Female Circumcision Vs Abortion

[Pacifist]

Alle ubaahne

ilaah baan kugu dhaarshaye maka dhab baa waxaad ku haadleeyso haadaba?

[Jacpher]

I somehow missed this thread but I never expected a Muslim would say, Inaa Wajadnaa Aabaa'anaa Calaa Umatin wa inaa calaa aa'thaarihim muqtaduun. Zukhruf 23.

[Fanisha]

Originally posted by Ducaqabe:

I somehow missed this thread but I never expected a Muslim would say,

Inaa Wajadnaa Aabaa'anaa Calaa Umatin wa inaa calaa aa'thaarihim muqtaduun.

Zukhruf 23.

You did not miss much.

Ale ubaahne uunbaa qori iyo qude qaatey oo meeshii walaaqaya with xanaa manaaa

[Xoogsade]

Alle ubaahne, you are funny saxib. Fiiri, waa runtaa in mar marka qaarkood dad ulajeedo kale leh ka doodaan arrimaha diinta, laakiin in this case, everyone involved has sincere interests as I see them including you. I am for less pain and naturality if islam isn't being undermined by that. And the reason my conviction leans towards that end, is because:

 

A- If islam doesn't place prohibition on non-circumcision for women, nor does it give clear order of it based on Authentic hadiths, why argue for it?

 

B- If the sunnah practice can not be supported with authentic hadiths, then it is cultural practice that has nothing to do with islam and a strong one in Somali community. The way I see it, the sheekhs themselves are too reluctant to give up the tradition. So they let it continue under the sunnah direction using perhaps some unauthetic ahadiths, and god knows because they never tell us the authentic ahadiths they are basing on the Sunnah.

 

C- Women are the ones who deal with the circumcision, they know better about the subject, if they aren't happy with it, perhaps we should take that into consideration and listen to their concerns? Aniga ceebaanba u arkaa inaan kala doodo arrimahooda u gaar ka ah. Not my business and I am not asking a woman how is she down there. Sunnah or not, it is faith that counts in the end bro.

 

 

Asxaabta kale

 

Haven't you noticed the popularity of Alle ubaahne ? check his ratings, Ten whole nomads voted for him Aniga xataa waan ka helaa dabeecaddiisa, we need people like that who have strong convictions about their beliefs. The noble thing for everyone to do is to understand where someone is coming from.

 

And Nur is still a Brother. He hasn't lost his Aura.

[Rahima]

Asalaamu Calaykum,

 

Sorry, I could not help but say something on this rather tough issue. I think when it comes down to gudniin Vs. possibility of abortion -- I rather chop my little girls stuff. I just think it will save a lot of POSSIBLE suffering. (PLEASE NOTE THE WORD POSSIBLE) I agree with many gentlemen's remarks' being Pro-Guditaan, and I agree with them because of the way of life in Today's missguided massess.

Let's bring back the practices of our forefathers, we have under estimated their wisdom.

You are no doubt the misguided fella.

 

Suggestion, please learn your religion and god i hope that whilst you carry these views you do not have any daughters.

 

You are on the safe side, and of course, I am with you. We will only stick to our culture and yet practice fully our religion. Don't get intimidated, activists in here are so aggressive in pushing their views down to the throats of others. People like you will not get lost when they stick to the two main sources that embody our morale framework, which is the Quran and the Sunnah. They accuse you for being Jeego-dheere, but don't worry, you tell them we're not dissatisfied with our diin and dhaqan.

So Alle-ubaahane, let me give you the benefit of the doubt here. Please explain that disgusting paragraph above.

 

Are you calling for FGM? And more importantly how is it part of our religion?

 

That said, if you are calling for it (which you seemingly are suggesting thus far), dare I say it you are the one who is in dire need of all that you suggest to the ‘activists’.

 

These days Alle-ubaahane, you dissapoint many of us. Your views seem incredibly backward and inslamic.

[sheherazade]

Originally posted by Alle-ubaahne:

Right, I am poisonous only when it comes to turning down the repulsiveness of your ever-shifting contemporary believes, but assume not cowardly at me. Many years from now, you find me firm and stable to an unbreakable grounds that lean on Islam, unlike the people you sometimes represent who are subject to anything, even the wind. And yes, you can go ahead and resort to your invisible authority now for deleting what I wrote, because all you were seeking is to provoke an argument that can lead either to deletion or demonize my views!

U don't need me to get demonised(u manage this all by yrself). I don't represent anyone except myself and I am as visible as anybody else. Yr attention-seeking is legendary.

 

I'm pretty certain at some point in this thread, u distanced yrself from Nur's suggestion. Now u're backing it probably to stoke the fire. If u want to encourage chopping up women's private parts in Ramadan or any other time, u're encouraging ignorance and u'll be leaning against a tree which will have your forefathers' ignorance as its roots.

 

Deen and dhaqan are not words that belong side by side, one takes precedence. I see u take whichever one u fancy to further your drama, all ado about nothing.

 

We must encourage that which is good and discourage that which is bad. Alhamdullilah for the all the women(and some men) in here who have expressed their views against this diabolical suggestion.

[Nephissa]

This isn't terribly unusual among the religious folks, who consider the "breaking of the hymen via vaginal intercourse" to be the cut-and-dried definition of sex. Yaa Rab! May Allah forgive you for your ignorance over this outdated thinking. There are other risk(ier) sex activities kids do now days, clits off or on stitched up or down. Whether in Kunturwaare or Bulohaawo, she can still do it! :eek: *yea really* May not get pregnant, if thats your only worries, but can get her freak on just as much. What then? It's not really in your hands is it? Takes more then Gudniin, wouldn't you think?

