AU mission to Somaliland says recognition overdue

[Gabbal]

^

 

My question to you young man was What Entity of theirs is the AU contradicting if it considers the genuine application of the Somaliland State ? You have not answered it yet.And am waiting.

Xarago, I sensed comprehension, or lack thereof, was a problem from the beginning hence the reason I sent you back to reread. If you had, you understand the distinction I made between the AU (the organization) and the AU mission (the factfinding group).

 

The AU (the organization) would not be contradicting anything were it to seriously consider recognition of "Somaliland", but the AU mission (the factfinding group) would be jeoparadizing the position of its governing body were it to take a stance or utter political sentiments that contradict those of the said body.

 

My example of Eriterea to you, huuno, was to bring to your awareness( if you have that sense at all) had they gone against that entity when they granted recognition to Eriterea.

Wrongful use of the word entity now. I do not know what you mean this statement, but let me just tell you this: the independence of the State of Eritrea, although signed in Addis Ababa, was not signed in the office of the secretary-General of the AU headquartered in Addis Ababa but in the office of the prime minister of the Ethiopia People's Revolutionary Democratic Front headquartered in Addis Ababa.

 

Mark my words, legality holds sway in this day and age. Somaliland can only be guaranteed independence by a mutual dissolving of the Act of Union of 1960. Tolstoy/Oodweyn understands this. It is why has countless said in the past that the future of both "Somaliland" and Somalia are dependent on "friendly" administrations in Hargeisa and Mogadishu without the objections or feelings of the "defeated lot" called into question. I think he wrongly assumes that the people of Mogadishu have opinions concerning the territorial integrity of the republic that are contrary to those of the defeated lot.

[AYOUB]

Originally posted by Xarago:

Huuno, in layska cantrabaqasheyo walaga fican yahey. My question to you young man was

What Entity of theirs is the AU contradicting if it considers the genuine application of the Somaliland State ?

You have not answered it yet.And am waiting.

Xarago

Eritrea is not the only example either, here's more given by another prominent African who supports Somaliland:

 

"Even those who sympathize with Somaliland feel that somehow they ought not to take a public position. And I think a regional organization like the African Union is very reluctant to legitimize secession. So, at the moment it is true that people are trying to find solutions. The solution for Somalia is Ok, but I don't think any effort to force Somaliland back should be part of that. It would defer the solution for Somalia as well; it would be back to square one. So, if you start bringing in Somaliland , who are reluctant citizens, even what you achieved now in forming a government for the southern part won't last for very long.

 

It was a good attempt to try and unite the part of Somalia previously ruled by the British and that previously ruled by the Italians. But it did not work. So, if Somaliland appears to be more capable of self-government, may be we should give them credit for that. There have been attempts before of countries that were united and pulled out like Mali and Senegal . They decided to break-up. Singapore and Malaya were put together as one country when they attained independence. Then Singapore said it is not going to work and pulled out. And now both sides recognize each other and Malaysia is a separate country from Singapore . An African combination which did not break up, and I hope succeeds consolidating, is Cameroon which includes a part that was ruled by the British and a part that was ruled by the French. The French part is the dominant part and there is a lot of disillusionment on the former British part but not enough yet for people to fight each other." -Professor Ali A Mazrui

 

 

Originally posted by Suldaaanka:

Duqa waa duurxulaysaa maalmahan. Waxani daacayad ka badane ma in la is caaya la isku soo geed fadhiistay? Geed walba in gubtaa waa hoostaalaye.

 

Awoowe, okiyaalihi iyo cumaamaddi'ba kaa dhacee, bal macawistuun xejiso, dumarna waa joogaan goobtee.

As time goes by and reality starts to grip, good ol Baashi resorts to stooping to the levels of "SOL village idi*ts". It's just the desperation and sheer hopelessness of the situation the anti- Somaliland charlatans find themselves in and I don't think SOL's OAP is turning into an asaasaq . Just like his adeero Muse Cadde's comments about people of Las Qorey, Baashi's reduced to verbal outburst out of frustration and inadequacy. Eager to see pitiful souls' next move.

[Gabbal]

^C'mon sxb, Baashi waxiisa kaftan bay ahayde kaftanka hada ma qaadan karti? Nin fir-fircoon baad ahayde maxaa ku helay?

