What about the people?

[Coloow]

Baashi, You know which side I support. I have never concealed my support for the IUC for bringing peace to Muqdisho. I have outlined the reasons on numerous occassions. I don't have to defend that stance. do I? At the moment it is a simple choice; between baadil and xaq. You don't defend xaq do you?.

 

The baadil side; Caydid, Abdullahi Yusuf, Caato, Qanyare et al.

 

 

LOL at "milked cow".

 

What about you and why?

 

 

P.s I am rather surprised that you posed that kind of question. But I guess nothing comes as a surprise to somalis anymore.

[Baashi]

I'm back.

 

Kashafa,

 

I hear ya. There are tribalist out there y'all say. I say yeah. You say they are here in SOL. And I say halulaya. You say I know they are tribalists cuz they're fast in the 180 degree turn exercise - a dance that is consistently in sync with where their clans fall on the nomad-political landscape. So far so good. I like the description and blve it or not I'm 56% with u on this.

 

Moving on...come to the real issue and let these personalities do their thang in SOL forum. At issue is a devastating war that's raging between two entities at the expense of poor civilians - Muslims, Somalis, in a time of great difficulties.

 

Is this war necessary? yes or no? Why? Is the timing right? Has UIC main objective of kicking dozen of Habasha advisers (the main obstacle of peace negotiation) been achieved?

 

Awoowe you wanna sit down and sip tea with ur awoowe and have a discussion along these lines? Do I hear yeah? Bingo!!!! Let's hear ur answers

[Baashi]

Caaqil my bro,

 

Cut the BS please (excuse the lingo). I know Somalis are dispicable human being except you. I f** tired hearing that kinda I'm holier than u just enough times from you.

 

 

**taking breath...inhale, exhale** Awoowe forgive me for being emotional there. I'm human ya know. Let's talk about the real issue for a minute. It is not fitting for grown up men to substitute that line of...(ya know what I'm talking about) for an argument. It is beyond you and me.

 

At issue is the WAR. I asked the question because i wanted to eduate you about the principles that you support or for a lack of a better word the system (read it is not about personalities involved in this cause) is best achieved when the strategy adopted is in line with the reality on the ground. That was the reason. But maa calaash you ducked.

 

Ok. let me answer your question. Who does Baashi support. I support UIC. Why? Because they are the only entity that want to realize a system where the primary sources of law is based on Islam. Ya hear me awoowe.

 

I odn't have to do a cheerleading though if they don't walk the walk. I'm critical of their blunders. I consider the decision of not taking part of the reconciliation process as a mistake. I absolutely 100% against this war. With my humble opinion, I think it is a huge mistake.

 

Waryee ma ila socotaa mise waxaan dib ugu laabanaa hebel waa qabyaaladiiste maxaa yeelay he or she does not support the UIC move to oblivion. Allah can turn the tables but the way I see our brothers are dealing with tanks in the hands of standing army (logistics, medicine, and what not) of a second largest military state of Africa.

 

Things could have been different had UIC leaders sit it out, take part the negotiotions, build their strength, establish administrative organs with muscular institutional capacity of the areas under their control, and buy time for a day that will inevitably come.

 

I guess the IndhaCadde of the world can trump the aspirations of Islamist to see Islamic system unfold under the radar. "Me against the world", "Jihad against the Ethios", "You have this many days to retreat or else" hawkish attitude is not something this nascent revolutionary movement can afford.

 

Calaa caleykse ma noqon. Ninba dhan u badi.

[me]

What about the people?

 

The people have been dying with or without this war. The people have been dying in senseless wars for the past 16 years. The people have been dying in the sea's trying to escape the hopeless situation in Somalia, I don't have to be graphic here, you know Somalia and in teh many ways our people have been suffering for teh past 16 years. Atleast this war promises us unity and peace. After we win this war things could be better. Atleast this war gives us hope.

 

Why do you say what about the people now and not before? I say to hell with the people. I am the people and I believe that its better to die fast then to bleed to death slowly. Somalia has cancer and this war is chemotherapy. It is poison but it might save Somalia.

