Somali Christians Murdered

[Oocyte]

It is beyond me how some people are trying to justify killings of others who do not want to believe in Islam any longer? Religion is based on personal belief and choice. Whether one is born to Muslim, christian, Jew, Hindi, Waaq or other religion shouldnt matter (since we cant chose our parents) - Its all about what sounds right to an individual.

 

Isnt it sad to be born muslim if one cant declare his/her own belief and would either be killed or stay hypocrite for the fear of it? And a what contradiction and double standard you are showing - Islam is perfect and peaceful religion which welcomes those who want to convert from other religions but if some of us leave Islam, we behead them :rolleyes:

 

 

Those who are salivating for killings of converts, you need to learn more about Quran instead of jumping to the Hadith you keep on quoting - there are verses like "let there be NO Compulsion in Religion" and "If it had been Allah's Will, all of the people on Earth would have believed. Would you then compel the people so to have them believe?” etc

Or the Hadith sounds more important eh?

 

Athena,

I second that sis.

[Macalin]

lakkad no again we don't kill non-believers who were born like that, but the muslims who turn to be kaffirs yes u should kill them.

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QacQac...Where in the Quran and Hadeeth does this say?...Ma qasab baa?...qofku haduu san rabin diinta quruxda badan?...Allah knows whats good for his deen and he knows wat he needs to do them, certainly no man should be doing that!

 

We dont have a khalifah here to give a decree or some so, a kangaroo court finds jamac hersi ali dhuuntoy guilty jst because he decided to be GAAL??...war naga daaya waxiina...show me meesha laquray quranka wat yall sayin!

[bilan]

What is the Islamic ruling on someone who is a Muslim(who is in Islam) but converts to some other religion later on??? Praise be to Allaah.

 

Apostasy (riddah) means disbelieving after being Muslim. There is no bad deed that cancels out all good deeds apart from apostasy. If a person dies in a state of apostasy all his good deeds will be wiped out, but if he returns to Islam, the reward for his good deeds will be restored and he does not have to make up any prayers or fasts that he missed during the period of his apostasy.

 

Shaykh al-Islam [ibn Taymiyah] said:

 

With regard to apostasy from Islam, whereby a person becomes a kaafir, whether a mushrik or a Jew or Christian, if he dies in that state then all his good deeds will be wiped out, according to scholarly consensus, as the Qur’aan says in more than one place. For example Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

 

“And whosoever of you turns back from his religion and dies as a disbeliever, then his deeds will be lost in this life and in the Hereafter”

 

[al-Baqarah 2:217]

 

“And whosoever disbelieves in Faith, [i.e. in the Oneness of Allaah and in all the other Articles of Faith i.e. His (Allaah’s) Angels, His Holy Books, His Messengers, the Day of Resurrection and Al‑Qadar (Divine Preordainments)], then fruitless is his work”

 

[al-Maa’idah 5:5]

 

“But if they had joined in worship others with Allaah, all that they used to do would have been of no benefit to them”

 

[al-An’aam 6:88]

 

Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 4/257, 268)

 

With regard to the shar’i rulings on apostates, if the apostate does not return to Islam, he must be executed.

 

It was narrated that ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Mas’ood said: the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “It is not permissible to shed the blood of a Muslim who bears witness that there is no god except Allaah and that I am the Messenger of Allaah except in one of three cases: a soul for a soul (i.e., punishment for murder), a married man or woman who commits adultery, and one who leaves his religion and separates from the jamaa’ah (main body of Muslims).”

 

Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6484; Muslim, 1676

 

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas said: the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever changes his religion, execute him.”

 

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6922).

 

Then if he is executed, he has died as a kaafir, so he is not to be washed or shrouded; the funeral prayer is not to be offered for him, and he is not to be buried in the Muslim graveyard. On the Day of Resurrection he will be one of the people of Hell who will abide therein for eternity.

 

The earth rejected the body of an apostate during the time of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), as a lesson and a warning to the onlookers.

