They are here to Stay

[Gabbal]

Originally posted by Jimcaale:

quote:Oh posh sxb. Jimcaale as always is infatuated with my cyber character but I would hope you debate like a man and quit with the character assassinations.

 

I do not know about Ceel or Caabudwaaq but I can honestly say Beled-Xaawo owes its peace and security indirectly to the Xabashi. It is fear of the Xabash base across the borderline that keeps the yey who want to cause insecurity apart from each other.

I do realize we owes to Amxaaro for the peace and stability of [insert city name here] and the liberation of Kismaayo from the ruthless hands of

our

enemy who violated our families for protesting in public.

My bad Horn if you get offended.

It's getting rather old Jimca.

[Castro]

Originally posted by N/AA:

It is

my belief

that the only thing keeping the ocean waves calm are the presence of armed,

somewhat impartial, foreign troops

. Because of their presence, there are not any possibilities of clan wars ensuing and because of an inability of one group to dictate the affairs of others through the barrel of the group, dialogue and communication are paramount as forms of problem solving. It is

my sincere hope

Somalis take advantage of the situation presented to them to reconcile and explore the reasons that led to this point and which has kept their nation lawless and anarchic for more then a decade. Only then,

I believe

, we should unite towards our historical common enemy and demand, and even fight, to have total control over our destiny again.

Good try saaxib but this falls woefully short of providing any convincing argument of what terrible disasters would befall Somalis if Ethiopian troops were to withdraw tomorrow. Moreover, your hopes and beliefs are well and good but evidence they make not. Finally, there are no impartial foreign troops in Somalia. Both the occupying force and the so called peace keepers have a clear mandate to protect the puppet regime. Impartiality, therefore, may be stated but is simply a ruse and a veteran of politics like you ought to be the last person to fall for such elementary propaganda.

 

The risk of fratricide you mentioned is real but, as you said, "because of an inability of one group to dictate the affairs of others through the barrel", it is highly unlikely any terrible disasters such as the killing of thousands or the displacement of hundreds of thousands would follow an Ethiopian withdrawal.

 

In other words, the calamity you predict upon Ethiopian withdrawal is simply a fallacy.

[Gabbal]

Originally posted by Faarax-Brown:

[QB] I am almost certain I believe inaa kaa badiyo, I spent my childhood life some less than a KM away from B.Xaawo, I was there as recently as last summer

 

War adigaaba iga roon, anigu reer Balanbalaan ahay geelayaduna meeshaa iyo galaadi ayay gaaraan lakin Beled-Xaawo allahu kariim maanta waa xuduntayda. Mustaqbalka dhaw dabaqyaan rabaa inaan ka dhisto anigu iyo reerkeygaba.

 

Inshallah I am scheduled to got there (among other places) pretty soon in the near future, magaalada jawigeeda guud waa sidee? Meesha waa lay dhoobanayahy balse kama daalo inaan warka hubsado.

 

 

p.s. Ina abti markaad ila ahayd ileen meel baad iga arkootay.

[Gabbal]

Originally posted by Castro:

quote:Originally posted by N/AA:

It is

my belief that the only thing keeping the ocean waves calm are the presence of armed,

somewhat impartial, foreign troops

. Because of their presence, there are not any possibilities of clan wars ensuing and because of an inability of one group to dictate the affairs of others through the barrel of the group, dialogue and communication are paramount as forms of problem solving. It is

my sincere hope

Somalis take advantage of the situation presented to them to reconcile and explore the reasons that led to this point and which has kept their nation lawless and anarchic for more then a decade. Only then,

I believe

, we should unite towards our historical common enemy and demand, and even fight, to have total control over our destiny again.

Good try saaxib but this falls woefully short of providing any convincing argument of what terrible disasters would befall Somalis if Ethiopian troops were to withdraw tomorrow. Moreover, your hopes and beliefs are well and good but evidence they make not. Finally, there are no impartial foreign troops in Somalia. Both the occupying force and the so called peace keepers have a clear mandate to protect the puppet regime. Impartiality, therefore, may be stated but is simply a ruse and a veteran of politics like you ought to be the last person to fall for such elementary propaganda.

 

The risk of fratricide you mentioned is real but, as you said, "because of an inability of one group to dictate the affairs of others through the barrel", it is highly unlikely any terrible disasters such as the killing of thousands or the displacement of hundreds of thousands would follow an Ethiopian withdrawal.

 

In other words, the calamity you predict upon Ethiopian withdrawal is simply fallacious.

You have taken the last quote of mines completely out of context and in fact has nothing to do with the conclusion you reached using it. However, you need not bother, I understand now where you are coming from.

 

This reminds me of the time the Rwandan genocide was occurring and the U.N security council was debating the political correctness of using the term "genocide" and what it would imply in terms of even immediate and large-scale intervention.

 

Castro, get off the high horse adeer.

 

No one is analyzing scholarly work here and none of us can completely convince you of something that has not happened yet, but those of us who are aware know and understand the fate of Somalia left to its own self-destructive devices.

 

16 years of modern civil war and centuries old legacy of blood fueds are a witness and example of what is to come if left to our own devices.

