Pictures: Shirkii Pland

[Nationalist]

A conference in Pland's capital Garowe with tangible results involving the Pland government under leadership of H.E. Muhammad Abdi Hashi and Pland's tribal leaders. The latter group was thoroughly represented to the last and smallest subclan. Also representatives of minority groups were represented of course, including those not originally from Pland were welcome.

 

Islaan Muhammad Islan Muse [Nugaal] and Garad Saleban Garad Muhammad [sool]

Beldaje Yasin and Beldaje Abas Ali [bari]

 

More pictures at http://puntlandpost.com/

 

Results till so far:

 

- Firm rejection of any delay of the presidential elections. The elections will be held Januari the 5th 2005 Inshalah.

- Peace agreement whereby Pland is willing to withdraw it's military forces from Sool, Sanag and Ayn regions if Sland will do so as well.

- Invitation of Pland's tribal leaders to hold talks with Sland's tribal leaders. If the Slanders can't come to Garowe, the Planders will come to Hargeisa.

 

The conference is still ongoing and it had started two weeks ago.

[Gabbal]

Islaan

Muhammad

Islan

Muse

Nationalist help me out here. I've never really gotten the point of "Islaan"? Is it a traditional Somali title or one introduced? And doesn't so many traditional leaders bring confusion at critical times as to who to follow? :confused:

[MR ORGILAQE]

Nationalist help me out here. I've never really gotten the point of "Islaan"? Is it a traditional Somali title or one introduced? And doesn't so many traditional leaders bring confusion at critical times as to who to follow?

 

Thanks for your querry bro i will try to answer it as best as i can

 

islan is the title given to the elder of a sub clan withing the MJ clans.To date only two of those sub clans have adopted that title.Others have adopted Beel Daaje,Ugaas.Now in Puntland as whole you'll find Sultaan,Garaad in Sanaag and Garaad in Sool and Sanaag clans.They all come under the authority of the Boqor of the whole Puntland Tribe including the ones in Gedo,Kismayo.He is the final authority and his decision cannot be questioned.However he rarely uses it but rather becomes the one that all of them will bring any differences to and sort of becomes the mediator.I hope that answers your question.

[Sophist]

Orgiliqe, The boqor of Qardho? are you saying he is the Grand Garaad of all? Walee taas waxbaa kuugu laaban.

 

Labada nin ee isla Sawiran ee Nugaal iyo Sool kayimi are currently the most powerful Isims in Puntland.

[General Duke]

Nationalist, nice pics bro.

 

Orgi, I think you are right the Boqor of Qardo was the highest authority of all the issims of Puntland and Gedo etc.

 

Sophist, the two pictured are the most respected elders right now. Islan Muhamed is looking younger though..

[MR ORGILAQE]

Orgiliqe, The boqor of Qardho? are you saying he is the Grand Garaad of all? Walee taas waxbaa kuugu laaban.

 

sophist it seems you know nothing of the Ism hierachy in Puntland.Amongst the tribes of Daaro... the highest Authority is the Boqor based in the "taalada boqorka" in Qardho this has been the case since ancient times

Because he cannot be present for all his peeople who live in more than two thirds the land mass occupied by somalis in somalia,ethiopia,kenya each sub tribe and cna even sub clans and families have their own elders elected from within and then going up the sub clan,clan,sub tribe,tribe all these is similar to the hireachy of a government and the head of the government being the head of state in this case the head of the tribe is the Boqor.This by no means diminishes the clout or popularity of some of the isms but ask them yourselves and they will tell you we are represented by the boqor and they all respect and will listen to him if he asks for it.There is a dedentralised system of governance more like the Federal system that Somalia had decided to adopt.The good thing here is tat this has been going since ancient times.We are now going back to our roots.

[Sophist]

My dear boy, don’t be beguiled by my western nick, I is one rugged white kneed man whose knowledge in this field even surpasses those who are considered authority.