[Che -Guevara]

All Somalis just blow hot Air and attach too much importance to what foriegners say or do.....Too many promises , but little substance......A decade or so later, Sland is still becoming independent and Somali proper has yet to stand on its own feet, and here we have fadhi Ku dirir nation being at it again. Same old stories, same old fights, but little change...Success of our nation as state whether united or divided depends on the success of all Somalis. The sooner we realise...the better of we will be.

[Xoogsade]

Qof ku jecelaa kaala doodo inaa wax wadaag noqotaan. Reer koofurka diidmadooda in waddanka uu kala go'o waa ka daacad. Surely, they are not all coming to Hargeysa or to Berbera and want to settle there, they want the unity of what we know as somalia to remain as it is and stop some misguided somalis from cutting ties to the rest and deform the country. Unity "now" demand is good for posterity. Once you devide communities, each will introduce hatred and fabricated history to justify their stance against the other. Can you imagine 90% somalis hating on 10% of their own? Likewise, would it be beneficial for a minority to vilify their brethren and lie about them to justify self serving political interests based on clan sentiments to their kids?

 

Each community now manages and takes care of their own business lately, some are on their way to doing that, so I fail to see why a somali group wants more than that and a small clan enclave/enclaves to be recognized as a country

[Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar]

You know, folks, it surprises me why a certain one-dimensional issue supporters always come to one another's side to support or cheerlead.

 

Robotic behaviour?

 

Why there isn't a 'public' disagreement, since I am sure they are plenty of out there 'dusted' under the carpet about political disagreement issues pertain to their region, as not openly shown on this forum.

 

You know I am sure if tomorrow I registered a new nick name, and started supporting one-dimensional political issue on this particular board, these certain folks, -- one of them not surprisingly always comes out of lurking to hurrah what he perceives to be his cyber 'cousins' regardless how wrong or correct they are -- will surely welcome me among to be their few cherished "cousins."

 

A little requirement would be to conform to their unwritten 'regional' conformity of ultimate group-speak -- literally. So, instead of writing 'qadhaadh,' if a person slips and writes 'qaraar,' as it was finely illustrated on this very board to a hapless new comer who received a reprimand straying from 'cousinity' group-speak.

 

What they utterly failed to realize is the fact Soomaalis during pre-civil war grew up different regions with different dialects, regardless of that person's clan's associated region's dialect. Under their tribal telescope, however, everything is black and white, one-sided dimensional political issue being the foremost of them all.

 

Hailing and backing up one another all the time indeed is tiresome, really. Diversity is what makes this world fully interesting -- a little at it does. Bring your individualistic political interests forward, no need to put them under the carpet on SOL, because others from groupthink may question your loyalty.

[Xoogsade]

Miskiin, reer koofur ku faraxsan waddankoo kala go'o haddaa aragto waa doqon qabiil neceeb dartiis u taageeraayo qalad ama maxamed dheere oo kale who believes reer waqooyi were burdensome lots to the south to begin with and they will only go away with their burden lol. As for going against the popular group mentality, it depends on how strong you feel about your individuality and indepent thought. If clan matters more to you, then you go with the flow even if you disagree with them.

 

Btw, miskiin, have you forgiven me about the name callings? I disagree with you on what we have talked about still and it shall remain so, but my apologies about the insults.

[Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar]

Xoogsade, ha u bixin. Reer Koonfur kaliya ma'aha ee waa every conscious Soomaali wax dhibsanaayo in dalka la kala gooya. Damiirkeena ma aqbali karo. That seven-like beautiful country qaarad in la kala gooye wax la yeeli karo ma'aha. Kuwii maqnaa ayaa murugu nagu haayo sidii lagu soo celin lahaa, wacdala kuwii jiray in lasii kala gooye.

 

Nasiibxumo ku dhacday reer Goosato waxee kusoo aadeen Midowga Soofiyeedi oo burburay iyo Dagaalkii Qaboobnaa oo dhamaaday.

 

Hadee almiina declare gareyn lahayeen their secession in 1980s on official SNM declaration ku jiri lahayd, wax waa is badali lahaa, oo either labada quwad waagaas tartamaaye ayaa midkood ku hormari lahaa aqoonsigooda, even if they didn't rule a tuulo. Eebaba uma qadarin, maxaa yeelay Soomaalidii la siray oo dagaalkii jabhada ahaa Soomaali National Movement goosasho kuma jirin ajendahooda. [Haduu jirina oo u qarsoonaa Soomaali inay siraan damceen iyagaa isa siray.]