 

It was narrated that Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: There was a Christian man who became Muslim. He used to recite al-Baqarah and Aal ‘Imraan, and he used to write down (the revelation) for the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). Then he returned to Christianity and he used to say, “Muhammad knows nothing but what I have written for him.” Then Allah caused him to die, and the people buried him, but in the morning they saw that the earth had thrown his body out. They said, “This is the doing of Muhammad and his companions. They dug the grave of our companion and took his body out of it because he had run away

 

from them.” They again dug the grave deeply for him, but in the morning they again saw that the earth had thrown his body out. They said, “This is the doing of Muhammad and his companions. They dug the grave of our companion and threw his body outside it, for he had run away from them.” They dug the grave for him as deep as they could, but in the morning they again saw that the earth had thrown his body out. So they realized that what had befallen him was not done by human beings and they had to leave him thrown (on the ground).

 

Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 3421; Muslim, 2781.

 

And Allaah knows best.

 

 

i bolded it for you guys

[bilan]

salaam

here is another good one it answers your questions why it is long but if you have a doubt why murtad has to be killed then read it,also there are guidelines to be followed, it is not like the judge will go around and kill people because he was told they changed their religion, there are conditions whether the person can considered apostate, such as if the person was ignorant,or forced, and people are not to be put to death immediately but the judge will give them a time and give them chance to clear their doubts,so don't worry Lakkad jamac hersi ali dhuuntoy will be given a plenty of chances to come back.As a non Muslim, I find myself Intrigued and attracted to your faith. However, I find it difficult to comprehend how a man can be sentenced to death for speaking( Salman Rushdie). I would have thought that we as humans do not have that right to make those decisions, only god can?

Praise be to Allaah.

 

We thank you for your confidence in us and for sending this question to us, and we appreciate your being intrigued by our beliefs and your eagerness to find out the answer. We welcome you as a visitor and reader and learner.

 

What stood out from your letter is that you are impressed with the religion of Islam. This is a good sign for us and for you. We are happy for our religion to reach people like you who are seeking for the truth. Our Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) told us that this religion would reach all places on this earth. It was narrated that Tameem al-Daari said: “I heard the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) say: ‘This matter (i.e., Islam) will certainly reach everywhere that night and day reach, and Allaah will not leave any house or tent [i.e., all dwellings, in towns and in the desert], but Allaah will cause this religion to enter it, and some people will be honoured because of it [by converting] and others will be humiliated because of it [for refusing to embrace it], and they will be ruled by the Muslims, an honour which Allaah will bestow on Islam and a humiliation which He will inflict on kufr (disbelief).”

 

(Narrated by Ahmad, 16344; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in al-Silsilah al-Saheehah, 3).

 

In your case, your admiration for Islam will motivate you to find out what this pure monotheistic religion teaches, and how it is in accordance with sound human nature and common sense. We advise you to avoid completely and preconceptions that may influence you and take your time in reading about the teachings of the Islamic religion. Perhaps you could read material on this site about Islam, such as questions no. 219, 21613, 20756, 10590.

 

With regard to your question, “However, I find it difficult to comprehend how a man can be sentenced to death for speaking. I would have thought that we as humans do not have that right to make those decisions, only god can” – what you say is correct, because no-one has the right to condemn another person to death without evidence from the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).

 

The ruling of execution because of a word that somebody utters is what the Muslim scholars call al-riddah (apostasy). What is apostasy and what constitutes apostasy? What is the ruling on the apostate (al-murtadd)?

 

1 – Riddah (apostasy) refers to when a Muslim becomes a disbeliever by saying a clear statement to that effect, or by uttering words which imply that (i.e., which imply kufr or disbelief), or he does something that implies that (i.e., an action which implies kufr or disbelief).

 

2 – What constitutes apostasy

 

The matters which constitute apostasy are divided into four categories:

 

(a) Apostasy in beliefs, such as associating others with Allaah, denying Him, or denying an attribute which is proven to be one of His attributes, or by affirming that Allaah has a son. Whoever believes that is an apostate and a disbeliever.

