The Wisdom In Talking.

[xiinfaniin]

Yaa Jammacatul kheyr wal Barakah,

 

Dialogue with the enemy is a strategy whose universal value has been widely recognized. Grasping that valuable nugget of wisdom, John Kerry smacked real hard on John McCain’s demagogic stance on the issue of not talking to America’s adversaries. If you have not been following America’s presidential campaign, McCain, Arizona US senator and this year’s Republic presidential nominee, has accused Barack Obama of naivety and inexperience when the junior senator from Illinois presented his foreign policy approach toward nations and leaders perceived to be America’s adversaries. I will talk not only to our friends, but I will also talk to our foes. Barack said. Barrack’s position, McCain retorted, shows the depth of his lack of understanding in international affairs. These disagreements may be symbolic and superficial. But the arguments both men presented to advance their own positions are worth studying.

 

John Kerry, as Obama surrogate and heavy hitter, does a superb job, in my opinion, to delineate the benefits of engagements with America’s detractors. In so doing, senator Kerry uses sound reasoning, and not impassionate appeals to emotions of American populace, to repute McCain’s foolish stance. Allah, I was amazed at how his logic follows the contours of Islamic teachings in terms of exhausting all means before resorting to armed conflict. The delegates Mohamed (scw) sent across Arabia and letters of diplomacy he composed were all part of that teaching. The hudnas he signed, and alliances he formed were all part of it. In short, there was no a single occurrence of war, I know of, for which a path of peace or an opportunity of dialogue existed that the prophet of Allah had not explored. And where the honor of believers or the interest of his message were at stake, serious considerations and thoughtful deliberations were the prophetic methods that formed the basis for making informed decisions.

 

I was also reminded the discussions we have been having here in SOL, and how our little John McCains formulated their broken arguments in favor of continuous war. SOL’s little McCains have less stature and power and the consequence of what they espouse here in the cyber space pales in comparison with McCain’s dangerous posture of warmongering. But the mentality and mindset of feeling compelled to be rigid and inflexible in the face of global challenges, even if the cost is clausal and the outcome uncertain, is a common denominator that’s hard to ignore. I am referring here to the hired pens that seem to be advancing, nay forcing, an agenda of war in SOL’s pages, and in the process deliberately belittling the efforts of peace as naive and lacking strategy---the seemingly able and intelligent nomads who publicly shame the likes of Sharif and accuse him of treachery and duplicity. That’s what this article reminded me. There was a great and beneficial xaddith that preached the universality of wisdom. Take it from whereever you find it, the prophet said. Here it’s yaa Jammaacah…

 

Somalia is in a sorry state. That much we all know. But this article also reminded me the inadequacy of thinkers and leaders that exist in the Somalis in Diaspora and back home. Perhaps if we had few strategic thinkers who have little patience and tolerance, we would’ve saved tens of thousands of innocent Somali lives that have been wasted for no assessable purpose.

 

Idinkoo raali ah, ikhyaarey bal hooyya oo aqriyyaa qalinka McCain dushiisa ku jabay.

 

 

=============================================

Opponents of dialogue often quip that talking isn't a strategy. Walking away isn't a strategy, either. McCain says that "there's only one thing worse than the United States exercising the military option, that is, a nuclear-armed Iran." But for all his professed reluctance, when McCain disavows diplomacy, he is stacking the deck in favor of war. What might we achieve by talking with Iran? Some say our engagement to date has not been productive -- but a less half-hearted and less conditional approach might well break the stalemate. We won't know until we try.

 

read on John Kerry's reasoning yaa Jammacah

[Gabbal]

Somewhere in your reasoning I would like to see mentioned:

 

-physical occupation of parts of a nation

-complex ill-developed political situation

-difference between options available to aggressor entities (such as the U.S would be) and entities shown the aggression (aggrieved party in Somalia).

-etc

 

Somehow I cannot imagine the prophet would have sent delegates if Medina had been caught from under him and his people were facing subjugation. This is my personal opinion after all but somehow I can't imagine the response would be similar to what you advocate.

