidhi" I HAVE A MASTER's degree in chemical engineering"!

Qof alle qofkii daawadda doodan with an open mind, lana socda dooda caamka ah ee ka jirta maanta aduunka, wuu ogyahay in waxyaabaha ugu wayn ee gabdhaha muslimiinta ah lagu maago, laguna dacaayadeeyo, siiba kuwooda niqaabka ama xijaabka xidhan ay tahay inaynan waxba baran, waxbarashana lahayn, guryaha iska fadhiyaan. Markaa gabadhu doodaas bay ka hadlaysaa, inaynan xataa isticmaali karin the usual stereotyping "xuquuq malaha, waxba ma barato, therefor she is covering herself"!

 

Walaashu ayadoo waxbarashadeedii qaadatay, sida qofkastoo ku nool france, bay dooratay inay niqaabna xidhato, diinteedaana u ogal, waliba muslimiinta dhexdooda dad baa aaminsan inuu waajib yahay. Markaa sida muslimiintu salaada u tukadaan, oo ay ayagu u doorteen inay tukadaan, oo wajigooda dhulka dhigaan, walaashani haday dooratay inay niqaab xidhato, adigu xagee ku xanuuni oo lagaa daaweeyaa marka? Yaana ku khasbay? ayadaaba afkeeda ka leh "anaa doortay"?, mise qalbigeeda baad u daadagtay?

 

France iyo yurub oo dhan waxaa ka jirta waxa la dhaho "xuquuqda diimaha", taas oo laga wado, qofkastaa diintiisa buu siduu doono ugu dhaqmi karaa, ilaa aynan qofna waxba u dhimayn, yacni dadka kula nool. Shay maro ah, oo la xidhana sida la ogyahay qofna dhibaato kuma hayo. Hadaad leedahay "mayee shaqo iyo wax kalay waayi", taasi waa arimo u yaala walaasha xidhata niqaabka, ayadaana qiimayn siday u xalin hawshaas..

 

Waxaad kaloo leedahay

 

we live in civilized world not the Jahiliyyah era and niqab or Burqa or what have you has no place in this civilized world.

Hadalkaas oo kale waa iska andacoon, wax lagu dhisi karana ma jiro waxaad soo qortay. Ma adaa "the civilized world" qiimeeya? Maxaa isku xidhay "jaahiliyah"(Days of Ignorance), iyo niqaabka? Tusaale: Xijaab la'aanta Muna bay dadka qaar odhan lahaayeen waa "jaahilnimo" ayagoo, intaas oo warqad ka qori kara jaahilnimadeeda. Laakiin ayadoo saas ah, waxba dooda kuma soo kordhinayso, waayo waa sidaan soo sheegayoo, qofba waxbuu jaahilnimo u yaqaanaa.

 

Waxaad kaloo aad uga xumaatay, inay walaashu aaminsanayn ama aynan "arkin"(waayo waa siday video-ga ku tidhi" qof lagu khasbay niqaabka. Hadalkaas adiga waa laga yaaabaa inuu kaa yaabiyo, waayo fikirkaada baa sidaas u dhisan. Laakiin muslimiinta maanta aduunka ku nool, intooda badani hadalkaas laftirkiisa bay ku odhan lahaayeen. Waxaan hubaa hadeer walaalada SOL ku jira, hadii la waydiiyo, qof ma taqaan niqaabka lagu khasbay, oo cabsi u xidhay inaadan helin qof ku dhaha "haa"! Waana xaqiiqadda jirta, laakiin adigu haday marba "Muna" dhahdo, "way jiraan", dee markaa xujo cad oo cirka ka soo dagtay inaad ka dhigtid waa nasiib darro. While walaasha Heba ay ka hadlayso facts, muslimiin badani ku raacsantahay.

Maalintay aragto gabdho lagu khasbayo niqaab, kama shakisani inay caawin doonto, ama waxay ka gaysan karto ka gaysato.

 

Hadalkayga bal hal maroo kale dhuux: Anigu ma lihi in aynan jirin aduunkoo dhan HAL GABADH oo lagu khasb niqaabka, kolay waxkasta aduunka waa laga helaa. Laakiin waxaan ku leeyahay boqolkiiba 90, ama ka badan(just being generouse, for sake of the debate), gabdhaha doorta Niqaabka inay xidhaan ayagaa iskooda u doorta, qof ku khasbaana ma jiro.

