A puzzle!

[Ms DD]

Originally posted by Sharmarkee:

 

true what you said in the above paragraph, but when a push comes to shove, The Sunni rich goverments(Saudis,Jordan,Emirates,Egypt)they suppose to stand up for the American/Isreal aggressions instead dispensing a political fatwa based by the kings/Emir's orientation propaganda. now Iraq is burning, lebanon is burning and palestine God help them, they have been slaughered like a sheep in a farm.

Salaam aleykum

 

I was reminded of this poem:

 

When the Nazis came for the communists,

I remained silent;

I was not a communist.

 

When they locked up the social democrats,

I remained silent;

I was not a social democrat.

 

When they came for the trade unionists,

I did not speak out;

I was not a trade unionist.

 

When they came for the Jews,

I did not speak out;

I was not a Jew.

 

When they came for me,

there was no one left to speak out.

 

The rich Arabs in the Gulf, their turn will come. By then they will not have oil to use as leverage.

[Nur]

Cambarro and Sharmarke

 

What you are seeing today is the harvest of many years of preparation. The gap is wide between Islamic East and Judeo-Christian West. The Secular west found peace within itself, We dont have peace as what we claim and what we do are not in synch. Neither Pan Arabism, nor Pan islamism are of help as they are both banners behind which no one is lining up anymore. The west is more faithful to secularism than we "Muslims" are to Islam.

 

Context is very important in this discussion, its about a Puzzle, the writer posed as a question begging for a solution. Where should we as Somalis stand? Realisticly, apart from lip service, little or nothing can we contribute to solve the problem in Lebanon, we share no borders, nor common persuation, we have problems of our own that we are not doing enough to slove, we are divided among ourselves ( Though All Sunnis) to even preach uniting Shia Sunnah in Lebanon against their common Israeli enemy, as i write this response, the Ethiopian Army was spotted diggin at Balamballe, bent on dividing Somalia to slices that they can dominate, using clan allegiance, the defeated warlords, and targetting Islam as its core national threat. In my opinion, we have no dog in that feud, our local tragedy needs our undivided attention.

 

 

Nur

[Ms DD]

Originally posted by Nur:

Cambarro and Sharmarke

 

 

Context is very important in this discussion, its about a Puzzle, the writer posed as a question begging for a solution. Where should we as Somalis stand? Realisticly, apart from lip service, little or nothing can we contribute to solve the problem in Lebanon, we share no borders, nor common persuation, we have problems of our own that we are not doing enough to slove, we are divided among ourselves ( Though All Sunnis) to even preach uniting Shia Sunnah in Lebanon against their common Israeli enemy,

Whilst I agree with this, i can not find within my heart not to care. As muslims we were ordered to hate injustice and oppression wherever it is. In the case of Lebonan, it hurt me big time to see how the muslims (and christians and Druze) were annihalted by undiscriminating Israelis.

 

But the prophet Mohamed (saw) can:

The Prophet (saw) said: "The Muslim community (ummah) is like a body; if one part is in distress, the whole suffers."

 

"Not one of you truly believes until he loves for his brother what he loves for himself," declared the Prophet Mohammed (saw), thereby sealing the universal brotherhood of man and enjoining on the society as a whole the upkeep of the downtrodden among their ranks.

 

What we also found it out (even though some us already knew) that non-muslim govts (not their people though) were united against the people of Lebonen (we really shouldnt count France as siding with the muslims as they have their own battles with them in their country). Many people in the west who believe in a secular society already see that acts carried out in their name by their governments are not always ethical. That unfortunately is the nature of the human world which is applicable just as much to muslims as all others.

 

 

Another point we always knew was the fact that these western govts put the interest of their people first (as they should) even if it is at the expense on invading other lands. We Somalis are way behind on this score. Each leader puts his and his qabiil's interest before the greater good for all Somalis. It is about time we all put the interest of our nation first and rebuild it. We can at least have a clout to influence the international community in favour of justice. Having said this, we really shouldnt neglect the obligation and rights other muslims in other countries has over us. If we do this, then we are no better then the muslims govts who disregarded the plight of the Palestenians, Chechnya, Kashmiris, Uighurs in China not to mention the plight of their own people.

