Somali Women and Revert Marriage Phenomenon

[Honesita]

Originally posted by Prince of Punt:

and let's be honest the sisters in the aforementioned stories would not marry a Somali brother even if he was a Sahaba, any of those excuses used by them where they degrade the Somali male demographic is just them second guessing their decision, and through the demonisation of Somali men they justify to themselves that this lifetime companion they have chosen was the right one. This feeling last for a year or two and then the inner demons start chipping away, because nobody can sustain an act for too long.

 

The proper sisters who married reverts and don't feel the need to justify themselves or explain their decision by degrading their fathers and brothers are usually the ones who are at peace with themselves and their surroundings. If i married an Indonesian muslim girl, i would do this, because i most likely LOVE HER AS A PERSON, and i'm ATTRACTED TO HER LOOKS, why the hell would i need to start talking crap about Somali women in general when they have nothing to do with how i feel about this Indonesian sister? If i degraded Somali women to justify my decision to marry an Indonesian girl, wouldn't it reflect badly on myself? Wouldn't it look like i have personal issues and a big chip on my shoulder? Yeah it would! Therefore is my opinion on the Somali community and Somali women really credible as a result? A BIG FAT NO!!

 

And actually I totally agree with these two paragraphs here... There are some Somalis completely not interested in other Somalis simply because they are Somali... I call this identity crisis... and I was also not speaking for those... May Allah protect us from such issues and give us confidence in ourselves and the good ones of our people...

 

Fi Amaani'Laah

[Chimera]

My point is; if a person is in a particular environment with X amount of 'losers' then that person has to start realising they are in the wrong place to begin with. Your not going to convince me that your ''sincerely interested to marry pious sisters preferring only Somali brothers but not knowing how to meet them'' are actually looking for Somali in the first place, because it simply doesn't make sense. My sisters found capable Somali men through a network of relatives and friends, what did my sisters have that your female friends don't?

[Che -Guevara]

Honest-How can one respect you if you don't respect yourself?

 

 

Anyway, if Somali man or woman decides that time has come and they want to sincerely settle down and marry fellow Somali-finding Somali mate ain't problem!

 

So, go and look for you Somali mate there's plenty in the sea that are hard-working and pious and worry not about reverts unless you are both going for the same Xalimo in which you should crushed him

[Honesita]

Originally posted by Che -Guevara:

Honest-How can one respect you if you don't respect yourself?

 

I don't understand! What does this mean?

 

Prince of Punt... lol, I'll go and ask them that question! In the mean time, I'll worry about how to make money offering a service in demand!

 

Fi Amaani'Laah

[Chimera]

Originally posted by ElPunto:

P.O.P et al,

 

When you can find large numbers of Somali women in jail, trafficking in drugs, murdering each other, joining gangs, being deliquents and absentee parents - then you can really speak of 'degrading Somali men' and 'demonisation of Somali men'. Otherwise - this is all cloud cuckoo land talk.

What a Non-sequitur, the terms; Jail, drugs trafficking, murder, gangs, delinquents, absentee parents are not EXCLUSIVE SOMALI DESIGNATED TERMS, nor are Somali men even close to topping the lists of these categories, nowhere near my friend.

 

What's even more illogical about your argument is how you pit a female immigrant group against their male counterparts, there is not a single native or immigrant group around the world where the female demographic has a higher ratio of criminals or gangmembers, that you even try to use this to back whatever vague point your trying make is just absurd and desperate to be honest.

 

Its the men who are always most heavily marginalised in a host country because they are seen as more threatening than their female counterparts. This is why empires in the past always first targeted the male demographic.

 

Be that as it may, how is brushing the entire Somali male population - the vast majority who are not drugs dealers, murderers or gangmembers -with the same negative brush in order to justify your own inferiority complex & identity crisis not a subject to be scrutinised, analysed and eventually dissect it for the bullcrap it really is? Kinda the way i just ripped apart your weak argument, but i'm sure your comeback will be along the lines ''When Somali women start a Civil War, or hi-jack ships then we can speak of 'Degrading Somali men' - otherwise it's all Clouds in Cuckoo land''. As if the entire male population of the Somali world out there is responsible for these acts and therefore should be generalised as a result. :rolleyes:

[Che -Guevara]

Originally posted by Honesita:

I don't understand! What does this mean?

hahaha..I'm sorry. I was referring to the people you were alluding-ones that are running away from themselves.

[Eng.Cadde]

I think this is very hot issue,I see sisters are advocating for interracial marriages simply because they dont want to be demonized when they find themselves in such sticky situation and that the brothers here are against it.

 

Lets remember folks that Interracial marriage doesnt mean a free happy life and it has its consequences if rushed into.

It is funny how females here use the deen card to justify thier fetish.

 

Personally speaking,I discourage my relatives to marry non-somali waxaaba laga yaaba in aan xiriirka isku jarno.!

