Somalia, the Third Republic

[Yeniceri]

Asalamu calaykum,

 

I think that these types of discussion forums are created to stimulate our minds and engage all of us in meaningful arguments. Therefore, I pose a question to all Somalis, especially politically-concious ones...

 

Somalia proper has gone through three stages, two with governments, and a third without. The first government, between 1960 and 1969, and the second government from 1969 to 1991. The third stage is the post-'91 era, which still continues.

 

My question then is, if and when we get an all-inclusive and justified government that truly represents the Somali people, how would YOU like it to be different from the previous ones?

 

Remember, mistakes are harmful unless we learn from them. We learned that dictatorship doesn't work and neither does a centralized government, all based in Mogadishu. We're too diverse for that.

 

So what qualities would the government have? What ministries should be priority? What type of government?

 

And please don't say anything about 'democracy.' Think deep as Somalis, NOT as Western-influenced Somalis! The answers are all there.

 

I'll start by saying I support a Confederation of Clans. Somalia, the Third Republic!

 

Sidaa iyo Nabadgelyo!

[La Fidele]

please don't say anything about 'democracy.'

I don't mean to be poking holes (not REALLY), but why is it that you don't strike out the classic concept of a "republic", along with democracy?

The suggestion of a confederation still doesn't say anything about the political system that should be adopted. i don't think a centralized government failed outright in Somalia---it had more to do with the government's incompetence rather than the system.

If we want to look away from Western political systems, it seems the other viable option is based on Islam. Pure clanism is definitely not a solution, although I do believe it will be a certain factor of consideration (whether it means to incorporate it or not). By the way, if you haven't already seen it, there's a very interesting topic in the Islam forum titled "Islam's approach towards democracy" that may give some insight

Think deep as Somalis, NOT as Western-influenced Somalis!

*LOL* I'm sorry, but I think this is too much to ask. I think almost every individual in the world has been influenced by the West in one way or another. If we're not trying to be like them, we keep them in mind when we're figuring out how to differentiate ourselves from them.

[Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar]

Salaan...

 

Somalia proper has gone through three stages...

To begin with, since when was Soomaaliya 'improper?' Goodness.

 

And another thing, why do some folks from that part of the north are obsessed with that region? In here, almost all those who distinguish themselves regionally do hail from the north. It is no coincidence that we do have in here the likes of Northerner, Burco's_First_Lady, Nugaal-Nomad, Hargeysa_Queen, another Burco, Hargeysa-Flex, Wiil-Nugaal, Wiil-Majeert--n, Buhoodle, Ceergaabawi, Puntlander, Wiil-Qardhood, another Hargeyso...

 

What is this obsession with both northwestern and northeastern regions? Kamoon, guys, this is rather getting too much. I have yet to see a person who is using as his/her user name associated with some southern part of the country in this forum.

 

This is rather getting tedious, walaahi.

_________________

 

P.S.: I am from Berbera nooh. Wait a minute, yes, it is Baardheere, mea culpa!

 

And I do know that I am off the topic.

_________________

 

Macsalaama!!

[Thinkerman]

Hi Nugaal.

 

I would just like to just follow up what Jazeera touched on. Although admitedly the idea of a centralized Govt system returning to somalia in the near future would probably abit too much to hope for given the Hurt, Anger and suspision that still lingers with us, i dont necessarly view it as being obselite as a system of governing the country.

 

I admit i dont no the history of our country in as much details, and the history of the conflict in as much details as most of you probably do.

But i do think that we will have to change soon or later, we cannot remain in the state that we )(somalia, somaliland,puntland) that we are in today. It simple isnt a viable long term option for stability or security purperses

 

Like Jazeera pointed out we have been discussing a similar topic in the islamic section for a while now and am sure u could probably get more veiws about a possible system of governance based on islam.

 

well good luck with it

[Yeniceri]

Asalamu calaykum,

 

I appreciate all you're responses.

 

Jazeera

 

Tell me why is it that its 'hard' to NOT be influenced by the West in terms of you're views? Are you suggesting that you're more a follower than a leader? Think about the statement you made. We're all influenced by different forces, at one point or another. My central concern is for us NOT to be so influenced by Western or any other culture so much that we loose sight of our national goals, as Somalis.

 

Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqyaar

 

I suggest, brother, that you keep the first two labels of your name and drop the 'aqyaar' part. I have presented a topic here for ALL Somalis to discuss and you're so narrow-minded as to linger upon a 'name.' I, along with my entire family, hail from the region of Nugaal, in and around the Nugaal Valley, northeastern Somalia. So why would I not have this name? Wiil_NUGAAL simply means a boy from Nugaal. I'm representing my roots. You should respect people's roots and their choice of names. And if you don't have anything to contribute to this ongoing discussion, then please feel free NOT to respond!

