Somali Parliment should PREPARE to move to Mogadishu....

[General Duke]

It is a fact that Mogadishu is safe and in the hands of a unified faction.

 

The Somali Governemnt specialy the Parliment should aim to relocate back to Mogadishu. As soon as possible.

 

This would create an opportunity to start the final chapter of this dark period in our history.

Also this factions claim that they want peace and recognise the TFG, would be proven or disproven.

 

There should be no fear of a lasting settlement and courage is required...

 

There is no difference between Baidoa, Kismayu, Bossaso and Mogadishu.

 

The era of the warlords is finished and it is time for unity and peace...

[Ahmed_Guree]

The era of the warlords is finished and it is time for unity and peace...

Are you sure about that Especially about TNG?

Are they not Parliamenterians who happen to be Warlords or Former Warlords.

Some who have been expelled from Mogadishu.

Why should we trust the TNG(A coalition of Warlords) who for the past 16 yrs refused to give the Citizens their rights now after they have been kicked out we should turn against the Liberators?

[Juje]

Duke the whole of Somalia does not centre around Mogadishu.

Mogadishu was not safe before due to conflicts among one of the major clans in Somalia, it is safe now cause of an uprising within it and for the better, Alxamdulillah.

Now to say they have sorted themselves does mean that the rest of the somali clans have to sit around them and be dictated. There has to be a reconciling factor and that is the TFG formed in Nairobi. Thus the ICU has to recede to this entity if it is genuine in its intention.

If we are to follow as you are saying it means that the TFG should disperse and its members integrate to the ICU. That my friend is illogical, the vice versa is logical.

The ICU should come clean and state its position in Somali politics, and they should bear in mind it is not representative of the whole of Somalia. And Mogadishu alone is not Somalia.

The legal gfovernment that exists in Somalia today and that has the support of whole of Somalia is the TFG, it may be weak but it is certainly not irrelevant.

[NGONGE]

You’re forever surfing the huge wave of Somali politics, Duke. Don’t you ever get tired of it?

 

It was only at the end of 2004 that you and many on here were rejoicing at the establishment of the TFA and then you rejoiced even more when president Yusuf was chosen to the lead the Somali Transitional Government. Was it not a year ago when things looked bleak and the Speaker (Shariff Hassan) was proving a pest? Was it not less than a year ago when many prominent Minsters in that government were being petulant and causing Mr Yusuf and his Prime Minster all sorts of grief?

 

Were not these Islamic courts accused of being remnants of the defeated Al-Ittihad masquerading as a new and peaceful grouping? Was it not a few years before that when Mr Yusuf defeated them in Puntland? Was it not three years ago when things looked dark and bleak for Puntland and Somaliland? Did we not expect war to erupt between those two entities?

 

Was it not a few years before that when president Abdulqasim’s TNG was the great hope for us all and many thought Somalia was saved? Did we not, months after that accuse him and his sidekicks of corruption and weakness? Did he not fail?

 

Was it not years before that when the former president of the Republic of Somalia was defeated by the various ‘resistance’ groups? Did we not all (or at least most of us) rejoice at his overthrow and look forward to a better future?

 

With such a history, with that many setbacks and celebrations, don’t you think it’s time we all sat back and watched the clowns wreck more havoc. It’s not as if these Islamic Courts are any better than all the rest (they’re Somali after all). If I were you, I’d hold my celebrations and condemnations just yet. There are many twists and turns on the way. If you get too involved, you’ll forever be changing sides, just like you did with adeero Abdullahi, and just like many here were cheering for those wretched warlords a while back and are now cheering for those that defeated the warlords.

 

Somali politics is like a cat that was dropped in water and jumped straight out. If you try to predict where it will put its foot next you’ll only develop a headache, or worse still, an epileptic seizure.

[Kush]

General Duke

It is a fact that Mogadishu is safe and in the hands of a unified faction.

 

The Somali Governemnt specialy the Parliment should aim to relocate back to Mogadishu. As soon as possible.

 

This would create an opportunity to start the final chapter of this dark period in our history.

Also this factions claim that they want peace and recognise the TFG, would be proven or disproven.

 

There should be no fear of a lasting settlement and courage is required...

 

There is no difference between Baidoa, Kismayu, Bossaso and Mogadishu.

 

The era of the warlords is finished and it is time for unity and peace...

