The Trouble with Islam

[La Fidele]

Perhaps you've come across this catchy line recently--it's the title of a newly published book by Irshad Manji, a Canadian TV Personality of East Indian descent. She is also a lesbian and a feminist. Oh, and she's Muslim too. And a self-described Quranic scholar (but who speaks no Arabic) no less!

 

To list the vast number of severe flaws in her arguement is so taxing that I won't be bothered with it here, but I think the fact that she has no knowledge of the Arabic language and her open homosexuality are enough to give someone a clear idea of exactly what kind of agenda she's pushing.

 

Basically, Manji accuses Arabs of manipulating Islam into a rigid religion, "causing Muslims all around the world to dress like Arabs, memorize Qu’ranic verses in their language, and adopt their politic outlook," and subsequently banning Islamic Ijtihad (independent reasoning). She also says that the Quran "informs terrorism" and "preaches hate", and that anti-semitism, homophobia and mysoginy are inherent in Islam.

 

Attacks on Islam these days are nothing new, but what's so unsettling about Manji is that she claims to be a Muslim--who fasts, abstains from alcohol, prays (but not as proscribed in the Quran)--and yet makes such heretical claims and actions that trump all other things! Even worse is her--and many other Western intellects--arrogance to recite excerpts from an English translation of the Quran and take it entirely out of context and significance. Through this fault she sides herself with famous Orientalists, scholarly foes of Islam, such as Bernard Lewis and Daniel Pipes.

 

In the end, her book is a disservice to all Muslims, and really just flattering to Zionists and other Westerners who wish to continue the image of Islam as a "terrorist faith." Not surprisingly, Manji is catching a heck of a lot of attention from Western media, despite an overwhelming negative response from book critics.

 

If you'd like to read more about Manji and "The Trouble with Islam," her website is Muslim Refusenik . An informative article/critique can also be found at The McGill Daily .

[hukri]

As Stephen Schwartz, reviewing the book in The Globe and Mail suggests, Manji seems to want a religion without rules.

“The book should be called 'The Trouble with Irshad Manji,'” Mohammed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress, remarked recently. Elmasry may well be right. Despite its overarching goals, The Trouble with Islam reads best as a poignant account of one woman’s struggle to maintain her Islamic faith while honestly addressing the moral qualms she feels afflicting her.

^^I Agree

 

Gay and muslim? :eek: Acudubillah!! May Allah show her the right path!

[Baashi]

What an inconvenience! Manji seems to run an obstacle that erects a wall between her worldly desires and the kind of social conformity dictated by divine rules. As Stephen Schwartz put it, she “seems to want a religion without rules”. As there is no such thing as religion without rules, she has an idea: Islam needs to be reformed to her liking. After all, Martin Luther successfully spearheaded a reformation movement and freed fellow faithful from the shackles of papacy. If she is successful, she will too bring about a progressive Muslim polity. Among other things, Prayer times will be tentative, Lesbians will be embraced as pious and prayers will be led by them, and she envisions Islamic state free and just as the current Israel state. These are paraphrased quotations from her book

 

I haven’t read her book but the reviews are good enough for me to draw a conclusion. Manji is on to something and that’s not included the trouble with Islam. It is more on her and the trouble and the futility associated with reconciling the irreconcilables. Mohammed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress hit the nail on the head when he suggested that the book should be renamed ‘The Trouble with Irshad Manji’.

[Bambina]

Salam to all of you , a month ago I watched Irshad's islamic point of view on CBC and thought about buying her book.At that time , I didn't know,she was a lesbian,I've only learned it while reading your posts and that is not going to make me stop buying her book because I can judge by myself her views regarding Islam.

 

Let me start by saying that just because I agree with some of her points , it doesn't mean that I agree with her open homosexuality,because I believe some people might right away jump to hasty and false conclusions.

 

Since I didn't read her book , I can't quote specifically what she wrote.But based on what she said on TV,I don't think she was insulting Islam but rather , critisizing the way some people misunderstood the Quran.

 

She said for example , that some used Islam to dominate women and I believe you might agree with me guyz,if you take the Afghan example , under the Talibans , women werent allowed to be educated and I believe it's the opposite of nabi Mohamed's teachings(SAW).

 

Other things , Irshad should have changed the title of her book because it gives a negative conotation to Islam by starting by "the trouble with Islam" , but you have to be cautious enough to read further.I believe in our religion , however how some misunterpret it , scares me.

 

That is why I all recommend you to buy her book so you can see for yourself where Irshad stands on her islamic views.Sadly,I noticed if a muslim starts critisizing the way Islam is applied ,he or she is immediatly accused of insulting Islam ,working with the medias of the West or being paid to destroy Islam's image.

