A Political Quagmire Sprouting in Somaliland

[African]

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: Here we go, here we go, here we goooo...one nil, one nil, one nil....

 

Originally posted by Yasima

Came down boys - take deep breath!!! Aaah!!

Relax - Now there is a somali saying that goes like this "Elephants don't see the flies on them but they always see the flies on the other Elephants"

Sister, u will hear the same song with the same chorus and with the same singers over & over again in this forum, so don't waist your energy. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[AYOUB]

Gediid

So please stop misleading people with false made up stories you pick up from Allpuntland.com......

All I can say is you believe Smith and Co you believe anything. My favourites bits must be the dodgy 'intelligence' included:

Culminating this newly formed alliance is Somalia's reenergized al-Itihad al-Islamiya - A/Qassim Salat Hassan's ARTA supporters and financiers. Chief among them are known individuals suspected of sustaining close ties with Middle East terror organizations,

also included are al-Qaeda's Horn operators and some 'most wanted men

I can't tell wether this is kissing Ucle Sam's backside or making excuses for the hoodlums gathered in Kenya over the last year or so. Who are they going to blame next?

[Baashi]

Culminating this newly formed alliance is Somalia's reenergized al-Itihad al-Islamiya - A/Qassim Salat Hassan's ARTA supporters and financiers. Chief among them are known individuals suspected of sustaining close ties with Middle East terror organizations, and which in Somalia are often associated with kidnapping and assassinations of foreign aid workers. They include Mr. Ahmed Ali Jim’aale, the recently deported from Dubai, UAE, and the chairman of the shutdown Al-Barakat Corporation (now operating as "Golis Red Sea" in Puntland, "TelSom" in Somaliland, and "Hormuud" in Mogadishu and the rest of southern Somalia); also included are al-Qaeda's Horn operators and some 'most wanted men,' chief among them Col. Hassan Dahir Aways, Mohamed Daylaaf (Mogadishu), Abbas Ali Abdi (Mogadishu), Abdullahi Warsame Yare (now operating in Dubai and is the Middle East and UAE al-Itihad group representaive), Mohamed Sheik Osman of Dalsan Hawala, Abdullahi Hussein Kaahiye "Asbaro," Ismail Hassan Kutubaweyne and Abdilatif Yusuf Barre, who all have now began fundraising and militia recruiting campaign for the new alliance.

Its totally wrong to go down this path. Labelling decent, low abiding Muslims as terrorist to score political points against your tribal rivals is sign of weakness. The individual who wrote this paragraph is trying to discredit legitimate businesses that employe many many Somalis. He is a "useful ***** " for Ethiopians and other Western powers who are capitalizing this civil war.

[miles-militis]

Mujaahid – forgive me as I mean not to be rude dear Bruv, you seem only to say what comes to mind, and do no thinking in your rationale. If I were to take your word for it ( Somaliland is not the creation of elders, but it is the creation of the people, it is them that have the final say. Very hard for you to understand I assume, since that kind of power by the people, never exist in Southern Somalia ), and believe you me I am willing old boy, how is it that the following statement is not only true but also the whole truth, nothing but the truth inter alia:

 

http://www.somalilandnet.com/somaliland_voice/opinion/0130.shtml

" In October 1992, the Guurti once again stepped in, with representatives from the ********** clan playing a lead role in peace-making. A cease-fire was agreed at the town of Sheekh, and a date fixed for a broader reconciliation conference to be held at Boorame, in western Somaliland. The Grand Boorame Conference held between January and May 1993 represents another watershed in Somaliland's recovery and development. In the absence of meaningful support, the burden for hosting the meeting was shouldered by the Boorame community. During five-months of deliberations, the 150-member Guurti, together with hundreds of delegates and observers from across Somaliland, agreed upon the following:

 

 

The peaceful transfer of power from the SNM interim government to a beel (community) based system

 

Election of a civilian president (Maxamed Xaaji Ibrahim Cigal) and a vice president (Cabdirahman aw Cali)

 

Adoption of a National Charter and a Peace Charter, intended to serve as the basis for efforts towards peace-building and state-building, during a further transitional period of two years.

 

A combination of factors including deeply rooted mistrust between clans, continuing factional discord within the SNM, the clash of powerful egos, and international interests, all came into play when the Boorame process moved from conference hall to the proving grounds of Somaliland in mid-1993.11 By November 1994, these tensions had erupted into full-scale conflict that engulfed the central regions of Woqooyi Galbeed and Togdheer (Bryden: 1994) for almost two years. Fighting broke out in Hargeysa in November 1994, and by March 1995 Burco was also in flames. The war continued until early 1996, displacing a considerable portion of Hargeysa's inhabitants and the entire population of Burco".

 

It is difficult to debate when one’s perspective of all things historical is blurred, is not receptive to the actuality, and fails now and again in providing supportive material of his adopted line reasoning. Troubling, do not reckon?

 

Sorry old chap but again here, I along with the rest of the world were under the impression that the entity that is of Somaliland was and remains the sole creation of the traditional elders (Guurti et al), but here you seem to be disputing that. Would you care to elaborate upon how you managed to deduce your conclusion? See if you could indulge me as to whom the congregating parties were in Borama and Burco?

