ONE OR TWO ON FEMINISTS

[Abtigiis]

^Real men! ME and REAL MEN.

 

Let us not get bogged down into technicalities! The real issue is not who is real and fake. But that regardless of the fact that some advocacy is justifiable to ensure basic rights of women are addressed, like all movements, some with all-togather different motivations have hijacked the legitimate cause!

[Cara.]

Originally posted by Paragon:

^Cara, as Abtigii is saying, 'real women' arent bothered about feminism, either? Something, eh?

I wonder at the common sense of anyone who would argue that real African women have no problems with sexism. There's no unequal access to education for boys and girls, no traditional practices that limit their potential. It's all just feminists agitating over the trivial because they are just unattractive and jealous. 'Real women' in Africa are content to serve coffee, and if they are particularly ambitious, maybe they can be maids in Dubai or Saudi Arabia, especially if they are real pretty and accommodating.

 

I really don't have anything much to add to this silly discussion. Of all the struggles that Africans face, I fear the greatest one is the complacent stup!dity of some of its men, ignoring the larger social upheavals while whining about how women don't know their place anymore.

[Ms DD]

SO why do you decide what is fake and what is real? You have no business of being fed up with women who are fed up with the likes of you (the patronising kind). No one knows better of what women want than women.

[Kool_Kat]

Originally posted by Paragon:

*Goes off to get his

Bun iyo Qaloon

War iga siko ee wax iga sii Qaloonkana...No bun for me though...

 

A&T, toloow yaa u cabaadidoontaa inuu kuusoo hiiliyo maanta? Ninkaa fulaysay oo kaa cabaad badan oona kaa nacnac badan waa ii dhiman yahay on SOL...Dhiiqo kasto intaa lugaha la gasho, baa hadhowna 'tol ba'ayeey' lasoo istaagtaa... Hayeey...

[Ms DD]

lool Kool. Dee daa ninka, ha u dhameystirine. Careful ..before he calls you a'whinging hairy woman'.

[Kool_Kat]

Ms Double D (aaaaaaahahahahahaha, wanted to call you this since reading this earlier ), ma'u dhameystirin runta lee usheegay...Gabar walaashiis eh oo ka nexeyso aan ahay nooh...

[Cara.]

I didn't know Abtigiis was a woman, Ms DD. Or are you forgetting this little story is from his fervid imagination? The whole thing is as absurd as a Kipling morality tale without the charm of talking animals.

[Paragon]

Originally posted by Cara:

I wonder at the common sense of anyone who would argue that real African women have no problems with sexism. There's no unequal access to education for boys and girls, no traditional practices that limit their potential. It's all just feminists agitating over the trivial because they are just unattractive and jealous. 'Real women' in Africa are content to serve coffee, and if they are particularly ambitious, maybe they can be maids in Dubai or Saudi Arabia, especially if they are real pretty and accommodating.

 

I really don't have anything much to add to this silly discussion. Of all the struggles that Africans face, I fear the greatest one is the complacent stup!dity of some of its men, ignoring the larger social upheavals while whining about how women don't know their place anymore.

Cara, those in Africa don't seem to have serious discussions about sexism or gender roles. This discussion oddly seems to be a diasporic one, which contests African women's new-found freedom at self-expression and fulfillment. And I suspect the underlying reason why Abtigiis has posted the above write-up, is to show that women in the African continent are still unaffected by this western disease of 'feminism'. Even more interesting, if I can read between the lines, the blissful submission of 'beautiful' women to their allocated gender roles is still un-altered, by global socio-political ideas on the 'emancipation' of women .

[Ms DD]

Isse

Do you know why? Women in daispora wey ka kaaftoomi karaan ragga halkan. Women are independent here so they can afford to fight for their rights. I will right more later

[Paragon]

^And I shall be back when you manage to find time to write more. You know this is a very sensitive subject that always gets some girls hot under their collar. I am not going as far as pigeon-holing the ugly ones as candidates for the feminist revolution, because I'd rather believe that there is no such thing as feminism; just pissed women at one point or another. Or even better, a phase to be passed .

[Naden]

'Ugly', 'short', 'old'.

 

There is an oft used advice in writing that says: kill your darlings . You're a talented writer but when you get this burning urge to pen adolescent meanderings like you've just done, then I would urge you to heed Faulkner's advice.

[Cara.]

