Muhammad Posted November 12, 2003 Asalamu Alaykum - Ramadan Kariim » Next Question 1. who founded the mughal empire in south asia? 2. how long have they ruled? 3. what is the most famous building in India they have built(not Masjids)? » peace Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sophist Posted November 12, 2003 Salamu Aalaikum Ikhwaani Fil Caqiida, Sayfulahi Al Maslull, walaal, Brother you threading a dangerous road that may lead to precariousness situation. The question who was right and who was wrong (the fight between the Sahabah) is quietly rightly answered by the Ulumaa'u Salaf Saalih. Ibnu Taymiyah speaks about it comprehensively in his Fatawaa and also in a book called Iqtidaa'u Siraatul Mustaqiim can Muqaalafatu Ahlu Jaxiim. So as his student Ibnu qayim, Iqaathatul haafaan (not sure the complete title) the concluded thoughts on this issue that we can not formulate a judgment upon the Sahabah, we are Khalaf and they are Salaf; it is matter that is entirely up to Allah Subna Lahu Tacaalaa. What makes you think you can judge the matter better that those Uluma who came before us? The whole of Salaf kept quite about this, and called it wasqtu Fitna. We the current Muslims have other matters far important to discuss then what went between the Sahaba, that is history and unlike the history that is taught in western insttutions, this is one that needs not any speculation. There is no need to formulate any hukum on this brother. You can learn from the history without lebbeling the part of the Sahabah some sort of lunatics. Mucaawiya was great Sahabi Radiyalu Canhu so as Ali Radiyallahu canhu (I am quite suspicious the over usage of Karamalahu Wajha, the Suna- the practice- of the Salaf a Saalhi was to say Radiyalahu canhu when a member of the Sahab's name was mentioned. However, the Shia, especially the Imaamiyah, invented this term Karamalahu Wajhu because they want to elevate the possition of Ali above that of the Rest of the Sahabah including Abu Bakar, Omar and Uthman; so we can say this is muxadatha, as in invention). It is futile exercise to busy onself on the issue. The matter has been solved and that is it. We are not judges and we certainly have no legal knowledge to pass a verdict on this case. Secondly, On the matter of who elected Abu Bakar, you can read the detailed account in all the books of History of Ahlu Suna Wal Jamaaca, Taariikhu Dabari, Albidaaya Wanihaaya Ibnu Kathiiir. Ali was not even in the picture, the seat was between Omar and Abu Bakar. Further, when the prophet SCW was ill, he asked Abu Bakar to lead the Prayer, this was indicative of his sucession. Brother, walaai this khatar. Just read those authentic books and the matter will be cleared Insha Allah. Walahu Aclam bisawaab Sophist Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rahima Posted November 13, 2003 Sophist, jazaakum Allahu Khayr akhi . That was well put and may Allah bless you for the clarification. Many a Muslims fail to understand that we are not in a position to speak ill of the saxaba who were the best of generations. Often this is a trait of the shia- i should know i have first hand experience. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sayfulaah-almasluul Posted November 13, 2003 to SOPHIST. THANX for ur freat effort to try enlight us about what happened between sahaba which of course we can't by pass,walaal i think the history is quite an informative lesson that we should all learn from it,mistake happened but the history is there for us inorder not to repeat these mistakes again. Brother you threading a dangerous road that may lead to precariousness situation. The question who was right and who was wrong (the fight between the Sahabah) is quietly rightly answered by the Ulumaa'u Salaf Saalih. walaal agree with u that so many ulima spoke about things that happend between sahaba,so many of them adviced the people not to speak or even interfair with this matter,however there are quite large number of moslims scholar who openly discuss and debate the issue in lengh,among those who conperensively and detailey talked about these matter is sheikh sa'iid ayuub .in his book ma'aallim al-fitan he talked in lengh what happened and why and how?i am sure as everyone do that sahaba were not macsuumiin they were people who can make mistakes,they did make mistake.the battle in which thousands of moslim lives were lost was part of their mistakes.the battle of jamal,the battle of sifeyn,the battle of karbala in which prophet's grand son husein killed!!!!was this all happened just like that or it was as a result of policies and rules being emplemented by some and opposed by others? and here comes aquestion if the sahaba were right on whatever they did,why do we have to oppose the somali civil war?was there any justfication of what happened? What makes you think you can judge the matter better that those Uluma who came before us? The whole of Salaf kept quite about this, and called it wasqtu Fitna. We the current Muslims have other matters far important to discuss then what went between the Sahaba, that is history and unlike the history that is taught in western insttutions, this is one that needs not any speculation. There is no need to formulate any hukum on this brother. walaal i never claim to have more right or entitlement to judge the maater,i am rather seeking enlightment and knowledge, i am mere student who eagerly wish to know why and what lead those early moslim to disaster.what can we learn about it?if we quitte about it then what is the benefit of history?i do not however agree with u that salaf kept quite about the matter.the sahaba theymselves talked about this,they agreed and disagreed. we live in world of illusion about our history where we can't quite sure why some thing happened.and what who did it and why he did it?some few scholars want people to remain that way.(of course almost all of them debated and eblighted the people about this mater) On the matter of who elected Abu Bakar, you can read the detailed account in all the books of History of Ahlu Suna Wal Jamaaca, Taariikhu Dabari, Albidaaya Wanihaaya Ibnu Kathiiir. Ali was not even in the picture, the seat was between Omar and Abu Bakar. Further, when the prophet SCW was ill, he asked Abu Bakar to lead the Prayer, this was indicative of his sucession. Brother, walaai this khatar. Just read those authentic books and the matter will be cleared Insha Allah. i am not suprise of ur comment about abaa bakar's election,becuase u are like any other suni taking ur views from ahlul suna sources,walaal when we are talking aboutabaa bakar election and saqiifah,we have to rememeber the circumtances that surounded it.could ali even attend the conference in which as u said abaa bakar was elected?if he did not why?who elected abaa bakar?was there any division between the attenders of that conference?between who and who was the comptetion?was it between ansaar and muhajiriin? was ali?was the prophet p.b.u.h buried at the time of conference? if not why?could alli leave the prophet p.b.u.h unattended and lobby for leadership? walaal there hundreds of question we need to acurately answer if we want to establish the truth of the matter.and unless we find concrete evidence and dalliiilis then will remain in illusion, and solution of molism division will be far and unrepairable.it is in fact hard and long way,but we have to try.moslims sufferd so much,tens of moslims are daily losting their live as a result of shiateism and sunism.many scholars spend all their energy jsut to aprove or disaprove the otherside's claim. we pray GOd to guide us all to right path. amiin apologise if any find this comment offended,and i would like to hear from my fellow nomads. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
