Boosaaso: 'xataa aroos lama qaban karo'.

[Allamagan]

MMA. sxb cid Bari ama Puntland kaa xigta ma lahan, you are right, you can praise, criticize, haseyeeshee waxaad jeceshahay marwalba in aad xumaantooda ka hadashid wanaaga ay samysteena ad dafirtid. Dhibka & mockery-ga jooji sxb waxaan 'funny' ahayn 'funny' hanooga dhigin.

[Juje]

Originally posted by General Duke:

the mafia admin elected by the mafia ppl..

Call them whatever you want, though I resent them being called Mafia. But tell me this, and I have seen you state this reassuringly number of times, when and where did the people of Puntland ever stood or qued to elect members of Puntland regioNAL Parliamment, when sxb. And for the same matter does the leader of Puntland has the mandate of the people? Dont go about this your usual style of spining and swinging. I want direct answer.

[Fiqikhayre]

^^Do you know the essenance's of democracy and true representation Juje? Do you believe the people of the United States elect their president? Are you familiar with the electorial college? Have you ever heard of representative democracy? Do you only think democracy and a legitimate 'mandate' to rule comes from the votes of the electorate i.e. the citizens and residents of one given region, state or country?

 

Well count yourself 'lucky' juje as you're going to be taught about the different types of democracy that exist, which you're obviously ignorant about!

 

Firstly most progressive democracies on the globe only allow their citizens to elect the legislative powers of a given region, state and country only, but never executive and judicial powers!

 

Juje have you ever heard of Demarchy? Well I don't think so, so let me give you a discription of Demarchy, shall I?

 

Demarchy attempts to achieve democratic representation without needing elections—it is "democracy without elections."

 

It further say's about Demarchy: Demarchy which has people randomly selected from the citizenry to either act as representatives, or to make decisions in specific areas of governance (defense, environment, etc.). One of the results of this would be the cessation of political parties and elections.

 

That's why Juje in Puntland there are no political parties allowed, whether they call themselves 'Ramaas' or Badbaado for that matter. Puntland is a progressive representative democracy and may I add Juje we got the best system!

 

The mandate of Cade to rule comes from the elected constituets of the person, who represents them in the parliament and upper house of Puntlands parliament! This representatives were elected by their constituetns to serve their interest in the Puntland parliament! The traditional leaders or issims, which are well respected and legitimate rulers of certain constituents read clan, who are legitimate and fairly elected by their clans are the persons, who in consultation with the chief intellectuals of that clan and businessmen elect the person, who shall represent their interests in the parliament of Puntland!

 

Therefore Puntland State of Somalia is a progressive representative democracy, whose constituency representatives can legitimately elect the person they think would best suit to become the overall leader of Puntland!

 

Now tell me Juje, people who have a form of governance, law and order, a parliament, judical and executive bodies, with a standing army and hierarchy of governance to why they should give all the things I mentioned up for a bunch of loosers, who don't have an alternative and besides that don't even have a form of governance themselves!

 

Mogadishu today is without a governance and proper 'maamul' and now they want to dictate to people, who have a progressive representative democracy to give it all up for what Juje? Yes nothing.

 

Besides that Juje talking of having a 'mandate' to rule, who gave Ina Dahir Aweys and Indhacadde the mandate to decide what is good for the somali people? Cadde Muuse today is the most legitimate ruler inside Somalia and he's got the mandate of all Puntland clan's to rule over them, but which/what mandate do poor Ina Dahir Aweys and Indhacadde have? Well the answer is none!

 

Puntland is a progressive representative democracy Juje like it or not, your approval or disapproval will change nothing!

 

Now I'd urge you to further educate yourself, as I can't do that by myself each and everytime!

[Jaylaani]

By any means necessary. They should do anything to protect their security and keep the peace. The Taliban of Africa are the ultimate terrorist. Their main objective is to destabilized peaceful regions.

 

 

Duke

 

lets get serious here for a minute. There was never elected officials in Puntland. The only individual who has the right to vote is Abdilahi Yusuf. He inserted himself in power after he lost to that dude Jamac something…(sorry, I can’t remember his full name) and he appointed Cade Muse after he became the president of Baydhabo.

[Fiqikhayre]

BTW Juje, Demarchy is the puriest form of Democracy and the best form suited for us, especially being muslims, I reject the western notion of every man having a vote to elect their rulers, that's insane for me and totally unobjective!

 

It's best to use Demarchy compatible with Islam and the best and puriest form to elect true representatives, because I believe the 'masses' can be manipulated and mislead and all the people having a vote is just not right and certainly not in Somalia's case!

[QabiilDiid]

Jaylaanis, How come you reached this radical conclusion that the saviors of Somalia are terrorists? Are you seeking sympathy from the SNM gangs that are rooming in the northwest regions of Somalia? Or do you think that President Bush will get interested in your enclave? It is not marketable strategy to imitate what your enemy is saying about UIC? UICs troops are coming to Hargeysa and a street near you. They will save you from yourself.