 

On to the subject at hand, a centralized government all controlled from a Somali capital, whether it be Muqdisho or else, is not a viable solution. Somalis are a freedom loving people. I see the chances of conflict severely lessing when we're all free to do and choose as a society how we would like to be governed. Remember, a government CANNOT exist without the CONSENT of the governed. If WE choose a form of government, then our differences will gradually diminish and we'll focus on more important issues, such as schooling and healthcare. Right now, peace is the key. It opens all doors!

 

Sidaa iyo nabadgelyo!

[Baashi]

Wiil-Nugaaleed,

Well, my gut feeling answer is that it is very hard to get 'all-inclusive and justified government' but assuming we do get that I would like to see them choose a republic in the sense that elected reps will govern the state.

 

We should down play the idea of confederacy and embrace, with caution, federal form of government in which union of regional provinces recognize the primacy and authority of central government while retaining certain powers of governmemnt.

 

Isimo, duubab, and malaaqyo should be considered as politicians. If they want to be the official reps of their constituent they should run in their geographical sphere of influence e.g known demarcated districts where their constituent reside.

 

Finally, the supreme law of the land should be Islamic Sharia. We should also have an official body of knowledgable and cognizant Uluma whose sole function is to safegaurd the primacy of Islamic law in the context of the legislations that are passed. Application of criminal law should communserate the dissemation of Islamic literature through channels of communication and degree of knowledge public have about Islam. I would wait about ten yrs before implementing that so that State can recover from the anarchy.

 

I am dead opposed to the idea of clan confederacy or federal triblism. It just plays right into the hands of warlords and their clanish rationale. I'm kind of open-minded to restrained regional autonomies if they confirm the territorial integrity of Somalia in their constitution. My only concern about that is the layers of bueracracies it will create and price tag that comes with knowing how meager our resources are.

 

I agree that peace is first milestone we all should strive for.

[La Fidele]

Tell me why is it that its 'hard' to NOT be influenced by the West in terms of you're views? Are you suggesting that you're more a follower than a leader?

Wiil-Nugaal, is it really necessary to attempt attacks on my character? Really though, what does insinuating whether I'm a follower or leader have to do anything?

 

I'm not going to put much effort in responding to your question, because I believe I've already answered it in my first post. Let me quote it for emphasis.

every individual in the world has been influenced by the West in one way or another. If we're not trying to be like them, we keep them in mind when we're figuring out how to differentiate ourselves from them.

That above not only refers to culture, but western political thought and systems.

 

Anyways, I understand the importance of prioritizing our national goals, but it is impossible--and detrimental--in this global environment to not take other countries' policies into account.

 

So maybe I put in a little more effort than I meant...oh, well. The more content you can respond to, right?

[Thinkerman]

I agree that peace is first milestone we all should strive for.

 

Indeed Baashi

 

I would wait about ten yrs before implementing that so that State can recover from the anarchy.

 

Walaahi that would be more than reasonable.

 

We should down play the idea of confederacy and embrace, with caution, federal form of government in which union of regional provinces recognize the primacy and authority of central government while retaining certain powers of governmemnt.

 

Indeed we should, in an indeal world that is. Sure why not to confederacy. However given the unique problem the somalia faces and the vunerability that such states would face from outside pressures i.e. ethopian interferance. I would down play confederacy idea aswell.

 

Hey great contribution you made some very intersting points saxiib.

[Saanjo]

Somalia has seen a centralised democracy, a brutal dictatorship and a prolonged civil war. I think the anly option now is a federal system with a loose central government. My reason is that almost all Somalis have obsessed with one title "THE PRESIDENT" and the solution is to make a very weak president and believe me we will see all these warlords running away from that post. Also the federal system is functioning very well . Look at USA-the greatest economic power today, Germany-greatest economic power in Europe, Malaysa-a thriving economic power in East Asia and UAE-the most prosperous nation in the Gulf Cooperation Council all use federal system

[jaaluut]

Weak-decentralized government, with a mandate to mediate provinces ,and for foreign affairs.

seperation of powers,and the independence of courts and the executive branche.

 

a supreme council made up of mullahs to oversee the military, security and courts.

[BN]

Saanjo

I agree.

 

Somalis were always decentralized before the Europeans came. Look what happened when we created a One city State(Xamar). :mad:

 

All major schools, hospitals, infrustructure, development etc. was concentrated in Muqdishu. This while most of the country was a No Mans Land(ie Bari) .

 

Now that we are once again decentralized these regions are developing again.

 

That is why I am opposed to centralized city state again. The only people in favour of that are xamraawiye or Hawiye people who want MQ to gain it's former beauty.

 

Anyone who thinks decentralized wont be successful look at all the other confederations like Switzerland, UAE, Canada USA,etc. All rich developed powerful states.

 

I also agree about weak president idea 2.

 

1LUV

Liban

[AUN]

Thanks Bari_Nomad

 

I think that majority of Somalis agree with this with the exception of those who have in mind a return of dictatorship like the one we have witnessed or even worse