Unfound accusations against Col. Barre Hiiraale

[Allamagan]

^ lol. OK. MR. Perfect

[xiinfaniin]

LOL@Sulayman!

 

You remind me the infamous war sermon of Mark Twain! But I take it as a eulogy saaxiib !

Instead of confusing people and citing the holy Qur’an to defend a warlord (a feeble effort any way), why don’t you take a page from Ina Haabiil’s famous baroor-diiq;

 

Bari yio galbeed baa laga yiqiin golaci dheeraaye’e

Magaciisu waa gudubsanaa gaaliyo islaanee’e

Geesiigiii lawada …….goconayaa mooyi’i

 

sii wada hee yaa jamaacah! I know Allamagan is the literary stud around here so you might as well enlist his help Sulaymaanow !

 

Weligeey tanoo kale!

[Gabbal]

^Sidaa laguu sugayaadan ogeyn.

 

Can you tell us why Sheikh Mukhtar Roobow called Barre's halgan for Kismaayo a kacdoon?

[Allamagan]

^^^^ Hornow Xiin car hakaga jawaabo.

[xiinfaniin]

Horn, when was that? I've not heard it!

 

Waa markii aniga iyo Roobow naloo kala bixi lahaa .

[Allamagan]

Hornoow, drop the link for Xiin!

Hint: go to somaliweyn.com and look for this audio

[Gabbal]

Originally posted by xiinfaniin:

Horn, when was that? I've not heard it!

 

Waa markii aniga iyo Roobow naloo kala bixi lahaa

.

Maslaxada daraadeed waan ka laaban waxaan idhi, Sheikh Roobow iyo Sheikh Xii marnaba dooni mayo inaan iska hor keeno!

 

 

Allamagab waa ku salaamay!

[xiinfaniin]

^^lol. Ha isku kaaya layn sheekha then !

[RedSea]

Originally posted by Che-Guevara:

 

Resdea...I just stated what he and his clan militia to the poor people of Marka. If he repents, that's between him and His creator, but history should reflects atrocities that were committed by his criminal enterprise.

History? the whole darn history of this place you call home is dark.If you keep looking back, you won't find one good area to openly be thankful for.But what I am saying exactly is that,the folks in Marka have no complaints today,unless you and the people who call Abdullahi Yusuf as their savior make something out of it.

 

If you do agree whatever the ICU is doing is good,then note that he is part and parcel of the ICU my friend,therefore he is taking a huge role in the success of the ICU.there are not buts and if,nor are there members who have done little and some who have done more,since turnout is all good news for the ICU,then he is a part of that good news.

 

So, my advice is,don't fall for the propaganda and empty durbaan tumis put forth in here, Shiekh Maxamed Siyad "indha Cadde" waa rageedii. Ilaahay ha daayo.chew on that for those of you believing otherwise.

[Cumar]

Salamu Calykuum ya akhi Che-Guevara

 

Originally posted by Che-Guevara:

That's where he made the mistake. You can't remain neutral in conflicts. He along with every Somali has invested interest in the outcome of the current TFG/Courts struggles. Choose side. One can't be TFG Defence minister and praise the courts at the same time.

That is where are you are incorrect. Neutralism is a great advantage for a mediator or conciliator. Without Col.Barre Hiiraale's neutralistic stance, war would have erupted many months ago.

 

As for the slander against him, bro the man is warlord. That should say enough.

This issue bothers me really and that is individuals using the Somali definition of warlord and the standard definition of warlord interchangbly. What is the standard definition of a warlord?

 

The standard definition of a "warlord" is:

 

"is a leader whose power has been attained by non-democratic means but who exercises authority usually on the basis of an appeal to ethnic or religious identity, and who usually controls a definable territory where he has a near monopoly on the use of force. A warlord, as opposed to a gang leader or petty crook, operates within a clear and defined political framework."

 

By this definition, Col. Barre Hiiraale is a warlord and the ICU are a group of warlords, but what about the oft-used and cited Somali definition?

 

The Somali definition of a "warlord" is:

 

"a criminal thug who recruits men from his own tribe and who have allegiance to the warlord. He is someone who drives his capacity to intimidate one or few persons at most. A warlord drives his power from his capacity to intimidate the civilian populations of whole villages, towns and cities and is usually responsible for the death of hundreds of innocent civilians."

