SUFISME IS THE RIGHT WAY

[Cara.]

It is of value to make these defintions and distinctions because we don't live in isolation anymore and are faced with many different religions and much confusion in the form of 'intellectual secular thought' which seeks to state that because other religions exist, that we can't really choose one over the other. Of which a response can be made that because there are different cars out there, should we ignore them because people get into accidents using them and just take the subways or better yet-cycle around!

LOL. That's a terrible analogy Khayr. Yes, you can do without cars. Public transportation is better for the environment, while cycling is certainly healthier for you AND better for the environment. Likewise, if a perusal of different religions leads me to conclude that none of them espouse a truly superior message, either factually or morally, then I can suggest that one should either practice a particular faith but keep in mind that it's only a personal preference (like someone preferring a Honda over a Toyota), or one should abandon them altogether for (gasp!) secular humanism.

 

A no-brainer really. But I think you were making some good points there before you segued into your favorite strawman argument ("Moral Relativism" anyone?)

[Khayr]

Ah... the absurdity of the agnostic argument. I was just stating the same argument that the avg. person makes today, when they choose to reject religions altogether.

 

In a way, it is a question of what you want to Believe more importantly it is about

You!

 

Simple Universal questions:

 

• Why am I?

• Where am I?

• How am I?

• What am I?

• Who am I?

• When am I?

And Yes, it does come back to the idea of Relativism because the avg. person's answers to these questions would reflect that.

[Socod_badne]

Kheyr,

 

Why is it you always go at pains to be SOL's undisputed sanctimonuous prig?

[Taliban]

Originally posted by Khayr:

According to the Mufasirun like Imam Baydawi, Qurtabi and Qushari, the workd Kamal in the ayat is in reference to the completion of the Risalah/Message of the Rasul (sallahu caliyhe wasilm)

Of those three, I am only familiar with imam Abu Abdullah Al-Qurtubi, if he's the one you meant to be "Qurtabi." However, I do not have his tafsir of the Qur'an, therefore, I do not know if what you have claimed about his (and the others) tafsir of the word "Kamal" is true. Until you provide a link or two substantiating your claim, I will treat this part of your comment a claim that needs proof. Also, provide the full names of Imam Baydawi and Qushari.

 

Originally posted by Khayr:

and infact when the Hadrat Omar heard this he started weeping out of sorrow because he knew that the Rasul (sallahu caliyhe wasilm's) time with the Sahaba would soon come to an end.

His reaction wasn't that Islam is Perfect or that because they are Muslim, that salvation is guaranteed for them. Certainely, Hadrat Umar was not of that frame of mind.

Is what you have written your personal analysis of Hadrat Omar's reaction to the ayat (His reaction wasn't that Islam is Perfect), or is it what Muslims at the time have documented? Did Hadrat Omar clarify to Muslims at the time that he was reacting for the specific reason (His reaction wasn't that Islam is Perfect) you claimed?

 

Originally posted by Khayr:

So the question really is-

 

Do we misinterpret the Deen and Sentimentalize it?

The overwhelming majority of Muslims, about 90%, who are Sunnis, believe Islam is a perfect religion. They also believe the Qur'an is a miracle, perfect, unalterable, incorruptible and immutable, because it's protected by Allah. The tafsir or interpretation of the Qur'an by great Muslim scholars, jurists, theologians and ulemas such as imam Maliki, imam Shafi'i, imam Hanbali, imam Hanafi, ibn Ali al-Zeylai, ibn Taymiyyah, ibn Qayyim, ibn Kathir, ibn Baz, ibn Abdillaah As-Sumaalee and many others througout the Islamic history support what Muslims believe about Islam being a perfect religion.

 

The remaining 10% of Muslims, of which 9.5% are Shia, and 0.5% compromise of micro/nano sects and cults (such as the Qur'an alones), have a different interpretation of the Deen. For example, the Shia believe the Qur'an has been tampered with and is imperfect. The Qur'an alones also believe the Qur'an has been tampered with and a Coptic messenger named Richard Khalifa was sent to them in order to enlighten them and purify the Qur'an by erasing two ayats from it. The Ismailis, the Bahais, the Yazidis, the Druzes and others also have different beliefs and interpretations. So, yes, those 10% of Muslims misinterpreted and sentimentalized the Deen.

 

Originally posted by Khayr:

Why is it necessary for some to claim that Islam is Perfect or whatever their religion or madhab might be?

It's not about claiming; it's about believing. Believing Islam is a perfect religion is central to the beliefs of 90% of Muslims.

 

Originally posted by Khayr:

Allah is Perfection all else not being Him, is not Perfect. The very fact that Islam can be defined is a testament to its limitation because at the end of the day, it is not Allah but a WAY to Allah.

The Qur'an is Allah's Words; Allah's Words cannot be imperfect. Your claim that Islam is Allah is incorrect; Islam is Allah's message and guidance to mankind. The 90% of Muslims I have mentioned never claim(ed) Islam is Allah; they say and believe Islam is Allah's message and guidance to mankind. In case if you don't understand Islam; saying Islam is Allah isn't the same as saying Islam is Allah's message and guidance to mankind.

 

Originally posted by Khayr:

The Quran are the Words of Allah but it does not encompass ALLAH and ALL knowledge of ALLAH. It contains a particular message that is enough for Mankind until the Qiymah. A message that if followed, we can attain Salvation.

Is "does not encompass" your philosophical/personal viewpoint, or is it what great Muslim scholars, jurists, theologians or ulemas teach or taught? If the later, quote one or two of them.

[xax]

I think most people fear what they don’t understand. To my knowledge, not all Sufis chant on top of hills or make a habit of committing shirk. And neither is Sufism its own sect in Islam, but rather part of existing Islamic sects. Sin is a Sin no matter which Madhab or sect of Islam you follow and there are more ways of getting from A to B then one road. Sufism in my experience focuses on reflection and contemplation to draw closer to God, That’s not say they don’t pray, or fast or fulfil any of their other obligations but in fact they try to do more. Sufi is the person who fasts outside of Ramadan, who wakes up extra early to pray before fajar, and who tries to spend most of his day in contemplation of Allah, by dikir, prayer etc.. Although Sufism is now days becoming more associated with dancing around in a trans instead of worship, we must not let hippies and ‘alternative’ people in seek of all that’s ‘exocitc’ dictate to us the construct of our faith. Real Sufism is not about getting high and putting yourself in a trans in the outback of Morocco, skipping prayer, or committing any form of shirk. Real Sufism is seeking to be closer to Allah by increasing worship. And just as you find Sunni Muslims who follow the sharia committing all types of sin, you can also find someone who calls himself a Sufi and is also misguided. So let’s try to judge Sufism by its meaning and not the example of people.

 

Allah knows best.

[Sharif_seylaci]

exactly sufisme is the right way it is sunni you know its not shiaite or somehting

[Changed]

Quote "I hope we realize the great lesson in Imam Abu Haneefah's statement and stop arguing while wishing the other person is misguided... The purpose behind everythin we talk about should be guiding others not causing them further misguidance..!"

 

Jazalallah....I could not agree with you anymore

 

Hey I had a question to Kheyr... Why isnt Islam Pefect? Islam is derived from the Quran and we all know the Quran is the worlds of Allah. Allah is Perfect therefore Islam is Pefect ... Muslims arent Perfect on the other hand. Islam being perfect doesnt Discredit Allah and his powers...