[Baashi]

Perfect. It doesn't give hope to Ahmde IIdoow in Garas-Jeereed. He has his hands on his head and he is this close to lose it. With seven kids suffering from malaria, he sets his eyes on the road full of dhiiqo...with no dameer at hand, how is he gonna make it to the promise land where the white angels called infidels have the heart to take care of his needs!!! Do you see the irony. Walk a mile in Mr. Iidoow's shoe and then come back here and ahsre ur infinite wisdom.

 

Me bro Somalia has a cancer you get that one right however is this war a chemotherapy? How so my bro? Pray tell awoowe!

 

As any war, the odds are 1/2. Right? What if Ethio and their puppet TFG prevail?

[Faarax-Brawn]

Is this war necessary? yes or no? Why? Is the timing right? Has UIC main objective of kicking dozen of Habasha advisers (the main obstacle of peace negotiation) been achieved

I think this statement here is what made people take sides. The TFG says that the Xabashi have only advisors while the rest of the somalis say that close to 10K xabashi soldiers have invaded somalia.

 

For every true somali nationalist void of Qabil,has made his support for the IUC. Not becoz for a true love for the IUC but for a common historical hate for the Xabashi.SIMPLE sxb

 

Baashi,so long as you beleive that the Habashi have just sent some mere dozen trainers and not a military,I dont think you will EVER agree with the IUC side . Lets face this simple truth.

 

Baashi, I have very simple questions sxb:

 

IWHY is Meles putting so MUCH money,TIME,Weapons on a somali faction that doesnt have much support from a majority of somalis?

 

[iI]Do you[Adiga personally Baashi] think its in the interest of Somalia & Somalis to have Ethiopia have the ability to decide which somali gov't rules Somalis?

 

[iII]Is it in the interest of the entire Horn of Africa region for ethiopia to clout so much power? Will YOU[bashi] as a somali allow the Xabashi to clout so much power?

 

[iV]. What is your thought about Xabashi soldiers fighting in SOMALI soil againt SOMALIS,knowing well what we have been thru the Xabashis?

 

[V]. So,What becomes of the occupied land of Somali Galbeed that had so many brave somali warriors spill blood for their land? Will, this land be ever left for the xabashis?, in the event that Meles and an ethiopian backed govt comes into power?

 

Over to you sir

[Coloow]

Baashi, Sidaasi iga dheh bro. There is no BS here. I don't know why you u think we are BS-ting. We could discuss on for hours about who started the war? Was it the right timing? etc. Laakin hadda maxaa laga qaban karaa? the war has already started.

 

But overall, I am glad that we see share the ideal.

 

Tanks, helicopters haddii guul lagu gaarayo ciraaq baa laga gaari lahaa. At the end of the day will beats everything.

[Baashi]

Brother Ciraaqiis are bleading big time. They are divided. Great classical scism in Islam has been revived. Every 1 Uncle Sam died takes 1000 with him. A great society, educated, and brotherly nation with enough wealth to sit at the table has been eliminated. Do you see that my man. Yes Americans are lost in the mayhem but that pales what Ciraaqis are suffering in comparison.

 

Ohe ye Awoowe this is what we can do:

 

We cab stop cheerleading for or against this tragedy. if you are raising your voice at least push the peace...i know SOL foruming is not relevant. But within nomads who congregate here the least thing we can do is reason with each other.

 

Both sides are Muslims and Somalis. Habasha wins when it gets the support of some of us. The folks who support the presence of Habasha have their reasons. Let's hear from them. Impeach their argument if it is nonsense.

[Coloow]

Baashi, brother, Aniga Amxaaro iyo madax korankor ma la i tusi karo. I would rather cheerlead for the IUC than hold my breath (which in essence is supporting the amxaaro lackeys). But I get your point. Death and destruction has befallen our people. MAy Allah help us.

 

We are talking about an invasion sxb! INTRUSION INTO A NATION by a historical enemy.

[me]

Baashi,

 

I am from the bacaad, and at the bacaad we have one rule, two men who havent fought before will never be friends. Somalis have been fighting for 16 years in this senseless civil war and guess what this war no matter how brutal it was or how bad, it has helped us in many ways and it has tought us many lessons. These lessons will benifit our people for a long long time, its just growing pains. All the great nations of today are the results of bitter civil wars. It is not just a civil war, we are negotiating for the direction of our country, we are negotiating for our future. So not all is lost.

