Ronaldinho Show.

[IL CAPO]

If you ever thought that Ronaldinho was over rated then I think now you know why he is head and shoulders above any other player in the world right now as he is without a single shadow of a doubt the best player in the world right now.

 

When was the last time you saw Salgado being mocked and not only once or twice but through out the whole 90 minutes by one single player?

 

Ronaldinho just did that with ease and in that match he demonstrated why he is the best player in the world and if he doesn't win Fifa World Player of The Year come December then to hell with Fifa.

Peace.

[N.O.R.F]

If you ever thought that Ronaldinho was over rated then I think now you know why he is head and shoulders above any other player in the world right now as he is without a single shadow of a doubt the best player in the world right now.

No doubt indeed

 

When was the last time Carlos and Salgado did not cross the halfway line? Throughout the whole game both Carlos and slagado had work to do, this is where they lost the game, Beckham and Figo were not helping back in defence, the full back were exposed by Ronnie, Deco, Xavi, Eto and Larson.

 

 

 

I have a feeling that French boy Thiery 'i love myself' Henry will snatch it as he won the Prem last season and Ronnie didnt. But then again only Micheal Owen has won the EP for maybe 20+ years.

 

when is the euro and fifa awards?

[Thinkerman]

I cant believe his steped up another gear AGAIN!!!!

 

He is the best player in the world no doubt, on every department, skill, dribbling, effect on game, goal scoring his the MAN.

 

I would still prefer to see Shevchenko given the award for world player of the year for his goal scoring record over the last 5 season with milan, his been instrumental in there successfull Champions League and Seria Campaign, and his is yet again this season the difference between a midocer and a competitive Milan.

[NGONGE]

Originally posted by IL CAPO:

When was the last time you saw Salgado being mocked and not only once or twice but through out the whole 90 minutes by one single player?

 

Ronaldinho just did that with ease and in that match he demonstrated why he is the best player in the world and if he doesn't win Fifa World Player of The Year come December then to hell with Fifa.

Peace.

I agree on the Ronaldinho point. However, regarding Salgado, he gets mocked all the time, saaxib. By players inferior to Ronaldinho!

Roberto Carlos is another. Real has never been a team with a strong defence (even when Hierro was in his prime). When that team is not playing well upfront, the defence is always shown up to be mediocre. But, when they’re firing on all cylinders, they all look great. There are a few players hitching a ride on the backs of the outstanding guys (Salgado and Carlos are definitely ones of them).

 

It looks like we’re entering a new era in European football these days. The giants of Manchester United, Real Madrid and Bayer seem to be fading away. Any news of those technical Italians, any at all? I’ve stopped following them ever since Channel 4 lost their rights (don’t think I’ve missed much either).

[Thinkerman]

I begg to differ Ngonge Salgado and Carlos are usual the work-horses of Real boming up and down the flanks.

 

Ronaldo and Beckham and Figo (who missed a Pen last night) are simple not doing anything. Manchester i think are showing that they are still in there with a good display against the very strong Lyon.

 

The Italians BARRING lol the Black sheep of the family that is Roma are dominating there respective groups with Juve recording a 5 straight 1 - 0 win at home to Ajax Inter remaning top on 10 points and Milan sharring top spot with the Great Baraca on 9 points, so the italians are doing quite well.

 

I predict inter will self-destruct in the next knock out stage as they always do, but Milan and Juventus should reach at least the Semi's, i think Juventus will teh be the hungrier of the two and i would love to see teh contrasting styles of a a solid counter attacking Juventus against the outragiously Flamboiant Braca in the Final

[N.O.R.F]

i would love to see teh contrasting styles of a counter a solid counter attacking Juventus against the outragiously Flamboiant Braca in the Final

Now that would a dream final

 

Thuram vs Ronnie

 

I only wish Davids stayed at Barca, they will need him when the going gets tough

[NGONGE]

I begg to differ Ngonge Salgado and Carlos are usual the work-horses of Real boming up and down the flanks.

 

Ronaldo and Beckham and Figo (who missed a Pen last night) are simple not doing anything. Manchester i think are showing that they are still in there with a good display against the very strong Lyon.

