Somali doctor's fulfilling their role?

[Gabbal]

Jason-

 

It's true that the Goobabweyn were left alone to their farms and villages until the USC came on their genocide mission during the civil war. The Goobabweyn left their lands to escape the USC, and never came back after they settled in Bakool.

 

 

Nomadic_Activist-

 

When you apply for a citizenship in Kenya they will ask you for your qabil and if you write Ma-rahan you will be denied citizenship immediatly. This all because the Ma-rehan clan refused to sign a "peace-treaty" with the British , for the "peace-treaty" included the Ma-rehan clan giving their territory up and being governed by the British colonialist. Ugaas Doore who was the Ugaas of Gedo at that time refused to sign the treaty, because he said he would never succumb to forign rule and will never give his land freely .

Bro first limit your clan-naming (I know Maskiin and I are guilty of it, but it was in a whole different context ).

 

Second, Ugaas Maxamuud Qhalib Dhoore will always have a respectable claim to Gedo history. He was essentially the main reason why the British government seceded Jubbaland to the Italians. Treaty, after Treaty did they bestow upon him, all sent back to them ripped in pieces. The British could not manage to enter his territories without suffereing dire repercussions, and as a result they called him the Mad Mullah's Half. Here is a short story about the legendary Ugaas:

 

Sheekooyinka xiisaha leh oo inoo tilmaamaya urursanaanta qabiilka, waxaa kamid ah tii dhexmartay Ugaas Maxamuud Dhoore oo u dhashey beesha ********* iyo sarkaal talyaani ah oo masuul looga dhigay degaanka waqooyiga Juba. Sarkaalku mar uu damcay in uu tiriyo geela beelaha ********* ee ku dhaqan gobolka Gedo, ugaaska ayaa ka diiday oo ku yiri :

 

" Geela ********* oo aad tirokoobtaa waxaa kaa xiga xusulkaaga oo aad leeftaa ".

 

Sarkaalka oo aanan dareensanayn in xusulka aanan la leefi karin ayaa isku dayay in uu xusulkiisii leefo, markuu carrabka la gaari waayay ayuu ugaaskii la hadlay oo uu ku yiri :

 

" Haddii aan cududda jebiyo, markaas xusulka carrabka waan la gaarayaa ".

 

Ugaaskii : " Taas macnaheeda sow maahan in dhibaato faraha lala galo ".

 

Sarkaalkii : " Haa ".

 

Ugaaskii : " Dhibaatadaas ayaa kaa xigta geelayaga oo aad tirisaa ".

 

Beelihii ********* waxay ku shireen meel la yiraahdo Yaaq, halkaas oo ay ku guddoonsadeen in ay muddo 24 saacadood ah ay geelooda ka tallaabiyaan xuduudda. Dhacdadaas waxaa loo yaqaan Seero Goys. Talyaanigii wuxuu la yaabay sida fudud oo ay isu ururiyeen iyo degdegta ay go´aanka ku fuliyeen.

 

Sir. Kirk oo ahaa qunsul u fadhiyay dowladda Ingiriiska jasiiradda Sensibaar xilligii uu gumeysiga inoo imanayay, ayaa waraaq uu Soomaalida kaga hadlayay wuxuu ku qoray sidan :

 

" Soomaalida ku nool koonfrta Soomaaliya waxay la dhaqan yihiin kuwa waqooyiga deggan. Waa dad urursan, dagaal yahanno ah geesinimona u dheertahay oo islawayn. Sidaa darteed waa howl adag in aanu ka dhaadhicinno in aanu nahay dad ka sarreeya ". (Kirk to Granville. dispatch No. 18. January 17. 1885).

Source

 

 

Maakhir-

 

It was alrady hijacked sxb.

 

to find any Court before which they could plead that the 1897 Treaty was null and void because of the Treaties of 1884 and 1886 between the Somali tribes and British government. I.M Lewis

We understand the treaties of 1884 and 1886, but what was the treaty of 1897?

[Nomadic Activist]

Nomadic activist, the British only signed treaty with certain clans.It signed treaty with all Is.aq and D.i.r clans in 1884 at once.

My whole point was that the Ma-rehans did not sign the treaty with the British, and that was one of the main reasons they let the Italians buy Jubbaland from them.

[Bakar]

Still, you have not provided any evidence pertaining to your, which I have anticipated from the inception of this thread. To gain clear idea at the outset of the nature of our thread, it is essential to begin with an examination of what you have just postulated by enquiring validity of your source; the intent of writer/narrator; and most of all the state of society that you trying describe. As you know, history is told from manifold of perspectives, and is used to shape the thinking and regulate the life of the intended group/society. Also, must I remind you that the influences that have formed narrator are the same as those which have moulded the events that constitute the matter of his story? By inquiring the intent of the narrative, one may discover that your aim is nothing more than misleading historical presentation to posterity.