 

Here again you make a statement which in your mind is probably genuine, but in reality is nothing but. “….. Somaliland is not like South, where one man just goes out and does what ever he wishes. On the contrary, in Somaliiland if one takes such steps, he has to pay a very hefty price”. I wonder what you might mean by hefty price – persecution and imprisonment for one’s political and ideological believes. Is that what we have got here? I do not suppose you recall when AbdiRahman Tuur (the father denounced the existence of his own creation) engaged Aideed in the nineties soon after he was outmanoeuvred in the battlefield by the shrewd, yet dodgy Igal.

 

As for Somaliland being any different from any other region, or state in the Dark Continent, perhaps you care to venture own reflection upon these observations of yet another author of Somaliland. His verdict “…. saddex awoodood oo kala madax banaan- Awooda Fulinta ama Xukuumada (executive body), Awooda Xeer-beegtida ama Maxkamadaha (Judicial Body), iyo Awooda Xeer-dejinta ama Golayaasha Baarlamaanka (Legislative Body). Haddaba, ka waran haddii qof keligii ahi saddexdaba darandooriyo oo la garanba waayo shaqadiisa, oo ah tan Somaliland haysata” Axmed Maxamed Diiriye Toorno Ahmediriye@hotmail.com

 

Is this democracy? How does it differ from any other dictatorial regime?

 

And another thing, how would you interpret this news bulletin published in one of the local papers. What do you reckon is the basis for the alleged dispute ‘ween Riyaale & his VP Mr. Yasin? “ Waxa kale oo ay qoreen inuu madaxweynuhu khiyaamaynayo madaxweyne ku xigeenka iyo inay madaxweynaha iyo madaxweyne ku xigeenku is-haystaan… ” read the whole piece over here. http://www.halganews.com/1003/3/Wasiirka%20Daakhiliga%20oo%20Beeniyay%20in%20Madaxweynaha%20iyo%20Ku%20xigeenkiisu%20Khilaaf%20ka%20dhaxeeyo.htm

 

Believe you me old chap, I do see the real world. How, you may ask? In my last trip to Hargeysa, mid you my birth place (Goljano), I was astounded as to the level of corruption and abuse of authority (in agreement with the author here) on the part of the administration, Guurti and Salaadin themselves, and diligence and hard work on the part of the ordinary people. Thus, perhaps due care might be exercised whilst debating others who might know more about the subject matter (Hargeysa local politics in this case) than yourself.

 

Still not convinced? Well, what can I say?

 

n/b: I as ever could not possibly agree with the author on the issue of Somalis being characterised as terrorists.

 

Best of luck,

Cheers.

[A.J. Timacadeh]

what is this obsession people seem to have with somaliland. i mean it seems to me that people like samurai warior, smithers and their puntland alliance read all the articles about somaliland and post the 2/3 negative ones here so they can show to the somaliland caolition here that everything is tumbling down on somaliland. sometimes i wonder if they had put so much effort and time into their own regions their own regions wouldnt be the ruins they are in today.

 

i am not siding with he somaliland coalition here but i hardly ever see them posting every single negative article about puntland.that to me shows the difference between the puntland alliance and somaliland coalition.

[India]

I see the old man Samuria is still at. No rest for the wicked eh!

 

Uncle give it a rest will you! Your obsession with Somaliland along with your die hard haters ( bari, Horn, Smithy) are getting tiresome and FRANKLY BORING. Get a new hoppy perhaps you should all look for your newest host of your zillions attempt to reconcile. Patethic.

 

It is just beyond me how Somalis have the odacity to even mutter a word against Somaliland. But then envy is man's deadliest sin!

 

Boringly

Dusty.

[LANDER]

A pretentious member quoted "Know and recognize principles of propaganda. Try to avoid using them yourself. " in his ethics and standards of discussion. Perhaps he should've added do not tell half truths or make isolated quotes whitout showing the context or the source pertinent to this quote in its entirety. Now here is the last bit of the outdated source posted by the person in question and the important preceding factors he left out that is highlighted.

 

 

The peaceful transfer of power from the SNM interim government to a beel (community) based system

 

Election of a civilian president (Maxamed Xaaji Ibrahim Cigal) and a vice president (Cabdirahman aw Cali)

 

Adoption of a National Charter and a Peace Charter, intended to serve as the basis for efforts towards peace-building and state-building, during a further transitional period of two years.

 

The Guurti also used the occasion to review and revamp the ongoing reconciliation processes in different parts of the country.

 

A combination of factors including deeply rooted mistrust between clans, continuing factional discord within the SNM, the clash of powerful egos, and international interests, all came into play when the Boorame process moved from conference hall to the proving grounds of Somaliland in mid-1993.11 By November 1994, these tensions had erupted into full-scale conflict that engulfed the central regions of Woqooyi Galbeed and Togdheer (Bryden: 1994) for almost two years. Fighting broke out in Hargeysa in November 1994, and by March 1995 Burco was also in flames. The war continued until early 1996, displacing a considerable portion of Hargeysa's inhabitants and the entire population of Burco.