[Nephissa]

Originally posted by HornAfrique:

Somehow I cannot imagine the prophet would have sent delegates if Medina had been caught from under him and his people were facing subjugation. This is my personal opinion after all but somehow I can't imagine the response would be similar to what you advocate.

Wow, an impressive comparison to say the least! L0L. This has got to be the weakest argument you've ever offered. Is that all you have, sir?

[Fabregas]

Be Horn careful saxiib, waxu lagu odhanaya you're a war prone cyber dagaalyahan, one that wishes to see a " continous war".

[Emperor]

Lets remember Nabiga CSW immigrated from his birth place and most beloved city, Makka... but some will argue at the time Jihad wasn't institutionalised... Also how silly can one compare the Fake Sheikh criminal gangs that are terrorizing people to the pious Sahabba...

 

Please leave the Prophet (PPUH) and the Sahabba out of this thread for the gangs led by druglord Indhacade aren't no wear near to be compared to them... Marka afkiinna kareeba nabiga suuban calayhi Salaatu wasalaam.

 

As for the post, I completely agree with Xiin, first try and explore what might the dirrin bring out if nothing then you have all your other options on the card, no one will get hurt or lose in talking, just ceaze the fake self proud you attest to possess, it is not going to help you in any way, form or shape... arrogance never helps, dadka unbuu kugu diraa mooyee wax kaama celiyo.

[Paragon]

The wisdom is talking when it is the time for talking, not when that time has elapsed.

[Naxar Nugaaleed]

all this talk of the Prophet vs. so and so really shows how sick minded out of touch with reality some here are too think of a petty wars between Somalis in the dustiest and poorest corner of the world in terms of the founding of the worlds second largest religion. get real people, there are no religious, global or world shaking implications for a fight between two dusty nomads and their other dusty neighbor. These criminals, be they religious lunatics or petty warlords, will be defeated regardless how much crying some do here on sol.

 

Going back to the original topic, people would be silly to oppose negotiations, wither we acknowledge it or not. Yet we must recognize that fact that repeating the same thing, again and again and expecting a deferent outcome amounts to retardation. The Agents of anarchy in somalia, what ever form they come, will do or say anything to to keep the status quo. In my opinion, dealing with or negotiating with requires both the carrot and the stick.

[wacdaraha_aduunka]

I'm continually being amazed at what these so called shabaab supportes are made up of! Just look at the their make up you got people who are generally afraid of governments thats able to enforce basic law and order as this goes against they're mind of setting in which their business can flourish i.e. drug-dealings and some business men and then you got some in mogadishu who sit on xaaran property and wealth in which they know they have to vacate when all those owners retun, Then you have people like horn afrique who's was so supportive of all the attacks these shabaabs were carrying out ruthless attacks even when civilians were killed and said weey shihiiden well are you to determine who's gonna be a shahiid or not DID I ASK TO DIE?. But when the shabaabs were approaching kismaayo oh it was all about lets talk and ilaah baan ka baryey inuu kala qabto. Now where lies your support in shabbab 100% or the buck stops at kismaayo? Then you have the people who just basically follow them on clan basis.

 

Besides Horn its true the country is occupied but who caused it pls i leave the pleasure for you ro rammble on it and we might as well benefit from it extra cover and support while we train our national security forces.. whats the complex political situation its simple either choose dowladnimo or face being killed when caught and am for real its simple as that.

[Abtigiis]

Ya Ahlu Khiyaana wa asxaabul Isticmaar,

 

An irrelevant analogy by way of illegitimate reasoning. High class demagoguery. That is what all the McCain-Barack talk is! It is simple, Xinn et al. You accuse us of being war-mongerors. We see you as preachers of submission. "Give the right one, when your left cheek is slapped" jingoists.