 

As a muslim you should follow Mohamed's teachings (SAW) but also remain critical when you have doubts because it expands your knowledge , when in need of real answers to your questions.We all have different views about Islam , is that a crime?

We all argue in our daily lives but you'd be surprised how many people will threaten you if you write a book about how Islam should be applied in the right way. If tomorrow I come out with a book accusing how people are neglecting Allah's guidelines ,should I be accused of being a kufr? NO,on the contrary ,Im trying to defend my religion as much as I can because I have to fight against hypocrites.

 

To Jazeera ,you might have read the book , which explains your negative comments about Irshad maybe she does push too far her comments about Islam , like I said before I didn't read her book and I intend to find out what she has to say.

 

But you said: "She is also a lesbian and a feminist. Oh, and she's Muslim too. And a self-described Quranic scholar (but who speaks no Arabic) no less!" and "Even worse is her--and many other Western intellects--arrogance to recite excerpts from an English translation of the Quran and take it entirely out of context and significance."

 

 

First of all ,I wont emphasize on her sexual preference since I know that homosexuality is haraam and not quite the point Im trying to get to.I have the feeling that the fact Irshad was feminist made you believe it was one of the reasons she might have critisized Islam ,unless Im wrong ,you could be a muslim feminist since you defend women's rights.But what I thought was very arrogant coming from you is,the fact that you emphasized in bold "english translation of the quran" as if people reading in arabic were better interpreters , let me tell you ;not all people are able to read arabic , plus people reading in arabic sometimes make mistakes when interpreting the quran.

 

 

I know my speech is quite long but I hope it opens your eyes, critical thinking helps you understand because if you don't , you might as well agree with what the kufars have to say.Real issues exist in Islam , people are neglecting some of Allah's teachings, hiding the veil of truth behind hypocrisy.Irshad brought up some important issues but to know if she's destroying Islam's image you have to read her book and find out for yourselves as I intend to do.

[qori xabaalan]

Here we go again, another Muslim advertising another tool (a book) to bash Islam. I guess we did not learn any lessons from Salam Rushdi’s book and Khumeni’s blunder!

Jazeera, I ask, I know what her motive is (money and hurt Islam), what is yours? Sell more books for her? Shame! This article is nothing but an advertisement of this book and you have an audacity to put it on this supposedly Muslim forum. If I were you, I would pull this advertisement!.

 

I wonder how many Bambinas out there ready to buy this book for enlightenment in Islam and in turn make this womam richer?

salaama

[wind talker]

I'm sorry. I must be lost.

 

Since when do the opinions of a Canadian journalist of East Indian ancestry warrant a response?

 

Pathetic.

[Reality Check]

Bambina,

 

I agree with you ...make your own conclusions about the book.

 

Personally, I have heard the woman speak last night on TVO (have not read the book). At first, I thought this chick needs an attitude adjustment..looked like she had a chip on her shoulder. But Later on, as my mom would agree, she did make good points about middle-eastern countries and the voice of the Muslim people (or should I say lack thereof). We as muslims are not the most perfect people on earth, nor do we not have important issues to discuss. All we are concerned is about the "IMAGE" of the muslim people to nonmuslim rather than tackling issues between us. We do have terrorist amongst our people, but we are complacent about it. I especially liked when she said "We as Muslims need to be challenged"...meaning if we are in the wrong, WE NEED THINGS FIXED..we are far from perfect.

 

As for the feminist part of the your post Jazeera, why must we always put feminism in such a negative connatation? Are we so againt Women's rights? I am feminist (pro-woman's rights), does that make me a nonmuslim or discredit the work that I do?

 

As for her Homosexuality, that is haraam, but then again how many sins do you commit on a daily basis...or your whole life put together?

 

In fact, within the panel of muslims there, there were some shady characters too, that I wouldnt want representing me as a Muslim. I didn't like the way that Al-mesry kept dodging issues when asked a simple question.

[Qac Qaac]

first let's set the rules early,

 

1. Islam is perfect, there is no trouble, trouble with her.

 

2. it is very clear in the quran, and in the sunnah of our beloved prophet, that there is no place for gay ppl, both male and female in our religion, and no thanks. we not gonna reform it our religion like Martin Luther did to christianity.

 

again, the kuffars, and those who like to be like kuffars like this woman here, always seem to find islam problem, only from the women side. this is getting old.

 

islam treats women perfectly, but muslim men, and their st00pid calture creates the bad treat on the women. clarify this pt ok.

