Islam in Women

[Xoogsade]

Originally posted by Naku Penda Piya:

But tell a man his little boy throws a ball like a girl, and see what happens.

Bishaaro Bil Kheer, I would give the young boy a good beating for throwing the rock like a girl. A boy is supposed to be a boy in every sense, act like a boy, play like a boy, sit like a boy and talk like a boy. I am sure you wouldn't prefer the misguided approach some parents in the west take when their little boys behave contrary to men's biological norms. Such encouragement, thanks to the propaganda of the feminists, results in a disaster. No wonder some men of age with families seek sex change just because the devil breaths into their mind they are feminine deep inside and they have been denying themselves the luxury.

 

PS: The world is a beautiful place with men being Men and Women being women. And if you ask me, the best thing we have as somalis are somali women. I think to take a tough stance against norms that blurr roles and confuse behaviours are important for the continuity of mankind without such stance being made as anti-women.

 

As for the topic at hand, there are more qualified persons around from both sides with eloquence to represent a healthy view. I will happily read other people's contributions

[Castro]

Originally posted by Roob:

Ignorance and men are the cause of the poor situation of the woman today!

Roob haduu intaaba garanayo, rajuu leeyahay. I agree with the above statement and for some to claim, falsely, that women in the Somali culture and in Islamic countries in general, are not oppressed is the height of duplicity.

[sheherazade]

Rahima, perhaps each culture will require its own clean-up process with a slant on the women for Somalis(they ARE their own worst enemy) for instance and an emphasis on the men for another.

 

Roob, I made it clear from the start that I didn't want to engage in banner-waving- Islam is good etc. People use it as a way of brushing aside the real issues and I wanted to focus on what is rather than valid points that are used as excuses. You have done that so thank you.

 

Xiin, it was not my intention to prove the presence of female oppression in Muslim societies in this post. You on the other hand are determined to 'show' me that there isn't a problem. And how have you done so?

 

Firstly, you have suggested that I have had bad experiences and that these may have dirtied my painter's brush. Not only is this uncalled for and unsubstantiated(I never drew on personal experience alone) you have mocked me for doing so(something I haven't done mind you).

 

I recommended the magic carpet trip because I believe in going outside my personal realm and seeing for myself what the situation actually is. Drawing merely on what I(insignificant as a statistic) have experienced would be narrow-minded and laughable. Had I done so your mockery would have been justified but it was in vain.

 

You then go on to back-up your 'no oppression' shouts with an example from your past. Do you see what I see? You have painted with a brush dipped into an eye-blink, a drop in the paint of Muslim culture and presented your work with flourish. Voila.

 

How utterly, contradictory and feeble. Title your painting, 'Own goal'. You have used a painting technique that you yourself mock.

 

Once again, it was never my intention to prove oppression(this is a given in my mind) but if your are bent on disproving its existence, you are doing a woeful job. You personalised this when you suggested I speak of my own limited experience alone. It is the oldest trick in the book, unworthy of any topic, but when presented as you have yours, something to laugh at out loud and wholeheartedly. Raise that bar you speak of, don't point it at me.

[xiinfaniin]

^^

[xiinfaniin]

Falxadoy,

 

It goes without saying that woman in Islam is a sovereign entity and a responsible human being. Her admission to faith is completely a personal matter. Allah addresses her, not through proxy of Muslim males, but directly to her. Gender is not an issue in Islam. A Muslim is rewarded or punished on the basis of her/his actions. Individuality of a Muslim is principle of this faith. Although sex is immaterial in the verdict of Islamic jurisprudence, the divine text makes some distinctions and exceptions in some secondary regulations. These distinctions are in accordance with both sexes respective human nature. This write-up addresses some of those distinctions.

 

Although Muslim woman played a vital role in the domain of leadership throughout of the Islamic history, it is the degree of her role that had been limited by the traditional thought. It is the opinion of the majority of Muslim jurists that deemed inadmissible for woman to hold the position of head of state. The heart of their ruling rests on Abu Bakrah's hadith reported by Bukhari (7 Of Nine was right after all). But the question of leading prayers was also considered. So let us state the hadith first:

 

Imam Bukhari reports from Abu Bakrah the following: "Allah provided me with considerable benefit during the battle of the camel with one word (or one statement). When news reached the prophet (S.A.W.) that the Persians had appointed Chosroe's daughter as their ruler, he said: '' A nation which placed its affairs in the hands of a woman shall never prosper!''

 

As I mentioned before traditional interpretation of this hadith, as Hafiz Ibn Hajr indicates in Fathul Bari, does not permit women to hold the office of head of state. This hadith, they argued, is inclusive; an articulate proof that exacts comprehending verdict (Caam), which can’t be retired without it being particularly termed so by another divine evidence (Khaas). And so their ruling remains valid. The method of this interpretation is inline with the fundamentals of the science of Islamic fiqh. In the absence of both Al-Khas (exception by another divine evidence) and Al-Naskh (abrogation), a Muslim who believes in the science of Usul al Fiqh is bound to accept this opinion. Contrary to the prevailing contemporary feminist view, this hadith does not injure the dignity of woman nor does it insult her intellectual capacity. This verdict can’t be logical basis for establishing relationship between gender and performance in political office. That is a weak argument, in my opinion, that can’t be sustained. What this verdict did is to regulate the degree to which a Muslim woman can rise in her public service. Why, you may ask. It is the divine judgment of the Lawgiver and I am not fond to snoop the intent of His laws. The companion of the prophet understood it that way and most Muslim jurists interpreted it that way.