 

Originally posted by Nur:

as i write this response, the Ethiopian Army was spotted diggin at Balamballe, bent on dividing Somalia to slices that they can dominate, using clan allegiance, the defeated warlords, and targetting Islam as its core national threat. In my opinion, we have no dog in that feud, our local tragedy needs our undivided attention.

 

Nur

I totally agree. As you said, we can only pay lip service as i feel helpless. It is upto the leaders of IUC and TFG to stop Ethiopia. Isnt 16yrs of anarchy enough in our country? Why are they letting the outsiders divide the country?

 

We can only make dua to Allah swt.

[Nur]

Cambarro sis

 

I dont have a TV, and I dont watch the nightly news, it causes indigestion to me, not the sick unjust and horrible footages, but the level of cleverness in concealing truth and sellling falsehood wholesale.

 

You are right, we should care, we should feel for these people who are bombarded for the sake of breaking their will for being united as Muslims ( Shia, Sunnah) , Christians and Druze. I dont understand the logic of bombarding Sunni and Christian areas, if Israel as it decalared was only after Hizbollah, but having the US treasury as its bankroller, the bloody tagging game ( US and Israeel, against Hezbollah) was over when Israel ran out of weopons, the next round of cheating is about to start.

 

Nur

[Sharmarkee]

^^

 

Brother Nur,

 

That was Salman the persian(RC), who said when he found the truth:

 

أبي ألاسلام لا أباً لي سواه أذا اÙتخرو بقيس او تميم

 

The Sahabi, was a persian immigrant only looking after the truth, and nothing else but the truth, as he declare his lack of interest the powerful desert arab tribes.

 

It would be amazing that if Somalis one day gather under the banner of islam, surley it will solve all our problems, but the question is do we have this noble qualities of a nationhood Ya Sheekh Nuur, secondly who is slicing the country Somalis or Ethopians, I think it's not the latter but the first whether they are crooked warlords, or cunning politians, or a short-sighted clannist. they all weilding knives to dismember this poor nation, something Ethopia and any other hostile nation is getting for the cheap.

 

Otherwise regarding Huzbuallah against yahuuda it is all about:

 

"Fight them, and Allah will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame, help you (to victory) over them, heal the breasts of Believers".(9/14)

قَاتÙÙ„ÙوهÙمْ ÙŠÙعَذّÙبْهÙم٠اللّه٠بÙأَيْدÙيكÙمْ ÙˆÙŽÙŠÙخْزÙÙ‡Ùمْ وَيَنصÙرْكÙمْ عَلَيْهÙمْ وَيَشْÙ٠صÙدÙورَ قَوْم٠مّÙؤْمÙÙ†Ùينَ

[Nur]

Sharmarke bro.

 

Islam was established bottom up, not top down, nor middle-up, or down. It started when a single man, Muhammad SAWS received revelation from Allah to surrender to Allah, and then, to warn those close to him in kinship, he went up a nearby hill in Makkah and called all the clans of the tribe of Qureish, Yaa banii Abdal Mutallib................Ya Banii fulaan, so on, his offer was to his clan was that if they surrenedered to Allah, that Allah will make them leaders of the world, from that point on the circle was getting larger to include the entire population of Makkah, free citizens and slaves alike, Salman the Persian, Suhaib, The Roman and Bilal The Ethiopian were all inducted to the core of this nascent faith. The Movement spilled over the nearest large town, Yathrib ( later named Madinatul Rasul), the battle of badr followed and islam from that point took its universal mission to establish itself as the only Deen ( Sovereign System to Govern Humans ) on earth.

 

From the above, I am sure that you would agree that the rise of the islamic courts based on clans to be on the footsteps of the first beginning of the Islamic localization. The courts refelect the surrender of the clan to Allah, which is followed by their convergence with other clan courts, just like how the Tribes of Aws and Khazraj in Madina converged to become ANSAAR. This trend will continue up until the circle enlarges to iclude all nations.