 

In la qiimo tiro dadka halganka hubaysan taageersan oo tuke canbaar leh laga dhigo, ama dadka loo tuso dad juhala iyo Intolerent ah is all your strategy. Taas dadka idin ka dhagaysan ula taga. McCain iyo Barack are nothing for me, by the way. Dad bay qiimo la leeyihiin. There are Somali's who talk more sense day in day out. I would have liked if you quote those. Or perhaps continue with the tale of Prophet's (SCW) modus operandi. Demonizing those who see differently, glorifying a mix club of "traitors, genuinely concerned citizens who are wary of war, opportunists, the disorientated, the disengaged who confined themseleves to didactic messages on peace" by calling them Jamaacatul Khayr wal Barakh is disingenious.

 

Stop this bullish behaviour! That is what I am annyed at more than the issues we differ on. You are stifling freedom of expression and opinion!

[xiinfaniin]

^^Alla maxaa shiddo ku haysa! Kuwa dadka la tusayyaa maaha kuwa halganka hubaysan ku jira. Kuwa dadka la tusayyaa waa noocaaga adeer.

 

A & T, waa laguu arkaa. Dhan walba warlord yar baad uga egtahay...

 

Asxaabta kale, minus NN, waa isla jar-jarayna haddii alle idmo. Haddese ciyaalkaan la cayyaarayaa ee hallay saamaxo yaa ahlu karam...

[Gabbal]

Originally posted by Nephthys:

quote:Originally posted by HornAfrique:

Somehow I cannot imagine the prophet would have sent delegates if Medina had been caught from under him and his people were facing subjugation. This is my personal opinion after all but somehow I can't imagine the response would be similar to what you advocate.

Wow, an impressive comparison to say the least! L0L. This has got to be the weakest argument you've ever offered. Is that all you have, sir?

My logical brain tells me the weak argument goad is directed towards me while my rational brain tells me it is directed towards Xiin, however if it is directed at me have no misunderstanding Nephthys I never offered an argument. That tadbit was a mere side comment to Xiin evoking the prophet's name and his use of "delegates" to spread peace. I could not help but point out the situations are altogether completely different you see.

 

Then you have people like horn afrique who's was so supportive of all the attacks these shabaabs were carrying out ruthless attacks even when civilians were killed and said weey shihiiden well are you to determine who's gonna be a shahiid or not DID I ASK TO DIE?. But when the shabaabs were approaching kismaayo oh it was all about lets talk and ilaah baan ka baryey inuu kala qabto. Now where lies your support in shabbab 100% or the buck stops at kismaayo?

Check yourself adeer. I never questioned the right for the resistance to go to Kismaayo. Nay, I questioned the wisdom of trying to go there by force as did almost all of the pro-resistance nomads in this forum. Parts of the nation are under direct foreign occupation and the resources and manpowers that could be waged to continue the cycle of Somali fratricide could be better spent against the invader force. There is no need to try to go to Kismaayo by force at this time where there are no Ethiopians stationed and the people, if they are not directly supportive of the resistance, are not in arms against them. Wada hadal and rationality should take precedence over everything else in this sort of situation. If the Kismaayo group had armed themselves to directly fight against the resistance, however, with an aim to give leverage to the invader force....halagu jihaado midna yaanan laga reebin ayaan oran lahaa!

[N.O.R.F]

Originally posted by HornAfrique:

Somehow I cannot imagine the prophet would have sent delegates if Medina had been caught from under him and his people were facing subjugation. This is my personal opinion after all but somehow I can't imagine the response would be similar to what you advocate.

Careful there saxib. Don't stamp on Xiin's 'rational' thinking.

 

Xiin, Nelson Mandela and the struggles of SA would have been more appropriate

[Naxar Nugaaleed]

so why, horn, for the love of god would you support an organization that you say partook in the "cycle of Somali fratricide"?

[Gabbal]

Adeer I didn't know Xabashi have become Somalis in the past couple years?

[Naxar Nugaaleed]

stop with the red herrings and you hatred for other people, why would you support support such an organization. Clearly, you see where some of us see the hypocrisy.