Somaliland's incapability to gain recognition and its incompetent leadership

[LANDER]

I am not referring directly to Riyaale, but I am concerned with the pace the country is moving at. I feel there are 3 major obstacles that are holding back Somaliland, and these are not necessarily ones you’d expect.

 

3)Both national and international politics-(i.e. Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Djibouti, other Somalis etc…)

2)Territorial integrity and defining clear borders-(including dispute about Sool and parts of Saanag)

 

1)Charismatic leadership-international and national diplomacy, improving national infrastructure, improving defence etc….

 

 

I am pressed for time but feel free to post your own views on obstacles faced by Somaliland and how we can deal with them.

[Xassan Nasra Allah]

since you have figured out the facts, then why don't you do the rationale thing and stop this independance HOOHAA ?

 

READ my lips, IT will NEVER happen, so the sooner you guys accept the absolute reality, the better we will all be.

[BN]

Lander,

 

It's obvious that the more experience politician and statesman with charisma is SILANYO. But who knows if he would of had more sucess both locally and internationally in arguing the case for seperation. But it is obvious that Riyaal et al are incompetent and are doing a disservice to their people.

 

P.S. Does this mean that you are having second thoughts about secession?

[Gediid]

Xassan said

 

READ my lips, IT will NEVER happen, so the sooner you guys accept the absolute reality, the better we will all be.

Walee xaalkaagu waa NIN DAD QAADEY XUMBO CUSKEY Somaliland should be the least of your worries.The quicker you recognise that the better for all.

[rudy-Diiriye]

lemme put my 2cents. i would like ce this.

 

all east africa to unite in one nation and kick the ass of following countries.

egypt, saudi arabia and yemen. and let them pays for all the ppl they stole as slaves since the dawn of civilization... u ce pay back is *****!!

word!!

[LANDER]

Bari_Nomad for once we do agree, I would've like to see Siilanyo in power, just to test the difference between him and the Ciigaal/Riyaale camp. But the fact of matter right now is that Riyaale is in power and the rest of Somalilanders have to do whatever it takes to take their country forward regardless of who's in power. I do feel though that he is dragging his feet, alot of people said before the election that it would be disastrous for Riyaale to gain power. I will give him the benefit of the doubt as long as he gets off his lazy a**.

Now lets pretend we are all advisors to the government in Somaliland, where do you think the national policy should be headed?

1-I think we should start by improving infrastructures whitin the country (i.e. Hargeisa hospital, building roads in Burco)

 

2-We should reach out to the people of Sool and eastern Sanaag and offer basic social services over there.(if they don't already exit)

We cannot assume these territories are under our sovereignty unless we are directly involved and have a presence their. Also the people should not feel marginalise as compared to the rest of the country.

 

3-We should definetely come up with a solution to define CLEARLY the borders so we can implement some basics of sovereignty. There are already some checkpoints but we have to improve on that.

 

 

FEEL FREE TO COME UP WITH OTHER IDEAS PPL.........

 

p.s. RUDY i like your passion sxb, maybe in the futur somalis will be GREAT as you describe. I don't see that happening anytime soon though.

[Coloow]

Lander, what do you mean by holding back? Does a nation's development depend on recognition????

 

why is independence so important? my believe is that as long as you have food in the mouth of the citizens, social equality and a judiciary system that is fair, you don't need recognition or independence!

 

Unless independence and recognition bring with them hard currency in the form of foreign aid which certainly would murder the nation, then there is no need for one

[LANDER]

Entrepreneur,

I never said the only reason somaliland was being held back was a lack of recognition. I agree with you a nation needs not be recognized to function properly, and I even go a step further and wish for Somaliland to accelerate basic government functions, despite not having international backing. (i.e. improving infracstuctures, establishing sovereignty over borders etc...)

[miles-militis]

Lander, since you are the more logical one amongst many on the secessionist corner, who is we re: “we deserve better”? What is your definition of present day Somaliland? If you could answer that question for me, and be as definitive as you could possibly be, then we will have made a progress in the right path, and perhaps indulge you in approaching such worthy issues as “Incapable and incompetent leadership, establishing institutions, government agencies, defining border, sovereignty over borders, the issue concerning SS&H etc”.

[LANDER]

Samurai,

When I say “we” I refer to all the populations living within the borders of Somaliland declared may 18th 1991. No matter their tribal backgrounds, political stance or historical

Allegiance. Before you take this chance to jump to another debate let me state to you some my understanding of the present day situation in Somaliland. First of all, I cannot give you a definitive answer on the situation in Somaliland simply because the sources we all have for information tend to distort some of the fact to each their own degree, and that is why I don’t like to jump to conclusions. The only way I could give you definitive answers about the situation in SS&H would be for me to spend significant time in those regions (i.e.Las Canood, Erigawo, Bulhodle). So the best any of us can do is make educated guess’ based on conflicting information, and so I will state you mine. I believe there is a majority (how slight or large remains to be determined) in Sool that is currently against Somaliland sovereignty, Sanaag and Hawd also have some opposition however, the Percentage in Sanaag is not nearly as significant as the one in Sool . That being said, I still believe all these regions can effectively remain under the sovereignty of Somaliland. There will always be opposition when one declares independence, just like George Washington had to contend with the loyalist, any leader of Somaliland would

