SOMALIA: Saudi beheading of Somalis grossly unfair Amnesty says

[-Serenity-]

SOMALIA: Saudi beheading of Somalis "grossly unfair" Amnesty says

 

[ This report does not necessarily reflect the views of the United Nations]

 

NAIROBI, 8 Apr 2005 (IRIN) - The public execution of six Somali nationals in Saudi Arabia on Monday was a shocking abuse of human rights, according to Amnesty International (AI).

 

"Six Somalis were suddenly executed in public on 4 April without being informed in advance that their five-year prison sentences, which they had served - and also been lashed - by May 2004, had apparently been changed later to death sentences by a secret procedure," Martin Hill, Horn of Africa researcher for AI, said on Thursday.

 

Ali Sheikh Yusuf, Abdel-Fatar Ali Hassan, Abdullah Adam Abdullah, Hussein Haroon Mohamed, Abdul-Nur Mohamed Wali and Abdullah Hassan Abdu had been detained in a prison in Jeddah, one of Saudi Arabia's main cities, since their conviction for theft in May 1999.

 

AI said that the trial of the men, said to be migrant workers from Somali capital Mogadishu, had been inconsistent with international standards on fairness.

 

The six Somalis were unaware that they were at risk of death, according to AI, which said it had written to the Saudi minister of interior regarding the men's status, but had received no response.

 

Decrying the secrecy surrounding the Saudi Arabian criminal justice system, the human-rights watchdog said that most defendants and their families were not informed of the charges against them, nor of the progress of legal proceedings.

 

It further stated that defendants could be convicted solely on the basis of confessions obtained under duress, torture or deception.

 

Trial proceedings took place behind closed doors, AI said, and those accused had no right to legal representation - while in the case of foreign nationals, inadequate or no access to consular assistance was allowed.

 

AI put the total number of people executed in Saudi Arabia in the last four months at 51, almost two-thirds of which were foreign nationals.

 

It called on Saudi Arabia's King Fahd to commute all outstanding death sentences, and to bring Saudi trial proceedings into line with international standards.

 

According to the Somali press, human-rights groups in Mogadishu have also condemned the executions as illegal and contrary to both Islamic Shariah law and international law.

 

Source

[Haddad]

SOMALIA: Saudi beheading of Somalis "grossly unfair" Amnesty says

 

[ This report does not necessarily reflect the views of the United Nations]

Something is murky and in contradiction with the above two parts. The original title doesn't include the notation part. Amnesty International isn't part of the United Nations; each is an independent organization. Awdal News mistakenly wrote United Nations, instead of Awdal News in:

code:

---

[ This report does not necessarily reflect the views of the United Nations]

It should have been:

code:

---

[ This report does not necessarily reflect the views of Awdal News]

[-Serenity-]

Haddad, if you cant address the issue, kindly take leave of this thread.

[Haddad]

Originally posted by Amethyst:

if you cant address the issue, kindly take leave of this thread.

Well, I think the mistake in the article has to be corrected in order to address it.

[Xoogsade]

Originally posted by Haddad:

Well, I think the mistake in the article has to be corrected in order to address it.

Suppose it is corrected bro, what would be your take on the issue? Have you given your opinion about the punishment somewhere else? According to the report, these guys were given a jail sentence at first, after sometime the punishment was changed from jail time to beheading. It is a question of punishment not fitting the crime the way I see it. Nothing to do with arab wrong-doing or Somali law-breaking. This event is past gone anyway and prayer serves best those who are dead. But for the sake of discussion if someone raises the issue, it is better to discuss than argue.

[Garyaqaan2]

Well, I think the mistake in the article has to be corrected in order to address it.

 

warileen anagaaa wax araganay. Waxaan maqli jiray Odayga habarta lasaar. these homboy is goin somewhere. no one needs your F#$$$$$$$$$ up opinion take your sick mind to arab website sh###########t. I wonder what the arbas did to you the way you love their unjustice system.