From the little I saw of Real’s recent games, Figo looked to me like the only attacker who looks bothered and tries. I agree about Beckham and Ronaldo, they are not pulling their weight. Carlos and Salgado are good going forward (I didn’t dispute that) but they’re defenders saaxib and as defenders they’re average (to say the least).

 

Was just pulling your leg on the Italian point. Knew you would give me a good update.

[QUANTUM LEAP]

Any news of those technical Italians, any at all? I’ve stopped following them ever since Channel 4 lost their rights (don’t think I’ve missed much either).

Absolutely ever since gazzeta lost its rights, the Italians havent had the same shine. The leagues has plunged from being one of the best in the world to amediocre one.

 

As for Real, I would say it needs an overhaul of the team who happen to have grown into premadonnas rather than prolific footballers and a strong manager who can take on the director himself who happens to meddle in team affairs.

 

Barca looks hot and any team that comes across them would have to contend with Ronaldhino the samba king.

[Viking]

Originally posted by NGONGE:

From the little I saw of Real’s recent games, Figo looked to me like the only attacker who looks bothered and tries. I agree about Beckham and Ronaldo, they are not pulling their weight. Carlos and Salgado are good going forward (I didn’t dispute that) but they’re defenders saaxib and as defenders they’re average (to say the least).

You must have seen very little of Real Madrid then monsieur NGONGE. Salgado and Carlos have been the players who have worked hardest the past years. They are also very good defenders, and two of the most offensive defenders around, that's why they also are the number one choices in their national teams on their positions.

 

Real Madrid have created a division within the team with the intoduction of the term 'galacticos'. The others are made to sound unimportant (just look at the impact the exit of Makelele has had on their team performance). He was paid peanuts compared to the other 'stars' in the team and he was let go when he had the 'audacity' to ask for a raise. Makelele was like a fifth defender, who gave Salgado and Carlos more freedom to exploit the opponents half without any worries and Zidane didn't need to fall back to defend when he was around.

 

 

About Ronaldinho, what can one say, he enjoys playing football and does it eloquently. He's made Barca a very exciting side once again.

 

 

Absolutely ever since gazzeta lost its rights, the Italians havent had the same shine. The leagues has plunged from being one of the best in the world to amediocre one.

Quantum,

The Italian league has risen up again, remember the final at Old Trafford? Two Italian teams were in that final and Inter Milan was on of other semi-finalists. Last year was a bit awkward, none of the big leagues were represented in the final. Juve and Milan are very capable of making the final again this year, Chelsea and Barca are the only sides who look capable of challenging them this year (so far).

[NGONGE]

^^^^ I’ve seen little of the team only this season, saaxib. But, on the whole, I don’t rate either player as a good defender. They’re great going forward but are awful defenders. They both play for national teams purely on reputation and their ability to “bomb†forward at every given opportunity. They’re no Maldini, man.

 

I agree on the Makelele point though. He’s one of the reasons these guys were not found out all this time.

[QUANTUM LEAP]

You are right Viking though the fact remains that what the Italians where capable afew years ago was more than what they are accomplishing now. If you look at their leagues compared to others like spain and premier, there isnt much excitement about their form and only the main two or three (AC, Juve and Inter) tend to qualify for the championships. So its more dominated by the upper three or 4 clubs than what used to be afair league interms of skill and ofcouse financial distribution.

[Viking]

NGONGE,

We probably see the game differently sxb I've seen carlos since his days at Inter, before Capello brought him to Real Madrid and made him a world class player. Salgado is not your typical elegant defender (like Thuram, Nesta, Chivu or Ferdinand), but works very hard in what he does and is always like an extra winger, which gives Figo the freedom to roam about in the opponents half as he wishes. Like the goal they scored last nite against Leverkusen, Figo came in from the left (consfusing and messing the marking of the players) and Zidane didn't run to the right (instead played a one-two with him), Salgado filled that space.

 

You have to rate a player according to everything they contribute to the team on the field. What good is a player like Beckham? The only thing (I think) he is good for is free-kicks, corners and crosses. We don't see many crosses from him in Real because Figo plays on the right side and Real prefers to play the ball through instead of playing the "English style" (crossing the ball every chance you get hoping someone heads it in). But Real bought him for his popularity (good-will), especially in Asia where indho-yar always buy shirts with his name (not to mention tv-rights, which generates millions of euros).

