Samatar, Monster Next Door

[raula]

Originally posted by Jacaylbaro:

Thanksful, save your anger niyow ,,, we're doing our job and this is just the beginning.

 

perhaps your attempt at sarcasm was preceeded by daba******nimo! waxaa la yiri-Charity begins at home, marka dont look further yet!

 

Castro, as the brother said, or others have said, yes the court will hear it and we’ll see then. Ironically, then if this man is convicted (making the law be pertinent to US residents/citizens), then all those cronies like Cheney and the gang will forced to bite the bullet? I doubt that will be the case anytime soon. Conversely, you cannot refute the fact that this man (although, of distinguished stratum at the time) does come from a marginal clan. Perhaps others have the support of their clan/gang whatever-its not a revelation brother, plenty of Somalis up to now, with all blood that has been shed, still have their tribal pride running parallel w/their blood. Even so, minority or not, you are crook no matter your creed.

So take it easy, cool it w/your uncouth retorts-we all know you by your responses (and not personally, at least I don’t). The brother (thankful) has replied very considerately to you; I don’t see where you fail to understand let justice prevail to all, and not shed others? Consider it a difference of opinion.

[xiinfaniin]

Samatar dadka kama danbi badnay e maxaa laga rabaa?

 

Ma tol yari baa lagu tuhmay

[Castro]

^^^^ lol @ tuhmay. Yes, the US Supreme Court knows about Samatar's minority clan membership and based on that, has decided there's little political price to pay for prosecuting him for war crimes. That he's the highest ranking member of Afweyne's military junta to live in the United States has nothing to do with this.

 

Originally posted by raula:

I don’t see where you fail to understand let justice prevail to all, and not shed others? Consider it a difference of opinion.

Huh?

[Jacaylbaro]

Originally posted by raula:

quote:Originally posted by Jacaylbaro:

Thanksful, save your anger niyow ,,, we're doing our job and this is just the beginning.

 

perhaps your attempt at sarcasm was preceeded by daba******nimo! waxaa la yiri-Charity begins at home, marka dont look further yet!

 

and what is your point here Raula ?? ,,,,,

 

We agree all criminals should be courted but do not expect 100 of them will be brought to the court room in the same day, same hour and same time.

 

Samatar was the highest military official who was giving orders and that is why it starts with him now. Then we will go down to others.

[Thankful]

Castro, like I said the Supreme court will decide if he is immune or not, they are not looking at the facts of the case. They are just deciding if he can be prosecuted or not!

 

I don't think you guys grasp the fact that it has been 20 years since many of the war crimes took place. Yet, not a single witness has not come forward against any one else.

 

20 years is an enormous amount of time! Every other regime suspected of war crimes didn't wait to get the highest member and then work it's way down. You got after them ALL!! There are many suspected in London, England yet you see no one raising opposition to them. The case against Samatar has been going on for many years now.

 

Why hasn't other cases started up, why are these guys not being held accountable. To say "just wait", please....it's been 20 years now!

 

I know NW Somalis consider Morgan the biggest criminal, but in 20 years that he has gone to Kenya numerous times, no case has been brought forward. The 5 years years Siad Barre was in Nigeria, did people demand he's extradition? Like Liberia's Charles Taylor from Nigeria?

 

After the Warlords in Mogadishu fled Somalia when the ICU took over, did anyone put forward any cases?

Look at Rwanda, Former Yugoslavia, and any other place.

 

The fact that General Samatar is in court yet no one else is being brought forward who have found sanctuary in Europe, makes it seem very strange.

 

The reason why no one else in Siad's regime, Morgan, Riyaale, the warlords or many other suspecte war criminals in Europe are not being brought forward is because they have thousands of people that will rally support and will give them safe haven.

 

Where as Samatar does not!

[Jacaylbaro]

Originally posted by Thankful:

Castro, like I said the Supreme court will decide if he is immune or not, they are not looking at the facts of the case. They are just deciding if he can be prosecuted or not!

 

Hadaa maxaad la cabaaadaysaa ??

[Thankful]

Not complaining, but wondering why no one else has ever been brought forward! The same people, (like you), who are happying that he is being prosecuted, remain silent with their own monsters.

[Jacaylbaro]

and what did i say many times ?/ or you don't even read what i say niyow ?

 

 

IT IS THE BEGINNING .................... now that is in capital letters ,,

[Thankful]

Gen Samatar case started the beginning of last decade, why hasn't any new ones started?