 

This war with Ethiopia is a WIN-WIN war, we can never loose it and we will never loose it. We have everything to gain and Ethiopia has everything to loose.

 

We are not not farax and cali. We are gaashaan and waranle

 

We have a long history of wars and bravery, its in our DNA. All Somalis are born soldiers. Gaashaanka Soomaaliyeed anaga ayaa qaadeyna. For 16 years many of us couldn't choose sides, for 16 years we have been waiting. Now the time has come to fight a war that really matters. A war for our freedom, a war for our country, our people and our flag.

 

When I saw those pictures od STI and Universal TV. I knew that we are back. I knew it is our turn to carry the Somali shield. I knew our generation has been honoured. Like the 77 generation and the daraawiish generation were honoured.

 

The daraawiish fought 4 foreign enemies and many Somali enemies. They didn't have many guns, they where fighting with speers and swords. They were using shields while the enemy was shooting with machine guns, artillery and bombing from the air. They were fighting like men and they never lost heart no matter the odds, they where fighting empires. They never gave up. They where fighting for their fatherland, for their religion, for their freedom and for the honour of the Somali nation. They are still remmembered and they still inspire generations of Somalis. We still remmeber Sayd Maxamed cabdile Xasan and Ismaciil Mirre, does anyone remmeber the cowards they fought?

 

We are Somalis just like Xalanle was. The man that took 5 bullets trying to safe our flag.

 

We are men, We are Somalis and we will never bow to anyone. The daraawiish didn't have the weapons nor did they have the money to buy weapons.

 

We have knowledge, money and the will to fight. We can not loose this war.

 

This is not a war against Ethiopia, this is a war for Somalia.

 

We will win this war and we will dismantle our enemy for once and for all, let them do their worst.

 

The more they kill, the more warrior that will join the cause. We all know that saying, when god closes a door, he opens a window. Well the window has just been opened.

[Baashi]

Alla ya cizak my man Brown. Now we are talkin. Forumku haduu forum u qalmaa.

 

1. IWHY is Meles putting so MUCH money,TIME,Weapons on a somali faction that doesnt have much support from a majority of somalis?

 

Excellent. The reason is because Somalia and Ethiopia has unsettled dispute over a large swath of what is now Ethiopia. Melez has his deamon to deal with in his domestic affairs. Oromos and Somalis reside eastern regions of Ethiopia. And they are trying to breaking away from the rest of Ethiopia. He knows Somalis deep down and he has been qouted saying that the demise of Ethiopia as federal poluralistic state is in the hands of the post-conflict government in Somalia.

 

Abdullahi believes that Zanawi has fulfilled a key precondition. He responded a concern along those lines put to him when he visited to New York (by fellow clan members OG) that they should read the Ethiopian constitution. He said the right to secession has been granted to kilinka shanaad. There is some truth in that but his ignorence of the details of the Ethiopian constitution is amazing especially a man who wishes to be a statesmen. The constitution requires 2/3 of national vote in the parliament - an impossibility for Somalis to pass a resolution to that effect in this parliament. Needless to say, Melez wants to make sure that any post-conflict Somali government will be "friendly" to Ethiopia.

 

2. Do you[Adiga personally Baashi] think its in the interest of Somalia & Somalis to have Ethiopia have the ability to decide which somali gov't rules Somalis?

 

Simply No. I detest the Ethiopian interferences in our affairs. As a realist I blve that we should first sort our mess out and heal the nation and bring back Somalia that once existed into a glory. That will take atleast 50 yrs. In the meantime I would like to play the so called strategic ambiguity where we simply repeat the line that Somalia respects territorial integrity of Ethiopia but would like to see Somali ethnic population and Oromo Muslims be given the chance to decide their destiny (read that modify the constitution).

 

3. Is it in the interest of the entire Horn of Africa region for ethiopia to clout so much power? Will YOU[bashi] as a somali allow the Xabashi to clout so much power?

