The Issue of the New Kenyan Constitution

[Jacaylbaro]

This is taking more than i expected really. It is going through religious issues.

 

Now we have the Christians campaigning against the new constitution saying it favors Islam against other religions in the country.

 

Here we have the Churches demonstrating:

 

Kenya churches confident of referendum win

 

 

Will the Muslims do the same if things will be changed based of the Christians demands ??

[SeeKer]

^^JB did you read the 10 reasons the church was against the referendum or did you just happen to see the Islam is favored part only?

 

I am still working through the 179 page document but so far I haven't seen what the church is wailing about unless the clauses of the proposed constitution mean something else to them

The provisions of this Chapter on equality shall be qualified to the extent strictly necessary for the application of Muslim law before the Kadhis’ courts, to persons who profess the Muslim religion, in matters relating to personal status, marriage, divorce and inheritance.

Abortion is not permitted unless, in the opinion of a trained health professional, there is need for emergency treatment, or the life or health of the mother is in danger, or if permitted by any other written law.

A person may not be denied access to any institution, employment or facility, or the enjoyment of any right, because of the person’s belief or religion.

Every person has the right to freedom of association, which includes the right to form, join or participate in the activities of an association of any kind.

I am in complete agreement with these

A State officer shall not—

(a) maintain a bank account outside Kenya except in accordance with an Act of Parliament;

:mad: Bloody expatriates

A child found in Kenya who is, or appears to be, less than eight years of age, and whose nationality and parents are not known, is presumed to be a citizen by birth

About time

 

I just got to the Executive part of the document and after that its the Judiciary where I expect to find more info about the Kadhi courts but so far the clucking of the chickens seem unfounded

[Jacaylbaro]

The whole thing the church is wailing about is the issue of the abortion i heard ....... and that is why they're making noises.

[Separatist]

^^The most contentious issues that the clergy are vehemently opposing are the Khadi courts and abortion. They've even resorted to spreading lies and propaganda on the internet. It's a really hot issue in many kenyan forums. They're claiming Islam gonna take over the country if they are allowed to retain the courts. Not mentioning one of their arguments is the recent ban on DSTV (world cup specifically) and video centres in Mandera by muslim clerics. The churches are funded by an extremist group in the US. US dollars funding the church campaign

 

The campaign is getting ugly, I tell you.

[nuune]

Originally posted by Jacaylbaro:

The whole thing the church is wailing about is the issue of the abortion i heard ....... and that is why they're making noises.

You just don't get yaa JB, the constitution was written by a Muslim, with a Muslim name, and he happens to be from NFD, of Somali origin!

 

 

The church wouldn't mind if the person who wrote the constitution had names like Kyongo Mwanga Peter regadrless of religion or background.

[SeeKer]

^What a thoughtless allegation. These people have lived together in peace for years to all of a sudden develop a taste for racism/religious discrimination.

 

Its people intent on hate mongering that need to be barred from voicing their opinions.

 

JB, I reiterate ignorant people will always believe what they are told. If the Kenyans want to know what is in their constitution it is available in black and white. Even for someone who lives thousands of miles away. The language allowing for abortion is clearly stated in my previous reply. It is contingent on circumstances mitigating adverse effects on the mother (as dictated by a health professional) otherwise it is not allowed! .

 

As for the Kadhi courts it is a non issue as to what powers they hold outside of the muslim spectra.

Kadhis’ Courts

170.(1) There shall be a Chief Kadhi and such number, being not fewer than three, of other Kadhis as may be prescribed under an Act of Parliament.

(2) A person shall not be qualified to be appointed to hold or act in the

office of Kadhi unless the person—

(a) professes the Muslim religion; and

(b) possesses such knowledge of the Muslim law applicable to any sects of Muslims as qualifies the person, in the opinion of the Judicial Service Commission, to hold a Kadhi’s court.

(3) Parliament shall establish Kadhis’ courts, each of which shall have the jurisdiction and powers conferred on it by legislation, subject to clause (5).

(4) The Chief Kadhi and the other Kadhis, or the Chief Kadhi and such of the other Kadhis (not being fewer than three in number) as may be prescribed under an Act of Parliament, shall each be empowered to hold a Kadhi’s court having jurisdiction within Kenya.

(5) The jurisdiction of a Kadhis’ court shall be limited to the determination of questions of Muslim law relating to personal status, marriage, divorce or inheritance in proceedings in which all the parties profess the Muslim religion and submit to the jurisdiction of the Kadhi’s courts

Wacheni wakenya wajitatulie baina yao vile watakavyo. At least they bloody have a democracy where they can air and debate their views :cool: The AG will weather the storm and sign it.

[Haatu]

Seeker let's not blind ourselves. What nuune said is not far from the truth. But I understand that the catholics might be against the abortion bit. But aren't Kenyans followers of the Anglican Church?

[Polanyi]

The existence of peace doesn't mean that religious or racial sentiments don't exist. They often just bubble under the surface and manifest themselves in times of crisis. The non Muslim civilians joining the police in beating up Muslim protestors in Kenya is a recent example.

 

( hat, African Anglican churches are less "liberal" than European churches).

[Haatu]

KP: I understand that but generally speaking, the Anglican church is more flexible than the Roman Catholic one. This is just an excuse. They can't stand the fact that a Somali has writen their constitution.

[SeeKer]

^^Since when did Kenya align themselves to one sect. During colonial days I would have said they had a true allegiance but that doesn't hold true anymore.

 

Haatu what nuune said is the rhetoric rampart in the media. That he would condone it by repeating it is what I was affronted to.

 

Are you really going to say that this is going to be the straw that broke the camel's back? Kenya is full of people who are from different tribes, backgrounds, religions and traditions. They have co-existed for years peaceful except the occasional rousing done during elections.

 

People will always oppose change. No one likes to change. The Kadhi courts were functioning before this constitution was drafted and are just being grandfathered into the constitution. So makele will occur but sipendi watu waongeze mafuta kwa moto. If one points out the fallacy of the church's arguments long enough I am sure the deaf will hear again.

 

Ps:-Mimi si kipofu even though navaa machonne

[Polanyi]

hat, The Anglican Church is extremely divided. But those in African are against abortion and homosexuality. So they are not flexible on such issues.

[Haatu]

KP appreciated sxb.

 

Seeker:

 

It is just nonsense what the Church is saying. It is an excuse! Mark my words. EXCUSE! EXCUSE! EXCUSE!

[SeeKer]

^^Dee haa wa excuse but a transparent one. They will get over it and it will pass