 

Bombina, sis don't fell to the trap, u said, u r sure the Talibans ban women from education, well i just wanna know where u heard it from, coz i am assuming u were not under the taliban rule, if u heard it from tv, places like cnn, bbc, cbc, well those don't count, coz we know their history as liers especially cnn.

 

so if u gonna slander your muslim brothers in Afghan u really have to be sure, they are doing this, and is true, coz it looks like now america is doing nothing for the women of afghan, they still wear the Burqa, and still have no education. only brought their intrest in here.

 

cnn and bbc, are not bukhari and muslim, they are not saxiix most of the time, more than 50% and up is lies, and propaganda.

[Qac Qaac]

bombina critisizing quran, when u not even applaying it in your life,

 

critisizing it, and u didn't spend 40yrs learning quran to be scholar, quran is the word of allah, and u saying us human being could find flows in there.

 

Bombina do u really know this women, and what she stands for, u said i am gonna buy her book. she doesn't even practice the islamic minimum of the salat, saum, zakkah, and hajj.

 

also she said quran contradicts, r u serious. quran is the words of allah, can not never be contradicted.

 

pls tell me how some one could claim to be scholar. in universities they would laugh at you, u have to have knowledge to be educated.

 

naagtaan way ka shubtay, waxay na tahay naag ushaqeesa gaalada oo waxaaba ka fahmi kartaa her st00pid book is # 1. selling book in chapters. coz the kuffrs love when some one especially from the muslim ppl writes something like this. r u kidding me?

[Blessed]

Salaams,

 

Bambina

 

I do agree with you to a certain extent. Unfortuntaly, people have and do interpret Islaam to suite their own desires and many Muslims countries use it to oppress women and the poor through their cultural interpretations of Islaam. The problem here lies with the people and not Islaam!

 

Similarly women are also guilty of misusing the Quraan in their feminist battles. In most cases it is against Islaam and not the cultural interpretations of it.

 

Walaal, the fact that Irshad is a lesbian is manifestation of her stance with regards to the rules set out in the Quraan by Allah. Here we have a woman that is blatantly defying the rules of the Quraan... how can we be taking our deen from her?

 

Yes, social ills do exist in the Muslim world, no one is denying that and we should challenge them - but do we need a lesbian to lead us?

 

I have the feeling that the fact Irshad was feminist made you believe it was one of the reasons she might have critisized Islam ,unless Im wrong ,you could be a muslim feminist since you defend women's rights.

Her feminism is the reason that she attacked Islaam. Not she only highlights issues concerning women and ifnores the racism and un-islmic practices paravelant in the muslim world. There is nothing wrong with fighting for the rights of women - however, we must observe the islamic ruling in doing so - and that is to demand our rights using the Quran and the Sunnah as tools.

 

Feminism is a whole ideology of thinking that has several levels of interpretation and arguements - which often contradict the Quraan and the Sunnah. Bottom line it is a system of Kufr as its founders are kuffar and its thoughts are influenced by kaafir ideologies such as marxism, liberlism - soclism etc. Would you advocate for an Islamic democracy - nowing full well that democracy takes the rule away from Allah and assigns it to humans?

 

These ideologies might sound nice on the surface but the underliying message in all of them is that they all negate the devinity of the Quraan - how then; can we claim to be a muslim feminist - One who Submits fully to the will of Allah - but fights for their rights using kaafir ideas... doesn't make a great deal of sense.

 

 

 

But what I thought was very arrogant coming from you is,the fact that you emphasized in bold "english translation of the quran" as if people reading in arabic were better interpreters , let me tell you ;not all people are able to read arabic , plus people reading in arabic sometimes make mistakes when interpreting the quran.

The Quraan was revealed in arabic - therefore to get it's true and clear meaning one needs to understand the arabic language. That is classic arabic - which is not used anymore.

 

It doesn't mean to say that arabs are better Muslims than none arabs but that the English translation is someones English interpretation of the Quran. Where the arabic Quraan is exactly as it was delivered to the Messenger (saw), as was thought to the Companions. Anybody that has intrepreted a document will know that it is alomost impossible to do a word-for-word interpretation from one language to another. this is not to say that we should all learn arabic but that we would be in a better position if we knew it - and when one is claiming to be a scholar as is our Irshad - they must speak the language!!

 

*Allah knows best*

[Baashi]

Allah knows best indeed. And you just articulated the sentiments of many including me. Heblaayo what a lady u are sis. Can I call u Ameenah (yes? thanks), Ameenah you and other ladies (Bulo, Rahima, Rahma, Tamina, Jazeera, my favorite Barwaaqo, and many many other nomads make me proud every time I visit this site. Granted it is a screen character on a box...but your miyir and faith speak volumes...