 

Taasi waxay iga ahayd in aan ku socono qaabab hostoriga loo qoro, iyadoo la adeegsnayo “xeerar akadeemiga ah. Ma aha wax kasta uqorn amaba usheegno Ugaas hebel baan ka soo wariney.

 

 

HonAfrique says:

 

Aan ka bilawno boqortoyadii la odhanjiray Ajuuraan. Hadii taariikh dhab ah la eegayo, Ajuuraanki jiri jiray saldhigooda mahayn Qelaafo ama nawaaxigeeda ee waxay ahayd dhulalka ka mid ah gobolada Bay iyo Bakool.

 

Xageed ka soo aroorisey iney Ajuuranku ay saldhigooda ahayd Bay iyio Bakool, cajiib? Dadka ajuuranka ah waxay saldhigoodu ahayd meela badan ay kamid tahay Xamar ilaa iyo jawhar iyo inta dhankaas ka ah. Ajuuranku way yimaaden dhulka Digil iyo Mirfle (Baardheere ilaa bakool) ayogoo kazoo baxsedy dagaaladii ay lagaleen qolooyinka kale.

 

 

Ma doonayi inaan dadka meel xun uga dhaco laakiin dad badan oo Soomaaliyeed ayaa u haystaan dadka la yidhaa Digle iyo Mirifle inaysan Soomaali asal aheyn oo ay yahiin dad Soomaalized laga dhigay waagii Oromada dhulka laga kacinayay.

 

I believe this requires another thread. Because, you are delving into a different realm, which needs investigative research. Here you are dealing people with different language and culture. Let’s not venture that, for I know that you are going to disappoint me again.

 

 

Gasaargude waxay kazoo jeedan qowmiyada Digil iyo Mirifle, ayaga ayaana kusoo dejiye dhulka, sida taariikhda runta ah sheegeyso. Laakiinse waad caasideen. Dhulkana waxaa lagu gartaa magacyada ay leeyihiin hadaad dooneyso inaad taariihkdey leeyihiin aad fahantid.

 

Waqti mahayo, waan kuso noqon here-say aad meesha ku haysid mar kale

[Gabbal]

waan kuso noqon here

Plz don't I think I overestimated your awood in this topic. If I had known the value of your debate, I would have just brushed off your first scathing post.

 

Still, you have not provided any evidence pertaining to your, which I have anticipated from the inception of this thread. To gain clear idea at the outset of the nature of our thread, it is essential to begin with an examination of what you have just postulated by enquiring validity of your source; the intent of writer/narrator; and most of all the state of society that you trying describe.

The inception of my thread had to do with the mission of a doctor in Galgadud, not about the topic on Gedo that you had led it to. The rest I gather you are a new college student?

 

qowmiyada

Pardon my nonsense, but there is only one Somali-affiliated group that uses that lahjad. I am guessing you are of the other equation of the two groups that are fighting for Ceel-Waaq?

 

If so, dambi ma lihid

[Young Jeezy]

Fiiri dhulkaan aad sheeganeesid hadaa dad ka kicise adiga maxaa kussiiye adiga hadaa sidaa dadka uga kicise iyo si lamid ah lagaaga kiciye? Dad boqolaal sano magaalo soo degnaa ayaa maanta kuleedahay dhulkaan malihidee inagaa leh waayo waa baan degnaan jirne. Waxaas aqligal ma aha saaxib! Beelaha soomaliyeed beel degan dhulkaan ay kasoo faracmeen maba jirto ee waxay wada deganyihiin dhul ay xoog misa si kale(demographics) ku qabsadeen. Besides there is no recorded history of the region so there is no point in arguing over something when all you can provide as evidence is what your parents and relatives have related to you. :lol:

[Bakar]

Jalle HonAfrique says:

 

Plz don't think I overestimated your awood in this topic. If I had known the value of your debate, I would have just brushed off your first scathing post.

 

When did I ever give that impression? I thought I was the pupil, and you were the educator. Akhi, I am just questioning your line of reasoning and historical representation. Do you really expect me to go along with your subjective views and digest them? I am aware the fact that there are some individuals in this thread who share somewhat similar views. And, then, there are those who treat what you have advanced as dim and hazy forms of historical apprehension. So pardon me if I do not subscribe to fallacious narration, which Hiiraale people use as means to distort the history of both the land and its habitant--rightful owners.

 

The inception of my thread had to do with the mission of a doctor in Galgadud, not about the topic on Gedo that you had led it to.

 

This is what you wrote:

 

Dad badan oo kakal imanaya deegaannada ka tirsan gobolka Galgaduud ayaa ku soo qul qulaya degmada Ceel waaq si ay uga faa’iidaystaan hawshaasi indho fiiqida .