Be obliged to undertake a similar task. But for those regions to effectively remain in Somaliland sovereignty, I think the government needs to stop dragging its feet and start investing all their money, effort and time in improving all regions of the nation. Infrastructures and social services would be a great place to start. I believe these efforts would also face some serious security threats (i.e. Puntland loyal militias), and maybe security should be the first issue to be handled before infrastructures etc… Either way, case point of all this being that ALL people of the Somaliland regions “deserve better”. I will remain optimistic that the government and private citizens will see to it.

[miles-militis]

Very good indeed! It appears we are making progress now, and here is where the trouble lies. I shall address a couple of points in your piece for simplicity. The desire of what could have been, or should have been is generally accepted as untenable, thus shall not bother with what you reckon the Riyaale government will or should do years to come.

 

Though Somaliland of the old under the British colony comprised of a terrain approximating 5 (Awdal which was a district under the NorthWest region municipality & Sool part of Nugaal were the creation of the military regime) of the 18 regions of Somalia including SS&H, Somaliland of the present which is of interest in the discussion is a monster of a different kind: a tribal-hinged enclave deep in turmoil with neither the political leadership, resources, nor cohesive, significant structure of tangible substance of any kind. It, Somaliland of the present comprises of Hargeysa, Togdheer (excluding Buuhoodle, which was once the biggest district though now a region, Hawd under the Puntland administration), and arguably Awdal. And the “we” therefore excludes the people of SS&H including myself.

 

Irrespective of what is being spewed out on public forums, Somalia including SS&H do not consider Somaliland a reality rather a mere dream which run its natural course, hit aground, and had outlasted the goal of its initial thinkers the last of which was the late Egal who in broad day light in Washington DC of all places hung his gloves for the bout was conceded. This I do not think is what you want to hear, but then reality in general is not that comforting, is it?

 

Now, do you see how far apart you promoting pro-secessionist ideologies stationed in Hargeysa, and I, a pro-federalist situated in Lascanood, are on the simple definition of the issue? Why is this crucial you may wonder? It is so for it has to be noted that without SS&H, there is no Somaliland. A fact which none of you are brave enough, or willing to accept so as to let the past go and live in the future. Do we agree on that? Or do you have an approach of else? If so, please share before we get ahead of ourselves delving into matters social, governmental, institutional, historical, developmental, structural, legality and legitimacy.

 

Distorted of course only to the bamboozled willing to believe anything and everything resembling what the mind desires, and to the few who are cut off from the actuality on the ground, but not to the sons and daughters of the region who are fully in touch with reality.

 

Shall look forward to reading your responses on these matters.

So long!

[LANDER]

Samurai,

Notice how in my last posting I tried to stay as objective as possible when stating facts on the ground. Even more, I think I gave the opposition towards Somaliland a little bit more credit just for the sake of finding common ground. I wish I could say the same for you sxb. Your spewing the same discourse heard many times coming from the so-called government in Puntland. Your post is similar to the verbosity one can read on puntlandstate.com, so please ease up on the rhetoric I think your starting to miss the point of this particular thread.

[miles-militis]

Ok, Lander, “ Facts. So-called government in Puntland. Puntland loyal militias, Verbose read on Puntalndstate.com ” these I do not consider the words of a man who wishes to remain objective on the issues; having said that, I am willing to take your word for it, give you credit for a mature, respectable discourse devoid of any assumption of your intent on my part, thus extend you the benefit of the doubt. Believe me when I say it your purported facts are far from the truth.

 

Whist still on the issue of SS&H which I regard very much pertinent, very clever of you to have dodged to comment on a query in one my earlier postings: “ ….a simple question would be which administration provides public services such as institution building (that of organising townships and rural terrain in self-governing mode), allocating resources for the maintenance of state establishment including banks (Laascaanod’s primary bank opened a couple of month ago since 1991), government residences such town halls, local offices etc., tax anthology though infant yet rapidly taking shape, police forces to sustain order, promotion of the private sector, grass roots public cohesion and endorsement of the system of government in place, and above all enumerating the overall desire of the public in the aforementioned regions – a federal system of government in Somalia?” Do you care to venture an opinion here? This is to substantiate the basis of my argument and the rationale for my reasoning.

 

Still on the issue, I will give you a scenario – On one hand proponents who desire a republic in Northwestern regions of Somalia who share many similarities with centralist, thus in principal secessionist camp want to break away from Somalia with no legally binding, logically acceptable, historically or authoratively justifiable valid reasoning of any kind other than colonial legacy whereas on the other supporters of federal system of government though tussle with the irrational behaviour on the part of the former group accept the will of the people in Hargeysa & Burco for it is a strongly held believe that one ought to be allowed to determine one’s destiny, future and with whom one desires to associate. But what is disturbing about the secessionist camp’s fanaticism with respect to the object of their desire is their unfortunate realisation and indisposition to accept the will and desire of the people in Somalia in general, SS&H in particular. An issue one would never find them in their illusive maneuvering willing to approach head-on. Surprise me, if you could.