 

Despite numerous attempts to quell the conflict within Somaliland society, as well as from the diaspora, peace talks made little progress until 1996 (Bryden and Farah: 1996). Finally, in February 1997, after nearly five months of consultations, peace was concluded in Hargeysa (Bradbury: 1997) at a Conference that achieved the following:

 

 

 

· Cessation of hostilities (the "Ceel Xume" opposition group from Burco did not attend this conference but later joined the general peace settlement).

 

· A new constitutional document, to be valid during a further 3-year transition period.

· Re-elected President Cigal, with a new vice president, Dahir Riyaale Kahin, for a term of 5 years.

 

· Addressed some of the grievances of opposition groups, by increasing their share in the two Houses of Parliament. · Accommodated Somaliland's minority communities in terms of political representation

The Hargeysa Conference was followed by the longest period of uninterrupted peace since Somaliland's reclamation of independence - a sign that things are moving along the right track . But the challenges to reconstruction and development remain formidable: indeed, the complexity of the issues and the stakes involved appear to have grown. Somaliland has made tremendous progress, but there is no room for complacency if past gains are to be consolidated and progress to be sustained. The remainder of this paper is dedicated to illuminating the way forward.

 

2 Subsequent agreements between Britain and Ethiopia in 1942, 1944, 1948 and 1954 concerned the implementation of the 1897 treaty, but did not alter the substance of the original accord.

 

3 The official figure from the Ministry of National Planning and Co-ordination is 3 million.

 

4 The original treaties gave the British no rights to cede territory on behalf of the Somaliland clans - a prerogative that the British nevertheless exercised illegally and unilaterally in their negotiations with other imperial powers.

 

5 Laurence was the husband of renowned Canadian author Margaret Laurence, whose early works include two volumes based on her experiences in Somaliland: A Tree for Poverty and The Prophet's Camel Bell.

 

6 Many Somalilanders resent the use of the term "Somalia" to describe Somaliland's union with the south. They argue that Somaliland and Somalia united to form the "Somali Republic," and that substitution of "Somali Republic" with Somalia in casual use has helped to obscure Somaliland's independent origins and the voluntary nature of the union.

 

7 For a detailed account of events during this period, see: Somalia: A Government at War with its Own People (London: Africa Watch, 1990).

 

8 An entire section of Mogadishu distinguished by extravagant Villas came to be known as Booli Qaran, meaning the "National Loot".

 

9 Between 1987-89, an estimated 6.4% of total overseas investment was allocated to the north (GOS - Background: 1994).

 

10 The group was variously known as the Hargeysa Group, Ufo (a type of whirlwind signalling a change in the weather), and Ragga u Dhashay Magaalada (Men Born of the City - a pseudonym employed by anti-government pamphleteers).

 

11 The United Nations Operation in Somalia (UNOSOM) declined to recognize the legitimacy of the Boorame process and sponsored alternative leadership instead, contributing directly to a destructive round of civil strife in 1994-96.

[A.J. Timacadeh]

lander i dont think that your article proves anything and is the kind of propoganda that you say you dismiss.

[miles-militis]

Pure premonitions or is the author psychic?

What in God’s name is going?

 

First it was the Swiss businessman gutted in a broad day light in Hargeysa followed by the hunting of a former minister and later professor by the house of the Minister of Interior. Then came foreign volunteers in Erigabo. Next came the Italian old lady in Borama. The illegal arrests and continuous intimidation of journalists who constructively criticise Riyaale and his government – namely the chief editor of Jamhuriya now in prison.

 

And now the killing of two British teachers gunned down in Sheikh. What is next? I do not expect Lander to offer any meaningful insight here, and with Mr Oodwayne on the run after being discredited for doctoring other’s works and text plagiarism, perhaps our patriot conscript Mujaahid could be of service here.

 

http://jamhuuriya.info/index.php?art_id=1292&categ=2&expand=2&file=view_article.tp

[LANDER]

machavellian,

I wasn't posting this article to substantiate its claims, rather I posted the entire section on the political reforms and rebuilding of Somaliland that samurai had left out in order to serve his own agenda. So I hope you understand this article was or at least parts of it were originally posted by Samurai. If your not following, don't just jump in.

 

samurai,

I know you take great pleasure in any

negative effects even remotely associated with our republic of Somaliland, but try to hold back your relishing of other peoples problems. I'm sure the created province of Puntland could use more of your "constructive criticism" (or so you would have us believe since I seriously doubt your criticism is anything but constructive).

[A.J. Timacadeh]

my apologies lander i did not see the post samurai had writtent previous to yours. however i still think that if you know these great things that have happend for the peope of somaliland i still dont think there is any point in trying to convince non-somalilanders ,who are against the idea of an independent civilised and developed country of somaliland, that somaliland has come a long way and will continue it's progress with or without recognition from the international community. die hard federalists like samurai will not see that as anything relevant, they only care about the negative news coming from somaliland so that they can destroy somalilands name on websites like this.

 

so i advice to refrain from such actions in the future brother.