 

War ma anaa waalan mise cadan baa laga heesaya Sxb caadi aa tahay aan filaa. unless u are in a denail

 

 

The rest I gather you are a new college student?

 

I am gonna have to let this one slide.

 

Pardon my nonsense, but there is only one Somali-affiliated group that uses that lahjad. I am guessing you are of the other equation of the two groups that are fighting for Ceel-Waaq?

 

Is that a paranoia, i am sensing? Akhii, i think you have the tendency of projecting your inner reality into others. Or is that another way of diverting the discusion at hand?

 

If so, dambi ma lihid

 

Then, does that mean i have a genuine claim to Ceel Waaq. If so, then why are Hiirraal people claiming the land that never belong to them? Why are they carrying such atrocity against innocent people?

[Bakar]

Originally posted by Jason:

Waxaas aqligal ma aha saaxib! Beelaha soomaliyeed beel degan dhulkaan ay kasoo faracmeen maba jirto ee waxay wada deganyihiin dhul ay xoog misa si kale(demographics) ku qabsadeen. lol:

Sheekadii geela lama kala laha miyaa? Qofkii dhacsada ayaa iska leh :rolleyes:

 

So are you saying that these peopple are morally and religiously corrupted, and they have no respect for humanity, and seizing possession of another muslim and maintain control over them is their means of survival. In other words, what is happening in those regions is justfiable. Jason, this is the implication of your last post.

[Xudeedi]

Hornafrique, the 1897 treaty was the Anglo-Ethiopian treaty in which the English gave ****** and Haud regions to Ethiopia 15 years after Haile Selassie became the emperor. It came into force in the 28th June of 1954. Among the articles of the treaty included, " • All territory is crown land and only Ethiopians can own land-- Somali farmers must become Ethiopian citizens if they wish to retain their land ."

 

Hence, the Somali delegates were arguing of the betrayal of the British government by signing an agreement with Ethiopia to which we weren't a signatory party.

 

I think Professor Ismaciil explains well of the whole 1897 treaty and its Somali opposition, which was the purpose of the delegates, better than I.M Lewis.

 

The British tried to justify their perfidy by citing an Anglo-Ethiopian Agreement which had been concluded and signed in 1897 and to which we were not a party. Most agreements are, however, subject to

rebus sic stantibus

and the British could have – perhaps would have – allowed that agreement to fall into desuetude and become a dead letter had we ourselves been sufficiently educated and vigilant We would have foreseen and blocked all the Anglo-Ethiopian conspiracies by which our lands were surreptitiously transferred. Under the treaties of protection our forefathers signed with Britain we were supposed to be protected, not sold to the Ethiopians or any other power for that matter. And to add insult to injury the

delegation we sent in 1955

to the British government and the UN to reverse the transfer of the Haud and Reserved Area by invoking those treaties was told that such treaties had no validity in International Law because we were not sovereign.

Link

[Nomadic Activist]

then why are Hiirraal people claiming the land that never belong to them?

And what proof do you have that "Hiiraale's people" are "claiming" land that doesn't belong to them? I hope it isn't those kutiri-kuteen story fabricate by some delusional old man.The term "claiming" is hysterical to me because "Hiiraale's people" are the ones who live and dominet those places (Celi-waaq and gedo), or are you messing up "Hiiraale's people" with those from Mooyaale who are indeed the ones claiming Celi-waaq and the rest of Gedo :cool:

[Gabbal]

Originally posted by Bakar:

 

If so, dambi ma lihid

 

Then, does that mean i have a genuine claim to Ceel Waaq. If so, then why are Hiirraal people claiming the land that never belong to them? Why are they carrying such atrocity against innocent people?

So this is where it comes down to? Who is carrying out atrocities to whom is subject to opinion or whether there are atrocities even being carried out. The Ceel-Waaq problem is complex and was neither forseen nor started by Barre Hiiraale. Those who study the root cause of the problem know it has much to do with parliamentary seats in the Kenyan parliament concerning various Somali clans and Somali-affliated clans and whatever alliance they hold. It also has much to do with current Somali parliamentary dictations and the value of having cradible deegaan in the Somali Republic to be included permenantly in the future convening of the Somali parliament post-transitional era. So you can therefore understand the almost fanatical claim to Ceel-Waaq coming from the groups who have deegaan in and around Mooyaale and Nageyle. If you can't understand the importance of my latter sentences, I don't see the need to evaluate.

 

This is what you wrote:

 

Dad badan oo kakal imanaya deegaannada ka tirsan gobolka Galgaduud ayaa ku soo qul qulaya degmada Ceel waaq si ay uga faa’iidaystaan hawshaasi indho fiiqida .