[Jacaylbaro]

You need to finish one in order to start another ....... silly

[Thankful]

How much time do you think we have here?

 

NO you don't finish one to start another, they are all old men in their 60's and older. At this current rate of 20 years if you wait any longer no one else will face justice. In Rwanda, or Former Yugoslavia they didn't wait to finish one and then the others. That's not how it works!

 

Former Siad men in Europe and Riyaale get a free pass while one man from an oppressed group is attacked. What is the point of waiting?

 

How does Samatar in the U.S have anything to do with the British or Kenyan courts? Absolutely nothing! The warlords that blocked food aid to people or the rebels that hid among civilians and former regime guys who directly carried out the human rights violations with their own hands haven't even been reported the international human rights court?

 

It's quite obvious why!

[xiinfaniin]

Originally posted by Castro:

^^^^ lol @ tuhmay. Yes, the US Supreme Court

knows

about Samatar's minority clan membership and based on

that

, has decided there's little political price to pay for prosecuting him for war crimes. That he's the highest ranking member of Afweyne's military junta to live in the United States has nothing to do with this.

 

You are being a bit religious on Samatar's alleged crimes, ma istiri!

 

Also, it's my understanding that the US Supreme Court did not decide Samatar's culpability. The fact it accepted to hear the case does not say much where they will come down on it, Castro. I can certainly understand one would find the minority argument quite silly. I find the selective prosecution of Somalia’s former strong men silly.

[NGONGE]

Not you too, Xiin. You know what you're saying is rubbish and you have more sense than to repeat the minorty clan nonsense. Private individuals brought this case not an entire clan. Jb and others simply consider it a bonus but I doubt if they would have gone through the trouble of a court case.

 

I am actually amazed by the coolness of the man and woman who went after Samatar. I know if I was in their place and I found out that he lived in the same area as me I would be tempted to engineer a car accident somewhere near his house, sometime as he goes for his evening stroll.

[Castro]

Originally posted by xiinfaniin:

The fact it accepted to hear the case does not say much where they will come down on it, Castro.

Any idea how many cases the Supreme Court hears every year? Less than 2% of cases presented from appellate courts make it to its docket (over 98% are rejected and never heard). I would say it is beyond significant that it decided to hear the Samatar case (despite all its ramifications) but you can interpret the statistics any way you wish.

 

I find the selective prosecution of Somalia’s former strong men silly.

Saaxib I'm not sure what you mean by this. This civil lawsuit is a one-man crusade against Samatar. Do you think the accuser was browsing in a catalog of "Somalia's former strong men" and decided to pick this one? Is this what you mean by selective?

 

Samatar, the #2 man of Afweyne happens to be in the same country that the accuser sought asylum in. He decides to go after Samatar (the only member of Afweyne's cabinet to live here) for imprisonment and torture he claims were done to him. If Afewyne were alive and decided to live in the US, there would be a lineup of people wanting to sue him.

 

So your use of the word selective is difficult to understand. If you are implying that many others deserve to appear in front of a court, in addition to Samatar, no one here disagrees with you. Fill out the paperwork and I'll sign the petition.

 

Whether you realize it or not, we're all victims of the likes of Samatar and only because of our apathy do we let them go unpunished. But when someone decides to stop being apathetic, we question their motives and we either go down the pathetic road of clan allegiance and minority clans or worse, call their actions silly.

 

Have we not learned anything in 40 years?

[NASSIR]

Thankful, iskaga har the bitter folk's debate. Ha ku wareerin

United States Department of State

Review Authority: Harry R Melone

March 1990

 

SUMMARY: Two day trip to Northwest reassured us Prime Minister (Samatar) was right: Tension is easing, Isaaks are returning and Government is attempting to respond to region’s needs. It will be a long road back…..

 

Datt and I were allowed to travel unimpeded (Along with other Embassy, Datt and USAID personnel. We seem to have at last liberated ourselves from GSDR Travel restrictions thanks to Prime Minister’s intervention, and Department’s timely warning to Somali Ambassador. ***** are in fact returning to Bur;o and Berbera in growing numbers and, we were told, even large numbers to outlying villages.

 

GSDR and Somali Army seem to be facilitating return of displaced persons, as Samantar promised (Mogadishu 2485). We saw no sign and heard no report of any harassment or punishment. On other hand, we saw precious little evidence of material help available to returnees, notwithstanding Prime Minster’s statement that foodstuff, medicines, and water supply equipment have been sent to Bur’o.

 

 

Confidential.