 

Having said that, let me just correct you on your first faux pas. The family which you and I belong to were headed by the sub family of that famous man Wiil Waal; this disapproves your sweeping remark that the inhabitants of Qardho had been on the helm since the beginning of our time. Such is conjured up information which many young men from that vicinity had succumb to. About five hundred years ago, such unity was spoiled and from that damage sprung many men who saw themselves as the potential leader of the sub family were belong to. The Darwishes (this is nick name of my family) decided to crown their own Garad where the Dhabayaco (this is not negative word for those who don’t know it) crowned a Boqor thusly making fragmented system of Kingship.

 

But, confusion stems from the respect which is given in the manner of first born. Since the sons of Har.. the oldest being the Qardho man, such honorour is conferred upon him; not because he is the most influncial but indeed, Mohamed Hart. Is the oldest son of Hart.

 

Now, in modern contemporary world of Puntland, as you can even see from the pictures above, The Islaan of Nugaal and Garaad Saleebaan of Sool and Sanaag are the most influencial of all of them. Both are great orotors, and in the case of the former had been in the on the governing seat for more than five decades.

 

Marka nin aan wax aqoon maahi, ee maandhoow ha khaldamin.

[Gabbal]

Well I know that the clan of Gedo has only two traditional leaders. An Ugaas in Gedo that has higher authority of all the sub-clan in the South and an Ugaas in Cabudwaq that has the highest authority of all the sub-clan in Mudug.

 

Traditionally of the two, the one in Cabudwaq is the higher authority, but of these two at the moment, people listen to the one in Gedo more then Cabudwaq because he is considered more a leader.

 

But, confusion stems from the respect which is given in the manner of first born.

Sophist said it correct. In our case, he two ugases are actually brothers, and have been confered upon title, because their ancestor was the first born of Ugaas Diini.

 

I have been told there were attempts to modernize the system, make it more egalitarian, and politicize it, but the majority of the sub-clan adamantly refused alleging it would bring about confusion and disorder and that they were content with the two Ugaases.

 

They all come under the authority of the Boqor of the whole Puntland Tribe including the ones in Gedo,Kismayo.He is the final authority and his decision cannot be questioned.

Orgi, I think you are right the Boqor of Qardo was the highest authority of all the issims of Puntland and Gedo etc.

Interesting and how did that come about?

[MR ORGILAQE]

Having said that, let me just correct you on your first faux pas. The family which you and I belong to were headed by the sub family of that famous man Wiil Waal; this disapproves your sweeping remark that the inhabitants of Qardho had been on the helm since the beginning of our time. Such is conjured up information which many young men from that vicinity had succumb to. About five hundred years ago, such unity was spoiled and from that damage sprung many men who saw themselves as the potential leader of the sub family were belong to. The Darwishes (this is

nick name of my family) decided to crown their own Garad where the Dhabayaco (this is not negative word for those who don’t know it)

crowned a Boqor thusly making fragmented system of Kingship.

 

 

Sp=ophist you do have a point in the way the sub clans moved on however i never gave you dates or times i simply said since ancient times and 500yrs or so is ancient.As for the islan Mohamed and Garaad Saleebaan,they are the key isims at the moment.They are great isms and they have my utmost respect so do all the other isms.However one cannot ignore the hierachy and if you look at the first born/second born then garaad saleeban will be second to garaad abdiqani but garaad saleebaan is the more popular.similarly islaan mohamed will be second to islaan bashir as islaan bashir descends from the second born cumar maxamud whereas the boqor descends from the line of the boqor himself cusman maxamud who was the first born.similarly as you mentioned quite correctly because mohamed ***** was the eldest he takes the line of boqor and is accorded the respect by the other clans and isms accordingly.So you are "rugcadaa" he ....welcome to the club buddy

[Sophist]

Admin: This is a Anthropology discussion on some of the Isims in Somalia and their positions; pardon us for using tribe names; all used in good gesture.

 

Horn,

 

My knowledge on this matter is not confined to Puntland families but indeed to your kin too. For example I know that the Ugaas in Mudud is Reer Cali Shirwac Ugaas Sharmaake, where as the original one (the chap in Gedo) is reer Ugaas Guuleed, Ugaas Sharmaake both ilmo Ugaas Sharmaake which they are in turn are the sons of Ugaas Diini.