 

Nonetheless, let agree that we shall not agree upon the issue of SS&H at least for the moment as I trust the fate of the regions along with its future will eternally have been sealed shortly.

 

Now, perhaps we could address some of the problems you have raised including the viability of a self-sufficient, and not foundered upon the premise of foreign aid and grants, republic with fully fledged, functional institutions providing, and sustaining public and social service crucial to its existence in all aspects; lack of autocratic leadership, which are missing from the scene in the region in its entirety, equipped to address pressing issues such as institutional, social, financial etc; adverse influence and pressure from regional governments opposed to a such initiative for fear of opening Pandora’s box; inherent difficulties that will have been confronting a country with limited resources, if any; the issue of settlement of multibillion, and accruing debts in hard currency owed to governments and multinational financial institution by the old republic; just to name a few.

 

Pick one, let us develop it, and let us hope to remain objective so as to we keep out sanity.

 

Until then so long!

[xiis]

To Jack and company,

 

If you people can't handle a debate then don't engage in one. Why are you so afraid of my post? Perhaps I touched a nerve. Nevertheless, let me repeat to you the will of the majority of Somaliland is sacred and your recalcitrant minority in Sool will be dealt with in due time. Like it or not their will be a war if you people continue on this path so forget about any reconciliation or federalism but be ready for the consequences of your actions. However, on my part I would very much like to avoid further bloodshed among Somalis, but it seems your side is pushing our buttons on a daily basis. So don't cry when the big payback comes your way. Let me inform you there is a significant portion of our people who are itching for a Mogadisho-like revenge against your people, because rightly or wrongly they see you people as collectively responsible for the actions of your uncles afweyne, dafle, tuke, morgan, and many more like them that you consider heros. So you see my lad our differences are irreconciliable especially with a futile cyber debate. Such conflicts as ours are unfortunately only settled by the barrel of the gun. When that day comes may Allah help us all especially the women and children. But I hope for a speedy victory for Somaliland of course just like you would for your Puntland. I regret that matters have come to this point, but unfortunately I see no other choice for us. It is a national imperative that we must safeguard our territorial integrity at any cost and emphasize ANY COST. I have no illusions of what kind of war this will be. It will be a dirty civil war that will spill over way beyond the borders of Somaliland and Puntland even to the safety of our diaspora communities. It will pit mother against son, husband against wife, cousin against cousin, friend against friend. In short it will be a dirty war. For all our sakes come to your sense and start a dialogue with us NOW.

[India]

Lander walalo,

 

Trying to reason with some is impossible, you gave Mr Samuri a chance and all the while he remains the oppostion--opposed to that is, to reality and thruth. I dont know much about Sool, but this claim to Hawd and Sanaag is just redicules. I am rer "hawd" and I tell you that they are (95%) most fierce of Somalilanders, so this accliam by others to hawd is dumbfounding. And really this claim needs to be put a stop to because it can start a civil unrest back home and Mr Samuri " Biyo kabadn iyo gacamo kabad way ku qaadan".

 

 

On the issue of Somaliland and progression. I think we shall endavour to get as far as we can with getting recoginition. A established state that will not be another needy african nation will surely be a good start and make a case for seccession easier. I know that Dahir Riyale is not have as good as Mr Silanyo however we are stuck with him and thus must rally behind the new government. Athough am new to the Somliland politics am moved by how much my people have struggled and mansha-allah how they are doing today and this vowed to take active interest in affairs back home.

 

Now,

Having read the three main parties manifesto's I have to say i felt the best team (the men of actions were Kulimye) and would have had my vote, the camp is full movers and shakers and veterns snm-men who were willing to die for thier country and who were still willing to serve thier country-bless--I salute the SNM-they are my heroes.

The best Ideologies/manifesto were presented by UCID-although impressed by the number of young UCID members it was at the same time evident that the lacked experience and vision.

UDUB, I felt were a 50/50 camp, 50 that were dodgy and unaccountable and very much the ol school. The we "always" do things this way punch and those who have obviously learned alot from "allah yarhmu" Cigaal and thus know how to play the game well .

 

Looking at the lot above it is obvious in my opinion that Kulmiye would have made a considerable ground in moving things the right way. I hope Dahir's system does not become the platform of future S/L leaders. I think the country as whole need a infusion yound talented sisters like moi.

 

However, as they say "ask not what your country can do 4 u but what you can do for your country".

 

The eucational system is slowly improving and this is one area were we the Somalilanders can i.e -lobby for charties at your host country

-start a sponsership programme were say numberof people sponser the wages of schools back

home.