Paragon, your hopes regarding feminism speak volumes about you, but have little bearing on reality or the merits of feminism. If you are unaware of any discussions in Africa about women's rights, perhaps this is because no woman wants to have such a discussion with someone who feels that a struggle for human rights, justice or parity is a "passing phase".

[Paragon]

^Cara, I see a distinct difference between human rights, justice, gender equality, poverty eradication and the idle, diasporadic past-time that is the current so-called feminism. I spoke to women in Africa (note; women who are in high government positions, lecturers in institutions and business executives), and I was more receptive to hearing their informed opinions on gender issues, or what crucially needs to be done to enchance women's welfare in Africa. We debated on some subjects, agreed on some, disagreed on others, but overall we managed to conduct courteous discussions.

 

But come London, and meeting with their counterparts here, I was surprised to have been taken back to the old 'feminism' incensed idle shouts, shouts which I have never understand what benefits they have for constructive discussions. As it is, I have no problem with feminism, and infact, I very much appreciate the 'eco-fem' analysis of gender domination in nature, human nature, and the right path towards better gender relations. What I find very amusing , is the never failing reverberation of Ticknerian Arguments, that are hurled everywhere for the sake of argument, with no substance to them! I am sure if Morgenthau was still alive, he would've been as amused as I am, at the Ticknerian feminization of the variables of reality, which is now common practice in feminist institutes, and those whom they 'wrongly' influenced .

 

Lol. Look for "You just don't understand" by Anne Tickner and read it. It's a very entertaining write-up .

 

Perhaps, http://www.ecofem.org/ would interest you too.

[Cara.]

Paragon, your about-face is heartening to say the least, going from lauding African women for rejecting 'emancipation' and embracing traditionally submissive gender roles to claiming to be interested in the viewpoints of female politicians, business women and academics, hardly what comes to mind when one thinks of "allocated gender roles". I can only assume your initial forays were a haphazard attempt at humor

 

So do you want to edit your original blanket dismissal of feminism as a passing phase to add the qualifier that it is a particular strain of second-wave feminism in a particular field of academic research that you have trouble with?

 

I do not know what your beef is with Anne Tickner. Maybe because I'm neither a gender studies major nor an IR scholar, your sudden jump to this topic leaves me baffled. I read "You just don't understand", a real struggle to be honest (brought back unpleasant memories of proofreading my sister's women's studies papers). The article's contents are not nearly so abrasive as the title suggests, give it a read. Tickner seems to be arguing that dismissing a feminist angle on the study of international relations is incorrect. If you can concede that environmentalism (seemingly a gender-neutral area) has been enriched by eco-feminism, then why would international relations, essentially a study of power, be any different? It takes even the most cursory glance at colonialism to immediately suggest enough PhD theses on power, gender, and the relationship between the colonizer and the colonized to fill a library.

 

Tickner neatly sums it up thus:

Feminist scholars claim that gender differences permeate all facets of public and private life, a socially constructed divide which they take to be problematic in itself; IR scholars, however, may believe that gender is about interpersonal relations between women and men, but not about international politics

If this is "feminization of the variables of reality", then so is eco-feminism. At any rate, you would have a hard time convincing anyone that "international relations" has some reality distinct from human definitions, and traditionally human definitions have been male definitions. If a little injection of considered feminist opinion makes you wary, you should explain why. It's not as if international relations is chemistry or mathematics, and you don't see feminists trying to 'feminize' the atomic number of magnesium or whether 2+2=5 is correct. What gives?

 

Anyway, I too find the traditionally feminist concerns of promoting human rights, alleviating poverty, and fighting injustice more compelling than the academic slugfests you humanities people engage in. Let's agree that at least SOME feminism isn't the passing fancy of bitter women and I'll go back to baiting Abtigiis

[Emperor]

Lool A&T Saaxib Innaba Caadi matihid... By far this is the most sensible story you posted... ma qiso dhab ahaa??? Sheekooyin cajiib ah ayaad haysaa lol

 

Your observation is spot on, I must agree with 1 or 2 of what you said, most of the Feminist activists I see on the media ama aan maqlay are either Habar Old ah, desperate and lonely or divorced, ugly and gave up on men (way quusteen) lool, either meesha kasaarba way isku darsadeen waxaas oo dhan, that's from what I observe ninyahow...

 

SOL girls dagaalka joojiya Islamaha Feminist-iga ahna waxay yihiin waa lasheegi karaa dee... A&T be firm and tell the truth this is an open forum, Norf iyo Paragon haku dayan way kugu raacsan yihiin laakiin waa fuleyaal