 

and actuallly by claiming this, waxay ku tusaysaa fikirka qaladka ah aad ka aaminsantahay gabdhaha muslimiinta, waana bahdilid meeshii ugu dambaysay. Hadaad adigu freedom haysatid, ood isku malaynaysid inaad waxkasta la socotid, ayagan maxaa u diiday inay sidaadoo kale freedom, iyo caqliba leeyihiin ayagoo niqaabkooda qaba?

 

And it's exactly that kinda of mindset, that says"Muslim women can not think for themselves, they are oppressed, they do not know what's good for them" that makes governments come up with such ban.

 

Markaa waxaan ku soo khatimi, doodaada bal soo gaabi.

-Maxaad ugu diidantahay gabadhan xuquuqdeeda ah inay diinteeda ku dhaqanto sida dadka kalee wadanka ku nool?

- Maxaadna ugu diidi haday niqaabka iskeed u dooratay?

- Muna is as far as I know a Muslim woman, therefor she should be covering her hair(according to the religion she claims to follow), but she chooses not to do so, if france is allowing her this, Why shouldn't Hebe have the same freedom to choose how she dresses?

[Aaliyyah]

^Almiskiin don't bother wasting your time!..just let it go!..

 

Vans. Thanks sis for sharing this video.Likewise, I know few sisters who been wearing the niqaab for a long time and who are amazing sisters. Mashallah..

 

salaam

[LayZie G.]

^^^runaway princess, adiga war makuu yaalo, waayo, you failed to answer my questions, so let him, the one above you come to your aid, atleast he is trying, I dont see any harm in that, do you?

 

Al-Maskiin-Sakiin, you asked if aan daliil hadalka aan dhahay u haayo? As in, do I have explanation as to why I said the Niqab is not prescribed by Islam, is that what you mean by daliil?

 

The answer is simple enough, our holy scripture, the Qu'ran does not command women to wear the niqab. In other words, the hideous garb is not divinely ordained piece of clothing, which means it has no place in our religion and that means you can not invoke religious privileges without solid evidence to support your counter claim. (you might want to dig up Ibti's thread about this very same subject to aid you in your witch hunts)

 

Now, if you are in disagreement with the above statement, you, the party opposed to this position needs to produce evidence contrary to the statement, you need to prove me wrong. In other words, the onus is on you, my dear Maskiin-Sakiin.

 

Mida kale, if the discussion is moving in the direction of the garb and its place in Islam, lets discuss the reasons why women who wear the garb wear what they wear.

 

If you go around asking women, why do you conceal your face, what is the top response you get?

 

I'm doing it out of piety, I want to be closer to Allah because I want to go to Jannah. I want to be a good Muslimah, those are just some of the responses, which means, the answers boil down to what Muslim women think they are doing in order to have an edge over other Muslims.

 

Similarly, our young Muslim men are lectured on long periods of time about the rewards that are waiting for them in heaven if they were to carry out acts of violence against the public. They are promised virgins, waiting for the young brave soul but only if he is willing to strap a bomb vest on himself and willing to blow himself up inside a masjid, a market place, hospitals and in the case of Hotel Shaamo, in front of a group of medical school graduates, celebrating their success with their loved ones, beaming with bright.

 

In short, the Niqab or any garb that conceals the identity of the woman is worn because women and I'm speaking about the very same outspoken crowd, are of the opinion that it is waajib for them to wear it and failure to comply will have undesirable results, one that includes but is not limited to being ostracized by the community.

 

This means that, while the decision is theirs to choose (the women folk), the choices are limited for some and not so much for others, being boxed out on a either and/or scenario. As you can see, this type of interpretation of personal choice is convoluted. More often than not, fear prevails. Fear of losing honour is more prevalent than the choices these women claim to be making. Honour, ya Maskiin-Sakiin is a tricky thing, sometimes, it can be construed as being a choice and thats when things get muddy.

 

Mida kale, ya Maskiin-Sakiin, you said the following:

 

Waxaad soo qortay boqol kun oo qalad baa ku jira, meel laga bilaabo maba laha walee.