 

 

So when you are rating players like Salgado and Carlos, you have to look at their overall performance. In that, I think few players in the world can challenge them in their respective positions (but they are coming of age so you have to look at their performance during a number of years when rating them). Every "dream team" that has been mentionned by football coahes (and experst) has usually had Carlos on the left-back; who do you think has performed better in that position in the past ten years (don't mention Maldini because he's been often playing inner-back since Baresi quit football)?

 

Look at a player like Ashley Cole, he is quite similar to Roberto Carlos with his ambitious runs, giving the team a much more offensive line-up. He isn't much of a defender (atleast in my opinion, Carlos is a much better defender) but he has the stamina to run up and down the flank throughout the game, making the midfield look broader than it is.

 

 

Originally posted by QUANTUM LEAP:

If you look at their leagues compared to others like spain and premier, there isnt much excitement about their form and only the main two or three (AC, Juve and Inter) tend to qualify for the championships. So its more dominated by the upper three or 4 clubs than what used to be afair league interms of skill and ofcouse financial distribution.

Quantum,

England and Spain are no different sxb. In England, only Man U and Arsenal have won the league the past decade or so. In Spain, it's been Valencia and Real, Barca haven't won anything for five years!

 

But in terms of entertainment (technically skilfull players that is)), nothing beats La Liga. Even teams like Getafe, Numancia et al. are exciting to watch.

[QUANTUM LEAP]

Remember the likes of Sampdoria and Florientina? Now we got teams that we have never heard. I actually liked Chievo but lately havent seen them play but they were underdogs and giant killers at that time. I used to enjoy their encounters with the likes of milan and others.....quite exciting.

 

You are right La league is up there with the best and as for the premier, I would say the likes of Middlesboroug, villa and ofcouse Everton have narrowed the gap immensily.

[IL CAPO]

Originally posted by NGONGE:

I agree on the Ronaldinho point. However, regarding Salgado, he gets mocked all the time, saaxib. By players inferior to Ronaldinho!

Roberto Carlos is another. Real has never been a team with a strong defence.

[/QB]

Ngonge, Sxb I understand your point, but come on have you ever seen a player taking the Mickey out of Salgado at will?

 

The only player that comes close which I can think of right now is Valencia and Spanish left winger Vicente and he gets past him using his pace and you know Salgado isn't blessed with pace but the Goofy Genius used art, skill and loads of imagination and tricks to get past him.

 

Real's problem isn't solely about their defense or lack of it rather, I think the team lacks spirit, hunger and determination and in football you lack those three and you will be eaten alive.

 

 

if I may add one more, the team is crying for a balance, because look at the midfield, are Guti and Beckham really defensive midfielders? Is Carlos a really a defender? Is Helguerra a defender? Is Zidane a left sided midfielder?

 

 

The AC Milan of mid and late nineties come to mind when they had the likes of Baggio, Boban,Scevicevic,Vieria,Davids,Kluivert,Dugarry and so many other world stars and yet they never won anything while Rijkaard's current Barcelona side is a team fairly balanced and every player seems to be playing in his favorite position, believe me I will be really surprised if they fail to win at least La Liga this season.

Peace.

[Viking]

IL CAPO,

Boban and Savicevic were in the team that beat Barcelona 4-0 in the Chapions League final of 1994, Savicevic even scored in that game! Milan then won the league in 1995/96 with Baggio, Weah et al. and in 1998/99 with Bierhoff and co. Juve won the two years in between when AC bought many players from Ajax at once but it didn't work out as they had hoped. They bought Kluivert, Davids, Reiziger and Bogarde. Barcelona were ****** enough and tried the same thing (as AC Milan had done without success) a couple of years later.

 

 

 

Remember the likes of Sampdoria and Florientina? Now we got teams that we have never heard.

Quantum,

With Middlesborough, Bolton and Villa, they do have interesting players, but they are 'recycled' players, from other clubs after they have been ejected (Solano, Diouf, Hasselbaink and Viduka are perfect examples).

 

Sampdoria and Fiorentina were great teams in the sense that they brought players like Veron, Seedorf, Mancini (Inter coach) Mihajlovic, Rui Costa, Batistuta from 'nowhere'. Leeds did something similar (with Kewel, Viduka, Smith and Rio Ferdinand) they were Champions League semi-finalists a few years ago but now in the less prestigious Div 1.