 

Yes for now awoowe annigaaba lafahayga u dhutinaya maanta. Blve me if I could deliver the goods I would but for things they way they are, that's not possible today. Remember I'm for Somaliweyn. Tell me if you are not conversed with the details what that entails and I will happily eduacate you about the principles behind Somaliweyn.

 

4. What is your thought about Xabashi soldiers fighting in SOMALI soil againt SOMALIS,knowing well what we have been thru the Xabashis?

 

One word. Ayaan darro. UIC is the one to blame on this though. Bunch of ametours. Of course they have the best intentions at heart. The fact is before their rhetoric and charade of Jihad, TFG was isolated, divided entity begging for foreign boots. Ethiopia was sneaking in and out. Today it has the diplomatic cover to do its dirty war.

 

5. So,What becomes of the occupied land of Somali Galbeed that had so many brave somali warriors spill blood for their land? Will, this land be ever left for the xabashis?, in the event that Meles and an ethiopian backed govt comes into power?

 

That's the game. Scratch my back and I will do the same for u. But there r holes in this strategy. Once Somali government commences in Mogadishu still it can be replaced by Somalis with "unfriendly" regime. Somalis in Ethiopia have the numbers to effect a change. Being Somalis they have been exploited by Ethiopians. Melez's tool box has full of wrenches of all sizes that can dislodge anything when it becomes to Somalis.

[Faarax-Brawn]

Baashi, Walle you are a siyasi abtiyow. You have diplomatically stopped short of catogorically and unequivically condemning the precence of xabashi fighters fighting somali men!. For me, EVERYTHING else changed the day nin xabashi pointed a gun towards another somali in SOMALI SOIL. I have hard time already having to deal with the daily harrasment,killing and torturing of somalis in Somali Galbeed by Xabashi.

 

Just 25 meagre years ago,We were fighting these men and many many somalis lost their lives protecting you and me from this kind of aggression & here we letting that same enemy that has killed somalis yesterday,is killing somalis today into SACRED somali soil fighting against somalis in SOMALIA. Worse,is that we have somalis cheerleading for this enemy,all for what?? Because of qabyaalad. And please sxbow do not say that those 8K etoobiyan soldiers were trainers. B.S.Its a shame and its a shame that every somali must fight. I take this issue personally for I have had close family members fight against the xabashi in the war and so did many many somalis. In respect of this,I would expect every somali to at least condemn the precense of Xabashis fighting alongside somalis killing fellow somalis. That to me,is undoubtfully an eact of treason committed in the eyes of EVERY patriotic somali. Anyone who stands up to this bullying midget of a tigre called Meles has my undying support ,The same support my uncle,Heblayos father & heblow gave his life,his support to fight this OLD enemy that is the Xabashi.

 

I agree,tho' there is some truth to what you have said about the IUC being a bit too hasty with their aggression. But Baashi,runtii do you actually beleive the Xabash and Adeer Sam would have let these wadaads take over Somalia? Realisticaly, in a G.W Bush pre 9/11 world? K'mon nin oday baa tahaye,be realistic.

[Somali_Friend]

Originally posted by Baashi:

Alla ya cizak my man Brown. Now we are talkin. Forumku haduu forum u qalmaa.

 

IWHY is Meles putting so MUCH money,TIME,Weapons on a somali faction that doesnt have much support from a majority of somalis?

 

Excellent. The reason is because Somalia and Ethiopia has unsettled dispute over a large swath of what is now Ethiopia. He has his deamon to deal with in his domestic affairs. Oromos and Somalis reside eastern regions of Ethiopia. He knows Somalis deep down and he was qouted saying that the demise of Ethiopia as federal poluralistic state is in the hands of the post-conflict government in Somalia.

 

Abdullahi believes that Zanawi has fulfulled a key precondition. His responded a concern along those lines put to him when he visited to New York by fellow clan members OG that they should read the Ethiopian constitution. He said the right to secession has been granted to kilinka shanaad. There is some truth to that but his ignorence of the details of the Ethiopian constitution is amazing especially a man who wishes to be a statesmen. Constitution requires 2/3 of national vote in the parliament - an impossibility for Somalis to pass a resolution to their desired destiny in this parliament. Needless to say, Melez wants to male sure that any post-conflict Somali government is "friendly" to Ethiopia.