If I made inaccurate statements, point it out to me. Tell me that on this occasion, you stated this as fact and the truth is far from it, making what you said inaccurate but if I stated an opinion and you happen to disagree with what I said, that doesn’t make my words wrong, it just makes my words disagreeable.

 

Somali makugu soo qoraa saa waxa aan hada kuu fasiray aad ugu fahanto mase adiga afka ajnabiga maku liitadid like Aaliyah?

 

Unlike you, I took the time to view the video, I didn’t form an opinion of the guests based on their attire. I used the words of the mask one to help Aaliyah and Blessed identify their beloved’s shortcomings.

 

In short, read my previous posts and that should some up my reasons for contributing to this thread were the masked one is concerned.

 

France iyo yurub oo dhan waxaa ka jirta waxa la dhaho "xuquuqda diimaha", taas oo laga wado, qofkastaa diintiisa buu siduu doono ugu dhaqmi karaa, ilaa aynan qofna waxba u dhimayn, yacni dadka kula nool.

In my view and as far as Aaliyah is concerned, xuquuqda diimaha does not apply, to borrow aaliyah’s own words, niqab is a recommended product.

 

Going back to what I stated at the start of this post, you will have to produce evidence to the contrary, otherwise, I will have to take your statements as opinions and nothing more. If you want me to take you serious, you are going to have to do better than daliil keen adiga, you will have to show me and the many more people who hold similar view why you are right and we are all wrong.

 

and finally, you stated:

Hadalkayga bal hal maroo kale dhuux: Anigu ma lihi in aynan jirin aduunkoo dhan HAL GABADH oo lagu khasb niqaabka, kolay waxkasta aduunka waa laga helaa. Laakiin waxaan ku leeyahay boqolkiiba 90, ama ka badan(just being generouse, for sake of the debate), gabdhaha doorta Niqaabka inay xidhaan ayagaa iskooda u doorta, qof ku khasbaana ma jiro.

You will forgive me if I ask you for sources, I need you to show me credible sources which you cited before you reached the 90% conclusion.

 

Mida kale, you use statistics when you have the facts on your side, in your case, it just makes you look inept and futile.

 

 

Yours truly, and forever,

 

LayZie G.

[Jacpher]

Al-Miskiin, tan ha iskuxiijin. Alamtara la soo dhaaf weeye. Hanuunka Allaa bixiya boowe. I know you mean well in your debate brother but don't waste your energy and time on someone tying sunnanta suubanaha to Shaamo hotel. That's just najaasa fowqal najaasa.

[Aaliyyah]

Layzie, if i decided not to engage in this discussion with you that doesnt give u the right to call me names..

 

As for almiskiin coming to my aid??? lol that really made me laugh! you humor me!!......This brother chose to answer out of his free will!!!...I could have continued this discussion with you if I wanted to..but I dont debate with people whose arguments don't add up!..

 

But, hey the floor is all yours and whoever chooses to argue with you..

 

 

salaam

[Al-Miskiin]

LayZie G.

 

Waxaad soo qortay

 

you asked if aan daliil hadalka aan dhahay u haayo? As in, do I have explanation as to why I said the Niqab is not prescribed by Islam, is that what you mean by daliil?

 

The answer is simple enough, our holy scripture, the Qu'ran does not command women to wear the niqab. In other words, the hideous garb is not divinely ordained piece of clothing, which means it has no place in our religion and that means you can not invoke religious privileges without solid evidence to support your counter claim. (you might want to dig up Ibti's thread about this very same subject to aid you in your witch hunts)

Daliil waan kuu keeni, anigu waxaan aaminsanahay arinta niqaabka diinta Muslimiinta way ku sugantahay, quraan iyo axaadiith-ba.

Culimadda muslimiintuna ilaa salafkii(saxaabaddi, tabiciintii, iyo kuwii ka dambeeyeyba) way ka hadleen arintan niqaabka. In badan oo ka mid ahina waxay qabaan inuu waajib yahay, in yarna waxay qabaan inuusan ahayn, laakiin shay fiican uu yahay. Intoodan dambee leh waajib maaha, xataa waxay sheegaan wakhtiyada qaarkood inay WAAJIB tahay, tusaale wakhtiyada fitnada. Afarta madhab ee muslimiintu maanta u nisba sheegatana arintan way isku raacsan yihiin intooda badan.

