What you think of this?

[money]

You may have heard of this or familiar with it: Dumaashi - or so and so is my dumaashi...seedi is another case!

 

But let us talk about the Dumaal institution itself. it is first or second cousin to the institution of marriage.

 

Here are some examples and scenarios to really understand the complexities of Dumaal and I must admit this Dumaal thing made me think and think, reflect and reflect ......I am still as confused as hell and don't know what to make of it.

 

 

Scenario 1

 

A mother of 6 children dies of... say natural cause or maybe a childbirth complications. All 6 kids are under the age of 12. After the burial, funeral, condolences are done, the families get together and the elders suggest that the husband( now a widower) should get a wife to help him raise these 6 kids and they suggest he should marry one of the sisters of his late-wife. Reason: keep it in the family and another women won't be as caring and nurturing to the (semi-orphaned) kids as the Habaryar ( which Somalis believe is 2nd mom). No thought or talk about the future kids the new family will be having plus the 6 kids they got already. The husband is not asked to practice family planning or have vasectomy.

 

 

Scenario 2

 

A husband dies and leaves behind a wife (beautiful one )with ... say only 2 kids. After all the burials, elders again sit down and propose that the brother of the deceased hubby should marry the widow ( ex-wife of his brother). Reasoning: She is too good to get out of the family circle or fall into the hands of another man (of different lineage). No thought is given to her choices.

 

Scenario 3

 

This one is little bit opposite of the first scenario but with a twist. A husband dies and leaves a wife and 6 kids. After burials, elders get together and suggest that grandmothers and aunties should help the widow (wife)to raise the kids ( all under 10). No hook-up or future marriage for her! She had been producing kids almost every year and had no rest. No suggestion for her to get a family planning or hysterectomy - removal of the uterus. is this a double standard? or something else?

 

so ...

 

There are pro and cons for the whole Dumaal thing and I discussed this with friends. I just want to know what you guys think of it. Is it a practical thing? is it outdated? is it right? fair? complicated? should the husband ( in the first case ) castrated so not to have dozen more kids? Is it fair to the sister? brother? the widows? to the kids? would it create a confusion when two kids have the same mother but fathers who are brothers? or the same father but mothers who are sisters?

 

What you guys think of this. It is part of the Somali culture. Do others have it or practice it?

 

This maybe strange to some of you but is widely practiced in Somalia, Djibouti and Somali regions in Kenya and Ethiopia. We are bit westernized here and aspects of our culture may sound like quite alien, strange and backward but Dumaal is to this day done and is growing due to the perpetual deaths of so many Somalis due to the wars and famines.

 

The etymology of the word itself needs to be analyzed. where it is derived?

 

ancient Somali culture or it came to us through Islam

[Buuxo]

I think this dumaal think was not brought about for the good of the kids, but to ensure that the inheritence(ari/geel or what not) stays in the family and no other man gets it. Selfish iga dheh.

 

I feel for my ayeeyo's that had to endure this dumaal thing.Imagine going through 4-6 dumaal. Reer-ki dhanbaad dameyn brothers,cousins adeeros --eeew .I think this practice is slowly dying out.

[money]

Good point Cabdiyo: We discussed the inheritance, wealth and property angle of this and how it is not fair to the kids but still they do it and it goes on. And in my probing of what people think, I came across many who not only defend but strongly believe in it. And I do know some who have gone through it. I will have to be brave enough to ask them of what they think.

[Geel_jire]

It has its social benefits and the orphans gain the most especially in Scenario II .. who better to raise the kids as his own then an uncle.

[Kool_Kat]

Originally posted by Cabdiyo Cabdi:

Imagine going through 4-6 dumaal. Reer-ki dhanbaad dameyn

brothers,cousins adeeros --eeew .I think this practice is slowly dying out.

NO THANKS!!! Haduu hal dhinto, mid labaad dhinto, xaa sadax iyo afar igaarsiiyay? Cidaas dhan mar hore aan u goyn lahaa, iyaga iyo dhimashadooda...Istaqfurulah, laakiin, haduu hal walaal iga dhanto, kii i dumaalayna dhinto, kii sadaxaad maxaanba ku gaaraa, mar horaan cagaha wax ka dayi lahaa!!!

 

Mr. Money waxaa iga su'aal ah why is it when the wife dies and the husband is a widower you don't mention how hansome he is; yet when the husband leaves behind a wife and two kids, the first thing mentioned before the kids is how she is a 'beautiful one'? :confused:

 

N'way, this whole 'dumaal' thing is so yesterday's news...I would rather die lonely and miserable than to have my brother in-law as my new husband if uu husbandkeyga/his brother iga hor dhinto...NO WAY!!!