[-Serenity-]

Allah (Exalted is He) said in the Qur'an:

"If anyone slew an innocent person it would be as if he slew the whole mankind and if anyone saved a life it would be as if he saved the life of the whole mankind"

Al-Qur’an 5:32

 

And whose words carry more meaning other than Allah's when Allah(swt) said Allah loves not those who are unjust.

 

The following article sums up alot that has been discussed in the forum. I hope, in some small way, this clears things up for some... like it did for me.

 

Taken from Hiiraan website.

 

The Saudi Executions: Un-Islamic and Extra-judicial Killing

 

By Abdul Wahid Sheikh Osman

 

Introduction

 

It may seem quite disingenuous to some that so many Somalis have expressed sadness, outcry and anger regarding the recent Saudi executions. No foreign friend or foe has ever inflicted upon us as much misery and destruction as we, Somalis, brought upon ourselves. Therefore, if we, Somalis, are, indeed, serious about restoring our dignity and protecting our citizens and natural resources from the injustices and toxics of the foreigners, let us put our house in order and build a nation state that would safeguard our rights at home and abroad.

 

This short comment is not intended to discuss the position or view of the western legal systems towards the punishment imposed on these six young men. Suffice to say that the methods by which these executions are carried out amount physical torture and are contrary to the Bill of Rights, Charter of Freedoms and other safeguards enumerated in the constitutions, statutes and laws of the Western countries. Instead, I will attempt to examine whether or not these punishments are reflective of the Islamic legal doctrines and injunctions.

 

The Islamic Law and the Saudi Executions

Since the majority of the provisions in the Saudi Penal Code are based on Islamic law, at least in theory, I would like to examine the Saudi actions under both the strict interpretations of the classic Islamic Law and in light of the expositions by the early Islamic Jurists.

 

According to the statement by the Saudi Interior Ministry, the six Somali gangsters were convicted of “abducting and robbing taxi driversâ€. Thus, there were no allegations of murder in the statement.

Now, based on the above facts, the only possible crime, under Islamic law, which these men can be charged with and which they might be found guilty of is the crime of Hirabah, a crime similar to the Highway Robbery.

Linguistically (Arabic), the term Hirabah comes from the root Hariba, a verb that means to become angry and enraged. By derivation the noun harb (pl. hurub) means variously “war†and “enemy.

 

In Islamic legal terminology, the term Hirabah is broadly defined as “spreading mischief in the land,†but its precise meaning is “killing by stealth and targeting a defenseless victim in a way intended to cause terror in society.â€

This crime , being one of the Hudud crimes, and its punishment is described in the holy Quran as Surah al-Maidah 5 verse 33-34 states “The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crufication, or the cutting off the hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter. Except for those who repent before they fall into the power: In that case, know that Allah is Oft-Forgiving and Most Mercifulâ€

 

The Jurists from the four major schools of jurisprudence in the Sunni Islam have interpreted the punishment contained in the above verse as following:

 

(A) A Jail time or discretionary punishment (Ta’zir) not leading to death penalty but might include exile will be imposed where Hirabah was committed without seizure of property or causing death.

 

(B) First strike: With amputation of the right hand from the wrist and the left foot from the ankle where property was seized, but death was not caused.

 

© In the event of a Second strike, that is where the Hirabah is committed for the second time, the offender will face the imputation of the left hand from the wrist and the right foot from ankle.

 

(D)Where murder occurs in the course of committing Hirabah but no property was seized, the offender will face the death penalty.

 

(E) The most severe punishment will be imposed where the offender commits murder and seizes property, in which case he will face death penalty and or including crucification.

 

In the absence of any credible and fair sentencing guidelines, appeal process and competent legal defense in the Saudi justice system, the Saudi executions are, therefore, from Islamic law perspective, unusual, appallingly inhumane, cruelly disproportionate punishment to the crimes allegedly committed by these young men.