[Baashi]

As time goes by and reality starts to grip, good ol Baashi resorts to stooping to the levels of "SOL village idi*ts". It's just the desperation and sheer hopelessness of the situation the anti- Somaliland charlatans find themselves in and I don't think SOL's OAP is turning into an asaasaq . Just like his adeero Muse Cadde's comments about people of Las Qorey, Baashi's reduced to verbal outburst out of frustration and inadequacy. Eager to see pitiful souls' next move.

 

Welcome bro. and easy there on good ol Baashi . I'm not anti-Somaliland or for that matter anti-Durriyada. No. I'm simply anti-secession. I don't buy the crap secessionist are trying to sell. That's all.

 

Awoowe lama dirririn dee waxuna waa shaashad ee raggu ha kaftamo oo ha la yara dulqaato.

[SOO MAAL]

As northerner for me, I am not anti-northwest or anti-Somaliland, simply I am pro-Somalia, pro-north central Somalia (SSC region), meaning committed to the principle of welcoming, and being co-citizen with every Somali who believes the sanctity of unity and brotherhood of Somali people, in another words, if any Somali seeks to divide brotherly Somali based on the drawings of old colonial master or order from British queen. I am sorry, I cannot accept the unacceptable.

[Xoogsade]

Miskiin, They announced independence out of the blue and every somali was shocked. Sometimes though, when you read or listen to people from the north who are pro-secession, you get the impression their plan preceded any civil war and government abuse. If the reasons for which they are asking to secede could be said to have been southern agression, then surely most southern somalis have nothing to do with what happened. In fact, as you mentioned in another post, the same former regime officials hold important positions in Somaliland government today. So why do the rest of somalis have to suffer the emotional abuse of seeing their country torn apart by the few? I heard no other clan/clans or specific community/communities wanting a state of their own for their sufferings prior to 1990 and after.

 

Anyway, saxib, If somaliland is a region where more than one somali clan has a foothold, then secession driven by one or two of them is not possible. Somalia is back as clan animosity in the south has lost its potency and largely the south is peaceful. Waqooyi galbeed still remains part of somali proper territory and will forever remain so as long as the majority of somalis say so. Reer waqooyiga Dhinacooda haka sii hagaajiyaan waddanka.

[Suldaanka]

Ileyn Tanina Yaablehe; Tuug waa Isaqariyaa

Halka uu ka Xado Timir; Tuhunbuu ka Guuraa

Tobaadkani Ayuubow; Mid Tiriig sitaa yimi

 

Some people never sieze to stop recycling the same old tired points, which have been time and again easily defeated.

 

Thesedays, however, the same indivituals want to create a new sort of revision of history. They are preaching that "Somaliland" was part of Somalia, prior to the colonisers and Somaliland was rightly a region that belongs to Somalia. When the facts are that the only relationship there ever was between Somaliland and Somalia was the ilfated "union" which came about not by being invaded and annexed by Somalia, rather it came about because of the free will of the Somaliland people. The same people who freely also decided to restore their independence, on their own.

 

Miskiin, They announced independence out of the blue and every somali was shocked. Sometimes though, when you read or listen to people from the north who are pro-secession, you get the impression their plan preceded any civil war and government abuse

Well, yes, the feeling of being cheated and dominated started from the word get go, when Somaliland and its government was given just one minister in the first government of 1960s. A mere minister, and not an important one at that, it was the minister of education. The Presient became a southerner, the primeminister became a southerner, the parliamentary speaker was a southerner, all the ministers became southerners with the exception of the Eucation Ministery which was given to the former Prime Minister of Somaliland, Mr. Egal. We made a compromise, but the feeling of being cheated and wronged was there.

 

In 1961, the Somaliland parliamterians tried to make changes to a new constitution solely developed and put together by southerners without any input from those who came from Hargeisa. This again agitated and opened a wound.

 

In that same year, young Somaliland army officials tried in a failed cupe to overthrow the southern regime from Hargeisa and Burao and Berbera. The people who were at that time very naive and still believed the resonating calls from the likes of Suldan Timocade, reluctantly refused instead opted wanted to give more time to the Southerners to come to their senses and provide justice instead of trying to exploit the Northerners and their intoxication in the fake dream of Somaliweynism.