 

Does this definition apply to Col. Barre Hiiraale or the ICU? Nay and here is why:

 

• Col. Barre Hiiraale has never performed atrocities as opposed to others such as Caydiid, Morgan, et la.
• Col. Barre Hiiraale's army consisted of three different tribes including his own.
• Col. Barre Hiiraale has never intimidated the inhabitants but instead provided security and justice

The satisfaction of the people is witness to his justice as outlined in the news article that I have provided. But for your convenience, I will repost the important bit:

 

“Kismayo;s current peace and governance initiative are the brainchild of Mr. Barre Adan Shire aka Barre Hiiraale. Mr. Shire received unprecedented popularity among city residents after he effectively built bridges among various feuding tribes and banned looting and intimidation by his armed militias. His new security drive is welcomed by almost everyone in the city.

 

He lost close friends and former allies when he told them he is not a typical warlord and he's determined to build civil regional administration. Even many armed men from his ******* tribe left him for his stand on responsible governance. A former ally and a close tribesman, Adan jama Dhere is now collecting weapons and gathering tribal young men in an attempt to force Barre out of Kismayo. Mr. Dhere left Kismayo recently after clashes between his supporters and Barre’s.†http://somalinet.com/news/world/English/572

 

If Barre was really a "warlord" (using the second definition), then why did the ICU praise him on numerous occasions and in fact, why is he one of the few individuals who have been continuously praised by the Courts if he was guilty of warlordism and mayhem.

 

 

Salamu Calaykuum ya akhi Red Sea

Originally posted by Read Sea:

Well big ups to Col.Barre if he did indeed brought justice to Kismayo however,you must always keep in mind that one man's hero/savior, is another's warlord.If that is your point of view and the point of view of your likes,then you must remember,that certain sub clans in the Kismayo area were not too happy with Col.Barre being in control of the city,while others were.

Red Sea, based on the comment, I can safely say walaal that you haven't read my primary post. The majority of the inhabitants of Kismayoo were very satisfied with Col. Barre Hiiraale:

 

Somalinet.com reports:

 

“Kismayo;s current peace and governance initiative are the brainchild of Mr. Barre Adan Shire aka Barre Hiiraale. Mr. Shire received unprecedented popularity among city residents after he effectively built bridges among various feuding tribes and banned looting and intimidation by his armed militias.His new security drive is welcomed by almost everyone in the city."

 

The majority counts unless one should satisfy every individual which is frankly impossible.

 

The rest of the comments reflect the title of the topic and that is unfound accusations. Walaalow, these fictional perceptions have been already debunked if one has followed the situation of Kismayoo in the last few years. You already revealed that you were completely unaware Col. Barre Hiiraale’s introduction of security in the city which actually manifests that you haven't followed the political situation of Kismayoo in the last years and how did you manage to interpose a completely fabricated story of Col. Barre Hiiraale's intentions and actions. Col. Barre Hiiraale himself announced that after creating the Jubbaland state, he would step back

 

Col. Barre Hiiraale did not base his justice on tribalistic reasons; rather he treated everyone equally which made him popular. The article (which you haven't read, I presume) clearly mentions it. It says: "He lost close friends and former allies when he told them he is not a typical warlord and he's determined to build civil regional administration. Even many armed men from his ******* tribe left him for his stand on responsible governance. A former ally and a close tribesman, Adan jama Dhere is now collecting weapons and gathering tribal young men in an attempt to force Barre out of Kismayo. Mr. Dhere left Kismayo recently after clashes between his supporters and Barre’s.â€

 

In addition, I can understand you might think he is been treated unfairly,but being neutral doesn't make any sense,and certainly it doesn't make any sense to say that Barre Hiirale shouldn't have left Kismayo in a way of force,I think it was the right move,timely too,because the Ethiopians were planing on using the Kismayo port to harm other Somalis,thus Hiirale showed no sign of apposing such move if it ever happened,hence he is a minister of the corrupt TFG after all.

