I'm not Somali, I'm a Somalilandeeeeer

[Rahima]

Have you read Somaliland's constitution? Please read the document before you dismiss it as unislamic.

Brother Kowneyn, I don’t believe that I need to read the constitution; its application of it makes it pretty evident that it is unislamic (what does Islam say about opposition parties? Democracy?). I’m not saying that it does not contain elements which are in accordance with Islam, however since it contains elements which oppose Islam, then it is to be dismissed for the reason that you cannot pick and choose what to implement in Islam. You take it all, or leave claiming it as an Islamic system.

 

I’m sure that any constitution drawn up by any Somali government will be unislamic, but this is not the point. The point is that since Somaliland is not separating on points based on Islam, its reasons and therefore secession become needless in the eyes of Islam.

 

J11,

Both parties need to heed what Islam teaches.

This is the point I’m trying to make.

 

May He exceed your knowledge.

Aamiin and us all .

 

 

Now though, now Islam is being brought into it

No it is part of Islam. Politics is part and parcel of Islam, we as Muslims do not make this distinction, therefore since we cannot seem to agree upon other matters (considering that tribe seems to have become a passion for most Somalis), then at least we can reason upon the tenets of Islam since we all claim to be Muslims.

 

Furthermore brother, discussions only become futile when the elements of understanding and respect are lost. Until then we can all learn from one another.

 

Personally because of my weakness of Islam, I do not care if Somaliland gains independence, in fact for the sake of harmony I’m in support of it. But this is my weakness and as much as I would like to be against it for Islamic reasons and my overwhelming love for the unity of the Ummah above all other things, I lack this and acknowledge my downfall; however I will not justify it Islamically. It is one thing to do or believe something which is contrary to Islam but a totally different thing to legalize that which is prohibited (division not based on Islamic reasons).

[Xarago]

Originally posted by WarYaa DuDe:

even if you're right, you could have brought it in a more subtle way. That remark was humiliating to silent sistah naayaa!

Who are you calling naayaa...

[Xoogsade]

Rahiima, You are forced to accept the realities on the ground which are not your own making, therefore, I don't take your view as a weakness of faith but a position of powerlesness. There is little you and others like you can do in these odd situations where everything logical became illogical in the minds of Somalis and people with the right ideas are always the lonely voices in the Wilderness. My Question to you then is, Is it worth worrying to a point where you think your faith is damaged?

 

It is hard to feel sorry for people who make the wrong choices all the time in leadership? they are so blind to excuse year after a year the same pitiful men. That is when I decided long ago, it is not worth it, LET THEM BURN in HELL here and get Extra one if they don't repent after Death.

 

Wasn't there a verse in the Quran that read like "That is so because Allah will never change a grace which He has bestowed on a people until they change what is in their ownselves. And verily, Allah is All-Hearer, All-Knower" ?

 

Sis Rahima, Consider this as a sort of Punishment people deserve.

[Baashi]

Rahima,

You’ve made an excellent point abaayo. Even though “they†the pro-secessionists want to apply selective reasoning and revisionist history to the subject at hand, you have managed to step back and see the big picture. Nevertheless, you seem to be giving contradicting signals. On the one hand, you seem to be at ease with the dismemberment of this poor, war-ravaged, backward, and semi-desert country. On the other hand, you have dismissed the secession as un-Islamic. It doesn’t add up! I see you have taken a refuge under the shades of the branches of weakness in that big tree of desperation. Be bold and make a firm and unshakable stand in this cyber room. Yes you have no power to make a difference, but you do have voice to opine what you know is right. You are knowingly and willingly lending your voice with what you said is un-Islamic. Stand by pro-union/Islamist qallanjo!

 

Ngonge,

In fairness, Ngonge have made some good points. I disagree on the conclusions he drew from the election results and the importance he seems to attach them. For these elections were held in parts of the old British Somaliland domain. Once the results were in, they were interpreted as if all the residents of former British Somaliland are for the secession. Majority vs. minority designation do not apply here since residents there are Somali citizens for all they know.