[Juje]

Lieutenant General saxiib sheekada dheer iska dhaf iyo sharaxada, shacabka reer Puntland wax ma dorteen ha mise maya. Stop going around hand picked individuals who then went along to elect Cadde. No one can claim to have the mandate of the people in Puntland sxb however much you try to jutify it whether you call it Derma or Dunga. They have never been consulted nor asked to give mandate. Odayasha ama horjogayasha ama Isinka ama Ugaaska ama Suldanka that exists in Puntland or rest of Somalia cannot be classified as democratic status. Give me another one L General, that is not going down well sxb.

[Paragon]

Adeerayaal, xaalku 'afku sallax ku dheg'weeye. Juuq iyo jaaq toona ma oran kartaa ayaa dadkii lagu leeyahay. Runtuse hadii afka laga dedo, araxdeey ka dilaacdaa! Beelaha dega Buuntilaan waa ay u cuntami weydey in ay wanaaga ku dhaqanka diinta Islaamka ahi leeyahay in ay ka qadaan, kuma hoos maaruqaan xukun keli talis ah meheradaysteyna musuqmaasuq iyo waxaan damiirku aqbali karayn.

[NASSIR]

I think the people of Puntland are pressuring Cade to take a stand on their need to be ruled by Sharia Law.

 

Simply, Cade could be smart and act like Dahir Riyale when he announced to fulfill the desires of Somali.land people. The adminstrative system will be kept as it is.

 

One of the biggest clans of Bari region, people of Qandala have also declared Maxkamad on their own. I am really confused as of now with the whole Somalia situation.

[Jaylaani]

Originally posted by Nayruus:

Jaylaanis, How come you reached this radical conclusion that the saviors of Somalia are terrorists? Are you seeking sympathy from the SNM gangs that are rooming in the northwest regions of Somalia? Or do you think that President Bush will get interested in your enclave? It is not marketable strategy to imitate what your enemy is saying about UIC? UICs troops are coming to Hargeysa and a street near you. They will save you from yourself.

Lets focus for a minute..we're talking about somalia here.

 

malaha hadaad Somaliland soo qaadi waydo cumbuulo cuni maysid.

[General Duke]

Camir, all of us are up for Shariah Law and thats what the clans want. The admin should implement or die. But the clans even the one in Qandala want to change the system. The clan courts want to destroy the state..

 

As for the Qandala family here is their rebuke to the allegation..

 

puntlandpost

[NASSIR]

Duke, People of Qandalla have had traditional rivalry with their brethrens in Qardho and Banderbeila even prior to the state collapse. There have been reports on acts of kidnapping on ransom and minor clashes in Bosaso. I think I have opened a thread a while ago for the resolution of this inevitable clannish rivalries which may endanger the sustainability of the peace in the region. It is also another conjecture they may have that recourse to the Islamic courts might push for sound diaologue as opposed to the monologue of the current leaders.

 

Puntland is very powerful state and do have the capacity to put an end to the subversive activities that are circulating around every region, but the adminstration appears to be exploring reasonable avenues to not use force for the time being. The Islamists have quite succeeded in terrorizing the community with blandishments and bribery so they could shake the whole region.

[Fiqikhayre]

Juje what does Islam say about universal suffrage? Universal suffrage and the notion of ’one man, one vote’ is simply wrong, a waste of time and money and on top of that impractical and therefore out of the agenda for Puntlanders!

 

It’s up for each constituencies leader’s the issims, together with people representing the intellectual elite, entrepreneurial class, women rights activists and youth representatives i.e. the brains of each constituency to pick and choose and to nominate the best person amongst them, who is going to represent them and their constituencies interests at a higher platform, in which different constituencies representatives meet to discuss new policies and elect their ‘state representatives’ at a higher federal state level i.e. the president and vice president, who themselves are now going to elect the people, they think would best serve the country as cabinet ministers i.e. the ministerial portfolios, that’s how a democracy works juje and as long as the people wishes and interests are represented, respected and they’re happy, who is Juje advocating for universal suffrage? That’s what the people of Puntland have chosen and they’re happy with it! On top of that people are well represented and it’s a form of democracy that you simply can’t/don’t want to understand juje!