 

I am not questioning the solemn duty of the Saudi government to protect its citizens and maintain law and order rather, my point is that even under the most strict Islamic law interpretations, the charges brought against these young men carry maximum punishment of amputation of their hands and legs and NOT executions.

 

I wonder if the Saudi authorities would find the guts to impose the same punishment had the offenders were its own citizens or those of powerful foreign country, a sad fact that speaks volumes about the state of administration of justice in the Muslim world today!

 

Abdul Wahid SheikhOsman is an Adjunct Professor at the Law School of the University of Minnesota and a regular contributor of Hiiraan Online.

E-mail: Shei0038@umn.edu

[NGONGE]

^^ How did this article clear things up for you?

[shyhem]

Haddad

Well, I think the mistake in the article has to be corrected in order to address it.

You just felt like giving an opinion,or what else is bugging you dude?Sadly yours is not worth anything.I told you long time ago, that you should quit this whole Aljazeera thing.

[Haddad]

Originally posted by SomericaN:

 

I told you long time ago...

Under what username?

[-Serenity-]

NGONGE, I understood what you and your comrades were attempting to explain all along...except you made no relevance to the case in point (cuz there is none). While the author dismissed this.

[NGONGE]

^^ Did you really?

 

Neither the author, nor “my†comrades (well not all of them anyway) have told you that this whole thing is but a typhoon in an oyster shell, dear. Could you understand that one?

 

It’s the usual case of moral panics. Did you cry when princess Diana died? And, since you’re in the UK, shall I mention Jessica and Holly, Sarah whatever her name and the various other similar cases! No, hang on; let me return to my favourite subject, poor old ZamZam (remember her?).

 

You see, Amethyst, such “injustices†take place in the world all the time. There are countless stories, tragedies and unfair practises occurring all the time. The reaction to such instances is what’s important. To just wail and point fingers is not a sign of a healthy society.

 

Your articles above both overreact, like most of the people here, to incomplete information. In the case of Amnesty international, that’s just the way they’ve always been. The whole point of such an organisation is to push, cajole and magnify any examples of injustice so that they could help to banish them.

 

Still, someone has to step back and see things for what they are. There is nothing NEW about executions in Saudi Arabia, nothing sacred about Somali lives that would say, “Execute all the others but don’t touch our Somalisâ€. In other words, in the usual scheme of things, the Saudi justice system did what it always does. This time the “accused†happened to be Somali!

 

Should one have sympathy and wonder (note the use of this word) about the correctness of the punishment? OF COURSE.

 

Should one enquire as to how such injustice should be stopped? IT WOULD BE A FAIR ENQUIRY.

 

Should one wail and rant and lose his/her head with the vulgar? NOT IF ONE HAS ANY SENSE.

[Jumatatu]

Originally posted by NGONGE:

Still, someone has to step back and see things for what they are. There is nothing NEW about executions in Saudi Arabia, nothing sacred about Somali lives that would say, “Execute all the others but don’t touch our Somalisâ€. In other words, in the usual scheme of things, the Saudi justice system did what it always does. This time the “accused†happened to be Somali!

Exactly sxb the Saudi justice being what it is, suspiciously dubious, gives us the right to raises our voices this time cause the victims are our brethens. Now it is not the time for us to step back and see things how they are. There is nothing that can be done about the deceased six but if ever there is a numerous and united voices angry and in protest this time then it would hopefully ring a bell in the mind of Saudis to think twice in the future before carrying out such indecent and gravely injustice acts on future Somali prisoners in their custody.

I think you will agree with me one of the influtial factors in their decission to carry out such injustice was first superiority complex and secondly their understanding that there is no as such a Somali society united that will even blink about it let alone be alarmed.

It is the latter factor that needs to be proved wrong and show that it we are all hurt by it.

[NGONGE]

^^^ I don’t agree on either count, saaxib. The Saudis, like any other despotic regime, do not take into account any external repercussions when making their arbitrary decisions. Note, that I’m following your reasoning and ignoring the fact that neither of us have enough information about this case. We’re going by the Saudis’ previous record of injustice here.