 

Xoogsade,

Sxb remember that "Perpetual optimism is a force multiplierâ€. I say desperation talk is no use . You seem to understand the fundamentals of the discussion yet you lack the strength to say what you believe in deep inside. You managed to say I support secession even though you've admitted that you think it is a wrong move. :confused:

[Qudhac]

bashi

 

if only you could harm somaliland with your rhetoric farts and silly terms such as "they" and "pro-seccesionist lot" you might not have sounded like feable and powerless man with just those silly terms to fight with.

 

like the old saying goes stick and stone might break my bones but... (silly words and terms are water off my back)

[QabiilDiid]

I hope I’ve managed to help you split that hair satisfactorily, saaxib. Any other worthy comments on my post?

NGONGE,

I’ve heard it, too, while in Hargeisa. S/L government announced on radio Hargeisa that 97% of the population had endorsed the new constitution which included an article on independence. It said also that the international observers were financed by S/L Forum, a Diaspora group campaigning for the international recognition of S/L's independence. All their opportunity costs, air traveling, land transportation and accommodation expenses were paid by the S/L Forum under a traditional Somali hospitality!!

Now, I ask you (putting aside the six eastern regions who never saw what color the polling boxes had) did you accept the result of so called referendum at its face value by your own accord because you felt there was a merit in it or were you pushed by the emotions emanating from the people around you?

I found one thing in your articles. YOU need to take a stand on this important issue. Either you have to be a Somali and stand up for Somali unity even if it costs your life and properties or support these who are pushing more dismemberment of the Somali people without logical, economic, racial, humanitarian, Islamic, legal, regional, continental and international reasoning (bases)!!

[Xarago]

Originally posted by WarYaa DuDe:

who do you think naayaa! dhoocilyahow, leave the girls here alone. Don't feel better than them b/c you can speak Somali better, taas waa xaasidnimo!

Awal ayan yabey nag-nagtada badan ileen waa mid shoo dumarka ku af bartey.

[Salafi_Online]

Rahima

Those So called Shaykh, you think are upon salafiyah, are labelled as Khawarij of the era, by the great imams or our time, some people use old fatwahs from the gulf war but refuse to acknolwedge the fatwah of the late '90 like bin baaz refutation of them in 1998 and albani and Uthaymin, this is why we defame them and insult them, they are evil scholars who have little interest for the well being of this ummah, i have already provided the evidence by the great Shyakh Albani who called the khawarij of our era, and this imam does not speak from his desires! if you so wish to call them Shaykhs then so be it!

 

 

as for somaliland and the south and for any country for that matter, again i cant stress this enough, if the somaliland finds peace and prosperety away from the south, then so be it! Im sure you heard of the saying "the lesser of the two evil" its a shariyah principal!

 

THE FITNAH IN THE ABSENCE OF THE CALIPH

 

Hudhayfah (radiyallaahu ’anhu) continued: ‘‘I asked, ‘What if they (the Muslims) did not have a Jamaa’ah, nor an Imaam?’ He replied:

 

‘‘ Desert all of those parties and run away over the earth. It would be better for you, O Hudhayfah, to die whilst you bite onto the branch of a tree, than to follow any of them .’’

 

Al-Haafidh Ibn Hajar reported at-Tabaree as saying: ‘‘ This hadeeth indicated that when the people divide into parties in the absence of a leader, no particular group should be followed. If one can, he should desert all the parties for fear of falling into evil .’’

 

arent the south divided into parties(tribes)with not leader, each yearning for a piece of the pie? So the somaliland deserted them in fear that they would fall into evil, now it can be argued that somaliland is not doing so great! maybe so but they feel they are better off then being united! they choose the lesser evil!

 

Again every muslim should strive for unity, but on proper grounds such that it does not lead to great evil!

 

Again every muslim should strive for unity, but on proper grounds such that it does not lead to great evil!

 

Remember folks this is not a fatwa, its an opinion of my which most likely carries no weight as far as people are concerned! but its my opinion and its open to modification!

[Baashi]

Waryaa Dude,

Isku xishood son. Dumarka lalama tirsado. An apology is in order. Be a man! go ahead I know you can do it.

 

Qudhac,

Where did I go wrong bro. Words on the screen as Ngonge used to say, that's all they are. There is no harm in saying "they" to refer to the "pro-secessionist". FYI the pro-secessionist is not a "dirty" word. It inly refers to those who would love to see Somaliland to be an independent country. I disagree on the premise that some can make that monumental decision for all in that corner of the former British colony.