 

However the problem is the ’lack’ of allocated ministerial posts to each constituency, that angers people most in the state, if you’re really interested in local politics of the state that is Juje! Some constituencies’ think they’re under represented not in the Puntland Parliament but in the senior ministerial posts and therefore their voices don’t count! There are only 66 seats in the Puntland Parliament and some people think that although all of the seats were rightfully allocated to the different constituencies however that the ministerial appointments don’t reflect the diversity of the Puntland parliament and that they demand a fair allocation of ministerial posts that resembles the real situation on the ground. It’s a case of politicking and rivalry between the different subclan’s and no universal suffrage would actually solve the problem but a fair distribution of the ministerial posts amongst the subclans! E.g. UM sub clan of Mudug/Nugaal (Burtinle) have been allocated only two senior ministerial portfolios, UM is made of 9 or 8 sub clan’s and the two ministerial posts have been given to one sub clan, that said sub clan is again divided into 20 or so other sub clan’s but only two subclans were given the ministerial post leaving the other’s without ministerial post! Puntland already said no to big government and to large numbers of ministers in order to appease the different subclans but Puntland today functions despite some resentments from the sub clan’s that haven’t been given a share in the ministerial posts! But as long as the people of Puntland are happy with their chosen system, nobody can have a say in it, especially not someone, who himself doesn’t have equal representation and administration in place, who simply lacks any political system that governs the region/area he/she hails from! Juje before you speak of more complex systems and universal suffrage, why don’t you establish the simplest of the simplest administration that could be established in your region? This is not only a case and analogy of a donkey with one leg competing with horses but an argument to why that said horse isn’t elected by the ordinary Aisha and Farah but only by the people, who truly represent the best interests of the said horse and who have its well being at the heart!

 

Juje please if you can answer me this question:

 

It has come to Sakhars attention

Juje’s unconvincing pretention

He claims to have a valid assertion

I refute it as being an invalid contention

However I cannot doubt his intention

But Juje please answer me this question!

 

Why does Mogadishu have no administration?

[Fiqikhayre]

Caamir, I totally disagree with you on the notion, that what Riyaale did was actually ‘smart’, it’s simply political opportunism!

 

I said long time ago, the people advocating for sharia’ law to be implemented are just declaring, their ignorance and that they previous systems were simply based on daaquut!

 

Caamir Puntland has in its constitution implemented sharia law as being the highest law that actually governs the state! They declare, that no other religion then Islam can be propagated in the state and that anything that goes against the sharia law is also against the law of Puntland, actually we’re now governed by sharia law! The courts rulings e.g. on ‘qisaasta’ murdering a person who killed another muslim wrongfully or arresting people, who say something against the religion is already practised but what we need as I argued long time ago is a upper house of the parliament in which the religious folks, the ulama sit, pass laws and inspect laws passed by the lower house if they feasible with the Islamic sharia, the house should compromise of 22 leading Puntland religious figures like Sheikh Abdulqadir Gacmey and Sheikh Daahir! They should not be elected but rather nominated/selected by the President of Puntland on a presidential decree! They also should have total control on the countries judiciary and they should advice the president on policy making!

 

That’s actually what I wrote a year ago or so:

 

5. A New upper house of religious leader’s should be established:

 

Parliament should be made off a lower house and an upper house. The upper house should be unelected and made off "saints" pious people who fear Allah subxaanah and traditional elders such as isims such as boqoro, saladiin and cukaash. The upper house should have total control on the judiciary and they should also decide if the laws passed by the lower house of the parliament are feasible with shariicah law.

 

The house of religious figures should be nominated by the President. The number should concise of 22. They will also act as a "majilis-ashuura". They will advice the President on policy making.

 

On the other hand Caamir, don’t be fooled by the person’s drumming for the Mog clan courts, they simply people just like me and you, who often fabricate things for their selfish political exploits! I can do the same wallaahi, list names of my sub clan and say that we came to an conclusion to support the courts, it’s not that difficult! By the way the bayaan of reer qandala was ‘been-abuur’ a lie fabricated by a person, that has been brainwashed by the religious pretenders of Mog’s clan courts tto express unbased support for them, it’s really that simple, don’t believe what you read at all Caamir!

[Fiqikhayre]

Seems President Adde Muuse has answered my calls:

 

Shir wadatashi oo ka dhacay Gaalkacyo qodobana ka soo baxeen!

 

Saturday, 18-Nov 2006

Madaxweynaha DGPL ayaa xubno muhiim ah oo kamid ah culimada diinta islaamka ee reer Puntland.

 

Wadatashi kala yeeshay xaaladaha siyaasadeed iyo nabadgelyo ee maanta ka jira guud ahaan soomaaliya gaar ahaan Puntland iyo dersiyadeeda koonfur iyo waqooyi.

 

Waxaa ka soo baxay talooyinka soo socda oo loo arkey in ay ka tarjumayaan masalaxada shacabka reer Puntland iyo guud ahaan bulshada Soomaaliya.

 

1.In la taabo geliyo ku dhaqanka sharciga Islaamka.

2.In madaxweynuhu magacaabo gudi ka talo bixiya habkii wax loo sixi lahaa kana kooban golayaasha dawlada culimaaudiinka isimada iyo aqoonayahada DGPL

3.In la dhawro amniga iyo xasiloonida Puntland

4.In soomaaliya lagu xaliyo arimaheeda wadahadal iyo is afgarad.