 

Come here often and share ur take on the matters of larger concern.

[Jaabir]

Originally posted by Heblaayo:

Salaams,

 

Walaal, the fact that Irshad is a lesbian is manifestation of her stance with regards to the rules set out in the Quraan by Allah. Here we have a woman that is blatantly defying the rules of the Quraan... how can we be taking our deen from her?

 

It doesn't mean to say that arabs are better Muslims than none arabs but that the English translation is someones English interpretation of the Quran. Where the arabic Quraan is exactly as it was delivered to the Messenger (saw), as was thought to the Companions. Anybody that has intrepreted a document will know that it is alomost impossible to do a word-for-word interpretation from one language to another. this is not to say that we should all learn arabic but that we would be in a better position if we knew it - and when one is claiming to be a scholar as is our Irshad - they must speak the language!!

 

*Allah knows best*

 

 

Heblaayo.. AKA Ameenah.. I LOVE YOU WALAAHI.. ladies like you make SOL a good site to visit.. you said what i wanted to say walaahi..Jazaaki alaah Khayr and may allah guide us to his path..

 

 

[Bambina]

Again, some of you misunderstood me ,but I was 99% sure it was going to happen anyways , if you had really paid attention to my post, you would have noticed that I was supporting some of Irshad's points of view not ALL OF THEM ,besides since I didnt read her book , so how the hell , do I know if she's insulting Islam or not, unless I read what she wrote?I hope this makes sense to some of you.

 

It is so easy for me to know if some of you did really read my post or not and I love replying to your posts , specially when they are contradicting themselves.

 

Lets start with you QacQac , did I say , once that I was supporting those who critisized the Quran ?I hope you have good eyes because I have the feeling you are confusing me with Irshad ,right or wrong ? Specially when you say:

 

"quran is the word of allah, and u saying us human being could find flows in there."

 

or "bombina critisizing quran, when u not even applaying it in your life"

 

So dear Qac Qac , the day you will learn to differentiate between what I say and what Irshad says , you can get back to me and prove your points.Besides , you dont know if I apply or not Islam in my life , and I believe as a muslim , you shouldnt make such judgements , thats your first lesson and dont tell me you dont agree with that.

 

You also say:

"Bombina do u really know this women, and what she stands for, u said i am gonna buy her book. she doesn't even practice the islamic minimum of the salat, saum, zakkah, and hajj."

 

Dear Qac Qac ,I never pretended to know Irshad but let me ask you this simple question , do you know her as well? Because you seem to know her personally , since you confirm us that she doesnt pray ,nor fast, make zakkah or even go to hajj.But I have a feeling you dont know her as well.Clarify this ,ok.

 

Other things,propaganda is regularly used whether in Christian or Muslim countries, its nuttin new, bro, I do agree that CNN is not the best TV station to watch, but pointing fingers towards it everytime for every muslim problem is too easy as well blaming the West.I agree that some problems are due to the West but I believe we, as muslims have brains not to follow them.

 

This will be the first and last time I will explain to you my point of view, and this time open your eyes veryyyy big.

First of all,I believe in Allah's words ,the quran, to be one of the best teachings, dont get me wrong on that."The trouble with Islam" was written by Irshad not me,I hope you will know that.

 

Second of all,since we dont live in a perfect world, I believe some of us wont apply the exact Allah's teachings in their daily life,dont get me wrong on dat,Im not sayin that Im the best example existing on earth.

 

And third of all, dear Qac Qac , correct me on this one if Im wrong,but if I follow your logic,no problems exist in muslim countries, everything is beautiful and things only turn bad when the West sneaks its nose.

 

Do you believe in the Judgement Day? If you do , you will know that we're all going to be judged regardless on how many times we pray or not.Real issues exist in muslim countries not in the quran, I hope you understand that.Because if everything was fine ,there wouldnt be a judgement day mentionned in the quran at the first place.

 

Feel free to respond back if you have anything to add because Im done.

[Medley of extemporanea]

this is so s tu pid .... what business does this queer have talking about religion... someone needs to remind her that if she doesn't like islam, she doesn't have to call herself a Muslim.

[Libaax-Sankataabte]

Originally posted by Baashi:

Heblaayo what a lady u are sis. Can I call u Ameenah (yes? thanks), Ameenah you and other ladies (Bulo, Rahima, Rahma, Tamina, Jazeera, my favorite Barwaaqo, and many many other nomads make me proud every time I visit this site. Granted it is a screen character on a box...but your miyir and faith speak volumes...

Baashi, I thought I wrote that piece, but then I realized my name was not Baashi. May Allah reward them all with even more wisdom and goodness.