Baashi,

Corrections on the ethiopian constitution:

1. 2/3 vote is among Somali ethiopians not all of ethiopia. An Oromo or a Tigray have no vote in Somali affairs. The condition is that if 2/3 of Somali vote to seceed from ethiopia its their call.

 

2. I think President Abdullahi Yusuf read something you missed. This article in the ethiopian constitution and the Federal system is a Somali idea proposed by WSLF in 1984. Afar and Tigray were the first ones to respond positively and supported it. You can confirm this with ONLF. ONLF has never rejected the constitution, because its base supports it and if ONLF rejects the constitution it knows it is gone.

 

3. Somaliland also has the same reading of the situation. They know that its the wish of the majority of Somali ethiopians to give ethiopia a try. If it works they will be full participants and if it fails they have the exit already instituted.

 

4. Mugadishu would be the first to accept this, if AbdulKassim TNG had friendly relations with ethiopia as did President Barre in his last days. The border is not demarcated, but if there are friendly governments its easy to demarcate. The people in the supposed border areas at this time are friendly to each other. A lot of friendship has been established in the last 16 years among ethiopians and Somalis in Somalia.

 

Historically this issue is not being addressed genuinly and sincerely from Mugadishu. Its only brought as a card when ethiopia and egypt are in some conflict on the waters.

 

Walwal conference is the key. In that conference Somali from all corners gathered to form a greater somalia did not agree. Call it power struggle or something else, but one needs to recognize that so far for every Somali ethiopian who wants greater somalia, there are two that do not like the idea.

[Baashi]

Somali Friend,

 

I stand corrected. Inna Yussuf is right on this score. I have just checked the constitution and indeed Article 39 of the constitution agrees with you and the old man.

 

Greater Somalia is closer than close. What's left is having Somalia that once existed recuparate and recover from the self-inflicted wound.

 

Me,

 

My man. A history lesson for you. My fav poet Inna Abdille Hassan had lost the struggle. Somalia remained under European colonists' rule some 40 years after his death. Drawish as brave as they were, they had suffered a devastating defeat.

 

One thing you can be proud of is the fact that great Sayid refused to take orders from the white man. In that regard he was a great man worthy of our solute. Never forget though the man killed more Somalis than all the colonialists combined have killed.

 

Forward the clock and come to 1977. Again we have lost that war and suffered a humiliating defeat under the Habasha's hands with the Cuban and Soviet backers.

 

I can't help but qoute Marley's great exhortations and i paraphrase rise fallen fighters and rise and take ur stand again. He who fights and runs away, lives to fight another day. The wisdom here is pick ur fights, retreat if you must, never drop the ball.

 

Brown,

 

You didn't get it did u? Of course today I'm rooting for my fellow brothers. I pray that they win the battle. Fight the good fight, take a firm stand, defend ur spot but also play the game in the other front and accept the peace effort advanced by other interested parties.

 

My man we are in short supply and we don't have many friends in the region. If peace is possible it is in our interest methinks. Stop the war by accepting the talks in Khartoum. If TFG refuses flatly then we at least tried that route and the only option left will be in la harjado.

[me]

Baashi,

 

We haven't lost in the 1900's and we haven't lost in 1977.

 

In the 1900 the daraawiish fought like men so that we could walk with our heads high today. They died for our honour. many nations have been enslaved, the daraawiish saved our land. We would be called John and Micheal if it weren't for them. So no they haven't lost the war.

 

In 1977, Somalia wasn't defeated, Somalia retreated. Look at the defeats the habash suffered, look at the men and material they lost. They where backed by how many nations?

We with how many men did we enter the war? and how many did they have? what was teh ratio 10 to 1 in their favour?

 

Don't sell us short Baashi. We are better.

Somalia didn't loose the war on the frontline, Somalia lost the war on the diplomatic front.

 

This time we should cover our a$$ on the diplomatic front, that has always been our weak point.