Ya akhi, please do not tell me that you actually believed in the pretext that Kismayoo would have been occupied by the Ethiopians. This is why I specifically made a mention of the 'unconditional allegiance' in my initial post. Know, oh Red Sea, that if one doesn't base his actions and movements according the Qur'an and the Sunnah, then we reject him and we praise him if he does. The take-over of Kismayoo according to Shari'ax Law is Xaraan. Yes, it is hundred percent Haram and hence why I stated that they (the geniune wadaado) were misled by certain elements in the movement. Because of this, we reject the takeover and we denounce it for the sake of Allah (ta3ala). No one is infallible, not even the Prophets (except in conveying the Message) were despite the fact that our Nabi (scw) was the best of creation. He was rebuked several times for his non-wahy decisions. The geniune wadaado who made ijtihad for this takeover due misleading reasons are still rewarded since one who errs in itjihad is rewarded once while if he gets it right is rewarded twice.

 

If one wants to know the fiqh and the principle of why the takeover was xaraan in the Shari'ax, then you can pm or I might post it at a later time due its length.

 

Ya red Sea, Col. Barre Hiiraale has countless times revealed his position in regard to foreign interference. Please do read my posts ya akhi so I do not have the time to repeat myself. In addition, please read the latest interview (see HornAfrique's first post) of Sheikh Mukhtaar Roobow Abu Mansuur (xafidhullah) and where he mentions that Col. Barre Hiiraale was against foreign interference. Remember that they didn't call him a nationalist for nothing.

 

nor is it against the faith, our faith to critise a man like he.It doesn't matter how many Surats you may quote to make it seem as though its' immoral to say anything about him,but it doesn't apply to this situation whatsoever,he deserved of whatever happened to him,thus it wouldn't have happened to him in the first place,Allah isn't injust for your reminder,so Allah did justice,by causing Barre Hiirale to be gotten rid off by the ICU.

Brother, where did I object to criticism. I object to a specific type of criticism and that is biased criticism (see my primary post). That criticism amounts to slander according to Islam. Walaalow please do not attribute a xaraan act that has been committed as Justice from Allah (ta3ala).

 

Akhi Red Sea, once again your post validates and confirms my primary post and that is that most accusations are actually half-baked and pure fabrications.

 

Wasalam

[Cumar]

Originally posted by xiinfaniin:

LOL@Sulayman!

 

You remind me the infamous war sermon of Mark Twain! But I take it as a eulogy saaxiib

!

Instead of confusing people and citing the holy Qur’an to defend a warlord (a feeble effort any way), why don’t you take a page from Ina Haabiil’s famous baroor-diiq;

 

Bari yio galbeed baa laga yiqiin golaci dheeraaye’e

Magaciisu waa gudubsanaa gaaliyo islaanee’e

Geesiigiii lawada …….goconayaa mooyi’i

 

sii wada hee yaa jamaacah! I know Allamagan is the literary stud around here so you might as well enlist his help Sulaymaanow

!

 

Weligeey tanoo kale!

Salamu Caleykuum walaal xiinfaniin

 

I am quite astonished at the lack of extending the Islamic salam in spite of the fact that this is a Somali-Muslim forum.

 

akhi xiinfaniin, bear in mind that if you cannot add anything productive to the discussion apart from ridiculing my posts with no basis then refrain from posting in this topic unless your intention was to cause flame-war.

 

Wasalam

[xiinfaniin]

^^So Kismayo was a masal'ah fiqhiyah whose verdict some erred and others got rewarded, eh!

 

edit: I think this not to be the kinda productive threads i would take serious adeer, so pardon my jokes.

[Cumar]

Originally posted by Juje:

Inta kaleba yeelkad widayo, lakiin ma waxad hada ka yelna Barre Hiraale waa

'mu'miniin'

.

Salamu Caleykum

 

Waalow, refer to the tafsirs or ask a wadaad for the general injunction derived from this ayah.

 

Wasalam

[RedSea]

^so Yaa Akhi Sulayman, what are saying now,let Barre Hiiraale come back to Power in Kismayo, or what?

 

Are you also hinting,the ICU is doing bad job in handling the situation in Southern Somalia?

 

few questions to consider,since you seem to be defending one man's interest in this particular thread,while on the other hand we are defending the greater interest of us all.And as I said,if Barre Hiirale wants to come back,he must not have a militia outside for his own interest,no one will harm his tribe,and certainly no one will do injustice,so he must join this great cause of the ICU and be a member,then all negativivity that might have been said about him will be put to aside.

 

So what do you say about that Akhi Sulayman?(great nick by the way).

[Allamagan]

^^^ Red Sea, brother, why dont you answer my question I asked you in another thread I am still waiting your answer.

 

am