 

Orgi Liqe,

 

On the Point of Garaads (Saleebaan and C/Qani) both are the descendents of Garaad Shirshoore, the former being Garaad Maxamuud the latter Garaad Faarax. Unlike, the Maxamuud Saleebaan sons, who crowned their first born, Osman the Shirshoore boys were equally ambitious. Mohamuud was the oldest of the three sons (Mohamuud, Faarax and Cabdi Garaad). Rumour has it, Mohamoud was bit dim and Farah was a young bright man with ambition. Anyhow, a task was set to prove one’s ability to lead the tribe.

 

Cabdi oo ugu yaraa ayaa isku dayey inuu kala saaro. Wuxuu Maxamuud iyo Faaraxba u sheegey iney geed barda ah oo Nugaal kuyaal iney fariistaan. Wuxuu usheegey iney kobtaan uu uga tagey aanay ka kicin.

 

Harkii ayey fariistaan. Xoogaa Markey fadhiyeen ayaa waxaa wareegey harkii, faarax harkii ayuu la wareegey oo dhankii hooska ayuu aadey. Maxamuud wuxuu ku yiri faarax, beynoow kobtaan inaad ka kacdo maa aanay aheyn, ee wacadkii walaalkaa waad ka baxdey.

 

Cabaar ka bacdii ayaa waxaa soo noqdey Cabdi iyo ragiisii oo lasocda markaasey arkeen Maxamuud oo fadhiya meeshii lagu balamey oo qaraxi dhakada kaheyso, iyo faarax oo hooska raacay.

 

Kobtii bey kucaleemo saareen Faarax maadama uu isticmaaley caqli.

 

That is the history in which the Garadship had come about. But, my 11th grandfather, was not satisfied with such out come. And after couple generations, he declared Garaad Ali (the 9th Grandfather of Garaad Saleebaan) to be crowned and since then, Garaad Saleebaan and co were the head of the Clans of Nugaal and Sanaag and Garad C/qani the clans in Hawd.

 

Laakiin ayaantaan danbe wixii waa sarifmeyn, laakiin Labada Garaad ee Rasmiga ah waa Garaad Saleebaan iyo Garaad C/qani.

 

Hadana, Puntland waxaa shaqsi ahaan ugu sad bursi badan Islaanka iyo Garaad Saleebaan—sababaha taas keentey waa ay tiro badan yihiin.

[MR ORGILAQE]

Appalause Applause Applause Applause Sphist you are indeed "rugcadaa"I grant you that your are well versed in the "anthropology" as you put it

 

Yes the story is pretty much as i heard it and yes the two isms that are most popular are Salebaan and Mohamed.They are decent guys who look out for the best interest of their people may they continue in their quest.

[Gabbal]

Horn,

 

My knowledge on this matter is not confined to Puntland families but indeed to your kin too. For example I know that the Ugaas in Mudud is Reer Cali Shirwac Ugaas Sharmaake, where as the original one (the chap in Gedo) is reer Ugaas Guuleed, Ugaas Sharmaake both ilmo Ugaas Sharmaake which they are in turn are the sons of Ugaas Diini.

Impressive, shall I say Sophist? :cool: Very impressive.

 

Of course as in the Mohamud Saleebaan system, Ugaas Sharmarke was awarded the title as he was the oldest born.

[wind.talker]

LOL

 

Somalis and their obsession with oral stories! BTW, Islan Maxamad Islan Muuse doesn't share his role as the leader of the Issimada with anyone. He's the undisputed leader of the Isimada. I dunno where y'all got that mis-information from.

[Nationalist]

I didn't know there was an isim who has the highest authority in the first place. Islan Muse Islan Muhammad is the oldest isim and of the subclan that inhabits Nugal province.

Don't mistake him with Islan Bashir Islan Abdulle of Upper Mudugh.

 

Sophist good read mate. Horn, what Orgialaq said about the boqor being the highest authority is incorrect. But your clan was certainly part of the isim system that is now taking place in Garowe.

[MR ORGILAQE]

Sophist good read mate. Horn, what Orgialaq said about the boqor being the highest authority is incorrect. But your clan was certainly part of the isim system that is now taking place in Garowe

 

Nationalist i suggest you check your sources are correct before putting it on paper pal.the Boqor is the highest Authority and all you have to do is ask any knowledgeable person about it.Check it out maybe ask mom and dad?.