 

Its part of Universal Sunan of Allah, a seed will only grow when it is imbedded in the right soil, watered with right amount of water with right temperature, periodically exposed to sunshine, protected from the elements and pests. That sequence constitutes the planning for a year, according to a chinese proverb, to plan for ten years, you grow a tree, yet to plan for lifetime, we must develop people with right attitude, and finally to plan for eternal success, we patiently preach Islam and gracefully accept the pain that comes with it. Success does not just happen, it follows Sunan ( Cause-Effect) set by Allah. Sumetime you even stumble on success, because you must have done something right when you were actually after a wrong thing, the latter we call it a success by accident, and it may well be what happened in Somalia.

 

My point is that Islam begins with the person, family, clan, tribe, nation, then rises up to outer space and Jannah. The wisdom lies how to connect the sequence without jumping erratically to all directions at once.

 

 

Nur

[Castro]

^ Apart from die-hard clannists, the Bush administration and Abdillahi Yussuf, I can't think of anyone who's unhappy with the courts. However, what I read above, good Nur, is "irrational exuberance". Let's wait and see how the UIC works out its growing pains. The truth lies somewhere between your overly rosy picture ( ) and the more realistic view that the obstacles are great and success, though not impossible, is improbable.

[NGONGE]

I like your infectious optimism, Nur. Though I can’t trust Somali leaders (be they half-secular politicians or Mullahs) I do hope that your wish comes true. I just can’t imagine these courts to be just, fair and even-handed to all Somalis. I can’t help feeling that they’ll come tumbling down because of the irresistible lure of clannish pride, greed and power (which are all human failings regardless of one’s best intentions). I hope my cynical instincts are wrong though and these guys spread with their (hopefully) genuine application of Islam to all parts of Somalia.

[xiinfaniin]

It’s all about expectations yaa Nur. Given the fact that Islamic Courts are in their early stages, I would die happy if they achieve two things in our time:

 

1- Establish effective administration in Mogadishu and its environs. By effective administration I mean the restoration and the return of organs of governance. If the Courts authority and political influence ring supreme in Mogadishu they will undoubtedly have a lasting influence in Somalia and their legacy will outlive our generation. Mogadishu, though raped, is still the symbol of Somali nation. If they make it stable and thriving they would’ve indeed proved themselves, as Castro calls it, worthy governors who deserve to be trusted with our leadership. That [edit]assumes Courts have strong central control and policy objectives toward which they strive to achieve.

 

2- Show an attitude of national leadership and break from make-shift-courts they have been. Take initiative and come up a new strategy (and peaceful one at that) to revive the Somali state. Somehow articulate a political vision that appeals (not threatens) Somali masses beyond Mogadishu and work toward establishing relationships with stable regions. Somalia is ripe for change but to leverage that political maturity requires, I am afraid, more than stirring sermons or slogans full of Islamic appeals. As Nur pointed out Court’s success seems to be accidental and pure fortuitous! Some in the Court’s leadership, I sense, seem to be more ready than others to assume the responsibilities this victory brings. There is a vacuum of leadership in Somalia and they need to fill. Open a national dialogue and reconciliation to heal the wounds of civil war. A step that, mind you, no one has thus far done.

 

 

Lets hope this one succeeds.

 

P.S: NGONGE, sorry about the hijack of your puzzle thread .

[NGONGE]

Though I started this thread as a response to the events in the Middle East, the resurrection of another thread about the subject matter forces me to also bring this one up again and present you with my puzzle.

[Nur]

Ngonge bro. Writes;

 

I hope my cynical instincts are wrong though and these guys spread with their (hopefully) genuine application of Islam to all parts of Somalia.

 

Your cynicism is a wake-up siren, alarming against euphoric feeling of unfinished victory, its very healthy, your voice is needed as a check up, we will all be the winners if all of our intentions lines up with Allah's commandment, but like you said, our buddy, you know who, Satan is in the game, and he hates when brothers approach each other and hug.

 

 

Nur