 

(b) Apostasy in words, such as insulting Allaah or the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).

 

© Apostasy in actions, such as throwing the Qur’an into a filthy place, because doing that shows disrespect towards the words of Allaah, so it is a sign that one does not believe. Other such actions include prostrating to an idol or to the sun or moon.

 

(d) Apostasy by omission, such as not doing any of the rituals of Islam, or turning away from following it altogether.

 

3 – What is the ruling on the apostate?

 

If a Muslim apostatizes and meets the conditions of apostasy – i.e., he is of sound mind, an adult and does that of his own free will – then his blood may be shed with impunity. He is to be executed by the Muslim ruler or by his deputy – such as the qaadi or judge, and he is not to not be washed (after death, in preparation for burial), the funeral prayer is not to be offered for him and he is not to be buried with the Muslims.

 

The evidence that the apostate is to be executed is the words of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him): “Whoever changes his religion, execute him.” (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 2794). What is meant by religion here is Islam (i.e., whoever changes from Islam to another religion).

 

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “It is not permissible to shed the blood of a Muslim who bears witness that there is no god except Allaah and that I am His Messenger, except in one of three cases: a soul for a soul (i.e., in the case of murder); a married man who commits adultery; and one who leaves his religion and splits form the jamaa’ah (main group of Muslims).” (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6878; Muslim, 1676)

 

See al-Mawsoo’ah al-Fiqhiyyah, 22/180.

 

Thus it will be clear to you that execution of the apostate is something that is commanded by Allaah, when he commanded us to obey the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

 

“O you who believe! Obey Allaah and obey the Messenger (Muhammad), and those of you (Muslims) who are in authority”

 

[al-Nisa’ 4:59]

 

And the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) has commanded us to execute the apostate as in the hadeeth quoted above: “Whoever changes his religion, execute him.”

 

It may need some time for you to be convinced about this matter, and for you to think about it. Perhaps you think that if a person follows the truth and enters into it and embraces the one true religion which Allaah has enjoined, then we allow him to leave it quite easily whenever he wants and to utter the words of kufr (disbelief) that put him outside of Islam, so he can reject Allaah, His Messenger, His Books and His religion, and there is no punishment as deterrent, how will that affect him and others who enter the religion?

 

Do you not see that this would make the one true religion, that everyone should follow, like a shop or store which a person can enter when he wants and leave when he wants, and it may encourage others to forsake the truth.

 

Moreover, this is not someone who has never known the truth and practiced it and worshipped in accordance with it; rather this is a person who has known the truth, and practiced the religion and done the rituals of worship, so the punishment is no greater than he deserves. Moreover, such strong rulings as this are only applied to such a person whose life is no longer considered to be useful, because he knew the truth and followed the religion, then he left it and forsook it. What soul can be more evil than the soul of such a person?

 

In conclusion, the answer is that Allaah is the One Who revealed this religion and enjoined it. He is the One Who ruled that the one who enters it and then leaves it is to be executed. This ruling does not come from the Muslims’ ideas or suggestions. As this is the case, then we must follow the ruling of Allaah so long as we are content to accept Him as our Lord and God.

 

May Allaah help us and you to do that which He loves and which pleases Him. We thank you once again.

 

Peace be upon those who follow true guidance.

 

Islam Q&A

Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid (www.islam-qa.com) :

[LuCkY]

^^^JazaaKa ALLahu Khayran^^^and aLL others as weLL.

 

SubxanaLLaah :eek: !

 

I have been toLd that a MUsLim who becomes a NonbeLiever is to be stoned to death and is not the same as a person who was raised as a NonbeLiever.

 

So Case CLosed...Peace!!!

[Liqaye]

BRR,

 

ladies and gentlemen i must admit that my ilm is very little compared to the previous posters so i ask that people avoid flaggelateing me if i make a misstep in what i write.