 

Anyways, things changed a little in the late 1960s and early 1970s. But what astonished most Somalilanders was Djibouti's refusal to join the Greater Somalia bandwagon. That was an eye openner, particularly because Somalilanders contributed both hiil-iyo-hoo to the Djibouti's quest for independence. I am not here to mention that on the eve of Djibouti's independence, more than 100,000 thousand Somalilanders crossed the border into Djibouti and voted for their independence. There were lots of poetic poem-chains exchanged between Djibouti poets and Somaliland poets among them is that famous "Sii-leey" which started in the early 1970.

 

Anyways, with Djibouti refusing, and things getting worse, Somaliland worse nightmares becoming a reality when Afweyne and his "leeches" started raping and robbing everything... and everything just kept on going from bad to worse for Northerners... and the eventual attempted ethnic cleansing took place in 1988.. Somalilanders yar iyo wayn knew that it was time to just say good bye...

 

You have to understand that the union between Somaliland and Somalia was never between Hargiesa and Mogadishu alone, it was in the hope that the other 3 regions will also join. That hope never materialised. Hence, Hargeisa wants to reverse the union, since the whole plan failed.

 

If a "union" of any sort is a "Kiss of Death", then Somaliland is guilty as chargedt, but a "union" is not a kiss of death. People unite, companies unite, countries unite, and if all these unions do not work according to desatisfaction of either partner, then any union is bound to Breakup/dissolve.

 

The case between Somaliland and Somalia is a case of "union" that failed, and one of the partners of that "union" just doesn't want anything to do with it anymore. There is just noway there is ever be another union if one of the two is not willing.

 

Some people here are arguing that the "Act of Union" of 1960 is still valid, but they forgot that there was never a proper Act of Union, anyway!! It never passed the parliament hence never became official. Besides, the Afwayne dictatorial regime which came to power in 1969 also nullifies everything since it aboloshed the 1960s constitution.

 

Moreover, the country that existed between 1960-1991 completely became a "failed state" hence failed union. And Somaliland was never part of any new agreement to revive that union, whether its between the warring factions of today's Somalia or in the future. So in essense, in every part of the word "failure", the union failed, and one of the partners is not willing to reinstitute it.

 

Besides, if there is anything left over from that union, its the Somaliland republic which enjoys credibility in the eyes of the world. And in fact as an academic wrote "the closest thing to a viable central government of Somalia is found in Somaliland" (source), hence the surviving partner from the union assumes responsibility to either dissolve or continue the union. In this case, we dissolved it.

 

But it gives me headaches as to how someone would talk about of saving a "Union" when his own region/city is divided up into patchworks of competing/warring factions. A priority seriously misplaced or what? If you guys had the same passionate hate that you have for Somaliland for the warlords and the crminal entreprises that have reckhavoc in your neck of the woods istead of each defending his "favourite warlord" you might have gotten somewhere. But you are wasting such energy where you don't have anything of say in it. What a pitty!!

 

Final word, I would like to tell kuwa Somaliland u dardaarwarinaaya ee leh "Waa la idinla xisaabtamayaa", or "Ma go'i kartaa" etc... these people need to know that Somaliland hadiyad kumay iman. Yes, Somaliland was not recieved on a silver-platter. And please stop sounding like Ali Mahdi in his BBC interview of early 1991.

 

And finally, Somaliland diid ama doon / like it or hate it, this CARAVAN SHALL MOVE ON.

 

ps

for those who want to refer Somaliland as to being a mere region akin to Mudug or Hiiraan, which wants to secede from its mother country, I ask them not to waste their time.

 

You know, folks, it surprises me why a certain one-dimensional issue supporters always come to one another's side to support or cheerlead.

What did you expect?

[Pi]

Suldaanka's been taking lessons from Tolstoy. What with that humungous post.

[SOO MAAL]

Suldaan you have strange version of history,

 

I can’t believe that some still think that are British subjects.

 

The socalled Somaliland (or former Somali british colony) never existed before Europeans came to Somali soil, thus somaliland is simply british prodect and not Somali creation.