[Castro]

^^^^ Well if you understand where I'm coming from, why would you say "if the Ethiopians were to leave, a power vacuum of immense proportions would occur" and fail to back up that assertion? You've neither shown the immensity of the power vacuum nor explained its consequences and when I called you on it, you turned all personal talking about horses and stuff.

 

Come on old man.

[xiinfaniin]

Ethiopian presence in Somalia prevents Somali people from a bigger, and more disastrous, slippage into the current civil war!

 

^^That’s the argument you are attempting to demolish, yaa Castro, and as you’ve aptly recognized, it has the old and tired neocon line of ‘if-we-withdraw-now-they-will-kill-and-finish-each-other-off’.

 

I think it's quite bogus!

[Castro]

^^^^ I was hoping good Horn would put a positive spin on the tired line and show us how he understood the statement. Alas, I was wishing upon a star only to find a failed crop.

[xiinfaniin]

Castrow, the painful tragedy is most people who use this line as an argument mean good, while it serves a perfect scare tactic for the likes of Ethiopia who has been sewing the concept that each and every Somali tribe somehow need protection from its own neighbors and therefore Ethiopia with its singular generosity could play that role to meet Somali tribes’ security needs. That promotion of complete reliance on Ethiopia as the ultimate protector is evident in both Puntland and Somaliland. The fact it begun to creep into the south and seep around the edges of the other regions is quite sad wallee~~~

[Castro]

^^^^ Unfortunately, Xiinow, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

[me]

Waryaadha maqaaxiyadiina maxaa la yidhaahdaa, shaahana iiga warama? You all know whats up and what needs to be done. So lets stop talking and its time for some action.

[Gabbal]

Castro-

 

If you would so please as allow me to ask, what is, then, your belief Somalia will be with Ethiopian withdrawal. You have failed to listen to me and have looked for loopholes where there are non so let me be so bold as to ask you of what the most likely outcome will be.

 

I say the first outcomes of Ethiopian withdrawal would be immediate resuscitation of the infamous Mogadishu green line, clashes between two major groups behind those lines, as well as between Puntland and their neighbors to the south. Your Somaliland, led by hotheads, might even take advantage of that situation and hit Puntland from the west. This might bring other groups into the equation and the Somali Republic will be up in fires unseen since early 90's.

 

Simplistic? You bet. Likelihood? The most possible scenario.

 

Now you tell me what would happen.

[Garyaqaan2]

war ileen adunyadu waa cajiib. oo hada waxaa badatay qof kuu jeedo malaha ee waxaad rabto ku qor dariishada computerka.

 

It was was 17 yeard ago when good somalis said enought is enough we need major Gen Siyaad bari needs to leave. well that happen No one had an alternative to what will replace him. what happened we all know. My good friends castro, Faarax jimcaale I see yaa all carying ethio to leave great idea saaxiibyaal intaa joojisaan maaweelka noo sheega arintii badali laheed. mise cabitaan qaboob soo qabsada wadaado anaga iskaga keeya dhiga noo soo jeediya ethio ha baxdo hadii kale gaalaa la noqonaayaa :confused:

[Garyaqaan2]

war ileen adunyadu waa cajiib. oo hada waxaa badatay qof kuu jeedo malaha ee waxaad rabto ku qor dariishada computerka.

 

It was was 17 yeard ago when good somalis said enought is enough we need major Gen Siyaad bari needs to leave. well that happen No one had an alternative to what will replace him. what happened we all know. My good friends castro, Faarax jimcaale I see yaa all carying ethio to leave great idea saaxiibyaal intaa joojisaan maaweelka noo sheega arintii badali laheed. mise cabitaan qaboob soo qabsada wadaado anaga iskaga keeya dhiga noo soo jeediya ethio ha baxdo hadii kale gaalaa la noqonaayaa :confused:

[Castro]

Originally posted by N/AA:

Now you tell me what would happen.

I don't have a crystal ball but I will try to show you later how Somalis will be no worse off when the Ethiopians leave. In fact, I will argue they will be better off.

[Faarax-Brawn]

Originally posted by Garyaqaan*:

war ileen adunyadu waa cajiib. oo hada waxaa badatay qof kuu jeedo malaha ee waxaad rabto ku qor dariishada computerka.

 

It was was 17 yeard ago when good somalis said enought is enough we need major Gen Siyaad bari needs to leave. well that happen No one had an alternative to what will replace him. what happened we all know. My good friends

castro, Faarax jimcaale I see yaa all carying ethio to leave great idea saaxiibyaal intaa joojisaan maaweelka noo sheega arintii badali laheed. mise cabitaan qaboob soo qabsada wadaado anaga iskaga keeya dhiga noo soo jeediya ethio ha baxdo hadii kale gaalaa la noqonaayaa :confused:

Ironically,The Men who were responsible for that vacuum that you are talking about are the very same ones who want to run the country. What has changed since then? Have they grown wiser?

 

With the exception of the dead ones, the players are still the same. There is need for change,and it starts with the immidiete removal of the Ethiopians along with its puppet regime.

 

This govt is irrelevant,its a creation by warlords during a Warlord era,they are not a representative of the people. If a real dialogue is to occur,the people's representative need to be present.