US taking dangerous gamble in Mogadishu

[Caano Geel]

Brown

Labels aside, the facts on the ground are "the kings have long departed"....

 

1. It is difficult to see how a government put in power by a dictator that is wiping out his own people could ever even sniff at the lofty rhetoric is spouts so loudly.

 

2. Ethiopia has an incentive to pursue and the Zenawi regime would be acting against its own interests if it did not go into Somalia - if for nothing else it need the patronage of the green backs. Its our own peoples fault that we are the conduits of the imperial aspirations

 

3. Occupied or not, it's Somali blood that will be shed the most .. and we have the same duty as before to try ease the pain of this transition (however long it lasts)

 

4. No one needs or wants further bloodshed. So we should at least attempt to reconcile our difference and try to influence the kind of change we would like to see

 

5. Any credibility the TFG had/has will fast disappear if it cannot *at the very least* provide the peace and the security the ICU administered, and this is our strongest weapon -and as far as i understand our only objective.

 

we therefore have something -outside of the realm of power struggles- to hold them accountable with and in their own words- so lets ease on the mud-slinging and concentrate on trying to hold them accountable

[Caano Geel]

Originally posted by Naxar Nugaaleed:

The real wadanis, Brown, are the people who always have the interest of their people at heart. You and other who think like you are far from that. WE can have different opinion on what this interest of the Somali people is but is not our return to statehood our number one interest. Occupation, also, my friend is not how you define it to be. It is when one country takes over another, for what ever reason. If we are to define occupation as whats happening in Somalia, lets just say most of the world is occupied. It has accord again and agian in history, that when the government of a nation is besiged, it asks for the assistance of its allies for help. That is what Somalia has done. A few days. Our government will be in power, Ethiopian troops will be thanked for their assistance and sent back, and you will hate The president, prime minister and the rest of the government. aside from we are an occupied nation (The state of our nation for the past sixteen years is worst then any occupation I can imagen) what will be your excuse for not supporting our government?

Naxar

1. answer the questions posed to you.

 

2. I think you misunderstand the nature of statehood friend. A state *is* a means to an end, *not* the end its self.

 

So whe you say:

" WE can have different opinion on what this interest of the Somali people is but is not our return to statehood our number one interest".

 

a) The answer is unequivacle *NO*. We want mechanisms that will serve our collective interests, unbaised to our indivudual preferences. We'll take what ever provides that - .

 

b) No, most of the world is not under occupation. And those that are are the poorest, stinkiest ones fighting and being slowly wiped out.

 

c) the TFG is *not* a government until it proves it self in serving the interests of the peoples it administers. Up until then it is an interest group.

[ElPunto]

^Hmm - so CG - what is your take on the desirability of a corrupt, dictatorial govt a la Kenya or the small scale anarchy of southern Somalia? Quel est ton choix?

[Faarax-Brawn]

Originally posted by Naxar Nugaaleed:

The real wadanis, Brown, are the people who always have the interest of their people at heart. You and other who think like you are far from that. WE can have different opinion on what this interest of the Somali people is but is not our return to statehood our number one interest. Occupation, also, my friend is not how you define it to be. It is when one country takes over another, for what ever reason. If we are to define occupation as whats happening in Somalia, lets just say most of the world is occupied. It has accord again and agian in history, that when the government of a nation is besiged, it asks for the assistance of its allies for help. That is what Somalia has done. A few days. Our government will be in power, Ethiopian troops will be thanked for their assistance and sent back, and you will hate The president, prime minister and the rest of the government. aside from we are an occupied nation (The state of our nation for the past sixteen years is worst then any occupation I can imagen) what will be your excuse for not supporting our government?

War wuxu ma geyd maygaag ah baa? You are spewing the exact same thing i said with less inteligence of course. I simply said There is a difference of opinion. You find the Xabashi invading and their dabadhilifs a good thing,I DONT. You can spin this however you want this to be,But Ethiopia is NOT an ally of SOMALIA. Its an ENEMY of SOMALIA and their Prime Minister IMPOSED and bought WARLORDS of this very govt his Brother in law and Xabashi loving dabadhilif door Knob Geed on to SOMALIS.

 

The essence of this govt lies in its leadership and who hand picked that leader: Menace Zina-wi[Pun intended door knobs]. He is the same guy who hand picked this Door knob,asked him to go to IGADD to get front line troops and the people of Somalia rejected that. The evidence of that is found right here on SOL. So all FAILED and what do we see? Plan C.Invade the entire nation and have his hand picked leader rule somalia.

 

I am presuming that this Menace is doing ALL this,Going thru ALL this for the LOVE of SOMALIS & SOMALIA. Right Mr Xaar Nuglaaday and his door knob buddies? If that answer is YES, Then Please let us end this uninteligent nacnac & counter nacnac right here and right now.

[Caano Geel]

point

Umm, My choice?

 

First i'll take the "scale anarchy of southern Somalia" to mean the ICU administration..

 

The Kenyans have cultivates a vile kleptocracy, but other than Mau Mau uprising (1952-1960) hasn't engaded in wholesale genoside. they have a growing economy, somewhat peacefull polical movements (exc. if your a somali interest group).

 

I think what we forget with the ICU is that they are a reactionary movement, formed out of the scars of the population, to stave off to human leaches. And as such they performed a duty well and beyond any that could be expected or hoped for.

 

Therefore the argument cannot be an "either or" case, since the ICU could not of come about, if whatever ruled somalia could of at least put forward a percentage of what the kleptomaniacs of Kenya have provided for their population.

 

 

However, in my humble oppinion, we dont need movements, they are transiant. We need instituations (health, wealth, eductaion, ....) that stay. Let people bring on what ever belief set they like, so long as they leave the institutions in place.

 

For that reason i dont much care who is in power, so long as providing for their population is their only objective ....

 

Therefore, with regard to TFG only time will tell, and though sadly the past performace of their members and the track record of their sponsor dont leave much to the imagination, I dont think we should let go of our hopes.

[Castro]

Originally posted by ThePoint:

^Well - you know what they say about Amxaaro/Tigree loving, unpatriotic, treasonous, anti-Muslim, gaalo-raac, munafaq dhabadilifs - don't ya?

Yes. Door knobs.

[Jacpher]

Naxar: The problem with you is that you have no eyes and ears other than TFG. No other point of veiws other than the criminal entity. No point in engaging a door knob mindset.

 

Originally posted by ThePoint:

A/Y is a warlord but when he led Puntland - most acknowledged that some improvement had been made.

Can you name some of the improvements you speak of other than subjugating the public for another term, inciting a civil war and leading peaceful Boosaas to war twice and building Aqalka dowlada [read: presidential palace] in Boosaaso rather than the capital Garoowe.

[ElPunto]

Originally posted by Jimcaale:

quote:Originally posted by ThePoint:

A/Y is a warlord but when he led Puntland - most acknowledged that some improvement had been made.

Can you name some of the improvements you speak of other than subjugating the public for another term, inciting a civil war and leading peaceful Boosaas to war twice and building Aqalka dowlada [read: presidential palace] in Boosaaso rather than the capital Garoowe.

He helped to establish a functioning administration in North-east Somalia and led it for a number of years. There's one for ya.

 

I dislike it when people let their biases distort the facts. I also dislike those can't get themselves to comment positively in any manner due to their bias. After all, the worst of people have some positive points.

 

PS - Can you please tell me why you think building a palace in Bosaaso as opposed to Garowe is such a crime? I am most curious to know.