[Castro]

Originally posted by money:

Scenario 2

 

A husband dies and leaves behind a wife (

beautiful one

)with ... say only 2 kids.

Freudian moment?

[Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar]

ancient Somali culture or it came to us through Islam

Dumaal is dhaqan Soomaaliyeed, and I don't think it has to do with any other culture. Likewise uma maleeyi Soomaalida dhanka Islaamka inay ka keeneen. Probably waa pre-Islamic tradition. Ereyga dumaal ayaaba ka garanee.

 

We in this so-called modern world may never understand, laakiinse no questioin about it that it worked during its time and might still work. I don't think anything wrong with it, as long as labada isdumaaleyso isogolyihiin.

 

I hadn't hear hebel or heblaayo ayaa la dumaalay in ages, though. The reason it declined has to do with three other reasons, I guess: Dhaqankii geeljirnimo ayaa aad u yaraanooyo, oo magaalooyinkii ayee dadka dagayaan; kuwii Galbeedka ku koray ama arkay, meeshaana 'ilbax' mooday ayaa si qalad ah ugu fahmay; kuwa kale ee wadaadada cusub ah qarnigaan soo shaacbaxay, iyagana who have their own reasons, probably thinking since it might not be Carab culture, might then be un-Islamic, waa iyaga Carab ka dambeeyee.

[Geel_jire]

^ waa kugu raacsanahay sxb especially the western thing .. here everything is about the individual & taking care of No. 1 ... lakin dhaqanka geeljiraha the reason why dumaal was so sucessful was the mother/father were doing a selfless act & putting the children's interest before their own even if the replacement (man or woman) was a toad.

[Som@li]

Dumaal was a serious business in the past in Somalia, Sometimes a girl would refuse to marry a man,though she likes, and wants him but does not want the man in the line, lhis brother,lol that is crazy but Somalis were always in wars, and the chance of Dumaal was a high.

[Castro]

Would it still be called dumaal if my wife is alive?

[money]

I think if she wasn't beautiful (ugly-***) ... they may had still done it

[Cara.]

No Castro, that's just macking

 

Money, I think you're mixing many unrelated issues. Family planning doesn't have anything to do with dumaal. If the woman with 6 kids hadn't died, she would still likely have more kids, so why would the question only come up if she dies and her husband marries her sister?

 

Likewise scenario 2 and 3 just sounds soap-operish.

 

There were/are no social safety nets in Somalia. No state welfare, no social security, etc. Practices like dumaal are how we try to take care of the needy.

 

Dumaal is going out of style not because people are ashamed of Somali culture (there are much more shameful things we gleefully embrace), but because the situations we live in are different now. How many people live in clan enclaves, so that if their mother marries a man of another tribe she will be taking them away from their relatives? How many families live solely on their father's income? How many have to deal with the intricacies of inheritance of livestock or land?

 

I can just imagine the confusion of the San Diego Somalis having to see their good children move to Minneapolis just because the children's mother lagama gaarin before she hooked up with those strange northerners

[NGONGE]

Some of you Somalis are made in China. You talk about being Somali but you daily display your ignorance of how the tribal and clannish system works.

 

This tradition was a jaahiliyah tradition that preceded anything found in Somalia by thousands of years. In fact, some people even argue that it was first introduced by the Pharaohs. But, that in my opinion is a far fetched argument. The Pharaohs were more into direct incest rather than brother's marrying their dead sibling's widows.

 

The ancient Arabs on the other hand applied and followed the tribal system that we find in Somalia today. Almost all of the traditions that your average Somali would puff his chest at and mention with pride are and have been Arab customs.

 

The idea of someone marrying his brother's widow was introduced to primarily keep hold of the family's (and of course the clan's) wealth. For if the widow remained single there was always the possibility that she'll marry an outsider who would get hold of her deceased husband's wealth. The additional benefit of having to look after your brother's children might have also been a factor but, not usually, the main reason. Furthermore, the tradition of marrying one's cousins would have meant the new brother would not only marry his brother's widow but his very own cousin (this, I concede, is not a popular habit amongst Somalis).

 

I may write more about the old Arab tribal systems if I get time in the morning. It will clearly be educational for some of you.

[Fabregas]

^^Levirate Marriage could have been(probably) was practiced(still is by some OROMOs I believe) in the Horn-Africa before Somalis came into cultural contact with Arabs!