I wish it’s easy like that. The door has open for TNG to move to the capital unfortunately the TNG don’t has the right to decided about that unless the order comes directly from Addis.

TNG – tigray national government is created by Itobiya for the interest of Itobiya and one of the most important interests of Itobiya is Hydrocarbon natural resources in occupied Soomaliya territory.

Since Itobiya is satellite state in horn Africa, any kind of government that is selected by itobiya can’t function like sovereign institution.

 

Do you think that TNG will accept the superior law and order of mankind?

Will they ready to hand over those who committed human right abuses, corrupters and traitors of Soomaliyas national security to face justice?

For sure most of patriots Soomaliyan within TNG will join the court soon.

[Paragon]

NGONGE: It was only at the end of 2004 that you and many on here were rejoicing at the establishment of the TFA and then you rejoiced even more when president Yusuf was chosen to the lead the Somali Transitional Government.

NGONGE, to be honest even I accepted the TFG's election of Abdullahi Yussuf, albeit ralliing behind Cadow. The hope was that the TFG would set in place some sort of state apparatus and national frameworks that would kick-start the journey back to national reconstruction and reconciliation. I really didn't care who the TFG elected as long as they did what they were meant to do. But as time went by, their inherent inabilities to achieve anything of substance became clear and as the TFG became more and more hopeless, I too became less hopeful of them.

 

However, this didn't mean I have written the TFG out of the solution yet. I still think they have a role to play though deminished. That is if the TFG's Shariif can find a way to rescue it by replacing Abdullahi Yussuf and Gheedi with more reasonable individuals. That way, the TFG would become instrumental in using it's acquired international contacts while working with other groups in Somalia, chiefly the UIC in Mogadishu. That way the TFG could become part of something meaningful.

 

Somali Politics is in very sense unpredictable and, although I support the UIC myself, their priorities and policies can change dramatically. But I hope whatever their priorities and policies change to, that would not become war with other Somalis. We are tired of war. Time to rest from it is now I believe.

 

PS: Duke, for the TFG to relocate to Mogadishu it must get rid of the President and the PM. I just can't imagine how the TFG can achieve such replacements without the risk of total collapse. The President and the PM are not people who would give in that easily unless they are forced. The question is, who can force them?

[Juje]

Originally posted by Paragon:

Duke, for the TFG to relocate to Mogadishu it must get rid of the President and the PM.

I think I should thank Duke for opening can of worms in here, may be next time he will be calculative in his posts as he is widely known for.

Ok to the point Paragon. Let me remind you that both the Head of state and the PM were elected by a legislative council (namely the Parliament) that is made up of warlords, tribal elders, civil leaders and other public serving organisation in Somalia. Your Hassan Dahir Aweys, Sheikh Sharif, Balayo Indhocadde and the many Abu+ you have in ICU council were never elected except by their cronies who themselves were Morayans but lost out in the share in Nairobi.

The Head of the State and the PM are a result of hard laboring, concrete reconciliation process between the whole of Somali clans that lasted for over two years.

Now if you want us to throw down the drain this hard achieved status cause a couple of wadaad hoodlums in Mogadishu you have something else coming.

You say Mogadishu is safe and peace, good. Well, hello, the whole of Puntland, Somaliland and most others parts of Somalia were safe, prospering and in stability for over ten years while the newly found Abu+ were terrorising human beings in Mogadishu .

This notion that Mogadishu is safe and thus the government should concede to the ICU is totally absurd. So because of this I bet you want to replace Hassan Dahir Aweys with President C/llahi Yusuf and Sheikh Sharif with PM Geedi. And while you are it lets disband the whole Parliament and form a new one from the ICU. Come to think of it 80% of the Somali clans are not part of the ICU, so what do we do then, I wonder.

Anymore ideas guys????

[General Duke]

Juje,

 

Kindly explain why the TFG should not deal with the ICU the same way it deals with say Barre Hiiraale in Kismayu, Mohamed Dheere before him in Jowhar...?

 

If the TFG will tolerate anyone with a couple of technicals and give them positions such as minister of security and commerce as was in the case with Qaynyare and Sudi. Why not give posts to these new men with guns?

 

My point is why waste so much time when we all know that negotiation is the only way forward.

 

Ignoring Paragon and his defence of all things Inda cade and the occupation of lower Shabbele.