 

 

I am amazed at how some of somali are open to this mixing thing,This IR fetish is not something i condone.

 

 

Elpunto

If you sis is married to a revert you dont have to equate african-americans to us.Yes,some crazy things do happen but that doesnt represent the whole majority.

[Somalina]

And the wheels go round and round...round and round...

 

FYI. I'm not advocating for interracial marriage.

 

If we are talking about a phenomenon, let's talk about the growing number of De Facto unions in the somali community and society as a whole.

 

P.O.P --when you pass the Bar exam, and I happen to sit on the witness stand..then and only then ..you can object to my hearsay testimony...

[rudy-Diiriye]

well la is full of this phenomena! i am all for it.

i just dont give them my phone #. cuz, when she gets

all beaten up, i dont wanna be here 911 call.

 

there are like 20 couples in la...i never went their weddings or houses. its bomb thats ticking. lol

 

i have seen what happened to ones that did this when i was growing up!! its not a pretty picture.

[Somalina]

My cousin calls it "roommie with benefits"

[Cawaale]

^They are playing the religion card(or so you say), and you are playing the cultural card sxb. But the thing is, its their own life and their own choices. you don't have the right to call them names. let them be!

[GaroweGal]

Originally posted by Eng.Cadde:

I think this is very hot issue,I see sisters are advocating for interracial marriages simply because they dont want to be demonized when they find themselves in such sticky situation and that the brothers here are against it.

 

So if a girl is open to strange adults making their own decisions that can only mean she is hitting or planning to hit up an ajanabi?

 

What about if a Somali male does not 'condone' this entirely halaal union? Does that mean he possess racial fetish of ajanabis too? (or mayhap he has a dozen baby mommas that are ajanabi- say that is more the classy, respectable Somali male way eh?)

[ElPunto]

POP,

 

Clearly you're on a tirade. Perhaps that is why there is little logical or relevant in your post. Empires of the past targeting male demographics indeed???

 

1- There are many immigrant groups in North America - the place I am most familiar with. The rates of criminality for Somali men are much higher than for Chinese, Indian, Arab, etc immigrant group even if adjusted for the fact that more men than women commit crimes. In light of these stark facts - I'm not sure how one demonizes or degrades Somali men when making a comparison to Somali women or even to other immigrant groups.

 

2. In North America, Somali women are more likely to graduate high school, go to college or university, hold down a job and have no criminal records at disporportionate rates to Somali men.

 

3. When you make a comparison of the relative position of the 2 sexes - I am sympathetic when a Somali women says I can't find a decent Somali man since the numbers are not in their favour. That is not to say that they aren't many good Somali men out there. But there is a large disconnect.

 

I've made no generalization or demonization of Somali men. I pointed out how far they lag behind the ladies. This is not revolutionary stuff.

[Chimera]

ElPunto i can't help the fact that you have difficulty processing my 'Empires targeting the foreign males they conquer' analogy. Let me elaborate; in every society since the dawn of civilization it has always been the case where the foreign male demographic was considered the most 'alien' and 'dangerous', it is them who were targeted/marginalised the most wether as subjects of an empire or immigrants in a new country, while their womenfolk though still not fully accepted had it many times better. Therefore the latter group would find it easier blending in with the host citizens than their male counterparts, got it now?

 

1. If your so familiar with it, then i'm sure you will have no problems providing us with statistics lining up every immigrant group and their tendency for criminality, otherwise your just talking out of your azz.

 

2. Again where is the proof for this? This is a common argument i hear alot, but never is it accompanied by an actual study. The statistics of this study: Tobacco Use and Cessation Among Somalis in Minnesota puts Somali female graduates at 31% and Somali male graduates at 34%, yeah A REAL BIG DIFFERENCE

 

3. Again a logical fallacy, that ignores the far higher number of losers, criminals and dropouts in other communities. You are a fine example of what i was referring to in my other posts. You single out the Somali male demographic and hold them to different standards, as if they have to adhere to a 99.9% success rate, otherwise they are 'losers'. :rolleyes:

 

Its a good thing the majority of Somali men and women don't hold that self-depreciating view of their community that is so apparrent in you. No, on the contrary Somali Americans are to busy building a strong community:

 

Barely a decade ago, Lewiston, Maine, was dying. The once bustling mill town's population had been shrinking since the 1970s; most jobs had vanished long before, and residents (those who hadn't already fled) called the decaying center of town "the combat zone." That was before a family of Somali refugees discovered Lewiston in 2001 and began spreading the word to immigrant friends and relatives that housing was cheap and it looked like a good place to build new lives and raise children in peace. Since then, the place has been transformed. Per capita income has soared, and crime rates have dropped. In 2004, Inc. magazine named Lewiston one of the best places to do business in America, and in 2007, it was named an "All-America City" by the National Civic League, the first time any town in Maine had received that honor in roughly 40 years. "No one could have dreamed this," says Chip Morrison, the local Chamber of Commerce president. "Not even me, and I'm an optimist."