 

Don't be like the republicans and the neo-cons here in America. They are so far right in the political spectrum that they shun all the analysis and political debate. Anyone who dares to question what they percieve is "right" is doing so because they hate "freedom". Relax bro, ease up, and let it slide...and don't read into too much of what I wrote up there. I hope I make sense and if I don't in your eyes then give me the benefit of the doubt.

[Baashi]

C'mon don't let me down son

[Baashi]

Much better but I'm afraid it is not enough. Show her sincerity and don't compound the situation. Address her as a person not as "women" or "child". Swallow your pride one more time and take the higher road. Send a pm this time if that's what it takes to remedy the problem.

[Khayr]

Waryaa Dude saxib,

DON'T APOLOGIZE when you're not in the wrong.

 

Baashi, saxib why u callin' him out like dat walaal. Like u're advise suggested, use the PM.

 

Man, thats why I like the Baro family, waa

raag and they don't let people RUN dem.

 

Anyways, back to the topic at hand

[AYOUB]

Rahima:

It is that simple, therefore anything which opposes this goal (such as the further division of the Muslim lands) becomes unislamic.

Rahima

Separation is the product of division and not the cause of division of Somalia. The land division is just symbolic of the real division that has taken place in the last 20 years or so. Somaliland is a symbol of this split, as is the movement of Bantu Somalis to other parts of the worlds. If the Bantu Somalis had ways and means to stay and feel safe, I'm sure they would. Rather than talk about these 'product' of the division, its better if we addressed the causes and what has to done for these 'causes' of division not take place ever again. If the people of Darfur decide to go it alone in the future , I, for one, would fully understand and would not accuse them of breaking up Muslim land further. Political union is good only if its beneficial to ALL the people... You and I will always be in the same Ummah along with other Muslims no matter their nationalities or locations.

 

 

If there was a Khalifah, all that is needed is for the leaders of Somaliland to obey, support and give their pledge of allegiance to him and this does not necessarily has to through Xamar. Thats the way it used to be in the past and why do you think we should change it now?

 

If 'political/geographical union' alone is a way of uniting the 'ummah', we might as well join with the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and make 'the guardian of the two masjids' our leader.

[Tuujiye]

Man, thats why I like the Baro family, waa

raag and they don't let people RUN dem.

and we don't like people using us for an example..shaqo yeelo..

 

Waryaa dude you are wrong sxb.."nayaa" waa hadal xun lagu yiraahdo dumarka mana qurxoona sxb maxaa yeelay ma adigaa naageystay marka aa naag ku dhaheysid gabar? sxb ceeb waaye sida uu baashe kuu sheegay and be a man hala tirsan gabdhaha...

 

Xarago adigana ceyda iska daa because gabar "garac" iyow ax yaalo fool xun ugu yeereyso walaalkeed ma qurxoona specialy coming from a somali sister. Raali gali walaalka yaaqee!!

 

waraa kheyr baro family wiligeen anaga gabar uguma yeerin "naayaa" iyo wax la mid ah. Hanoo isticmaalin exmaple oo dhaga hadal ah sxb.

 

ps. Xarago iyo Waryaa dude..lol..ha ila yaabina dhalinyaro cireystay aan ahayee..lol..

 

wareer badanaa!!

[Kowneyn]

Khayr:

 

If you are looking for perfection its hard to find it. But you absolutely wrong to say the constitution disrespectful to Islam. The law of the land is to be shariah, no law that is in conflict with is to be enacted, the Guurti which are envisioned to become the seat of the culuma and culture leaders is the highest authority every law that is inacted by the parlaiment will first have to go through them and more importantly they are the legislating body responsible for both the religious and political guidance of nation.

 

Little more work and all the ingredients for a full fledged islamic state will be there and its only matter of time that this will become a reality on the ground. Somaliland is hoped to become a progressive democratic muslim state.

 

In any case, this has nothing to do with the right of Somaliland to independence. We all know what happened to union and what happened after it, if truly we want to be fair then we can't deny that its Somaliland that has always taken the Islamic course...may be they have better instinct, its for you to judge but that is undeniable fact as well.

 

Kowneyn