Should an adulterer care to pray?

[Abtigiis]

I am having this raging debate in the last couple of days with a characteristically head-strong Afghani Friend from Kabul. The issue is I am of the opinion that an adulterer who is unrepentant must not bother himself with Praying Salaat. I am using the verse “a Salaat is that which prohibits you from fuxshi and Munkar" as a reference.

 

Hence, one should not bother himself with bowing up and down minutes after he/she commits adultery and even worse when he is preparing to commit the same crime again when he finishes the 'prayer'. Unless, of course, he has a unique penchant for athletics and body exercises! It is clear he is not getting any marks for his efforts.

 

The Afghani brother’s point of view is that adultery is as in just as lying and killing are, and hence there is no connection to someone praying on one side and committing a crime on the other. For him, it is not a case of "all or nothing at all" and hence the two deeds are disparate and unrelated. Someone can warm the thighs of someone he is not supposed to, and yet again perform the ablution and go ahead with his prayers. The Afghani friend is not saying it is fine and normal for the person to do so, but he is saying it is better for him to respect at least some of the religious obligations, than for him to renege on all.

 

My position is with the key pillars of the faith, there is no such thing. If a person is an adulterer or a drunkard or a killer (remember not someone who killed at one point, but a killer who is practising the act without any contrition), He/She should not burden themselves with prayers.

 

What do SOLers think? The only catch is you all know about the Afghan pride and he will be reading your reactions. If he thinks he is losing the argument, my life will be in danger. So, try to be as diplomatic and do as much ego-massaging as possible if you are not agreeing with him. I mean the last thing you would want is for Nogobi to post an obituary post with my name in it.

[Curly]

Are you serious? A good deed is a good deed and it'll help wipe away your bad deeds...it's the shaydaan that tells you not to bother because "you've gone too far".

 

It's simple...If this person commits adultery and doesn't pray that would equate to more sins than someone who commits adultery and does pray...right?

[BOB]

A&T

Does he know about the World Cup in 2010? Is he even aware that the draw has been made already in Cape Town hosted by our beautiful Charlize from Benoni? Does he have her poster on his wall? Would he like to meet her? Does he have a contact with his great great uncle who has acres and acres of heroine farm funded by UK, sold by Israel and bought by US?

 

 

Peace, Love & Unity.

[Chocolate and Honey]

Lol@"Dont bother." It doesnt work like that AT&T. I'm afraid your friend is spot on. When it comes to cibaada, you can't stop it just because you happen to be a weak human.For instance, if one steals,or lies, or cheats, or even beats up his neighbor, should he forgo the prayer, fast or being baari to his parents because now he is a thug? Praying can actually help that person(well..eventually I hope)to repent later on. Who knows, maybe in one his prayers he'll feel remorse and quit it at once.

[hodman]

I agree that he should not stop praying. Despite his crime being one of the gravest in Islam, this person still has some fear of Allah and recognition of his responsibility to pray. Who knows it might be his saving grace for Allah forgives all crimes except shirk.

So there A T & T I guess he wont kill you now

[Rahima]

Prayer is not a burden, it is something that one should enjoy.

 

Also, prayer is compulsory for every muslim. Whilst it is a sin, commiting zina does not nullify ones Islam so long as they acknowledge that it is forbidden in Islam.

[Naxar Nugaaleed]

why concern your self with the relationship between someone else and their maker?

[Jacpher]

If one has a serious religious concerns, he should seek and address it to the appropriate knowledgeable people. Polling random replies of strangers on social network websites is not the best strategy to seek or receive authentic religious information. If this imaginary friend is not really you, the best thing you could do for him is advice him against his hawa and point him to Sheikh caalim ah. Taking religious guidance from online posts whether here or facebook, myspace defeats the purpose of practicing. You need factual reliable source based on authentic nusuus.

 

Prayers are said to wipe sins that's if one avoids the kabaa'ir. Shirk, murder and zina are said to be the three largest kabira. Knowing this, I don't know how one can conclude leaving behind the prayers is good at any moment or after committing any sin. Where did you get stopping prayers is bad for sinners? Is this another online poll?

[Jacaylbaro]

You are WRONG here Mr. A&T ,,,,, your Afghani friend is absolutely right.

 

Adultery is a sin and Prayers are Obligations ,,, do not mix the two.

[Abu-Salman]

Originally posted by Jacphar:

Prayers are said to wipe sins that's if one avoids the kabaa'ir. Shirk, murder and zina are said to be the three largest kabira.

Kabaa'irs or major sins are quite numerous and acts of obedience means greater divine protection from falling into them, often without even realising it.

For exemple, there are many forms of everyday Shirks (having bad thoughts or expectations about Allah: eg "he won't help us" etc) while getting involved even indirectly in usury is much worse than fornication (even the recording accountant or PCs maintainers are cursed since such people are "waging war against both the prophet and Allah").

 

Thus, the importance of gathering at least basic islamic knowledge (Kitaab Al Tawhid, Kitaab Al Kabaa'ir etc), while continuing to pray as the core of our purpose.