 

Laakiin intaanan daliil keenin, waxaan rabay inaynu saldhiga arintan isla fahano.

 

Hadaan qawlka culimadda ee ku saabsan arintan keeno, miyaad ku qanci? Mise waxaad rabtaa inaynu adiga iyo aniga maskaxdeena ku kala baxno? oo Culimadda arintan ka hadashayna meel ku tuurno?

Waayo as U know, maadaama aynu diin ka hadlayno, qofkastaa hadalkiisa la iskama qaadanayo, waa in daliil cad la hela, culimadda hadalkoodana la soo guuriyaa, markaasna qawlka ugu adag la qaataa? Do u agree?

Maxaynu ku kala baxnaa, ma Dadka diinta u cilmiga leh(salafkii, culimadda etc.) siday u fahmeen Quraanka, iyo axaadiithta, iyo waxay arintan ka dhaheen, mise wax kalaad maskaxda ku haysay?

 

And if it happens, and by the will of Allah It will, that u agree on that Niqab is wajib, does that mean that u'd allow muslim women to wear it? Mise Niqaabka sidiisaba waad ka soo horjeeda, whether the religion allows it or not.

 

If u do agree, doodu way sii socon kartaa bi'ithnillah, laakiin hadeerba yaynaan is daalinin hadaad hadhow markaan soo guuriyo culimadda kutubtoodu waxay ka dhaheen aayadaha ka hadlaya asturaada dumarka, hadhow ha dhihin "ayagaa sidaas u fahmay, anigu kuma raacsani"!?

 

 

Mida kale, if the discussion is moving in the direction of the garb and its place in Islam, lets discuss the reasons why women who wear the garb wear what they wear.

"Why they do", ha inoo dambayso, horta aynu meel isla dhigno, in Niqaabku diinta Muslimiinta ka mid yahay, ama in uusan ka mid ahayn(the last opinion is what U claim).

 

 

 

Similarly, our young Muslim men are lectured on long periods of time about the rewards that are waiting for them in heaven if they were to carry out acts of violence against the public. They are promised virgins, waiting for the young brave soul but only if he is willing to strap a bomb vest on himself and willing to blow himself up inside a masjid, a market place, hospitals and in the case of Hotel Shaamo, in front of a group of medical school graduates, celebrating their success with their loved ones, beaming with bright.

Is qarxin, iyo Niqaab shuqul iskuma leh. Arinta Niqaabka ku saabsan, ma jiro qof salafkii ka mid ah oo diiday, qaabkan is qarxintan aad la ordaysid waa wax cusub oo bilaabmay qarniyadeena.

Laakiin neverless Mawduuca ha ka bixin, hadaad rabtid inaad ka hadashid waxaas, topic kale samee.

 

 

In my view and as far as Aaliyah is concerned, xuquuqda diimaha does not apply, to borrow aaliyah’s own words, niqab is a recommended product.

Ana waxaan ku leeyahay muslimiinta dad baa aaminsan inuu waajib yahay Niqabku, waana opinion aad u adag, korna waxaan kuugu soo qoray even those oo aaminsan inuu yahay "recomended" inay xaaladaha qaar Waajib ka dhigaan. Daliilkeedana anaa kuu keeni, waa hadaad su'aalaha meesha ugu saraysa aan kugu waydiiyey iiga jawaabtid. Waayo inaan ana daliilo wakhti ku isticmaalo inaan keeno, adna aynan qiimo kuu lahayn waxay Culimadda muslimiintu ka dheheen niqaabka, meel kuma gaadhayno.

 

 

Ugu dambayn

- dacaayada iwm meel inoo dhig, hadal qaloocinta, personal attack iyo wixii la mid ah dooda waxba kuma kordhinayso, waa hadii aynu rabno dood quman,

- doodana aynu ka saarno waxkastoo mawduuca ka baxsan,

- anigu sida ugu fiican baan isku dayi inaan si dagan, edabna ku jirto kuugu jawaabo, mawduucana abbaaro. adna sidoo kalaan kaa sugi Insha Allah that means ugu horayn inaad magacayga saxdid.