 

To refute it, as some attempted, would require challenging either the authenticity of this hadith (some feminist commentators already did) or the integrity of the companion (this is also done) who narrated it. The third option is to explain in different light other than the traditional thought, which had also been done by minority of Muslim scholars (I have not read how they went about it, I would be glad to hear if one has). And that would just educe a minority opinion, which when contrasted to the thoughts of great salaf scholars would be a weak shout from a distant camp.

 

There is also the issue of leading public prayers, an integral function of the office of head of state. As you may probably know to be head of Islamic state is more than figurehead and involves not only decisions relating to peace and war, but also religious activities. An ideal Muslim leader would be expected to lead public prayers, an activity that women are not allowed to perform.

 

I have not given the time and effort needed to expound on this issue. But, I hope, I gave enough to solidify the legal relevance of this hadith, which my respected sister (magacyo-badan, but Falxado is my favorite) requested.

 

So there you have it, 7 Of Nine.

[Legend of Zu]

^^^ Xiin, Just to let you know that the abu bakar in this xadiith is not Khallifatul rasool - Abu bakar Assidiiq. he was another abu bakar (RA)(a saxaabi) and he narrated this xadiith after he was told about A'isha (RA)leading the battle of the Camel during Ali (RA) term of the khalaafah.

 

I will be back later with further info

 

Cheers

[xiinfaniin]

^^No confusion at all between the two, but your observation is noted. Please come back, I am in a debating mode today .

[-Serenity-]

Xiin, sorry I was away maantoo dhan. Shopping. Gotta look trendy and go out in style ya see. Hooyo says my jacket could feed a whole family in Somalia for a month - how is she to understand, it will keep me comfy, snug and up myself for all of 3 months?

 

Anyways, waad mahadsantahay for your efforts. What prompted this discussion was my reading of this book: The veil and the male elite - a feminist interpretation of women's rights in Islam. In the book, Fatima Mernissi argues about the authenticity of this hadith and provides a compelling argument. You should read it, its very interesting.

 

Also, I've been told that this hadeeth applies to a perfect Islamic state and a woman may not hold the position of Amir Al-Mu'mineen or khalifah(coincidentially, this word does not have a feminine gender in the Arabic language as well). As the world stands today with us dabbling in democracy everywhere, there are no objections to a woman holding the highest office in the country.

 

Athena for Somaliland prez 2020. LoL.

 

p.s. Falxado sounds more n more like farxal or foolxuma maalinba maalinta ka dambeysa.

[Castro]

Originally posted by iPod Athena:

Athena for Somaliland prez 2020. LoL.

WTF? Oh, I forget. You are a khaldaan after all.

 

As you were.

[xiinfaniin]

Falxado = luck + providence (without caps). It leads an entire class of Somali names; Abshiro, Ayyaan, Hoodo and the rest. How could that smell foolxumo, Falxado ?

 

But if your frowning facial expression does even remotely represent your disapproval of it, I would drop it. Of course, you have to PM me to consider it as a full protest from your side.

 

I see. Ms Mernissi not only challenges the authenticity of the hadith but she even goes further and impeaches the integrity of the Abu Bakrah, the companion who narrates it. She is a very daring woman, to say the least. But her insurgence, I must say, is destined for defeat. There is entire science of hadith that has agreed standards for accepting or rejecting the traditions of the prophet. And she seems to have taken it lightly. Bukhari and Muslim are two hadith scholars whose books enjoy consensus among Muslim scholars. Any one who challenges them will face an uphill battle; some people are sent wars that they are bound to loose, I suppose.

 

As for you, Falxado, I am sure you going to make a great guurti woman in SL. I also know that you can easily replace that oldie Edna in the office of foreign affairs. I would not even mind a well-read sister like you leading that emerging republic. But be aware NGONGE is contesting for the top post as well .

 

I guess when can start nomination process in SOL.

 

------Survives from the staged ambush and walks out unharmed with few scratches on the back (those were Sheh’s, or so I think )---.

[-Serenity-]

^ thats because waan kuu naxney.

 

I think you'll have to refute some1 like Mernissi who has done extensive research and studied Islamic history, with a little more than that buddy

[sheherazade]

Dude, I keep telling you: YOU scratched your own back.

[-Serenity-]

Originally posted by Castro:

Oh, I forget. You are a

khaldaan

after all.

Dont think I havent noted you're one too . Unless you're one of those traitor-khaldaans!

[Castro]

Originally posted by iPod Athena:

Unless you're one of those traitor-khaldaans!

Indeed. I've exorcised myself of khaldaan-ness a while back. I'd still keep my promise though, and campaign on your behalf in Khaldaania.

[-Serenity-]

Oh? So what are you now? - Cuban? I'd hate to think the Communist is winning in this Split Personality battle.

 

Come back to Khaldaania (Great suggestion. Maybe we can finally rid ourselves of the 'Somali') dear. We are kind to the confused