 

The center of town still has pawnbrokers and bars, but now there are also shops with names like Mogadishu and Baracka, with signs advertising halal foods and selling headscarves and prepaid African phone cards. "Generally, refugees or migrants that come into a town give a new injection of energy," says Karen Jacobsen, director of the Forced Migration Program at Tufts University's Feinstein International Famine Center. "Somalis particularly. They have a very good network [with strong] trading links, and new economic activities they bring with them." Retailers sell clothes and spices imported from Africa; other entrepreneurs have launched restaurants and small businesses providing translation services, in-home care for the elderly and other social services. There's even a business consultant. "Increasingly, there's an acceptance that immigration is associated with good economic growth," says urban-studies specialist Richard Florida, director of the University of Toronto's Martin Prosperity Institute. "How is Maine going to grow? It's a big state with a sparse population. One of the ways to grow quickly is import people."

 

Lewiston's sudden jolt is reflected even in enrollment at local universities. Although University of Maine enrollment has dropped systemwide since 2002, the student population at its Lewiston campus jumped 16 percent between 2002 and 2007. And Andover College, which opened a campus in Lewiston in 2004, had to start expanding almost immediately to accommodate a boom in applications. Enrollment doubled in two years.

 

http://www.newsweek.com/id/180035

 

Immigrants from Somalia and other African nations are making strong strides in Minnesota toward weaning themselves off welfare,helping to lend some urgency to statewide efforts to make sure that other racial and ethnic groups perform as well.

 

Research by state officials shows that, although African immigrants received more welfare assistance than U.S.-born blacks at the beginning of this decade, they now receive less.

 

"The truth is a little bit counter to expectations," said Chuck Johnson, assistant commissioner for children and family services in the Minnesota Department of Human Services. "We've always been concerned about immigrant communities, but we really found out when digging into it that the much bigger problems are in the African-American and the American Indian communities."

 

The state is asking counties to figure out why Somalis and other recent African immigrants are moving off welfare rolls faster -- which might lend clues to why other groups aren't.

 

Suburban counties in particular are seeing increasing numbers of immigrants and minorities.

 

"We're a rich suburban county with one of the lowest poverty rates in the country," Ruth Krueger, director of employment and economic assistance for Dakota County, told board members recently during a briefing. "We have not paid a lot of attention to minorities because the numbers have been so small."

 

On the state's so-called "self-support index" -- based either on working at least 30 hours a week or departing from welfare altogether --Somalis in Dakota County are earning a rating of 80 percent vs. 72 percent for whites, she said.

 

Statewide, the figures are 78 percent for whites, 75 percent for Somalis, 76 percent for other African immigrants and 58 percent for U.S.-born blacks and American Indians. Hispanics -- most native-born -- and Asians, including Hmong, have rates in the same range as whites and African immigrants.

 

Over time, each immigrant group relies less on welfare as members learn English and how to navigate U.S. culture, and as government agencies find solutions to their needs, Johnson said.

 

Welfare reform, with its five-year limit on benefits, has heightened the urgency for figuring out why some groups do better than others, he said. "We used to just send the check; now we need to figure out what's going on."

 

And the shift of minorities to the suburbs adds another challenge.

 

"Counties like Dakota, Washington, Anoka are realizing they're at the point where their caseload is really shifting, with a much bigger presence of racial and ethnic minorities, and they need to figure out how to work with those populations," Johnson said.

 

Dakota County has met with clients of different ethnic and racial groups to ask what it could be doing better, including what sort of rapport they feel with the county's caseworkers.

 

"Their experience with that is uneven," Krueger said. Most report some discrimination in hiring, she said. Still, she added, the issues minorities face -- such as transportation and training -- are similar enough to those of whites that the county's main focus "is on poverty, not race."

 

Link

 

I don't even know why i'm providing you with this info, because you will dismiss it solely for the fact that it contradicts that piece of rubbish your trying to sell us as 'facts'.

[ElPunto]

^This whole Defender of the Somali Male (DSM) complex you got going - saaxiib drop it. It's tiring. One - to draw conclusions about statistics you need numerous studies producing consistent results with a sufficiently wide sample size. I don't believe any such studies exist for the Somali community. In light of that - anecdotal evidence can be valid. Two - there is no need to bombard me with success stories of Somalis - we all know they exist. The comment I was making was narrowly focused on the gap between Somali males and Somali ladies. Which brings me to this - if you really believe that Somali males don't significantly lag behind the ladies on a host of factors including education, crime, joblessness - then there is no need to prolong this further. It would be like debating George Bush on the merits of 'liberating' Iraq.