 

 

Waan ka baxay

 

Ps. Walaalada igula taliyey inaanan wakhti ku isticmaalin arintan(Jacpher, Aaliyah), aad baan ugu mahadnaqayaa, waadna ku mahadsantihiin taladiina qaaliga ah, amba runtii inaan iska daayo baan rabay, laakiin hadana bal anoo khayr rajaynaya baan is idhi bal inyar sii wad, laakiin haday doodu siday hada tahay ku sii socoto, waan ku khasbanahay inaan taladiina qaato. Allahna khayr ha idin siiyo.

[LayZie G.]

Aaliyah,

 

Maskiin is coming to your aid, waayo, you had poor performance, there is nothing to be ashamed of. You can learn as much about failure as you can learn about success. He believes he can do a better job, so give your side a chance.

 

 

Layzie, if i decided not to engage in this discussion with you that doesnt give u the right to call me names..

What names? When did I call you names? Bal take a notebook and pen out and go through the 3 pages of writing and find some examples to post here. This is exactly why you bailed out because you were getting frazzled, not knowing when it was appropriate to use contradictory in a sentence or stating an opinion and thinking that it was a fact. I asked you to explain yourself, you couldn't do it, so you decided to take a break from it all but you are still here, giving commentary and making up stories about being called a name and pretending to be a victim?

 

Go find me an example of a time I called you a name....assuming you know what name calling is...until then, you are open to join the discussion. I stated my position to you, you failed to state yours, you just didnt have an argument, you never did and probably you never will, waayo, you cant even decide if you should wear the niqab or not.

 

Definition of a name-calling:- (just incase you didnt know) is when you call names to belittle another person, abusive names that degrade the other party. I find you adorable and sometimes entertaining, how can I call someone like that names? It just doesn't make sense.

 

Now let me get back to your teammate...

 

 

Daliil waan kuu keeni, anigu waxaan aaminsanahay arinta niqaabka diinta Muslimiinta way ku sugantahay, quraan iyo axaadiith-ba.

So adiga waxaad aaminsantahay that scholarly opinion is absolute and scholarly opinion is supreme?

 

This is exactly why I brought up the example about the suicide bombers and their promised virgins because some scholars believe that suicide bombing is waajib, does that make such verdict absolute for you, since you seem to be inclined to believe whatever ruling is delivered by your beloved scholars? Please explain yourself or I will take your silence as a yes.

 

The other reason why I talked about the reasons behind women wearing niqab is that they are of the opinion that the garb is waajib because they were told that the scholar's word is absolute.

 

What of the other scholars who do not come to the same judgement, what does it mean for you were their nay judgement is concerned?

 

I'm intrigued by your position because you feel that you can pick and choose the rulings that only applies to you, which means that if I were to answer your own question, by asking if the word of a scholar is absolute, your answer will probably be no, because you chose to follow one ruling over another, assuming that they are all in the same profession with the same qualification just differ in their opinion from subject to subject, meaning some feel it isnt waajib, while others you want to mention by name with their ruling are for niqab being waajib, then where does that leave the qur'an? the five pillars? is Niqab the sixth pillar? the five pillars are waajib...is the kitaab subordinate to the ruling of the scholars?

 

and as far as I know waajib is not the same thing as recommendation....Waajib=obligatory, to recommend= is to suggest

 

And if it happens, and by the will of Allah It will, that u agree on that Niqab is wajib

No, no, no, Niqaab is not waajib. No ifs, no buts, simple answer, NIQAAB IS NOT WAAJIB.. and if you disagree with the contrary, produce evidence to the contrary.....and dont interpret evidence as opinion. I want concrete, textual evidence that states NIQAB IS WAAJIB. (if you dont think qur'an is surpreme, then you are right, you and I dont have much to discuss since you believe qur'an is subordinate to scholarly opinion)

 

If some of your beloved scholars rule on a verdict, in this case, the niqab, as waajib, it means some of these scholars are compelling our dear sisters to wear the niqab...leaving the matter of choice full-stop, so what do you say to that?

 

Yours truly, and forever,

 

LayZie G.

 

 

PS: To the jackie's of the world, you should be empowered to say and do what you like and no one can make you feel inferior, not even LayZie G.