 

In June 26, 1960 the Somali British colony (northwest and north central Somalia) received its independence, Hergeysa became the first place that the noble blue flag flown, after 4 days the people of former British Somali (northwest and north central Somalia) collective decided to unite with their brethren of former Italian Somali colony (north east Somalia, central Somalia, and southern Somalia), and the to parliaments were merged. IT WAS NATION REUNION

In 1991, only small radical tribal faction called “SNM†that occupies part of northwest region NOT SAME PEOPLE , decided to declare independent state out of the blue unitarily without consultation with all the population if northern regions

 

The first president of Somalia was from central regions, the prime minister was from northeast, and the speaker of parliament was from southern regions. They from three distant major regions of Somalia.

 

Stop thinking your tribe vs. Somalia and British colony vs. Italian colony, it is backward thinking invented by European colonizers applying the old tricks of “divide and rule†, that part of our history is dark page, and Somali people must move on.

 

I certain egal wasn’t the only minister of Somalia first government cabinet, there was numerous other ministers from territories of former Somali British Somali colony, as well, the prime minister was from northeast if you care north Somalia, but I am sure you don’t care about north Somalia, you only care who is from your tribe in the government.

 

Can someone provide the list of somalia's first government (cabinet ministers)?

 

 

That’s irrelevant comparison; Djibouti is exceptional case for many reasons, (although Djibouti is not 100% Somali region unlike former British colony). Djibouti did not refuse to join their Somalia; the special circumstances dictated Djibouti to not join Somalia, at time Djibouti recieved its independence Somalia was in war with Ethiopia, and after the war ended, Somalia became an unpopular and defeated nation with weak economy, and the angry returned generals of the army started a civil war that still active in Somalia, a time when siyad Barre was expected to step down, on opposite siyad choose to be a ruthless dictator to compete with his rival generals (the present warlords).

 

I believe Djibouti never had the opportunity to join Somalia, and confident that Djibouti will unite with its brethren Somali people in the future, when mother Somalia get its acts together.

 

The current president of Djibouti is more patriotic than all socalled Somali politicians from all regions of Somalia. President of Djibouti said referring Somali warlords “ You have a group of people who are holding their country hostage. They don’t want to move forward. They just defend their own interests. They don’t want to create the necessary conditions for the people to express themselves, and nobody can remove themâ€

 

Somaliland leader riyaale regarding Somali problem “It is their problem. We were united in 1960 but we have with drawn from that union. We will not go back to the union. This is their problem. They have to solve their problem, as we have solved our problemâ€

 

Hargeisa wants to reverse the union

Laascaanood determined to stay as an integral part of Somalia and stay united with the majority of Somali people holding high the noble blue glag

 

Some people here are arguing that the "Act of Union" of 1960 is still valid, but they forgot that there was never a proper Act of Union, anyway!!

In fact there is no need of an act of union (but it is good as formality) because first, Somali people were one and united before the independence, second Somalia never recognized the british Somali

 

 

If Somalia that ceased to exist as government only but not as country is “failed state ? how about former somaliland (british somali colony) that ceased to exist as government and as a country all together? Nonexistent of course

 

 

Since Somalia does not exist in your own views, and the whole world knows that Somaliland (former British Somali) is a history by joined their Somali people. Then in order two of these regions (northwest, togdheer, sool, nugaal, bari, hiiraan, juba, bay, banaadir ) unite must need an act of union funny!!!

 

 

Suldaan before you deal with those patriot Somali people from former Italian colony like xoogsade and miskiin, address deal with patriot Somali people from former brinish colony who want their county to stay united dignified.

 

Cid rabta inay Somalia hal ahaatu waaa soomaalo dhan reer woqooyi na ey ka mid yihiin (or is reer woqooyi one city, one tribe, former european colony in somali soil or those who support radical tribal faction SNM (now so-called somaliland)? I think reer woqooyi is any somali from northern somalia (looyacade/saylac to Cape Guardafui/Gees Gwardafuy/Ras Asir)

 

I strong proponent the ideology of somaliweyn, Somalia ,somali republic, and northern Somalia, but I don’t the ideology of reviving old Somali British colony. However However, I am not agains if genuinely northwest decides to secede from rest of Somalia.

[Xoogsade]

Rudyard Kipling's poem of "The White Man's Burden" Half Devil Half Human should be a good read.