 

Many quick-witted observers have compared the case of the Somali dead to those of westerners in Saudi jails. Of course, the glaringly obvious point they’ve missed to report was the fact that these westerners WERE in jail and many also faced the death sentence. Diplomatic efforts and outside pressures are what forced the Saudi rulers to issue pardons. The “superiority†you speak of is unproven here (though I believe it exists – like it does with every nation; see “carab waa naagoâ€).

 

By all means, protest, campaign and remonstrate against what you perceive to be a total miscarriage of justice, saaxib. However, you need to do it sensibly and responsibly. Though I still believe it to be a waste of time and energy: an act of urinating against the wind as it were, still, if you believe such protests will yield results, go ahead and placate your sensitivity.

[-Serenity-]

Originally posted by

NGONGE:

Neither the author, nor “my†comrades (well not all of them anyway) have told you that this whole thing is but a typhoon in an oyster shell, dear. Could you understand that one?

I would say how one reacts to any situation would depend on how they can relate to it or the extent it impacts on their lives. It maybe “typhoon in an oyster shell†for you, but for some it’s a “whirlwind in your doorstepâ€.

 

It’s the usual case of moral panics. Did you cry when princess Diana died? And, since you’re in the UK, shall I mention Jessica and Holly, Sarah whatever her name and the various other similar cases! No, hang on; let me return to my favourite subject, poor old ZamZam (remember her?).

I sympathise with those situations and if I were in a forum they were discussing it, would say so. What you fail to realize is that, its natural to be feel more connected to people of your own nationally/tribe/family and that “connection†strengthens as you go further down in the relationship hierarchy. I don’t even understand why you cited these examples (‘cept in the last one). They serve no purpose in your unconvincing argument

You see, Amethyst, such “injustices†take place in the world all the time. There are countless stories, tragedies and unfair practises occurring all the time. The reaction to such instances is what’s important. To just wail and point fingers is not a sign of a healthy society.

Your constant reference to issues that may or may not carry sentimental value to some as “wailing†is just plain offensive. This is a forum – primary objective being discussing issues. No1 is “wailingâ€, merely voicing their opinions. It’s the only thing you can do here. It would be foolish for you to assume this is all that is done. And about pointing fingers – no response necessary.

Your articles above both overreact, like most of the people here, to incomplete information. In the case of Amnesty international, that’s just the way they’ve always been. The whole point of such an organisation is to push, cajole and magnify any examples of injustice so that they could help to banish them.

I take it that you have the complete information then NGONGE? Please share since you’re reacting as well. With regards to this particular case, there just isn’t enough information and that’s the primary reason so many people feel injustice has taken place. The whole thing was done and dealt with in complete murkiness.

Still, someone has to step back and see things for what they are. There is nothing NEW about executions in Saudi Arabia, nothing sacred about Somali lives that would say, “Execute all the others but don’t touch our Somalisâ€. In other words, in the usual scheme of things, the Saudi justice system did what it always does. This time the “accused†happened to be Somali!

You too have a thing for stating the obvious eh? There injustice taking place from Guatanamo bay to baidao. What makes you think I don’t care about these just as much? I would have loved to quote the Quran and show you where it says, if we witness any injustice/wrong doing, we are asked to voice against it (but I cant since I’m at work n religious sites are blocked!...maybe you should research and reflect on that?)

Should one have sympathy and wonder (note the use of this word) about the correctness of the punishment? OF COURSE.

 

Should one enquire as to how such injustice should be stopped? IT WOULD BE A FAIR ENQUIRY.

 

Should one wail and rant and lose his/her head with the vulgar? NOT IF ONE HAS ANY SENSE.

Wonder in silence or enquire are your only options eh? What about saying what I think? Do you have something against people voicing their opinions? As for me being vulgar mr.NGONGE, one must communicate with another in a language they understand…wouldn’t u agree?