 

War ma anaa waalan mise cadan baa laga heesaya [smile] Sxb caadi aa tahay aan filaa. unless u are in a denail

First, I didn't write the article, and second, the name "Ceel-Waaq" was mistakenly written in place of "Cabudwaq". I mean, of course, the article was talking about Galgadud, which is not anywhere near Gedo, right?

 

So pardon me if I do not subscribe to fallacious narration, which Hiiraale people use as means to distort the history of both the land and its habitant--rightful owners.

Walaal qalad baa gashay. The people of Gedo do not have any reason to distort any history of Gedo nor of its inhabitants, because they are the rightful owners. The case of the Shabellas is known throughout, why not Gedo? Because no one, my friend, occupies anything except the houses and lands their families have lived in for over hundred years and some. The people you allege where commited atrocities against in Ceel-Waaq have no saldhig in Gedo and only live in the border area. They are remanents of an older nation in southern Ethiopia and have no reason to claim Gedo nor any lands contained within it.

 

MAAKHIR-

 

Thanx for the information bro. Aad baan u gartay. The only question I have is, the Reserved Area infact means Wardheer Region right?

[Bakar]

Nomadic Activist says

 

And what proof do you have that "Hiiraale's people" are "claiming" land that doesn't belong to them?

 

I suppose your question does not beg for historical fact, reason being the proof is within the subsequent statement, though your initial intent was to use it as “counter argument†Let me quote it so that you will know where the proof lay.

 

You said:

 

Hiiraale's people" are the ones who live and dominet those places (Celi-waaq and gedo)

 

Now let us define the term domination .

 

Domination according to the dictionary is:

 

a. "Control or power over another or others."

b. " The exercise of such control or power."

c. " social control by dominating. "

 

It is my conjecture that this term can only be used in relation to causal connection. The cause in this case being the aggressor and the effect is aggressed. So when you say Hiiraale people dominate, it is indicative of injustice and repugnance of the people whom you are so fervently supportive of. As I said in my in earlier post, the truth will always remain sustainable--in spite of--our attempt to suppress it. We make choices at times even if these choices contradic the tenates of truth--Islam. It will always surface, but we choose to stand the opposite side.

 

After being a long time member in SOL, i came to realize that in spite of the degree of certitude and reliability someone els's material carries, every discussion/debate ends up in circle. I believe MMA tried to share his view one this discussion, and the respond he got from HonAfriques was abviously an indicative of the nature of those whose scope are confined to mythology pervaded by their predecessors.

 

 

PS. above definition is used to support my argument and rather not Condescend anyone. I am the last person to Criticize someone else' writing.

[Nomadic Activist]

I was wondering were you got "over another or others." from?

To control, govern, or rule by superior authority or power

 

That is the meaning of "dominate, and it doesn't include "over another or others"."And walal are you saying that "Hiiraale's people" aren't the ones who control(dominate) Gedo?

 

As Horn said you must the other equation (the ones who aren't "Hiiraale's people") of the two groups that are fighting for Celi-Waaq, so I understand were your coming from.

[Xudeedi]

Horn, the reserved area stretches from our border with Ethiopia, starting from Awdal region up to Sool into Wardheer and beyond, i believe.

 

 

Like British Jubaland (From Kismayo to Liboi) was proposed to be given to Kenya but SYL fought hard to retain this part of our land.

[Bakar]

HonAfrique-

 

I am very reluctant referring you that avatar. But, nevertheless, it never meant to signify your trait.

 

This what your wrote

 

The Ceel-Waaq problem is complex and was neither forseen nor started by Barre Hiiraale.

 

So u are saying that his people occupied the areas as peacekeepers, and their latent ambition isn’t snatching lands? Good one, sxb. :confused:

 

Those who study the root cause of the problem know….

 

Again you are politicising the barbaric act and treat as an intricate political situation.

 

it has much to do with parliamentary seats in the Kenyan parliament concerning various Somali clans and Somali-affliated clans and whatever alliance they hold. It also has much to do with current Somali parliamentary dictations and the value of having cradible deegaan in the Somali Republic to be included permenantly in the future convening of the Somali parliament post-transitional era.

 

Then, according to your statements, you are admitting that it is a pretext for engaging war against innocent people and pushing them out of their lands.

 

If you can't understand the importance of my latter sentences, I don't see the need to evaluate.

 

True. I concur with you on this one. I fail to see the need to assess them. Because you constructed some sort of validation in support of immoral conduct. And if you don’t mind me asking, what is the political reason for the presence of Hiiraalaysha in Baardheere, Luuq, and all the other regions? Please do come up another “complex†political shrewdness, because I am beginning to find it very entertaining.

[Emperor]

***** In circles, No where to an end ******