 

While we're at it, why aren't the males who engage in this behavior pilloried?

 

Allaa yaa ul i siiyo. :mad:

[Xoogsade]

LOOL, Ma naxdo maa magac ka dhigatid?

[Nephissa]

Go to bed son.

[Kashafa]

WOL,

 

As you rightly noted, your position is only applicable under an Islamic state, which if you look around, hasn't been in existence for 80 odd years. Lashings, 4 witnessess, it's all good: just show me the STATE. Untill then, a few Jamaican(and/or/somali/paki/arab/whoever) bodies found floating in the river will send a clear and subtle(well, not really) message: Muslim girls are off-limits. A waiting death-trap if you go about her the wrong way. Spinners can call it murderous and 'racialistic' all they want: it's just retribution. Where I come from, the quickest way to court death is to insult a woman. Let alone using/abusing them. It's how we do on our side.

 

Note: The 'Najaasah' term went for the Mushrik Impregnator, not the Tayyib/Tahir Muslim fetus.

[sheherazade]

so many stand-up comics..

too much respect for tomatoes..

 

There is so much correcting the wrong with a wrong.

 

Save us Lord.

[Kashafa]

^^ Aaamin Ya Rabbal Aalameen. Save us indeed from spineless souls, who forgot the meaning of honour and dignity, who are so entrenched in liberal philosphy that the word 'retribution' cannot be found in their dictionary. They have no answers(right or wrong), only questions. They do not condem, they only protest(weakly, at that). Save us Indeed.

 

Note: A woman prisoner of war is molested in Istanbul and the then-Caliph Al-Mu'tasim sends an gigantic army to storm that city and rescue her. But I forgot, he's a stand-up comic.

[Pucca]

The

Quran makes no mention

, whether explicit or implicit,

of female circumcision

. There is no consensus on the ruling of Islamic law in regard to it, and no analogy that is relevant and admissible.

Chastity and modesty are equally called for in men and women

. They are the means of protection against the unpleasant consequences of close contact between the two sexes.

Good upbringing, which instills virtuous conduct, is the real shield that keeps such contact from leading to consequences contrary to religious instruction and moral standards

.

Source Go on and read it all...

[-Lily-]

First of all, everyone is entitled to their views/ideas. But however, if the most educated and religiously inclined voices such as Nur are advocating FGM as a solution, we really have no hope for the future. I have not been this dissapointed in a long time.

 

First of all, does anyone have an exact statistic about this abortion issue? Or is it just more mass moral hysteria?

 

Secondly, I think possessing a clit is probably the last reason why girls would be promiscious. Look around at the Asian/Arab and other muslim communities, you don't see them practising such cruel methods.

 

How many somali parents discuss sex with their children? It's shued away as 'ceeb'. Parents are more concerned with their reputation than with their children's well being. Until men start taking responsibility for their families, instead of being wasted 24/7 we will see more abortions. Until mothers spend quality time with their girls and show them and teach them self value, rather than screaming at them to clean the house or feed 9 kids then perhaps we may be getting somewhere. I BLAME THe PARENTS because all the so called wayward teens could not have been programmed to be the way they are, they are a product of their environment. Look at middle classed children, sure they have those who drop out of the face of the earth, but most of them suceed.

 

Nur, go preach to the parents to discuss sex with their children.

 

Thank God we have a host of educated strong somali women coming up to drown out ignorant voices such as the ones whose views are dressed up as logical.

[Viking]

Originally posted by Kashafa:

^^ Aaamin Ya Rabbal Aalameen. Save us indeed from spineless souls, who forgot the meaning of honour and dignity, who are so entrenched in liberal philosphy that the word 'retribution' cannot be found in their dictionary. They have no answers(right or wrong), only questions. They do not condem, they only protest(weakly, at that). Save us Indeed.

 

Note: A woman prisoner of war is molested in Istanbul and the then-Caliph Al-Mu'tasim sends an gigantic army to storm that city and rescue her. But I forgot, he's a stand-up comic.

Kashafa,

Retribution doesn't necesarily make you a better Muslim sxb. During the Friday, the Imam was talking about a few issues and one of them was the ability to avoid meeting agression with agression. He mentionned a story when a man came and urinated Prophet SAWS mosque in Medina. Some Sahaba came running to the Prophet SAWS and wanted to deal with the man ("take care" of him for showing disrespect). The Prophet SAWS told them to let the man finish what he's doing, let him leave and then wash the spot where he urinated on with some water. He also mentionned another instance when a bedouin came and grabbed the Prophet SAWS by the collar (almost strangling him) and he demanded that he be given some of the wealth. Some wanted to "take care of him" but the Prophet SAWS said no, he gave the man what he wanted and in the end won him over. Meeting fire with fire isn't always the wisest thing to do sxb.

 

Originally posted by WaTerLily:

How many somali parents discuss sex with their children? It's shued away as 'ceeb'. Parents are more concerned with their reputation than with their children's well being...Nur, go preach to the parents to discuss sex with their children.

WaTerLily,

As Muslims, Somalis don't expect their children to be having pre-marital sex, alas, it happens many a times. Sex education doesn't necessarily arm you with morals, it teaches you the "downsides" (i.e. STD's and pregnancy) and encourages the youth to use protection (no moral lessons there - they are taught to learn how to avoid STD's and avoid unplanned pregnancy).

 

UK has the highest teen pregnancy in Europe, the most abortions are done in Scandinavia and sex education is not taught elsewhere in the world as much as it is taught in these two regions. Look up the prevalence of chlamydia and genital herpes in these regions and you'll see a pattern. As I see it, sex education actually increases promiscuity rather that decrease it as I think you have presumed.