 

A muslim who has become a christian has become an apostate.

this beacause he has denied AFTER believing that muhammed S.A.W is the last prophet of allah (S.W.T), scince our religion can bot be believed in, in doses like the western version of evolution, then most clearly the individual has apostased from religion.

Also how can one believe in the manifest doctrines of christianity like the god head of jesus (depending on what sect) the patrimony of jesus e.t.c with out being an apostate.

 

So if we agree that the individual is an apostate, then according to our religion the individual is given three chances during a period of confinement ( i am not sure about the length) to revert to islam, if the individual insists on the veracity of his delusions, then people the person must be STONED TO DEATH.

Make no mistake about it this is the punishment for an apostate of islam.

 

Now it is debatable who in this day and age can make the ruling on who is an apostate, but i believe, and this is how I understand it, if the individual goes through the procedure for apostasy and the ulamah declare the person to be an apostate, i would be one of the first people to stone the person to death.

 

But obviously if a person after so many oppurtunites to retract their statements does not, then according to the wisdom of the all mighty this all the person deserves.

 

Athena said:

 

This is Preposterous!! You people come up one rediculous post after another these dayz to fuel hate, regionalism, intolerance, fanaticism...you name it - anything negetive

Athena i dont know you so i will give you the benefit of the doubt.

The person who started this topic felt a need for a disscusion, one at least that has educated me and moved me to look up some information, this is what i hope the islam forum is for.

Every one who posts here does not do it out of hate or regionalism :rolleyes: ( how you got this into the equation i have no desire to know)but out of a love our religion and to learn more about it.

this hate and fanatisicm you talk about sounds like the western version of islam force fed to the shabaab.

Finally you have jumped higher than the sound warrants so what got you so vehement ?

[Macalin]

It was narrated that ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Mas’ood said: the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “It is not permissible to shed the blood of a Muslim who bears witness that there is no god except Allaah and that I am the Messenger of Allaah except in one of three cases: a soul for a soul (i.e., punishment for murder), a married man or woman who commits adultery, and one who leaves his religion and separates from the jamaa’ah (main body of Muslims).”

 

Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6484; Muslim, 1676

 

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas said: the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever changes his religion, execute him.

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Am glad i learnt something!/THNX BUULKA..err yea so lets stone the gaalos

[JIDAAWY]

Originally posted by Lakkad:

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Am glad i learnt something!/THNX BUULKA..err yea so lets stone the gaalos

Brother Lakkad.. bless your heart saxib.. we are all learning about our diin.. so may allah help guide us to whats right..

 

Waay to go saxib..

[Blessed]

 

 

Lets stone the gaalos aaah

 

Waar dee suga. You can't just kill people

 

There is a manner and a process that this law is applied. First and for most it has to be implemented in an Islamic state, where the shariciyah is the law. For those of you who forgot - Somalia is a 'democracy' (wannabe).

 

The person (apostate) has to be taken to an Islamic court - where they are given advice and questioned about their conversion from Islam and given a chance to think their action over - and then if they refuse to come back to Islam 'after clear guidance have been given to them' and only then do you pass judgment on them.

 

The judgment has to be given by an Islamic judge working in an Islamic court ---- I doubt that they have judges and courts in Somalia.

 

 

And killing people in their sleep is not only cowardly - it is unIslamic and barbaric - where is the Islaam in that?

 

I think we Somalis should be more concerned about implementing Islam in their life’s and our society and laws and policies - instead of killing helpless individuals. If we had Islam in Somalia - than perhaps ppl wouldn't reach a stage where they are running away from the deen of Allah!!!

[Macalin]

^^ When i said lets stone em i didnt mean to like jst go and LYNCH the folks..no of course not!

 

You have to be proffen guilty by a law of court like you said, but is there a true islamic state? governd by the sharia, except maybe for the KINGDOM?...so what if some missionary comes and starts apostating some poor ppl?, and say awhole village leaves islam, are jsut gonna stand by and say oh well theres no islamic court?