I belive by moving to Mogadishu peacefully the TFG would win the hearts of the local people and gain the support of many within the courts.

 

Those who want confrontation on both sides would be side steped..

 

As for the Ethiopians, Eritrians and other players in this great game, thier role would diminish..

 

A new strategy needs to be put in place, bringing together the victors of Mogadishu closer to the TFG...

 

Ngoon, nice to see you are still around mate.

[art]

General,how much of a threat do you think the ICU is to the TFG. Greater control of somalia by the ICU will certainly raise some eyebrows amongst the international community would it not? Do you think that ICU domination will lead to general insecurity in somalia?

[General Duke]

Art, the courts are a new power in Somalia, they pose a challange to the TFG which was build around the factions led by the various warlords.

 

The warlords were a dangerous obsticle to the very existance of the TFG, it was these clan based courts who destroyed the warlords of Mogadishu and hence created this new reality.

 

So far they have brought order to Mogadishu once the most unstable place in Somalia.

 

I belive the TFG as an institution can be strengthened by incoporating and opening ita doors to the courts.

[Paragon]

Duke: Ignoring Paragon and his defence of all things Inda cade and the occupation of lower Shabbele.

I belive by moving to Mogadishu peacefully the TFG would win the hearts of the local people and gain the support of many within the courts.

Duke, adeer how did you achieve to read all that into my post? I think your fear of Indhacade has made you delusional to the extent that any time I post a comment, you see Indha-cade in it! Lol. Bal kaalaya idinku sheega, dadoow. Ninkan Indhacade, is he like the Pirates of the Caribbean? Duke, sxb, I feel sorry for you really. May your nightmares disappear, and this is a genuine prayer. The sad thing is that Duke, whether I support or not support Indha-cade, he will outlast uncle Yey politically. So what are you going to do?

 

And one more thing, so far all you have achieved is to eat your own words and turn a 360 degrees angle. You have also failed all your arguments since they were bound to fail to begin with due to your faulty analysis. Marka adiga you are a lost cause. If you are man enough then please do stick to your position. Don't become a political yoyo on us please. If you can't hold a position to the end then don't come back this section. FYI: I have decided not to bother replying to you again since you have proved that you have nothing useful to say about Somali politics. Failure, thats all you know how to sow.

 

Juje, adiga sxb oilyada iyo biyihaa iskaga kaa qasmey. You didn't even come close to comprehending what is being discussed sxb.

[NGONGE]

Makes sense, saaxib. Still, your following words might have not.

 

However, this didn't mean I have written the TFG out of the solution yet. I still think they have a role to play though deminished.

That is if the TFG's Shariif can find a way to rescue it by replacing Abdullahi Yussuf and Gheedi with more reasonable individuals

. That way, the TFG would become instrumental in using it's acquired international contacts while working with other groups in Somalia, chiefly the UIC in Mogadishu. That way the TFG could become part of something meaningful.

Why spare Shariif?

[Paragon]

^^ Shariif is the only likely individual in the TFG that may act as a bridge-link between the TFG and the UIC and other parties in Somalia. His priorities include compromise and not conflict and he has already shown the willingness to negotiate with the UIC. That is why I think he should be spared.

[Juje]

Originally posted by Paragon:

Juje, adiga sxb oilyada iyo biyihaa iskaga kaa qasmey. You didn't even come close to comprehending what is being discussed sxb.

I wish I could say the same of you, but I cant, cause I will be over estimating you if I did.

[General Duke]

Alas poor Paragon is confused again. This government is based on power Sharing, the President still has the power of his region and the support of many Somali's..Sharif Xasan is also a popular figure in the TFG, now their position is not for negotiation, you would require a 2/3 majority to get rid of them, which is not possible.

 

Now coming back to the topic, the question is what can both sides agree on, first the ICU recognises the TFG as the sole legitamate goverment of Somalia

 

There should be a unified armed forces, thus bringing in the armed clans and the courts millitias.

 

There should be an end to the occupation of the lower Shabbele.

 

A power sharing agreement must be put in place..

 

There should be no Ethiopian, Eritrian or anyother foreign forces in the Somali territories.

 

But alas Paragon as usual gets things twisted and starts to belive the hype he has been told by some corners regarding the power of his favourite warlord Inda Cade...

 

NGoon, the TFG has survived the so called powerful warlords, it will survive the new so called powerful courts...