 

 

PS: one should adress the underlying issue through the Sunnah (fasting, marriage etc) and generally busy himself in a less lustful environment.

[Abtigiis]

I have to say I am surprised by the responses here. For me, I was thinking and still think that prayers of an adulterer or anyone who is involved in the major kabaa'ir doesn't count in the face of Allah as it is explicitly said that "a [real] prayers and [by implication one that is acceptable to Allah] is that which guards from bad deeds." Hence, it is clear the prayers of a serial adulterer is null and avoid.

 

The idea of saying the cibaada is separate from committing sin (as Jacaylbaro said) is alien to me and I don't think it is correct. I think it is linked.

 

P.S. I am yet to be convinced any of the opinions expressed is coming from real interpretation of what the religion says.

 

Cynically, I was thinking gabdho yar-yar oo gacanta lamarmariyey who are afraid they will be doomed to hell if they endorse my point were the ones who are acting as apologists for adulterers.

[Jacaylbaro]

Waar ka xishood hablaha sidaa ha ula hadline ,,,

 

 

The idea of saying the cibaada is separate from committing sin (as Jacaylbaro said) is alien to me and I don't think it is correct. I think it is linked.

We are talking about the Waajibaad here sxb ,, like the pillars of the Islam. Those are required no matter what.

 

but the Cibaadah should make you avoid the sins and that is required. But it is not the contrary that you avoid the prayers coz u committed a sin.

[The Zack]

Some scholars do say that "one knows when his/her prayers are accepted when the prayers help him cease the bad deeds one has been doing" but you don't just give up on the waajibaads just because you are a sinner. Actually it works the other way around, if one keeps doing his/her prayers one has a good a chance of being guided by god and that could help him/her stop the sins.

[Rayyan]

The Ten commandants in Surat Isra(Bani Israel) and Alancaam(The Cattle): both Allah (swt) strongly and profoundly forbid both in extreme warning and emphasised in clear cut, not to go near it: It‘s the fornication and Eating an Orphan's wealth. no dire warning like that come to the other evil-deeds.

 

In Chapter: Cattle, verse 151: Say: Come, I will recite unto you that which your Lord hath made a sacred duty for you: that ye do good to parents, and that you slay not your children because of penury – we provide for you and for them – and that ye draw not nigh to lewd things where open or concealed. And that ye slay not the life which Allah hath made sacred, save in the course of justice. This He hath commanded you, in order that ye may discern.

 

In Surat Bani Israel Or Isra

 

Verse: And come not near unto adultery. Lo! It is an abomination and an evil”. Fa inaha faaxisha wa saa a’Sabiil.

 

So if someone got into this crime of that Magnitude with all that warning – yes he/she will make tawbah, with a broken heart and promise not to do it again, and it’s the conditions of the tawbah – that you don’t do again as much as you can. And you are not belittling the crime. And you make great deal of istiqfaar and ask you Lord Forgiveness.

 

Salat Prayers as other brothers and sister said before me is a Must Do It, in Peace, In War, In Health, In Sickness, In travelling, In Stay, in Standing if you can, Sitting if you cannot, Lay down if you cannot, with fingers, if all else failed in your tongue, as far as you're still breathing and conscious. – That is the importance of the Prayers, and its the last words the Prophet(SCW) said when departing from this world, "Asalat Asalat wa ma malakat aymaankum". The whole business of having permission of staying this beautiful planet earth – as Allah(SWT) told us is to establish the prayers: pay zakat, and enjoy good, and ward off evil:

 

22:41 (They are) those who, if We establish them in the land, establish regular prayer and give regular charity, enjoin the right and forbid the evil.

 

Secondly its one of the good deeds as Sister Curly said: erase the evil deeds on one’s record. In Surat HUD: Verse: 114: Establish Prayers/Worship at the two ends of the day and in some watches (hours) of the night. Lo! Good deeds annul ill deeds. This is a reminder for the mindful.

 

 

A beautiful verse also: The Heights AlaCraaf) verse:33: My Lord forbids only indecencies, such of them as are apparent and such as are within, and sin and wrongful oppression, and that ye associate with Allah that for which no warrant has been revealed, and that ye tell concerning Allah that which ye know not.

 

No one will never stop praying, but you should know the borders, and the redtapes or redlines not cross or you're risking to have a wrath of Allah. once you know it, You are not same like the ignorant - and as the Prophet(SA) there was a guy laga xaarintimayay risiqi oo dhan all his provision was shortned on a crime he committed. secondly - Ya Zaani Abshir bil faqr!.

 

No need clubbing all night and ogling the girls, having your cake and eat it and come to the morning prayers. Dhayalsiba ku jira khatar ah.

 

Wallahu Aclam Wa Ilayhi Almsiir.

Rayan

[ADNAAN]

I agee with A&T here, the Afghani dude is full of shit . Whats the point of praying when you have already planned your next sin? it really defeats the purpose of repentance.