 

Btw am not asking this Q's am pondering!...but yea good analysis

[pearl]

Originally posted by Lakkad:

 

so what if some missionary comes and starts apostating some poor ppl?, and say awhole village leaves islam, are jsut gonna stand by and say oh well theres no islamic court?

 

Btw am not asking this Q's am pondering!...but yea good analysis

good point...i would like to know the answer to that as well....

 

my opinion is(if am wrong do correct me) that these villagers must have really low islamic knowledge and practice and thus were easily fooled into leaving islam.....the first step that should be taken is to first remove these missioners from farther corruption and educate these ppl about islam.....if they refuse to come back to islam i think the same ruling applies with accordance what the sisters bulo and ameenah mentioned ............

 

question is how do u wipe out a whole village who refused to come back to islam....

[Alisomali]

Lakkad the Kingdom you talk about if it isn't the Kingdom of God--Allah, there is no other real muslim state.

 

If your talking about those crazy Saudi Arabians, then their Kingdom is as far from Islam as any!!

 

I would like to go into this, but that would start a whole 'nother argument.

 

Furthermore, I find killing a person for leaving the true, pure religion that is Islam repulsive. How are we supposed to win reverts (i say reverts for every human child is born a muslim) when we go willy nilly and stone every former Muslims. the way i look at it those who convert from Islam will get thier judgement from Allah on the day of Judgement!!

[Qac Qaac]

Horta jazzakillah khayran to sister Buulo, answering the question for us.

 

Lakkad the sister answered everything for u, and u said let's stone the gaalo, i hope u don't mean sercustic.. is all those ayats and hadiths enough for u.

 

Libin, u have nice idea, and nice thought, and i would say u r very intelligent person, but bro u can't use your opinions, and say i think this should happen, in islam we fellow the quran and sunnah.

 

not only the quran. when u said, bring me quran, what is that mean, u don't take hadiths, quran and hadiths or the sunnah of the prophet scw are both to be taken.

 

pearl i agree with u, only villegers, or reer baadiyaasha, when i say this i don't mean reer miyyi nooooooo, i mean those still living in cities but still think like reer baadiyo, i hope u know wheat i mean.

[-Serenity-]

Originally posted by Huuganka Ideolojiyada:

Athena said:

 

quote:

---

This is Preposterous!! You people come up one rediculous post after another these dayz to fuel hate, regionalism, intolerance, fanaticism...you name it - anything negetive

Athena i dont know you so i will give you the benefit of the doubt.

The person who started this topic felt a need for a disscusion, one at least that has educated me and moved me to look up some information, this is what i hope the islam forum is for.

Every one who posts here does not do it out of hate or regionalism :rolleyes: ( how you got this into the equation i have no desire to know)but out of a love our religion and to learn more about it.

this hate and fanatisicm you talk about sounds like the western version of islam force fed to the shabaab.

Finally you have jumped higher than the sound warrants so what got you so vehement ?

Mr, stop selecting and replying to some part of the post rather than all of it. I do not care 2 know if u gained anything from the post or not either. 2ndly, why not answer to the 2nd para of ma reply...whats the point of having muslims who r muslims by name 4 fear of execution but have no place for Islam in their hearts? A true muslims is a muslim heart. Islam is submission to the will of one God...that comes from "WILLingness" not "force"!

[pearl]

Originally posted by Athena:

]...whats the point of having muslims who r muslims by name 4 fear of execution but have no place for Islam in their hearts? A true muslims is a muslim heart. Islam is submission to the will of one God...that comes from "WILLingness" not "force"!

HUMM.......very interesting.....just to elaborate more on ur point...say that after everything that exists to get this person back to islam doesnt work.....and if the person is a muslim by name only .....then what is point of the acts of worship this person performs.....cuz this person is worshiping the ppl he fears...rather than allah....which is shirk.....

 

so should a person be in constant fear of these pppl..and not lead his life the way he wishs...